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Monday, May 21, 2018

OTP 2018 May 21: President takes British royalty to a baseball game, May 15, 1991

The 65-year-old queen, dressed in a below-the-knee blue and red dress, black gloves and three strands of pearls, entered the Orioles dugout along the third base line. She formed a receiving line with her husband and the president, clad in a navy blazer, and Barbara Bush. The first lady wore a blue and white floral print dress.

While the VIP guests took their positions designated by their names on 3-by-5 cards, the song “Brown-Eyed Girl” played over the stadium’s public-address system. Their images appeared on the video screen in right-center field.

“I’ve been playing baseball for 10 years, and I’m used to a normal atmosphere,” said Cal Ripken Jr., the Orioles shortstop, after exchanging handshakes. “This is a lot different. There’s a lot of excitement.”

(As always, views expressed in the article lede and comments are the views of the individual commenters and the submitter of the article and do not represent the views of Baseball Think Factory or its owner.)

Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: May 21, 2018 at 07:42 AM | 1375 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: baltimore orioles, oakland athletics, off topic, politics, polyamorous wood

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   1201. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 26, 2018 at 02:57 PM (#5680016)
First of all, Clapper can go #### himself.


At the least, Ray and Jason would help him out with a three way reach-around.
   1202. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 26, 2018 at 02:58 PM (#5680017)
Ireland has voted to overturn its abortion ban by a 2-1 margin.


A world with fewer gingers is by definition better.
   1203. BDC Posted: May 26, 2018 at 03:27 PM (#5680034)
A couple weeks ago, the opportunity to adopt a one-year-old that needed a home, so I took it

I'm glad you could do that, Dan. La Dernière and I have fostered seven kittens in the past few years, all now in good homes. If somebody catches a feral kitten they bring it to us and we socialize it. It's not rocket science, mind you. The kinds of kittens people are likely to find are of breeds that are disposed to make good pets: but if somebody doesn't work with them at a crucial early juncture, they will never even be touchable, let alone good pets.

The most recent of the little guys moved to his permanent home a few days ago, which is more happy than sad, though you do get fond of them. And yes, they do disrupt the lives of the adult cats (we currently have two). But all in all it's worth it.
   1204. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 26, 2018 at 05:35 PM (#5680105)
At any rate a felony-murder conviction doesn't turn on whether he was "unarmed" -- even assuming that's true. Again, you don't understand concepts.

You are still trying to argue nuances of the law, when the question is one of morality of the outcome. Which very much shows that you do not understand concepts. What the law actually says, is completely irrelevant to the answer of the question. Something can be lawful and still morally repugnant, and something can be unlawful and still morally good. You fundamentally cannot answer the question of "is the outcome just," with "well the law says it is." That is a completely morally bankrupt position.
   1205. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 26, 2018 at 05:37 PM (#5680106)
A defendant who shows some signs of remorse is likely to do somewhat better,
It appears from the news coverage to be undisputed that he didn't do such a thing:
Judge Sibley Reynolds noted that Smith had shown no remorse for his actions during the entire trial process and took no opportunity to apologize.

Reynolds overheard Smith say, "I don’t have time for this" while waiting to be called and, and the judge confronted him about his comments.

“You got plenty of time for this,” Reynolds explained to Smith before handing down the sentence. “When I called the case earlier you said you ain’t got time for this, so I didn’t know if you had time for this now?”

Smith laughed and lowered his head, stating he didn’t know the judge heard him.

Reynolds paused and asked Smith, "You just don’t get it do you?"

"He hasn't said I'm sorry yet,” the judge went on. “He hasn't acknowledged to this court that he shouldn't have done, shouldn't have come around, in fact, his attitude toward this court and life, in general, has been sour.”

Smith’s grandfather made an impassioned plea for his grandson’s freedom, asking the judge to show mercy.

"Give him a chance to tell you he’s sorry," the grandfather pleaded with Reynolds.

“He’s had every opportunity,” the judge responded. "I’ve asked two or three times today.”

“Are you sorry?” the grandfather asked Smith then responded he was sorry for his actions and sorry for his "homeboy", referencing A’Donte Washington.

Chief District Attorney C.J. Robinson noted Smith’s attitude in court.

"After the jury verdict, he was laughing. Today in court he was laughing," Robinson said. “I have yet to understand what was so funny.”
You also add:
Finally, we don't know anything about the parole system in that state.
I don't, but at least one news report said that he'd be eligible in 20-25 years. (For those who don't know, there's no parole in the federal criminal justice system, and the best you can do is a 15% reduction for good time credits. But in many states, sentences have far less meaning.)
   1206. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 26, 2018 at 05:43 PM (#5680107)

Setting aside the felony murder discussion for a moment, 35 years for burglary? How can that be a just punishment? If there were any aggravating circumstances that justify such a sentence, they should have been named charges to be tried on. I cannot imagine a burglary in and of itself that would justify 35 years.
It was 15 years for burglary, plus 10 years for each of two theft convictions. Plus of course the 30 for murder.
   1207. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 05:58 PM (#5680110)
If so, that evidence needs to be shared.


Not until we get charges or the investigation ends, boyo.
   1208. perros Posted: May 26, 2018 at 06:02 PM (#5680113)
May the friendly neighborhood burgular find sympathy in your homes tonight.
   1209. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 06:05 PM (#5680116)
They're trolls, idiots, and whores.


I really wish you would stop maligning sex workers like this. It's an honest, if sometimes illegal, living.
   1210. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 06:09 PM (#5680118)
1) Woodford (the regular stuff)
...
6) Knob Creek


Am I strange... I like Knob Creek way more than Woodford. I keep trying random Bourbons (I think Larceny ... maybe) and coming back the KC. I also like bulleit Rye (and old Everhous, when I find it -- not enough to try very hard)

However, Laphraoig is my favorite scotch.... so I guess it's just me?
   1211. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 06:46 PM (#5680127)
Reading the actual review of the meeting behind 1166 (ignoring the "Reason" article beyond the click-through link to "Obesity Reviews")

Man, this is super long... you can read it yourself I think (hooray open access):

* There is NO evidence of Aspartame effecting energy balance (tested specfically)
* There is *mixed* evidence of Saccharine, Sucralose, Acesulfame-K and steviol glycosides (from stevia plant) effecting energy balance.
* There is *mixed* evidence for fat (unsaturated vs. saturated on blood lipid levels -- leading to atheroscerosis)
* EVOO and nuts are good for CVD
* evidence on omega-3-FAs unclear

Other sugary nuggets:
While dietary intervention studies comparing the consumption of added sugar to isocaloric amounts of sugar in whole fruit are lacking, the results from three RCTs suggest that consumption of naturally sweetened orange juice 85, 86 or grape juice 87 decreases risk factors compared with sugar‐sweetened beverages (SSB). In support of this, there are population studies that report that incidence/prevalence of metabolic syndrome 88, 89, CVD 90 and T2D 91-93 and their risk factors 94-96 are associated with consumption of SSB or fruit juice with added sugar 93, but not with consumption of 100% fruit juice.


HOWEVER:


Also, in keeping with the established paradigm by which positive energy balance promotes the development of metabolic syndrome through the increased insulin resistance and lipolytic activity of enlarged adipocytes 119 (Fig. 2), subjects consuming glucose exhibited higher 24‐h circulating free fatty acids (FFA) 117. In contrast, fructose consumption did not affect FFA levels. Yet it was the subjects consuming fructose who exhibited increased de novo lipogenesis (DNL), reduced fat oxidation, increased circulating TG (postprandial only), LDL‐C, sdLDL‐C, oxidized LDL, apoB, apoCIII and uric acid and decreased insulin sensitivity 117, 120, 121. The essential mechanistic feature that explains these results is that the hepatic uptake and metabolism of glucose is regulated by hepatic energy status, which allows glucose to bypass the energy‐replete liver and raise post‐meal blood glucose and insulin levels. In contrast, the hepatic uptake and metabolism of fructose is unregulated


My summary of this - if you have a *positive* energy balance, Fructose is worse than almost anything because it's unregulated by the liver.

I skipped the whole section on "do certain dietary patterns or components have the potential to promote fat gain via mechanisms that are in addition to their specific contribution of calories to the ‘energy in’ side of the energy balance equation?"

But the summary of the non-caloric sweeteners do claim the following:
Additional well‐controlled RCTs are warranted, most specifically for saccharin, acesulfame K and steviol glycosides, which have been studied less frequently than aspartame and for periods no longer than 16 weeks. More studies in children and more studies assessing metabolic and health outcomes beyond body weight, such as effects on glucose tolerance and inflammation, are needed.


   1212. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 26, 2018 at 06:54 PM (#5680128)
Laphraoig is my favorite scotch.... so I guess it's just me?


You are obviously a man of impeccable taste.
   1213. perros Posted: May 26, 2018 at 07:01 PM (#5680132)
Once you puke Laphraoig, there's no going back.
   1214. Stormy JE Posted: May 26, 2018 at 07:31 PM (#5680145)
My condolences as well. Not a good stretch of May for animals, I guess -- my eldest cat (only 7 & a couple of months), Bucky, died a week ago Friday in my passenger seat while I was speeding like a maniac to get him to the 24-hour vet; the day before, I'd taken him to my own vet, where he was sent home with a diagnosis of nothing more serious than a skin infection. *sigh*

Then Monday or so one of the feral females I'd been unable to catch abandoned her 5-kitten litter at around the 3-week mark. One died outside, but the other 4 I tried to bottle-feed to keep alive till I could get them to the vet the next day (Wednesday). Three died overnight, one the following morning at the vet's. The vet told me that the mother had to have abandoned them to begin with because they were sick, & that under the bsest-case scenario they probably wouldn't have survived a year.

Dammit all to hell.
:((( That was one awful week, gef. Please accept my condolences on your losses.
   1215. Shredder Posted: May 26, 2018 at 07:37 PM (#5680153)
1) Woodford (the regular stuff)
...
6) Knob Creek
I liked it, just not as much as the others. Honestly, my palate is pretty unsophisticated, and without lining them up in front of me and doing a taste test, it's hard to really pass judgment. I'm just kind of going off them feeling I had in terms of flavor when I drank them. It's weird, because as I said, I tend to like sweeter, but KC is lighter on the Rye (12%) than Woodford (18%).
   1216. Stormy JE Posted: May 26, 2018 at 07:38 PM (#5680154)
@bradmossesq:
Let me get this straight. The President staffed his campaign with 2 indicted tax frauds/money launderers (one pled guilty already), an agent of a foreign power (Page), and an unregistered foreign agent (Flynn), among other things.

And the scandal is that the FBI was concerned?
Folks like Moss who for well over a year ridiculed the notion that there was surveillance of the Trump campaign are really in no position today to offer smart-ass remarks like "duh, of course there was surveillance."
   1217. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 08:32 PM (#5680169)
Might need your #thoughtsandprayers as I venture in to MS-13 territory at Mission and 22nd again tonight...
   1218. Lassus Posted: May 26, 2018 at 08:38 PM (#5680174)
Man, I miss San Francisco.
   1219. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 26, 2018 at 08:41 PM (#5680175)
After Santa Fe Shooting, Have Conservatives Shot Their Wads?
The fierce response of [the Parkland massacre] kids threw conservatives off balance. And it seems to have them wrong-footed still, judging by their clumsy response to last week’s school shooting in Santa Fe, Texas.

Santa Fe was a near-perfect storm for conservative gun fans: For one thing, one of the victims of alleged killer Dimitrios Pagourtzis’s rampage was a girl who wouldn’t go out with him — which resonates embarrassingly with the misogyny of modern conservatism, abundantly evident from the insouciant pussy-grabbing of the president down to the creepy, crusty-gym-sock-scented “enforced monogamy” and “swamp witches” commentary of Intellectual Dark Web star Jordan Peterson in the New York Times.

For another, the school was being patrolled by two armed guards at the time of the massacre, which makes the “good guy with a gun” message of modern conservatives look even more like bullshit than usual. And Pagourtzis’s social media shows he was into Trump, guns, and Nazi imagery, which is just a little too on the nose.

Given this lousy material, conservatives did what they could, and that wasn’t much. The anything-but-gun-laws excuses were worse than usual. Fox News’ Sean Hannity suggested that, in lieu of gun control, “every school district needs to have some person that monitors every kid’s social media postings, maybe they need two people.” Ollie North, gun runner/traitor and new NRA president, blamed school shootings on Ritalin.

NRA deputy Riefenstahl Dana Loesch, no surprise, blamed the media: “Constantly showing the image of the murderer, constantly saying their name, is completely unnecessary,” she snarled on the telescreen; “we need to be very cognizant of what this creates.”

…There was also the usual scoffing at liberals for lack of gun arcana conversance. The main knock this time was that, in their post–Santa Fe head-shakings over gun violence, liberals mentioned assault weapons when — aha! — Pagourtzis only used a revolver and a sawed-off shotgun. Check and mate, libs! …Clearly these liberals have never done any mass murders themselves, the sissies, nor even played very much Doom II: Hell on Earth.

…“Something else is happening,” added [the American Conservative’s Rod] Dreher, putting the flashlight to his chin. “Something deeper and darker that I don’t think anybody can yet fully identify.” Maybe it’s Satan — or social media!

…At National Review…the demoralized [David] French couldn’t put his finger on it: He quoted at length from Malcolm Gladwell — always a sure sign that the author has given up — and even admitted, Dreher-like, that he favored some low-impact gun control measures, before muttering something about trench coats — see, we haven’t explored all the options! — and finishing with, “There are young men in the grip of a terrible contagion, and there is no cure coming,” i.e., ¯l_(ツ)_/¯.
   1220. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 26, 2018 at 10:04 PM (#5680208)
By the way, Jason keeps using the hash tag #whytrumpwasreelected when he thinks he flags found a liberal being too concerned about the national interest. Because he thinks he is the center and he’s already on board for trump volume two, but as always, some mean evil liberal is really at fault. They made him do it. He’s the real victim here.
   1221. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: May 26, 2018 at 10:53 PM (#5680230)
Laphraoig is as polarizing as it gets for scotch imo. I can dig it if I know I'm having one drink and it is totally independent of a meal. In other words late night and alone.
   1222. zenbitz Posted: May 26, 2018 at 11:26 PM (#5680246)
The last bottle we had the case cap said "Like kissing a mermaid who had BBQ for dinner"

   1223. Random Transaction Generator Posted: May 27, 2018 at 12:58 AM (#5680254)
The link in #1219 is borked/missing.
   1224. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:04 AM (#5680255)
It shot its wad. Sloppy seconds.
   1225. perros Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:28 AM (#5680256)
Does Village Voice even exist anymore? Or is it now an online version of the sex ads that were once its bread and butter?
   1226. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 08:33 AM (#5680259)
Does Village Voice even exist anymore? Or is it now an online version of the sex ads that were once its bread and butter?
The print edition went kaput maybe a year ago.
   1227. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 08:37 AM (#5680261)
Santa Fe was a near-perfect storm for conservative gun fans: For one thing, one of the victims of alleged killer Dimitrios Pagourtzis’s rampage was a girl who wouldn’t go out with him — which resonates embarrassingly with the misogyny of modern conservatism, abundantly evident from the insouciant #####-grabbing of the president down to the creepy, crusty-gym-sock-scented “enforced monogamy” and “swamp witches” commentary of Intellectual Dark Web star Jordan Peterson in the New York Times.
In the age of Harvey Weinstein and Larry Nassar, it's precious to read some writer refer to "modern conservatism" as the problem here.
   1228. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 08:42 AM (#5680263)
In other words late night and alone

At that point, Johnnie Walker Red works just as well.
   1229. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 08:48 AM (#5680265)
Iranian FM caught chanting 'death to US, UK, Israel':
Iranian Foreign Minister Mohammad Javad Zarif, considered a moderate by many, was caught on tape Thursday joining a crowd in a chant calling for the destruction of Iran's enemies—among them the US, UK and Israel.

The chant broke out after a speech delivered by Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei held in Tehran.

The crowd is then heard chanting "Death to America", "Death to Britain" and "Death to Israel," all while Zarif is seen smiling and mouthing the words shouted by the participants.
This is who Brussels considers a "moderate." LMAO.
   1230. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:10 AM (#5680266)
That would've been Obama, but it's not as if it's not getting worse since Trump took office, and it's not as if his hateful rhetoric isn't encouraging the offenders to think that he'll always make excuses for them. But that's what you get when government agencies essentially treat human beings as animals, and nativist politicians cheer them on.

In a better world, this report would lead to better Congressional oversight and a complete purge of the responsible officials, no matter who appointed them. In the real world of 2018, the human misery will only increase, and the blame will be put on the people who were simply trying to escape from an impossible situation.
That's the most you can do? Shrug your shoulders with "in a better world' blather that all of this repugnant #### took place under Obama and he did nothing in response? Sure, just make this all about Trump -- much like every other topic you discuss.

And where's the evidence this sort of treatment has gotten worse since the 20 January 2017?
   1231. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:11 AM (#5680267)
In the age of Harvey Weinstein and Larry Nassar, it's precious to read some writer refer to "modern conservatism" as the problem here.

This is true, since Harvey Weinstein is hardly a conservative, and who knows whom Larry Nasser voted for.

OTOH given that Donald Trump towers above every other figure among the modern conservative Republican party, it might be worth reminding us of a few problems that he presents, even if it does come in the form of a Fake News editorial from #failingNewYorkTimes.

Donald Trump’s Guide to Presidential Etiquette


Remember when President Michelle Wolf outraged the conscience of conservatives across America by cracking a joke about the press secretary’s eye makeup? Oh, wait — Ms. Wolf is a comedian. Telling jokes is her job.

A better example is President Hillary Clinton, who disregarded all protocol and endangered our national security by relying on a private email server to conduct some government business. Hold on, you say Mrs. Clinton isn’t president, either?

O.K., then — how about Barack Obama, an actual president? His disrespect for that station is the stuff of legend. A tan suit. Shirtsleeves in the Oval Office. Those big, impertinent feet defiling the presidential desk.

President Trump has managed to avoid those particular offenses. His suits are dark, his ties patriotically long. Yet in so many other ways he is violating Americans’ expectations of how presidents should behave — even of how adults should behave, particularly when children are watching. Yes, Mr. Trump has now been compared to Joseph Stalin by one senior senator from his party, and, yes, he has been pre-emptively disinvited to the prospective funeral of another. But most Republican leaders, usually such vigilant guardians of Oval Office decorum, have remained strangely silent.

So, for the fourth time in a year, we’ve compiled a list of Mr. Trump’s more egregious transgressions. These items don’t represent disputes about policy, over which reasonable people may disagree. They simply serve to catalog what Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell and all the other Trump-supporting Republicans in Congress and across America, through their silence, have now blessed as behavior befitting a president of the United States.

We find this guide a helpful way to avoid growing numb to what is so abnormal about this presidency, and to remind ourselves that a day may yet come when dignity and decency will matter again, even, perhaps, to Mr. McConnell and his fellow hypocrites.

IF YOU ARE PRESIDENT, YOU MAY NOW:

U­se your unsecured personal cellphone to call, among others, media personalities who parrot your talking points — and when you’re told this is a security risk, refuse to stop, saying that would be “too inconvenient”...

Fire your veterans affairs secretary by tweet, then pick as his replacement the White House doctor, who turns out to have a disqualifying history of alcohol abuse and handing out strong drugs

Tell Americans to observe Martin Luther King Jr. Day “with acts of civic work and community service,” and then play golf at your private course...

Mockingly imitate the accent of the Indian prime minister

Call politicians of the opposing party “treasonous” and “un-American” for declining to stand and clap during your State of the Union speech

Accuse an F.B.I. official of “treason” for sending a joke in a private text message that you take out of context

Be described by your future E.P.A. chief as likely to be “more abusive to the Constitution than Barack Obama”

Be described by your current chief of staff as “uninformed” on immigration policy

Make more than 3,000 false or misleading claims in less than 16 months in office

Try at least twice to fire the special counsel investigating you, and back off only when your White House counsel refuses to do it...

Keep an alleged domestic abuser on the White House staff and promote him, even after the F.B.I. denied him full security clearance because of the allegations, and then after he is gone, talk about your hopes of bringing him back on staff

Blame a high school gun massacre on the F.B.I. because it is “spending too much time” investigating your campaign’s possible collusion with a foreign power

Suggest that a law enforcement officer who failed to stop the massacre was a “coward,” that sheriff’s deputies who responded to the attack were “disgusting” and a “disgrace” — and later claim, despite dodging the draft because of bone spurs in your heels, that you would have rushed in, even without a weapon

Solicit campaign donations using a photo of yourself posing with a survivor of the massacre...

Congratulate the Russian president on his sham election victory even after aides warn you, “DO NOT CONGRATULATE,” and, when you call him, fail to mention Russia’s meddling in your election

Ask the deputy director of the F.B.I., in a private Oval Office conversation, whom he voted for in the last election —and later say of the request, “I don’t think it’s a big deal”...

Tell your attorney general to pressure the F.B.I. director to fire his deputy

Call your attorney general “DISGRACEFUL” on Twitter and “Mr. Magoo” in private, for following department procedure

Ask the deputy attorney general if he is “on your team”

Choose a pastor to lead a prayer at the opening of a new American Embassy in Jerusalem who previously said Jews are going to hell

Resist accounting for more than $100 million raised for your inaugural celebration...

Permit the public release of a sensitive memo prepared by your protectors on the House Intelligence Committee, who won’t even show the memo to the F.B.I. or Senate

Stream on your re-election campaign website a live list of donors giving money during your State of the Union speech...

Hire an attorney who publicly endorsed a conspiracy theory that the F.B.I. framed you

Hire another attorney who floats the prospect of presidential pardons to lawyers for top aides of yours who have pled guilty to or been indicted on federal charges during an investigation into your campaign

Hire another attorney whose office gets raided by federal authorities, then denounce the raid as an “attack on our country in a true sense”

Lie about having no knowledge of a $130,000 hush payment that your lawyer made, in the weeks before your election, to a porn actress who claims she had sex with you while your wife was at home caring for your newborn son, then later admit that you paid the money back in full, even though you omitted it on your financial disclosure form, possibly violating federal law — and even though you also didn’t sign the nondisclosure agreement that you now are trying to invoke in order to keep the porn actress silent...

When asked why you relentlessly attack the press, say, “I do it to discredit you all and demean you all, so when you write negative stories about me no one will believe you”

AND ALL OF THAT IS JUST FROM THE PAST FOUR MONTHS OR SO....

989. Stormy JE Posted: May 24, 2018 at 11:21 PM (#5679378)

############ of Mercy, you really are deep in the swamp.

1. Trump hasn't been as awful as I had feared.

So given all the above, just how much more awfulness were you fearing?

1103. Stormy JE Posted: May 25, 2018 at 03:58 PM (#5679691)

That feeling when John "women aren't home anymore to pickup the phone" isn't far right enough otherwise. Pretty soon the "purity" test for a potential RINO will be a cross between John Bolton on foreign policy and Donald Trump and Steven Miller domestically. With a dash of Mercerism thrown in for the 1%. It's a crazy coalition of shitheads you got going when Jason thinks John Kasich is closer to your average independent ("will guarantee a Trump win") than the Trump GOP.


Folks like you are too stooopid to realize that Trump represents *on balance* a move toward the center.


Just out of curiosity, what sort of cabinet would a more conservative Republican have chosen, instead of centrists like Jeff Sessions and Scott Pruitt?


   1232. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:12 AM (#5680268)
Apparently the only constituency in Ireland to vote majority "no" on abortion was Donegal.

This vote leaves Northern Ireland in an anomalous situation, with some of the strongest restrictions on abortion in the developed world. As with everything else having to do with Northern Ireland, the way forward looks extremely complicated, with some calling for liberalizing legislation directly from Westminster, and others wanting to leave the question to the Stormont parliament or to referendum (which would offer other problems and controversies).
   1233. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:14 AM (#5680269)
Trump represents *on balance* a move toward the center

I took this comment to mean that Obama had us on the fast track to turn into Venezuela, and Trump represents a comforting return to capitalist normalcy.
   1234. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:15 AM (#5680271)
That would've been Obama, but it's not as if it's not getting worse since Trump took office, and it's not as if his hateful rhetoric isn't encouraging the offenders to think that he'll always make excuses for them. But that's what you get when government agencies essentially treat human beings as animals, and nativist politicians cheer them on.

In a better world, this report would lead to better Congressional oversight and a complete purge of the responsible officials, no matter who appointed them. In the real world of 2018, the human misery will only increase, and the blame will be put on the people who were simply trying to escape from an impossible situation.

That's the most you can do? Shrug your shoulders with "in a better world' blather that all of this repugnant #### took place under Obama and he did nothing in response?

And where's the evidence this sort of treatment has gotten worse since the 20 January 2017?


Ask, and you shall receive:

Trump takes ‘shackles’ off ICE, which is slapping them on immigrants who thought they were safe
A week after he won the election, President Donald Trump promised that his administration would round up millions of immigrant gang members and drug dealers. And after he took office, arrests by Immigration and Customs Enforcement officers surged 40 percent.

Officials at the agency commonly known as ICE praise Trump for putting teeth back into immigration enforcement, and they say their agency continues to prioritize national security threats and violent criminals, much as the Obama administration did.

But as ICE officers get wider latitude to determine whom they detain, the biggest jump in arrests has been of immigrants with no criminal convictions. The agency made 37,734 “noncriminal” arrests in the government’s 2017 fiscal year, more than twice the number in the previous year. The category includes suspects facing possible charges as well as those without criminal records.

Critics say ICE is increasingly grabbing at the lowest-hanging fruit of deportation-eligible immigrants to meet the president’s unrealistic goals, replacing a targeted system with a scattershot approach aimed at boosting the agency’s enforcement statistics.

ICE has not carried out mass roundups or major workplace raids under Trump, but nearly every week brings a contentious new arrest.

A Virginia mother was sent back to El Salvador in June after her 11 years in the United States unraveled because of a traffic stop. A Connecticut man with an American-born wife and children and no criminal record was deported to Guatemala last week. And an immigration activist in New York, Ravi Ragbir, was detained in January in a case that brought ICE a scathing rebuke from a federal judge.

“It ought not to be – and it has never before been – that those who have lived without incident in this country for years are subjected to treatment we associate with regimes we revile as unjust,” said U.S. District Judge Katherine Forrest, reading her opinion in court before ordering ICE to release Ragbir.

“We are not that country,” she said.

Immigrants whose only crime was living in the country illegally were largely left alone during the latter years of the Obama administration. But that policy has been scrapped.

Those facing deportation who show up for periodic “check-ins” with ICE to appeal for more time in the United States can no longer be confident that good behavior will spare them from detention. Once-routine appointments now can end with the immigrants in handcuffs.

More broadly, the Trump administration has given street-level ICE officers and field directors greater latitude to determine whom they arrest and under what conditions, breaking with the more selective enforcement approach of President Barack Obama’s second term.

Trump officials have likened this to taking “the shackles off,” and they say morale at ICE is up because its officers have regained the authority to detain anyone they suspect of being in the country illegally.

Officers are detaining suspects in courthouses more often, and ICE teams no longer shy from taking additional people into custody when they knock on doors to arrest a targeted person. ...
   1235. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:18 AM (#5680272)
Trump represents *on balance* a move toward the center

I took this comment to mean that Obama had us on the fast track to turn into Venezuela, and Trump represents a comforting return to capitalist normalcy.

Yeah, I guess that's how a Trump apologist would be seeing things. But brother, that "*on balace*" is going to get a hernia from doing all that lifting.
   1236. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:36 AM (#5680273)
Just out of curiosity, what sort of cabinet would a more conservative Republican have chosen, instead of centrists like Jeff Sessions and Scott Pruitt?
I listed five issues on Friday where Trump moved the party left compared to four years earlier: Infrastructure, parental leave, immigration, entitlement reform, and prison reform. I should have added a sixth: trade.

Jeff Sessions and Scott Pruitt don't change that.
   1237. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:39 AM (#5680274)
Ask, and you shall receive:
No one's contesting that arrests and deportations are up but where's the evidence that the alleged abuse that the ACLU highlighted is worse now?
   1238. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:56 AM (#5680275)
Trump moved the party left … parental leave

Just to pick this one item: has Trump done anything on the parental-leave score, except a bit of yakking (mostly by Ivanka)? Has the GOP followed suit by pressing for parental-leave measures, federally or at the state level? This is a genuinely open question; there may be lots of stuff I haven't heard about.
   1239. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 09:59 AM (#5680276)
Regarding the Ireland referendum, it's still worth pointing out that there isn't a single red state in America that has tougher abortion restrictions than most of Europe, where abortion is banned after 12 weeks.
   1240. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:03 AM (#5680277)
Just to pick this one item: has Trump done anything on the parental-leave score, except a bit of yakking (mostly by Ivanka)?
Parental leave was in his latest budget proposal. I don't know how it has trickled down to the state level but it's no longer knee-jerk verboten for conservatives to back such a measure.
   1241. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:06 AM (#5680278)
I don't know how it has trickled down to the state level

I can tell you that in Texas the level of discussion is zero. Maybe elsewhere conservatives are proceeding. At least something appeared in the budget proposal, though if there's no chance Congress will follow up, such proposals are notoriously cheap talk. But even talk, I grant you, is something.
   1242. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:14 AM (#5680279)
there isn't a single red state in America that has tougher abortion restrictions than most of Europe

Yes and no. Most states (and of course the federal government) prohibit public funding of abortion, and those that provide it are relatively blue. Meanwhile red states have been moving to limit access, as in Texas. By comparison, in Western Europe, most nations provide public funding; a lot of abortions in England, for instance, are funded by the NHS. So while there may be theoretical aspects in American red states that are more liberal than those in some European countries (mostly thanks to Roe v. Wade, of course), the practical reality in Europe tends to be quite a bit more liberal.
   1243. Lassus Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:17 AM (#5680280)
I should have added a sixth: trade.

Was there a massive cliff to the left of Romney?
   1244. Count Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:31 AM (#5680284)
I don't think running an anti-immigrant campaign based on racist lies and then separating parents from their children at the border is moving to the "left" on immigration.
   1245. Count Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:34 AM (#5680285)
Trump's definitely not guilty and he has the tweets in the last day to prove it (bolded the best one):

@realDonaldTrump
8m8 minutes ago
More
Why didn’t the 13 Angry Democrats investigate the campaign of Crooked Hillary Clinton, many crimes, much Collusion with Russia? Why didn’t the FBI take the Server from the DNC? Rigged Investigation!

@realDonaldTrump
2h2 hours ago
More
Who’s going to give back the young and beautiful lives (and others) that have been devastated and destroyed by the phony Russia Collusion Witch Hunt? They journeyed down to Washington, D.C., with stars in their eyes and wanting to help our nation...They went back home in tatters!

@realDonaldTrump
19h19 hours ago
More
When will the 13 Angry Democrats (& those who worked for President O), reveal their disqualifying Conflicts of Interest? It’s been a long time now! Will they be indelibly written into the Report along with the fact that the only Collusion is with the Dems, Justice, FBI & Russia?

@realDonaldTrump
19h19 hours ago
More
This whole Russia Probe is Rigged. Just an excuse as to why the Dems and Crooked Hillary lost the Election and States that haven’t been lost in decades. 13 Angry Democrats, and all Dems if you include the people who worked for Obama for 8 years. #SPYGATE & CONFLICTS OF INTEREST!

@realDonaldTrump
19h19 hours ago
More
With Spies, or “Informants” as the Democrats like to call them because it sounds less sinister (but it’s not), all over my campaign, even from a very early date, why didn’t the crooked highest levels of the FBI or “Justice” contact me to tell me of the phony Russia problem?
   1246. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:35 AM (#5680286)

A Virginia mother was sent back to El Salvador in June after her 11 years in the United States unraveled because of a traffic stop. A Connecticut man with an American-born wife and children and no criminal record was deported to Guatemala last week. And an immigration activist in New York, Ravi Ragbir, was detained in January in a case that brought ICE a scathing rebuke from a federal judge.
We've been over this before, Andy. Pure hackery to mention Ragbir in an article supposedly about Trump allegedly deporting people indiscriminately. Ragbir was convicted of a multimillion dollar mortgage fraud. He was ordered deported more than a decade ago. He's exactly the sort of person who even amnestyers claim to agree should be deported: a convicted felon. (The "scathing rebuke" was only that he should have been given time to put his affairs in order, not that there was something wrong with his being deported.)
   1247. Count Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:36 AM (#5680287)
Trump is blaming his unpopular racist immigration policies on Democrats:

@realDonaldTrump
1d1 day ago
More
Put pressure on the Democrats to end the horrible law that separates children from there parents once they cross the Border into the U.S. Catch and Release, Lottery and Chain must also go with it and we MUST continue building the WALL! DEMOCRATS ARE PROTECTING MS-13 THUGS.


There isn't a law saying you have to separate children from parents, it's a policy that the Trump administration put into place.
   1248. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:43 AM (#5680288)
He also doesn’t know the difference between “there” and “their”. I can see why the Stupids gravitate towards him.
   1249. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:49 AM (#5680289)

Who’s going to give back the young and beautiful lives (and others) that have been devastated and destroyed by the phony Russia Collusion Witch Hunt? They journeyed down to Washington, D.C., with stars in their eyes and wanting to help our nation...They went back home in tatters


On this a Memorial Day weekend let us not forget those who have given their well-being to make America great again.
   1250. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:49 AM (#5680290)
Jason’s entire list of policies where they’ve moved “left” is bullshit.
   1251. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:49 AM (#5680291)
Yes and no. Most states (and of course the federal government) prohibit public funding of abortion, and those that provide it are relatively blue. Meanwhile red states have been moving to limit access, as in Texas. By comparison, in Western Europe, most nations provide public funding; a lot of abortions in England, for instance, are funded by the NHS. So while there may be theoretical aspects in American red states that are more liberal than those in some European countries (mostly thanks to Roe v. Wade, of course), the practical reality in Europe tends to be quite a bit more liberal.
I agree with some of what you say, but not the conclusion. I don't think abortion rights fanatics would view a 12-week ban as "quite a bit more liberal." Abortion rights people here freak out over 20-week cutoffs.

If a state tried to enact the common European model here -- funding through 12-weeks, ban thereafter -- we'd hear applause about the taxpayer funding, but then we'd hear hysterics about how lots of women just don't know they're pregnant by 12 weeks, and about how women just can't be expected to make a decision that quickly, and about how they just can't find the time to take off from work, and...
   1252. greenback made it work, honey Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:51 AM (#5680292)
No one's contesting that arrests and deportations are up but where's the evidence that the alleged abuse that the ACLU highlighted is worse now?

The only people who care about this "worse now" question are people who track the fake Internet points. Yes, Napolitano was a monster and Obama wasn't nearly as progressive on immigration as his supporters try to pretend.

But this is Juanaboutism. The R's control the White House, Congress, and the Supreme Court. Trump has made it clear with his rhetoric that he has no intention of doing the right thing. After Cantor got primaried, R's in Congress have made it clear they won't do the right thing. You own this ####### policy now.
   1253. Count Posted: May 27, 2018 at 10:56 AM (#5680293)
Obama was criticized from the left for his immigration crackdown. IIRC the theory was that he was trying to create space for an immigration deal but that never happened because of divisions in the Republican party. (Which doesn't let Obama off the hook for a needless crackdown in the first place - I am not against controlling the level of immigration in this country but cracking down solely for political purposes when there's no reason to think it will help Americans is gross).
   1254. SouthSideRyan Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:06 AM (#5680294)
Who’s going to give back the young and beautiful lives (and others) that have been devastated and destroyed by the phony Russia Collusion Witch Hunt? They journeyed down to Washington, D.C., with stars in their eyes and wanting to help our nation...They went back home in tatters


I know breaking down this idiot's syntax is a waste of my time, but what the hell is that parenthetical supposed to mean?

ETA: Other lives that are neither young nor beautiful I guess?
   1255. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:08 AM (#5680295)
Jason’s entire list of policies where they’ve moved “left” is bullshit

Moving down the list :)

Infrastructure isn't happening – again, I wonder how much of it was just talk to begin with. Even the original Bannon trillion-dollar plan was going to require states to fund construction and the feds merely to make it cheaper via tax breaks. In practice both parties have long loved pork projects, but actually moving the GOP toward funding them directly on any scale – I don't think Trump has moved the party an inch to the left on this one.

Immigration, yeah, no. I mean, except that Trump has assured us he has a big heart on this one.

Entitlement reform: Not quite sure what this means. Conservatives usually employ "entitlement reform" to mean privatizing Social Security or other such "let's break open this public piggy bank and stuff the money in our pockets" ideas. To the extent that Trump hasn't shown much inclination to promote this, good for him. But Republicans have found this kind of reform a tough hurdle before, even with a President inclined to promote it. I guess Paul Ryan's plan to dismantle Medicare failed, but that wasn't much Trump's doing.

Prison reform: Here JE may have a point, given the recent House bill, which Trump has supported strongly.

Trade: Maybe. Protectionist trade wars are as popular with some on the left as they are with some on the far right, so this could be an area where you move so far one way you're back around the other.

   1256. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:12 AM (#5680296)
If a state tried to enact the common European model here -- funding through 12-weeks, ban thereafter -- we'd hear applause about the taxpayer funding, but then we'd hear hysterics about how lots of women just don't know they're pregnant by 12 weeks, and about how women just can't be expected to make a decision that quickly, and about how they just can't find the time to take off from work, and...

It varies from country to country of course, but most EU countries have numerous exceptions 12 week cutoff. Including for both the physical and emotional health of the mother. If a mother is struggling that much with the decision, getting an exemption probably will not be too difficult in many places.

That aside, I have always said that viability as a standard is morally speaking a complete abortion. Saying you can kill this fetus at this point in a pregnancy right now, but in 10 years when we have new super incubators it will totes be murder, is disgusting. Either that thing inside the womb at that age has a right to live, or it doesn't. Of course, it is quite obvious why nobody on the left wants to give an inch on the point.
   1257. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:13 AM (#5680297)
I know breaking down this idiot's syntax is a waste of my time, but what the hell is that parenthetical supposed to mean?

The old and ugly lives that have been destroyed, like his own. Duh.
   1258. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:40 AM (#5680299)
Obama was criticized from the left for his immigration crackdown. IIRC the theory was that he was trying to create space for an immigration deal but that never happened because of divisions in the Republican party. (Which doesn't let Obama off the hook for a needless crackdown in the first place - I am not against controlling the level of immigration in this country but cracking down solely for political purposes when there's no reason to think it will help Americans is gross).

Obama issued his EO in the wake of the bill that passed the Senate but wasn't even allowed to reach the floor in the House. And while that ACLU report rightly takes him to task, it ends with 2014 and doesn't reflect the about face on enforcement emphasis that took place after that----an about face which Trump and Sessions have loudly and gleefully reversed.

It's one thing to argue that Obama's EO was unlawful and that Trump and Sessions are only enforcing the law. It's another thing altogether to pretend that under Trump and Sessions, ICE hasn't reached a new level of gratuitous cruelty.

It's also rather telling, though completely unsurprising, that JE doesn't even bother to try to refute the points in that Times editorial----all of which, BTW, are supported by links within each paragraph. At this point I get the feeling (Political Incorrectness Trigger Warning) that JE's ideal solution to the Trumpian Train Wreck would be for some illegal alien terrorist sympathizer, preferably a Muslim, assassinate him while he was giving a Memorial Day speech at Arlington cemetery. That way he'd be rid of Trump for good, which would spare him from having to hide under his bed every time someone points out that the Emperor is naked, but OTOH the Fake News industry would find a way to link the assassin to the entire Democratic Party. It'd be a total win-win.
   1259. perros Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:53 AM (#5680301)
Either that thing inside the womb at that age has a right to live, or it doesn't.


It's alive!
   1260. perros Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:55 AM (#5680302)

On this a Memorial Day weekend let us not forget those who have given their well-being to make America great again.


Venereal disease is no laughing matter.
   1261. perros Posted: May 27, 2018 at 11:59 AM (#5680304)
don't think running an anti-immigrant campaign based on racist lies and then separating parents from their children at the border is moving to the "left" on immigration.


They left the children to traffickers.
   1262. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:09 PM (#5680313)
I know breaking down this idiot's syntax is a waste of my time, but what the hell is that parenthetical supposed to mean?


He's intentionally carving out space for Ivanka, Jared, and Don Jr.
   1263. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5680314)
It's also rather telling, though completely unsurprising, that JE doesn't even bother to try to refute the points in that Times editorial----all of which, BTW, are supported by links within each paragraph.

Where is this editorial from your beloved Gray Lady?
At this point I get the feeling (Political Incorrectness Trigger Warning) that JE's ideal solution to the Trumpian Train Wreck would be for some illegal alien terrorist sympathizer, preferably a Muslim, assassinate him while he was giving a Memorial Day speech at Arlington cemetery. That way he'd be rid of Trump for good, which would spare him from having to hide under his bed every time someone points out that the Emperor is naked, but OTOH the Fake News industry would find a way to link the assassin to the entire Democratic Party. It'd be a total win-win.

Poor Andy. He still can't fathom someone who approves of *most* of the administration's policy decisions and relieved Trump's not as batshit crazy as feared while still harboring a solid dislike for the guy.

Sorry, Andy, but we do exist.
   1264. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:12 PM (#5680315)
At this point I get the feeling (Political Incorrectness Trigger Warning) that JE's ideal solution to the Trumpian Train Wreck


You're still on last year's Jason, Andy. At this point, Jason is fully fledged Trumpkin. He sees no "train wreck." He sees a "moderate" administration just trying to pass a few "conservative" laws here or there, and a Deep State + Liberal Media Conspiracy to harm his President which must be attacked by all "true patriots." It's the price he's paid, this twisting of logic and morality, to get to his only needed end-game; war with Iran.
   1265. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:15 PM (#5680316)
That aside, I have always said that viability as a standard is morally speaking a complete abortion. Saying you can kill this fetus at this point in a pregnancy right now, but in 10 years when we have new super incubators it will totes be murder, is disgusting. Either that thing inside the womb at that age has a right to live, or it doesn't. Of course, it is quite obvious why nobody on the left wants to give an inch on the point.
So your view is "that thing inside the womb" has no rights until it manages to stick its head all the way through the vaginal call? Or do the toes have to be seen too?

Maybe you ought to sit this discussion out...
   1266. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:16 PM (#5680317)
Poor Andy. He still can't fathom someone who approves of *most* of the administration's policy decisions


No one with a basic moral spine could conceive of such. That you can indicates your basic failing as a human being.
   1267. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:16 PM (#5680318)
The 1,475 misplaced immigrant children are not a human or a political problem. John Kelly assured an interviewer that they will be "put into foster care or whatever."
   1268. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:17 PM (#5680319)
So your view is "that thing inside the womb" has no rights


You understand that in order to worry about abortion you'd need to touch a woman first, yeah?
   1269. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:21 PM (#5680321)
Stick with what works indeed:
While many car owners would love to kick back with a good book while the family minivan whisks their brood down the interstate, driving stick appeals to those who seek tangible experiences in an era of digital assistants and apps for just about everything. These die-hards fear that the car, long a symbol of freedom and spontaneity, is becoming just another numbing high-tech appliance. Meanwhile, vehicles that still offer stick shifts telegraph an image of high performance, toughness, nostalgia and fun—all factors that can seduce new customers. ...

There certainly is joy in changing gears in rhythm with the car. Some people get a tingle from the sound of the engine revving as they slide down into a lower gear while threading winding roads like Connecticut’s Merritt Parkway or the curvy section of U.S. Route 129 in North Carolina, known as the Tail of the Dragon. Taking on twisting, scenic routes in a nimble sports car with a manual transmission can feel like a masterful fox trot. Think of the opening in the original 1969 version of “The Italian Job,” in which a man drives a Lamborghini Miura along the Great St. Bernard Pass in the Alps that links Italy and Switzerland. Skip the part where it tumbles down the cliff.

Not everyone agrees, of course. The appetite for shifting gears by hand first began to dim in the 1940s when automatic transmissions like the Oldsmobile Hydra-Matic started catching on among consumers. In 1965 celebrated auto writer Ken Purdy broke many sports-car fans’ hearts by opining that automatic transmissions were surpassing stick shifts and would soon push them into obsolescence. But the sticks are still here and car companies keep churning them out while updating other parts of their vehicles with the latest automation technology. Car makers will continue to woo customers with the promise of good times that come with manual transmissions. While not quite booming, the market for stick shift cars has a loyal, respectable following. Sticks accounted for around 5% of the more than 17 million new vehicles sold in the U.S. last year—which means well over half a million drivers were working the clutch on the way home from the dealer showroom.

BMW’s Mr. Plucinsky said the number of people buying manual transmissions today makes it worthwhile for his company to keep building them. “This group of customers doesn’t appear to be shrinking,” he said.
I got to drive through the narrow streets and roads in and around Croton-on-Hudson yesterday and it reminded me why those who buy muscle cars and roadsters equipped with automatics are truly history's greatest monsters.
   1270. The Yankee Clapper Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:44 PM (#5680328)
There isn't a law saying you have to separate children from parents, it's a policy that the Trump administration put into place.

Misleading euphemisms are a staple of those who object to enforcing the immigration laws. "Separating children from their parents" just means not arresting minors when their parents are arrested for illegally crossing the border. American citizens don't get a pass because they have children if they are arrested, so more favorable treatment of non-citizens attempting to illegally enter the country wouldn't appear to be warranted.
   1271. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:46 PM (#5680330)
That aside, I have always said that viability as a standard is morally speaking a complete abortion. Saying you can kill this fetus at this point in a pregnancy right now, but in 10 years when we have new super incubators it will totes be murder, is disgusting. Either that thing inside the womb at that age has a right to live, or it doesn't. Of course, it is quite obvious why nobody on the left wants to give an inch on the point.

So your view is "that thing inside the womb" has no rights until it manages to stick its head all the way through the vaginal call? Or do the toes have to be seen too?

I have no idea how that can be your takeaway from what I wrote. Well I do have an idea, but it involves your brain being addled with excessive amounts of cheeto dust.

But to put it very very clearly. I think the 12 week standard in most of Europe is much, much, much better than the US version.
   1272. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 01:52 PM (#5680332)
I think the 12 week standard in most of Europe is much, much, much better than the US version.
Now come over here and advocate such an abortion policy. The loony left won't give a flying #### about the exceptions you describe and within hours you'll be portrayed as more dangerous than a thousand Kevin Williamsons.
   1273. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:00 PM (#5680334)
Now come over here and advocate such an abortion policy. The loony left won't give a flying #### about the exceptions you describe and you'll be portrayed as more dangerous than a thousand Kevin Williamsons.

Well you are always so quick to blame everything bad republicans do on the left. The right can own this one. As I said, it is obvious why no one on the left wants to give an inch on the matter. The right are absolutists on the matter, and they are not going to stop until abortion is completely outlawed.
   1274. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:07 PM (#5680336)
The right are absolutists on the matter, and they are not going to stop until abortion is completely outlawed.
So the left wants abortion-on-demand *because* many conservatives ultimately want abortion outlawed? LOL.

It's as if you pull these shitty arguments from the crack of your ass.
   1275. BDC Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:11 PM (#5680339)
vehicles that still offer stick shifts telegraph an image of high performance, toughness, nostalgia and fun

I can assure you this is not the case with my 2018 Honda Fit.
   1276. Fancy Crazy Town Banana Pants Handle Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:12 PM (#5680340)
It's as if you pull these shitty arguments from the crack of your ass.

I will remember that, the next time you use the same logic.
   1277. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:21 PM (#5680344)
Dean Obeidallah:
This Memorial Day weekend lets honor the women and men who bravely sacrificed their lives fighting to protect our nation's freedoms by RESISTING Trump's attacks on our democracy.

#TheResistance is the highest form of Patriotism!
Dumbest tweet of Memorial Day weekend? Or ever? I mean, FFS, this was Sammy-level stooopidity.
   1278. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:27 PM (#5680348)
So the left wants abortion-on-demand *because* many conservatives ultimately want abortion outlawed?


No, we want abortion-on-demand OF conservatives.
   1279. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:29 PM (#5680349)
Dumbest tweet of Memorial Day weekend?


Don't let them tear you off that keyboard, warrior. They want you on that listserv. They NEED you on that listserv.
   1280. Lassus Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:30 PM (#5680350)
Dumbest tweet of Memorial Day weekend?

It's hilarious and sad you think this is dumber than Trump's work this weekend.
   1281. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:32 PM (#5680351)
Misleading euphemisms are a staple of those who object to enforcing the immigration laws. "Separating children from their parents" just means not arresting minors when their parents are arrested for illegally crossing the border. American citizens don't get a pass because they have children if they are arrested, so more favorable treatment of non-citizens attempting to illegally enter the country wouldn't appear to be warranted.
Except that they're also applying this policy for asylum seekers, not just parents arrested for illegally crossing the border.
   1282. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 02:53 PM (#5680358)
Except that they're also applying this policy for asylum seekers, not just parents arrested for illegally crossing the border.


Someone really needs to go through Don Jr's bank receipts for the time these kids got "lost."
   1283. Ray (CTL) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 03:24 PM (#5680366)
Thought experiment. Set aside ideology. Question:

Has Trump learned much about the structure and function of government in 17 months on the job? The roles of the three branches; the constraints on presidential power and on executive orders; the courts, the law, the powers of the FBI, the Constitution, the oversight roles of Congress, how a law gets passed, budgets, the 10th Amendment, the levers of power the federal government has over states via funding, etc.

Would an 8th grader still know more than Trump after taking a civics class?
   1284. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 03:27 PM (#5680367)
It's also rather telling, though completely unsurprising, that JE doesn't even bother to try to refute the points in that Times editorial----all of which, BTW, are supported by links within each paragraph.

Where is this editorial from your beloved Gray Lady?


I guess you didn't follow the link the first time around (see #1231 above), but here it is again. And there's a supporting link for every paragraph within.

Donald Trump’s Guide to Presidential Etiquette

At this point I get the feeling (Political Incorrectness Trigger Warning) that JE's ideal solution to the Trumpian Train Wreck would be for some illegal alien terrorist sympathizer, preferably a Muslim, assassinate him while he was giving a Memorial Day speech at Arlington cemetery. That way he'd be rid of Trump for good, which would spare him from having to hide under his bed every time someone points out that the Emperor is naked, but OTOH the Fake News industry would find a way to link the assassin to the entire Democratic Party. It'd be a total win-win.

Poor Andy. He still can't fathom someone who approves of *most* of the administration's policy decisions and relieved Trump's not as batshit crazy as feared while still harboring a solid dislike for the guy.

Sorry, Andy, but we do exist.


I'm still not sure how any president can be any more batshit crazy than the one you're supporting. Just how much more evidence do you require? Short of starting a war, how could any president be more erratic and bombastic than Donald Trump, not to mention more corrupt and racist? He's like the perfect combination of Earl Long, Edward Koch, Rod Blagojevich and Joe Arpaio.

Just exactly what were you expecting? That he actually would shoot someone on Fifth Avenue?
   1285. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 03:32 PM (#5680370)
vehicles that still offer stick shifts telegraph an image of high performance, toughness, nostalgia and fun

All I've ever owned are stick shifts. They're both cheaper than automatics and better for keeping you focused.
   1286. Ishmael Posted: May 27, 2018 at 03:40 PM (#5680374)
On the subject of immigration, if you're a reader of the Crooked Timber blog you might be interested to read Chris Bertram's just published book, Do States Have the Right to Exclude Immigrants?

As you'll probably already know if you do read Crooked Timber:
The book challenges the assumption that lies behind most debates on immigration, namely that states have a discretion to do pretty much as they like and may set their policy according to the interests of their own citizens.

I'm hoping to pick it up soon.

Link
   1287. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: May 27, 2018 at 04:27 PM (#5680390)
JE, #1274, responding to #1273:
LOL. It's as if you pull these shitty arguments from the crack of your ass.

It's called concealed carry.
   1288. David Nieporent (now, with children) Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:09 PM (#5680398)
I'm still not sure how any president can be any more batshit crazy than the one you're supporting. Just how much more evidence do you require? Short of starting a war,
There you go again, Andy. You do that all the freaking time. You ask a question and then you say, "Except for the answer, what's the answer?"

how could any president be more erratic and bombastic than Donald Trump, not to mention more corrupt and racist? He's like the perfect combination of Earl Long, Edward Koch, Rod Blagojevich and Joe Arpaio.
He could do more things. Most of his tweets are exactly what you said -- erratic and bombastic. But that's all they are: tweets. They're things he says, not things he does. He actually does very little. Maybe that's because people in his administration have stopped him from doing the craziest stuff, but that's part of the equation. If he were as bad as one could've reasonably feared, he could've fired Mueller. He could've sicced various agencies on his enemies (including the media). Instead of just posting whining tweets that DOJ won't send SWAT teams to Chappaqua to Lock Her Up! he could have ordered it done. He could have ignored court orders, such as those blocking his notaban. And, yes, he could've nuked Belgium.

As much as you condemn Sessions -- because you confuse policy differences with qualifications -- it could've been a lot worse. He could've nominated Jeanine Pirro or Michael Cohen to be AG. Or Roy Moore. Or he could've nominated Moore instead of Gorsuch for SCOTUS. Or could've named one of his flunkies at Trump Tower to be his Chief of Staff. He could've nominated Ann Coulter to be Secretary of State. Whatever; I'm just brainstorming here. I'm guessing none of those would've been confirmed, but that's not the point. Those would be far batshittier crazier, and even if they failed would've been far more disruptive to the country.
   1289. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:25 PM (#5680401)
the narrow streets and roads in and around Croton-on-Hudson yesterday
.

Jason, you should've called when you were in the neighborhood! Some great roads around here. Bear Mountain Parkway, going north around Anthony's Nose and down to the Bear Mountain Bridge, then west to the Palisades Parkway, Croton Avenue, heading south around the reservoir. Great views of the Hudson traveling south on Rte 9 between Peekskill and Croton.

I learned to drive on a stick shift and have always loved them. But our last 2 cars of been Priuses; they have the continuous variable transmission, which is (for me) much better than your ordinary automatic. So the only time I get to drive a stick anymore is when we rent a car over in the UK or Ireland. Unfortunately, our last two trips we haven't used a car, and we're not going this year. Maybe
   1290. Random Transaction Generator Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:28 PM (#5680403)
You can take George Takei off the "Weinstein" list.

And one of the more painful accusations to come out of the entertainment industry’s outing of sexual predators in its midst came from a man named Scott Brunton, who said in November that beloved Star Trek actor and social-media personality George Takei had drugged and groped him after a night out in 1981. Now, Brunton has walked back his story in a new report from Observer, and Takei has responded with forgiveness.
   1291. Hysterical & Useless Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:33 PM (#5680404)
it could've been a lot worse. He could've nominated Jeanine Pirro or Michael Cohen to be AG. Or Roy Moore. Or he could've nominated Moore instead of Gorsuch for SCOTUS. Or could've named one of his flunkies at Trump Tower to be his Chief of Staff. He could've nominated Ann Coulter to be Secretary of State. Whatever; I'm just brainstorming here


David, are you angling for a slot in the administration? Honest to god, you send up trial balloons like those, you're sure to be getting calls.
   1292. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:47 PM (#5680407)
how could any president be more erratic and bombastic than Donald Trump, not to mention more corrupt and racist? He's like the perfect combination of Earl Long, Edward Koch, Rod Blagojevich and Joe Arpaio.

He could do more things. Most of his tweets are exactly what you said -- erratic and bombastic. But that's all they are: tweets. They're things he says, not things he does. He actually does very little.


Well, other than fire people at a rate that only his former Apprentice character could possibly top.

Maybe that's because people in his administration have stopped him from doing the craziest stuff, but that's part of the equation. If he were as bad as one could've reasonably feared, he could've fired Mueller.

Which I agree he probably won't do, because there are limits even to Trump's stupidity.

He could've sicced various agencies on his enemies (including the media). Instead of just posting whining tweets that DOJ won't send SWAT teams to Chappaqua to Lock Her Up! he could have ordered it done. He could have ignored court orders, such as those blocking his notaban. And, yes, he could've nuked Belgium.

I suppose the point being made here is that he's not Huey Long. I think I knew that, though I might add that Huey Long at least had the virtue of not being a racist.

But what, exactly, was inaccurate about my above description of him as being "the perfect combination of Earl Long, Edward Koch, Rod Blagojevich and Joe Arpaio"? He's as erratic as Huey's younger brother, as bombastic as Hizzoner, arguably as corrupt as Blagojevich, and with a history of racism that's certainly in the neighborhood of Sheriff Joe.

I'd ask you to to ponder that thought for awhile, but its point is better directed at JE, since your own posted comments about Trump have implicitly made many similar comparisons.

As much as you condemn Sessions -- because you confuse policy differences with qualifications -- it could've been a lot worse. He could've nominated Jeanine Pirro or Michael Cohen to be AG. Or Roy Moore. Or he could've nominated Moore instead of Gorsuch for SCOTUS. Or could've named one of his flunkies at Trump Tower to be his Chief of Staff. He could've nominated Ann Coulter to be Secretary of State. Whatever; I'm just brainstorming here. I'm guessing none of those would've been confirmed, but that's not the point. Those would be far batshittier crazier, and even if they failed would've been far more disruptive to the country.

Here I think you'll agree that you've just about lowered the bar to a point where the world's tiniest caterpillar would be hard pressed to crawl under it. You might as well have said that he could've appointed Sean Hannity as his chief unofficial confidant.......oh, wait.....
   1293. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:50 PM (#5680409)
Gabriel Malor thread:
Quick, devise a system where you have to deal with families, including children, in a detained setting. Also, you aren't allowed to build new detention centers, you must figure out how to use the ones you've got.
One solution is to release the children into the custody of guardians—usually family, but sometimes not. And sometimes—not always, but not a trivial number—those children do not appear for their court dates.
Is that horrifying? Well, pick your poison. You want DHS and HHS to keep track of them? Okay, they'll stay in jail until their court date.

Oh, that's inhumane? Well, they can be released to guardians. Which means that DHS and HHS can't watch them every minute. You pick.
To return to this thread of a few days ago (scroll up), the solution being advanced by many appears to be to simply release the families intact within the United States. That used to be an option, but then smugglers started claiming small children were theirs if they got caught.
The responses here are practically Trumpian—take a deeply complicated policy issue that has vexed decisiontakers for decades, declare that it has a simple solution that is morally imperative.
It's the easy button argument. Trump does it all the time, and it seems his detractors can't help but adopt it too.
   1294. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 05:54 PM (#5680410)
Jason, you should've called when you were in the neighborhood! Some great roads around here. Bear Mountain Parkway, going north around Anthony's Nose and down to the Bear Mountain Bridge, then west to the Palisades Parkway, Croton Avenue, heading south around the reservoir. Great views of the Hudson traveling south on Rte 9 between Peekskill and Croton.

I learned to drive on a stick shift and have always loved them. But our last 2 cars of been Priuses; they have the continuous variable transmission, which is (for me) much better than your ordinary automatic. So the only time I get to drive a stick anymore is when we rent a car over in the UK or Ireland. Unfortunately, our last two trips we haven't used a car, and we're not going this year. Maybe
Aside from your narrow and winding streets, H&U, I always get a kick pulling up on Old Post Road to one of only three dummy lights in the state.
   1295. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:02 PM (#5680411)
@neontaster:
Elon Musk: Give me 500 billion tax dollars and I'll make a machine that teleports you using soap bubbles. It's called BubbleWarp.
Everyone: YASSS BEAR MY CHILDREN, TONY STARK!
Elon Musk: Not a huge fan of the media, though.
Everyone: OMG REAL LIFE SUPERVILLAIN!
Hehehe.
   1296. Lassus Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:06 PM (#5680413)
The responses here are practically Trumpian

This has become genuinely disturbing to watch.


And now we're back to Elon Musk, fallen liberal hero. FFS.
   1297. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:09 PM (#5680414)
And now we're back to Elon Musk, liberal hero. FFS.
Hey, we're also back in Croton-on-Hudson. Hi-five!
   1298. Stormy JE Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:23 PM (#5680415)
Stephen Miller (the other one):
Editor in chief of the New York Times Magazine also just now discovering how inhumanly immigrant children were treated in 2014

Also Stephen Miller:
So weird how Linda Sarsour, an Obama Pod Bro, Shaun King, a NYT editor & a CNN reporter all tweeted the exact same AZ central article thinking it was 2018 & not 2014. How do those things happen? It’s a Scooby mystery that may never be solved.
It's like there's an echo, echo, echo...
   1299. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:29 PM (#5680417)
If the state can’t devise a system to humanely care for children of detained individuals the. The state is morally required to not detain them at all.
   1300. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: May 27, 2018 at 06:34 PM (#5680418)
Jason doesn’t care about any of these children. He cares that the separation of children from families and then being lost to sex slave traders might be an effective ad for democrats.
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