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Monday, April 30, 2018

OTP 2018 Apr 30: Republicans in Congress return to baseball field nearly a year after gunman opened fire

As a light rain trickled down Wednesday, Republican members of Congress returned to a baseball field where a gunman critically wounded teammate Rep. Steve Scalise and shattered their sense of security nearly a year ago.

“Today is an emotional day,’’ said Texas Rep. Joe Barton, manager of the Republican congressional baseball team. “But it’s also a rebirth, a renewal. I’m proud of the team.’‘

On June 14, Republican lawmakers practicing for their annual charity baseball game against Democrats found themselves scrambling to dodge gunfire from a man behind a chain-link fence.

 

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 07:56 AM | 1655 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: congress, off topic, old people's medicine for fuel, politics, shooting

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   1. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:05 AM (#5662790)
A GOP Circular Firing Squad In Indiana’s Senate Primary

NBC News: “Drunken driving, self-dealing and false advertising. Those are just some of the charges voters here are sifting through in a brutal three-way Republican primary that will determine who gets to take on Sen. Joe Donnelly (D-IN) in November. That contest on May 8 is one of a handful across the country that will determine which party controls the Senate next year, and Republicans believe they have a good shot at winning the seat.”

“The primary in Vice President Mike Pence’s home state has turned personal largely because there’s hardly a whit of policy difference among the three GOP candidates — Reps. Todd Rokita and Luke Messer, and former state Rep. Mike Braun. They’re all against abortion, taxes and the growth of entitlement spending, and they’re all doing their best to portray themselves as the second coming of President Donald Trump.”


Intent on squandering a historically great Senate map the GOP decides self-immolation is the best tactic. I guess they know how to run their party better than I, so I will keep my advice to myself.
   2. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:08 AM (#5662794)
Strange but true ... hot topics are only hot for so long. Have you heard about the Lindbergh kidnapping?

LOL. It's no longer a "hot topic" with Democrats because nearly two years have passed since Steele's first reports were prepared and nothing that wasn't already publicly available has been verified.

Republicans have taken an interest in the dossier to ascertain how it was pimped to secure FISA warrants and then later to undermine a democratically elected POTUS.
   3. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:11 AM (#5662797)
A hearing that had the C-Span3 twitter feed going crazy doesn't entirely qualify as "all other Democrats wanted to talk about". YMMV.

Oh look, Lassus is back from his overseas jaunt and the first thing he does back at OTP is fail to comprehend the meaning of "for example."

EDIT: And what Schiff and his fellow Democrats say at a HPSCI hearing featuring Comey and covered by pretty much every ####### media outlet matters a great deal.
   4. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:14 AM (#5662800)
#1316:
Yesterday, Senator John McCain's son-in-law tweeted, then quickly deleted, the following:
"John hugged me tonight. He asked me to take care of Meghan. I said I would. Fuck you soulless crazies. Fuck you all the way to hell."

McCain has been undergoing treatment for brain cancer since last summer, and has yet to set foot in Washington DC this year.

The night before last, Donald Trump egged on his crowd in Michigan to boo John McCain for his Obamacare vote last September.
   5. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:21 AM (#5662802)
LOL. It's no longer a "hot topic" with Democrats because nearly two years have passed since Steele's first reports were prepared and nothing that wasn't already publicly available has been verified.


Like I said, time has passed and everyone (except Trumpkins) have moved past the Dossier. Trumpkins seem stuck on it (for reasons I outlined past thread).

Republicans have taken an interest in the dossier to ascertain how it was pimped to secure FISA warrants and then later to undermine a democratically elected POTUS.


LOL. Don't be ridiculous. The GOP controlled Congress and executive branch have a million tools at their disposal to "ascertain how the FISA warrants were secured". Like seriously this is not some group of noble ragtag political refugees, the GOP holds ALL the levers of power in DC. If they want to find out how something happened they could have found out quickly and easily. You realize that, right?

And extra LOL for "undermine a democratically elected POTUS". Good stuff dude. The investigation was launched from a GOP controlled administration, and everyone knows exactly why it was launched. And it hasn't undermined anything, unless securing guilty pleas and filing charges against those who they have constitute such undermining. I really really want to hear what specifically has undermined Trump, was it the charges against the Russians, because that admission would be very interesting. Still, I will keep an open mind. What exactly has happened that has undermined Trump?
   6. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:21 AM (#5662803)
Republicans have taken an interest in the dossier to ascertain how it was pimped to secure FISA warrants and then later to undermine a democratically elected POTUS.

From the other thread: Aping SBB, holy crap.
   7. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:23 AM (#5662805)
Say what you will about the Soulless Crazies, but they did a killer set at the Trump inauguration with some really high energy renditions of their hits "I Know Your Dossier IS but What is Mine?", "Resign, Resign, Everyone Else Resign", and "Hack in the USSR".
   8. Hot Wheeling American, MS-13 Enthusiast Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:34 AM (#5662807)
@KFILE:
Trump group staffer Carl Higbie says he stands by his comments that 75% of veterans with PTSD are faking it.
   9. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:39 AM (#5662808)
On the bright side, Carl Higbie doesn't dismiss all emotional trauma incurred because of service to one's country:
@SHSanders45 @PressSec is such a class act. Well played Sarah, I’m sorry you had to deal with that. You have my utmost respect.
   10. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:40 AM (#5662809)
Couldn't have said it better myself.

“Just present the facts and let the American people if they think someone’s lying,” Schlapp said to CNN’s Alisyn Camerota. “Journalists shouldn’t be the one to say the President or his spokesperson is lying. What that does to 50 percent of the country is make them feel they are not credible to listen to.”


Well, I guess I could have said it better by saying "40 percent of the country".
   11. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:43 AM (#5662810)
@KFILE:

Trump group staffer Carl Higbie says he stands by his comments that 75% of veterans with PTSD are faking it.

Carl Higbie
‏Verified account @CarlHigbie
Replying to @NEPhilliesPhan


I stand by those comments. Comments made on a veteran hosted show with veteran audience. I am an ambassador to and involved with many Vet groups and spend much of my free time helping vets. That’s how i can accurately make those comments.
2:34 PM - 29 Apr 2018

Why haven't Ray/JE/Clapper condemned this slander? Not said that it was "stupid", but condemned it.

It's been nearly 24 hours. Where are they?
   12. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:46 AM (#5662812)
Nope. The dossier doesn't even mention Fusion, let alone describe any agreements between the company and the Russian government.

LOL. I guess that one's aimed at the target demo. The dossier mentions Kremlin-tied people all over the place.
Indeed it does. And any average daily edition of the WSJ or NYT also mentions "Kremlin-tied" people all over the place. Also leaders of African, Middle Eastern, and South American countries, as well as CEOs of various corporations worldwide. That's called reporting. Doesn't have anything to do with the topic of collusion, though. So any other irrelevant observations you wish to make?

They agreed to provide dirt on Trump (*), and Steele agreed to take it and publish it. (And likely spread it, though that one's a bit unclear at this point. John McCain agreed to take it and spread it, and so did the FBI.)
Apparently you do not understand what the word "agree" means. Maybe it'll show up in your word-a-day calendar eventually. Neither McCain nor Steele (who is not Fusion GPS, and is also not Hillary Clinton) agreed to do anything. When I ask you a question and you answer it, a normal English speaker does not refer to that as an "agreement."

Me: Have you seen where Bill put the TPS reports?
Co-Worker: He left them on the table in the conference room.

Normal English speakers do not describe that as the co-worker agreeing to tell me where the reports are, let alone as me agreeing to accept the information about where the reports are. Maybe one of your fake associates can explain to you that it would be sanctionable to label something as an agreement where no such agreement exists. (Now, in contrast, if I said, "If you tell me where the TPS reports are, then I'll buy you lunch," and he does, then that would be an agreement.)
See, that's the funny thing. When no one knew Herself was behind it, it behooved TDSers to speak the truth about the Kremlin ties to the dossier -- thus we have the Vanity Fair article stressing the bona fides of Source A and Source B. That's boomeranged back on the TDS brigade now that we know the dossier's provenance, to be sure -- but the facts remain the same.
Right. And their bona fides -- that they are in a position to know the facts they were reporting -- remains unrefuted. Doesn't mean that there was an "agreement," let alone one between Steele and the Russian government, let alone one between Fusion and the Russian government, let alone one between Clinton/the Clinton campaign/DNC and the Russian government. When James Comey gave his memos to his professor friend to give to the media, that wasn't the American government giving out the information; that was James Comey doing it on his own, against the wishes of the government.

And, of course, the Trump campaign did have an agreement with her

I see that "agreement" is the new mot du jour in the effort désespéré. Yes, Trump, Jr. "agreed" to meet NKL,
Who? Seriously, just admit you made a mistake, instead of repeating some made up letters.
but that's been known for quite some time. He actually admitted it long ago. Big whoop.
And yet, you keep denying it.

(*) Interestingly, as I've noted, the dossier mentions explicitly that Russian intelligence has compromising info on Herself, thus making her under the Trump standard "compromisable" and "blackmailable" -- but that of course has never been noted nor remotely investigated. Which makes it quite hard for the rationalists among us to take any of this seriously.
Not really interesting at all. First, you have no idea what was investigated. Second, the dossier mentions explicitly that the Russians have no "embarrassing conduct" vis-à-vis Hillary, so no compromisability or blackmailability.
   13. DavidFoss Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:48 AM (#5662813)
Trump group staffer Carl Higbie says he stands by his comments that 75% of veterans with PTSD are faking it.

The VA Secretary position is open, maybe Higbie should apply?

PTSD is not a new thing. My grandfather moved from the farm to a white collar job in the city because of shellshock he had from serving in WWI. Seems strange, but evidently being close to all of the noisy tractors bothered him. In the very long run, the move to a white collar job in the city worked out much better for him and his descendents anyways, but it always made for an interesting family story.
   14. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:50 AM (#5662814)
A GOP Circular Firing Squad In Indiana’s Senate Primary

[...]

Intent on squandering a historically great Senate map the GOP decides self-immolation is the best tactic. I guess they know how to run their party better than I, so I will keep my advice to myself
So, basically, you're saying that primaries are bad and keep candidates from winning general elections?
   15. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:51 AM (#5662816)
I am positive the usual suspects will rush to denounce this action. Justice Dept Deleted Language About Press Freedom

In updating its manual for U.S. attorneys, which provides guidance for prosecutors and other federal lawyers, the Trump Justice Department eliminated entirely a section titled “Need for Free Press and Public Trial,” which had been “included in versions of the manual at least as far back as 1988,” BuzzFeed News reports.

“The changes include new sections that underscore Sessions’ focus on religious liberty and the Trump administration’s efforts to crack down on government leaks — there is new language admonishing prosecutors not to share classified information and directing them to report contacts with the media.”
   16. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:52 AM (#5662817)
Republicans have taken an interest in the dossier


To deflect and spin as long as possible, in service of their Dear Leader and hopes of continuing to pack courts with radicals and morons.
   17. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:55 AM (#5662818)
So, basically, you're saying that primaries are bad and keep candidates from winning general elections?


I said no such thing. I linked to an article (which strongly implied the GOP primary had devolved into an unusually toxic brew of personal attacks), pointed out the GOP has a historically good Senate map, and then - to avoid charges of concern trolling) that the GOP primary was entirely a GOP affair, which they are in charge of and which they have the knowledge and concern (which I do not have) and so they must know what is best for them.

I do know when Democratic primaries similarly devolve into non-policy matters I get annoyed, but that is just me regarding my own party. The Indiana GOP Primary is not my circus, not my monkeys.
   18. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:57 AM (#5662819)
So, basically, you're saying that primaries are bad and keep candidates from winning general elections?

YMMV as to whether they're good or bad, but sometimes they sure do select unelectable general election candidates. Would Doug Jones likely have beaten Luther Strange?
   19. Swoboda is freedom Posted: April 30, 2018 at 10:58 AM (#5662820)
PTSD is not a new thing.

My father in law was never the same guy after he came back from Korea. (According to his sisters). I don't think it was the kimchi.
   20. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:03 AM (#5662822)
#13:
Trump group staffer Carl Higbie says he stands by his comments that 75% of veterans with PTSD are faking it.

PTSD is not a new thing. My grandfather moved from the farm to a white collar job in the city because of shell shock he had from serving in WWI. Seems strange, but evidently being close to all of the noisy tractors bothered him.

This great monologue by George Carlin never loses its punch.
   21. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:06 AM (#5662825)
My father in law was never the same guy after he came back from Korea. (According to his sisters). I don't think it was the kimchi.

It might've been that prime Texas steer.....
   22. stig-tossled, hornswoggled gef the typing mongoose Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:10 AM (#5662828)
My father in law was never the same guy after he came back from Korea. (According to his sisters).


I've noted before that my dad was judged 100 percent disabled by the VA because of PTSD from Korea. He wasn't able to hold any sort of job & basically just wandered the country (though I daresay the fact that he & my mother didn't get along didn't help). I've wondered more than once whether the stress had something to do with his death at 34 of a heart attack. (His only brother died of heart failure as well, but he lasted till 58.)
   23. DavidFoss Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:19 AM (#5662829)
This great monologue by George Carlin never loses its punch.

On that same grandfather's trip back from the war, there was an outbreak of the flu on his boat. That's another ailment that doesn't sound as bad today. Back then, the flu was a global pandemic which killed tens of millions of people and he was stuck on a densely packed transport ship in the middle of the Atlantic for a few days. Anyhow, he made it and I'm here.
   24. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:21 AM (#5662830)
FWIW Comey's discussion of his book tonight (at GWU) is being televised by C-SPAN 2 at 7:00 PM, followed by a round table discussion. Probably not recommended for those who get their talking points about Comey from either Hillary, Bernie, Trump, or Devin Nunes.
   25. Swoboda is freedom Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:21 AM (#5662832)

This great monologue by George Carlin never loses its punch.


The only problem is that "Shell Shock" while punchy, is not really accurate. They thought the shock waves from the shells did damage. It is better than battle fatigue. PTSD describes the problem more accurately.
   26. Swoboda is freedom Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:30 AM (#5662834)
On that same grandfather's trip back from the war, there was an outbreak of the flu on his boat. That's another ailment that doesn't sound as bad today. Back then, the flu was a global pandemic which killed tens of millions of people and he was stuck on a densely packed transport ship in the middle of the Atlantic for a few days. Anyhow, he made it and I'm here.

I may have told this story before, but my grandfather was married before he married my grandmother. His first wife and child died of the flu in New York while he was fighting WWI in Europe.

He married my grandmother 10+ later and had my dad. If that doesn't happen, I am not here.
   27. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:33 AM (#5662835)
The only problem is that "Shell Shock" while punchy, is not really accurate. They thought the shock waves from the shells did damage. It is better than battle fatigue. PTSD describes the problem more accurately.


So I just read this, minutes ago. Report To Army Finds Blast From Some Weapons May Put Shooter's Brain At Risk

Military personnel may be endangering their own brains when they operate certain shoulder-fired weapons, according to an Army-commissioned report released Monday.

The report, from the Center for a New American Security, says these bazooka-like weapons pose a hazard because they are powered by an explosion just inches from the operator's head.


I suspect there are twin effects, the psychological, and sometimes there are brain injuries from combat. As the NFL has "discovered" the human brain is more fragile than we might think.
   28. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:36 AM (#5662839)
As the NFL has "discovered" the human brain is more fragile than we might think.


I've discovered that on the OTP.
   29. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:37 AM (#5662842)
Like I said, time has passed and everyone (except Trumpkins) have moved past the Dossier.


LOL. It's not as if the Dossier got the whole RUSSIA! RUSSIA! idea going or anything. And it's not as though there isn't an IG investigation going on about it.
   30. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:42 AM (#5662845)
As the NFL has "discovered" the human brain is more fragile than we might think.


I've discovered that on the OTP.


I think you've confused "fragile" with "difficult to locate," GB.
   31. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:43 AM (#5662846)
Doesn't have anything to do with the topic of collusion, though.


There's no such thing as "the topic of collusion." There's "Trump-connected people met with Russians," there's "other people met with Russians," there's "Clinton's campaign met with Russians."

Nothing more. You're just dressing some of those meetings up with the meaningless fluff term "collusion." But there's nothing distinguishing them and never was.

Second, the dossier mentions explicitly that the Russians have no "embarrassing conduct" vis-à-vis Hillary, so no compromisability or blackmailability.


As if the only thing someone can be compromised on or blackmailed about is "embarrassing conduct." Your comment must be aimed at the target demo.

(Your material on a so-called "agreement" -- your new favorite word of the day -- is nonsensical gibberish not worth the bother.)

   32. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:50 AM (#5662850)
He has no reputation, other than within the target demo
LOL. I guess that one's aimed at the target demo.
Must be aimed at the target demo.
Weak, for the past seven days. Your branding is really failing.
   33. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:55 AM (#5662851)
Weak, for the past seven days. Your branding is really failing.


Then it's no big deal.
   34. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:55 AM (#5662852)
Weak, for the past seven days. Your branding is really failing.


I don't think his heart is really in it anymore. The decline is real, I guess.

I am not even sure what "Target Demo" actually is though. It is a term usually used when discussing sales and marketing, neither of which David is doing. He is arguing and discussing, but that is it. Weird how some terms get caught in the "hot key" loop of stretchy, even when they are nonsensical gibberish, not worth the bother.
   35. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 11:55 AM (#5662853)
SBB without his pet phrases is like Gallagher without his mallet.
   36. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:00 PM (#5662856)
It is a term usually used when discussing sales and marketing,


Right -- that's why I'm using the term.

neither of which David is doing.


The fact that you would say this shows his ... cough ... success. The best seduction oftentimes leaves the target unaware they're being seduced.

I am not even sure what "Target Demo" actually is though.


It's been explained -- it's the group of people who share his TDS who are unable or unwilling to see through his cavalcade of distortions, half-truths, and fabrications, all couched in what he comically believes is the authoritative knowledge base and rhetoric of a "real lawyer."(*) He writes not to explain, or to really discuss or debate, but instead to keep his and the target demo's spirits raised. Understandably so -- it's been a tough 20-odd months.

(*) But as both Ray and I have pointed out at length, much of what he's said about applicable law is pure dilettante gibberish -- again aimed at his sales and marketing efforts, not legal acumen or rigor.
   37. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:02 PM (#5662858)
Add sales and marketing to terms stretchy doesn't understand. And seduction, but that was over-determined already.
   38. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:03 PM (#5662859)
The best seduction oftentimes leaves the target unaware they're being seduced.


I've tried explaining that and explaining that to women, but somehow they never want a second night of passion with me.
   39. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:08 PM (#5662862)
LOL. Don't be ridiculous. The GOP controlled Congress and executive branch have a million tools at their disposal to "ascertain how the FISA warrants were secured". Like seriously this is not some group of noble ragtag political refugees, the GOP holds ALL the levers of power in DC. If they want to find out how something happened they could have found out quickly and easily. You realize that, right?
Obtuse Mouse is obtuse. They are utilizing those tools now. Investigations don't happen at the speed of light. Ask Bob Mueller if you think otherwise.

As for the executive branch, some of the folks who are suspected of being part of this shitshow are still employed or, in the case of Comey's pick for congressional liaison, Greg Brower, have just left the building.
   40. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:09 PM (#5662863)
It's not seduction if Putin or Cohen pay for it.
   41. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:11 PM (#5662865)
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Schlapp is at least technically correct. Most newsrooms still warn reporters not to try ascertaining intent. If anything, that's for the editorial board to decide.
   42. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:11 PM (#5662866)
Obtuse Mouse is obtuse. They are utilizing those tools now. Investigations don't happen at the speed of light. Ask Bob Mueller if you think otherwise.

As for the executive branch, some of the folks who are suspected of being part of this shitshow are still employed or, in the case of Comey's pick for congressional liaison, Greg Brower, have just left the building.


Dude seriously, the FISA stuff hardly takes years to investigate. And none of the rest of what you mentioned is worth getting all excited over, though hey you be you. I am still hoping for you to explain what exactly is undermining the legitimately elected POTUS though, that sounds really ominous and interesting. Care to explain?
   43. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:13 PM (#5662867)
FWIW Comey's discussion of his book tonight (at GWU) is being televised by C-SPAN 2 at 7:00 PM, followed by a round table discussion. Probably not recommended for those who get their talking points about Comey from either Hillary, Bernie, Trump, or Devin Nunes.
I suspect you didn't watch Bret Baier's interview of Comey, which I linked to over the weekend. You may wish to reconsider.
   44. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:16 PM (#5662873)
Why haven't Ray/JE/Clapper condemned this slander? Not said that it was "stupid", but condemned it.

It's been nearly 24 hours. Where are they?
First of all, what's a "Trump group staffer?"

Second, this is the first I'm reading about this and, despite your "nearly 24 hours" hysterics, it doesn't sound like you knew about it until minutes before you posted above.

Third, it seems like an outrageous comment, but I'll wait until after reading more on what was said and its context later this afternoon or evening before passing judgment.
   45. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:16 PM (#5662874)
And none of the rest of what you mentioned is worth getting all excited over,


It is for actual liberals.
   46. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:21 PM (#5662877)
Dude seriously, the FISA stuff hardly takes years to investigate. And none of the rest of what you mentioned is worth getting all excited over, though hey you be you.
Here's one example of many of reasons why investigations take forever.

Here's another.

Here's a third
.

Once more, investigations don't start and finish at the speed of light, even when everyone is fully cooperating.

But ultimately, Congress won't be the ones lowering the boom on McCabe, Comey, Brennan, Clapper, and/or Yates. (And yes, there are others.) If that happens, that will be courtesy of Sessions and Rosenstein, with the assist from Horowitz.
   47. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:24 PM (#5662878)
Here's one example of many.

Here's another.

Here's a third.


I am more interested in your words. If you can't be bothered to explain though, it is probably not that big a deal.

EDIT: Are these examples of undermining the President or something which I didn't ask for examples? I assume you will explain all.
   48. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:27 PM (#5662881)
I am still hoping for you to explain what exactly is undermining the legitimately elected POTUS though, that sounds really ominous and interesting. Care to explain?
Using the intel agencies and federal law enforcement (EDIT: and a foreign ex-spook and members of the media) to spread unverifiable information about relying on a foreign adversary to win the election is pretty much a textbook example of attempted delegitimization.
   49. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:31 PM (#5662883)
I am more interested in your words. If you can't be bothered to explain though, it is probably not that big a deal.
Anyway, I have spelled it for you and your fellow band members numerous times. A one-sentence summary may be found in #48.
   50. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:31 PM (#5662884)
Using the intel agencies and federal law enforcement to spread unverifiable information about relying on a foreign adversary to win the election is pretty much a textbook example of attempted delegitimization.


Who is doing this? I mean it sounds really bad when you put it that way. Gosh. Why was such an investigation launched by a GOP administration? Sounds like you need to get your house in order.

Of course it becomes much less ominous if it turns out that a foreign adversary (Maybe France*? Maybe someone else.) really did help one candidate get elected.

* Lighten up Francis.
   51. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:33 PM (#5662886)
Attempted delegitimization is a crime punishable by five years of Michael Cohen cease & desist letters.

Not a matter to take lightly.
   52. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:33 PM (#5662885)
A one-sentence summary may be found in #48.


Who is doing this nefarious "using"? Such a sentence as in #48 cries out for more details. care to supply them?

EDIT: Also, does stating the elected POTUS is not a US citizen and thus not eligible for the presidency also undermining? More or less serious?
   53. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:34 PM (#5662889)
Who is doing this? I mean it sounds really bad when you put it that way. Gosh. Why was such an investigation launched by a GOP administration? Sounds like you need to get your house in order.

Of course it becomes much less ominous if it turns out that a foreign adversary (Maybe France*? Maybe someone else.) really did help one candidate get elected.
Keep up the obtusity, Mouse. It's clear you're not even reading what I post.

Let's see how you respond after the first indictments come down. Until then, someone else can play your infantile games.
   54. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:36 PM (#5662892)
Let's see how you respond after the first indictments come down.


My guess is the same way after the first 17.

Oh wait, my bad... those indictments don't count. Because reasons.

EDIT: 19... mea culpa
   55. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:38 PM (#5662894)
My guess is the same way after the first 17.

Oh wait, my bad... those indictments don't count. Because reasons.

EDIT: 19... mea culpa
How many have to do with supposed Russia-Trump campaign collusion? Um...

Do yourself a favor and remain tucked inside the Canadian bungalow.
   56. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:38 PM (#5662895)
Let's see how you respond after the first indictments come down.


Hillary? Anyway, seriously, I have no idea why you think some random FBI person being indicted will rock my world. I have said numerous times, but hey I will say it once more, I am OK with people who break the law being indicted. Really.

I support the Mueller investigation, because I think it is important to get to the bottom of what happened in the election, especially after allegations (serious ones) were raised against the current and previous POTUS. Such a situation cried out for an investigation as impartial as possible and I am glad such is happening.

If side investigations uncover other wrong doing then I am all in favor of it.
   57. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:39 PM (#5662896)
How many have to do with supposed Russia-Trump campaign collusion? Um...


18.
   58. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:40 PM (#5662898)
I am not even sure what "Target Demo" actually is though.


It's a made up phrase designed explicitly to mean nothing, and therefore mean whatever the troll needs it to mean at any hedge and spin. Why would you expect anything else from him at this point?
   59. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:41 PM (#5662899)
How many have to do with supposed Russia-Trump campaign collusion? Um...


That is not, nor has it ever been, a metric for success. If a murder investigation uncovers counterfeiting and puts a stop to it, that is a good thing. Even though it is unrelated (directly) to the murder investigation. And of course I don't think Mueller was ever limited to strictly "Russia-Trump campaign collusion", no matter how much stretchy and crew bleat it was.
   60. Stormy JE Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:41 PM (#5662901)
Anyway, seriously, I have no idea why you think some random FBI person being indicted will rock my world.
You're not serious. You've never been serious.
   61. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:46 PM (#5662905)
You're not serious. You've never been serious.


Serious people source their conspiracy theory nonsense from deep right wing propaganda sites.
   62. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:48 PM (#5662907)
Serious people source their conspiracy theory nonsense from deep right wing propaganda sites.


Once he finishes sourcing to himself, SBB hopes to attain this level of objectivity.
   63. zenbitz Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:50 PM (#5662912)
I don't get it JE. Don't you realize that the only thing better for a Democrat that sticking it to the GOP is EATING OUR OWN?

We want all those guys taken down. Because #### the FBI.
   64. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:51 PM (#5662914)
Using the intel agencies and federal law enforcement (EDIT: and a foreign ex-spook and members of the media) to spread unverifiable information about relying on a foreign adversary to win the election is pretty much a textbook example of attempted delegitimization.


Like you ever opened a textbook at Buchanan High. No Juan, you're a Sweathog slacker through and through.
   65. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:52 PM (#5662915)
48

Using the intel agencies and federal law enforcement (EDIT: and a foreign ex-spook and members of the media) to spread unverifiable information about relying on a foreign adversary to win the election is pretty much a textbook example of attempted delegitimization.


except that the winning candidate had already started the delegitimization process before the campaign was over.

"It's rigged! It's rigged! I won? It's not rigged!"
   66. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:55 PM (#5662920)
You're not serious. You've never been serious.


Well, I don't take your hysterics all that seriously, sure. I assume you are objecting to the "random". Sure, they are not truly random, they are just people I had never heard of before, will never hear of again after this sad affair is done, and who I have zero stake in their guilt or innocence. "Random" was shorthand for that, if it offends you choose a different word that expresses my deep and undying indifference to their fate (other than I wish all people well, of course).
   67. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:56 PM (#5662922)
Using the intel agencies and federal law enforcement to spread unverifiable information about relying on a foreign adversary to win the election is pretty much a textbook example of attempted delegitimization.

Who is doing this?Who is doing this?


LOL. You really should put at least some effort into learning what's going on. The "I'm just going to wait for Mueller" is getting rather long in the tooth.
   68. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:57 PM (#5662925)
except that the winning candidate had already started the delegitimization process before the campaign was over.

"It's rigged! It's rigged! I won? It's not rigged!"


Followed by insisting that millions of illegal votes were cast, but only for his opponent.
   69. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:58 PM (#5662928)
Reading these threads week in and week out, I think it's wild that some of you have met each other IRL or are Facebook "friends."
   70. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 12:59 PM (#5662932)
Your Trumpkins at work, in a single sentence:

Scott Adams thinks that the Daily Caller piece sourced to Alex Jones proves SBB was right all along.
   71. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:01 PM (#5662936)

Followed by insisting that millions of illegal votes were cast, but only for his opponent.


That, too.
   72. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:02 PM (#5662938)
Reading these threads week in and week out, I think it's wild that some of you have met each other IRL or are Facebook "friends."


Heh. I like Jason. I admit I like most people I meet. I am way more mellow and relaxed IRL, but then again most people are I think. It is OK to know and like people and also to disagree with them in the strongest possible way.

Heck, I am visiting my sister in Florida next week and she and her husband are very big Trump supporters and extremely and religiously conservative. I am not those things, but I still like both of them and look forward to spending the night at their house and the next day on a day cruise and otherwise hanging out. Sure, we don't talk politics or religion, but it is not like either of our views are a secret from each other.

Note: This is my middle sister. Not the youngest and very liberal one in DC, nor the also liberal retired one who is an elected (very low level) official in Illinois. So not the sister you met Jason.
   73. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:03 PM (#5662939)
Oh wait, my bad... those indictments don't count. Because reasons.


Because they don't involve Russian "collusion." That's the reason.
   74. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:07 PM (#5662945)
I hear that going to prison is not so bad so long as it is not for "Russian Collusion".
   75. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:08 PM (#5662947)
Because they don't involve Russian "collusion." That's the reason.


Uh-huh.

Good thing they don't involve "Russians".
   76. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:09 PM (#5662950)
I hear that going to prison is not so bad so long as it is not for "Russian Collusion".


Concession accepted.
   77. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5662954)
"Concession" accepted, you mean.
   78. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5662955)
TMZ: JARED KUSHNER TARGETED BY DERANGED MAN WITH A METAL POLE AT TRUMP INTL HOTEL


Trump was right. You can't trust the poles.
   79. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5662956)
Or is it concession "accepted"?
   80. BDC Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5662957)
I think it's wild that some of you have met each other IRL or are Facebook "friends."

I think anybody who'd get personally offended at the shade thrown around here would have left OTP long ago :)
   81. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:13 PM (#5662958)
There's no such thing as "the topic of collusion." There's "Trump-connected people met with Russians,"
Nope. Met with an emissary from the Russian government. To discuss how the Russian government could help them with the election. Some -- i.e., those familiar with the English language -- might even call that "collusion."

But describing Trump's family members as "Trump-connected people" is worthy of one of your patented LOLs.
there's "Clinton's campaign met with Russians."
Complete fabrication.
   82. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:16 PM (#5662963)
"Concession" accepted, you mean.


I sense frustration sinking in. I'm pretty sure you were warned ahead of time that any serious "collusion" dirt would have been leaked to the press and published long, long ago and that it was quite unlikely anything was going to be found. You could have saved yourself a lot of time just going with that.
   83. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:18 PM (#5662966)
Why haven't Ray/JE/Clapper condemned this slander? Not said that it was "stupid", but condemned it.

It's been nearly 24 hours. Where are they?


First of all, what's a "Trump group staffer?"


In this case, a former member of Trump's transition team who's a big fan of Steve Bannon.

Second, this is the first I'm reading about this and, despite your "nearly 24 hours" hysterics, it doesn't sound like you knew about it until minutes before you posted above.

Absolutely correct. Obviously I was just mocking the insistence that we all immediately denounce comments by comedians and cable news commentators whom some of us have never even heard of.

OTOH (obligatory snark alert) you might be somewhat aware of Trump's last 500 lies, racist comments, and other outrages against common sense and common decency, and you've been similarly mute when it comes to those over the past 21 months.
   84. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:20 PM (#5662968)
Nope. Met with an emissary from the Russian government. To discuss how the Russian government could help them with the election. Some -- i.e., those familiar with the English language -- might even call that "collusion."


No -- no one would call that "collusion." (*) Well, TDSers might I guess, but I've long ago given up predicting how far off course they'll go.

And of course -- we're getting to the yawn point now -- so did the Clinton campaign. Many more times, and at its own behest. And with success in gathering opposition research dirt.

there's "Clinton's campaign met with Russians."

Complete fabrication.


LOL, ok. Which word, "met"? So collusion requires face-to-face meetings now, and Steele never met anyone in person? Perhaps the target demo can see what you're up to here. But perhaps maybe not.

(*) Trump or Clinton were entirely within their prerogatives to meet with Putin to seek election help, or even his endorsement. Not sure what principle you think demonstrates otherwise. Putin couldn't have legally donated money, I guess -- but so what? Absent independent illegality, there's nothing wrong with an American candidate seeking and obtaining the endorsement of the entire Kremlin. It wouldn't do any good, of course, but there's no reason they couldn't.

   85. Traderdave Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:24 PM (#5662971)
So when Trump resigns or is removed, which OTP Trumpkin will be the most fun to laugh at?

Which one will stay in OTP and take the the whipping the longest?

   86. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:26 PM (#5662972)
So when Trump resigns or is removed, which OTP Trumpkin will be the most fun to laugh at?


Beyond Face, and it's unclear where he stands on the subject, there are no "Trumpkins" on the board. Like "collusion," they're figments of the TDS imagination.
   87. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:26 PM (#5662973)
So when Trump resigns or is removed, which OTP Trumpkin will be the most fun to laugh at?


The dumb one.

Which one will stay in OTP and take the the whipping the longest?


The pathetic one.
   88. Traderdave Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:28 PM (#5662976)
87

So Ray & Ray?

Or Stretchy & Ray?
   89. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:30 PM (#5662977)
So when Trump resigns or is removed, which OTP Trumpkin will be the most fun to laugh at?

I (sadly) don't think this will happen; but it's already fun, in a jet-black sunrise sort of way.
   90. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:31 PM (#5662978)
Trump was right. You can't trust the poles.

Wait, did he actually say this about the Poles?
   91. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:33 PM (#5662979)
Well, you don't see this every day... last week, a Republican candidate in the Oregon Governor primary released a private poll showing him dropping from a first-place tie to a 15% deficit. He argues that this should convince all the other very conservative candidates (besides him) to drop out of the race, consolidate their support in his slumping candidacy, and shore up his numbers.
   92. Zonk is Just the Right Amount of Wrought Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:34 PM (#5662980)
Wait, did he actually say this about the Poles?


In fairness, that's his term for strippers.
   93. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:34 PM (#5662982)
So when Trump resigns or is removed, which OTP Trumpkin will be the most fun to laugh at?


None of them. Seriously, I really truly don't want GOP President Trump to be removed for cause. If it happens it will be cause for sadness not celebration.

That said TGF and his tears and sorrow will be the best. Sadly I doubt he will express them here, but he genuinely supports Trump (for the worst reasons), and he will be saddest if Trump departs the Oval office ahead of schedule. The others are pretty much only in it for other reasons (mostly "we hate liberals") and will be able to pivot pretty quickly.

Which one will stay in OTP and take the the whipping the longest?


Stretchy is immune to shame (obviously) and Ray has already taken the worst this site has to offer ("It's over, it's always been over" & "Catcher's throwing lane"); Ray has a thick skin and seems to realize how important this thread is (Hint: Not at all). I doubt either will leave.
   94. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:36 PM (#5662984)
Beyond Face, and it's unclear where he stands on the subject, there are no "Trumpkins" on the board.


That's true, the more accurate term would be "Trumpholsters".
   95. Traderdave Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:38 PM (#5662985)
I (sadly) don't think this will happen; but it's already fun, in a jet-black sunrise sort of way.


I don't think removal happens unless it is proved -- so incontrovertibly that even Trumpkins agree -- that the campaign took Russian money. It would probably take a video of Putin handing over a suitcase of cash directly in to the Shortfingered one's hands to get to that.

But resignation is a non-zero possibility, one that could be triggered by several possible events, or a combo: flipping both House & Senate, Mueller indicting for Trump financial crimes (money laundering, FCPA, etc), mass resignation of staff and cabinet, a warning from the GOPe that an impeachment vote will go to the floor, etc. He hates the job as it is, significant pressure could cause him to quit and then spend the rest of his life on Fox declaring himself GOAT.
   96. . Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:41 PM (#5662988)
Or he could just be ... you know ... voted out of office in 2.5 years. I know that's a little too boring for the ... LOL ... "resistance," but it's nonetheless constitutionally accurate in every sense.
   97. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:43 PM (#5662990)
But resignation is a non-zero possibility, one that could be triggered by several possible events, or a combo: flipping both House & Senate, Mueller indicting for Trump financial crimes (money laundering, FCPA, etc), mass resignation of staff and cabinet, a warning from the GOPe that an impeachment vote will go to the floor, etc. He hates the job as it is, significant pressure could cause him to quit and then spend the rest of his life on Fox declaring himself GOAT.



I have zero clue how to handicap Trump pulling a Palin. The combination of his personality and delusions net out in such a confusing way that nearly nothing would surprise me honestly.
   98. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:44 PM (#5662992)
Or he could just be ... you know ... voted out of office in 2.5 years.

Of course. I don't think wanting this embarrassing excuse for a festering pustule removed sooner through proper parliamentary/constitutional means, procedural or otherwise, is a moral failing the way you do, however.
   99. Traderdave Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:44 PM (#5662993)
Or he could just be ... you know ... voted out of office in 2.5 years. I know that's a little too boring for the ... LOL ... "resistance," but it's nonetheless constitutionally accurate in every sense.


He won't run.
   100. Lassus Posted: April 30, 2018 at 01:47 PM (#5662995)
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