3101. Jolly Old St. Nick Points To The Sky Posted: November 06, 2012 at 04:14 PM (#4294831)

EDIT: I voted early at Horner Park, so I don't know if the problems you describe are occurring at my precinct today or not. Hope not, obviously.

So you're saying that an ostensibly voluntary arrangement turns out not to be voluntary at all after you look at the circumstances surrounding it? That ostensible consent doesn't make everything okay?

Bioshock II was a let down (but still fun at times), and the multiplayer was a f*cking sh!t sandwich.

It's the obvious response to your assertion that blacks weren't able to leave the South *during the Jim Crow era*.

There's nothing even ostensibly voluntary about the "contract" to pay taxes.

No; I'm saying that "ostensibly" doesn't mean what you think it means.¹ There's nothing ostensibly voluntary about it.

NBC's RCA 501 "electronic computer" gives Kennedy 333 to 1 odds of winning the 1960 election as of midnight on election night,

And you would have a magic talking unicorn as a pet, too.

The Definitive List Of Who Athletes Are Voting For, So You Can Decide If You’ll Hate Them From Now On

And of course you don't have to leave. The liberal retort to "love it or leave it" was "love it .. and make it better". Which you have the option of doing. But nonetheless, one of the conditions of remaining a citizen in good standing is agreeing to follow the rules voluntarily, including those about paying taxes. Of course, there's also civil disobedience if that's your thing. But that's essentially walking away from a contract because you consider it unjust. Which is fine, but not very libertarian.

Joe Biden realizes that he can "Springtime for Hitler" the administration and decides to adopt the personality that The Onion thinks he has.

The breakdown is almost 100% correlated to the athlete's race.

Sure there is. Nothing is forcing you to be an American citizen. Your parents did, admittedly, enter you into the contract while you were a minor, as was their legal right, but once you became an adult, you have the ability to terminate the contract at will.

I mean, if I am a member of the local country club, and they insist that I pay my annual dues, I don't get to rage about involuntary confiscation of my property. Paying dues is a requirement of membership in the country club. If I don't want to pay dues, I should not be a member. Same goes for the United States as a whole.

You are free, of course, to terminate the contract and remove yourself to another jurisdiction.

Are you going to pay for his flight, moving expenses, possible language training, job search/placement expenses? If not, then moving isn't free either. Not to mention what Dan says in #3058.

So, is that what you tell homosexual couples? Or people who disagree with the Patriot Act? Or people who have their speech suppressed? Or are drafted and sent off to die in a war they never wanted? (Obviously, there's no draft right now, but this is theoretical)

I'm sure it isn't what you do or would do (nor should you), so your argument is fundamentally dishonest. You don't *really* believe in the "do what the government says because that's part of your social contract" argument; you're just making a rhetorical flourish that nobody really believes (and you know it).

The "social contract" is a metaphor, and does not involve anything like an actual contract or voluntary consent.

Except Chris Kluwe

Whoa, are you having the exact same one on two different sites? Is that a coincidence or do BTFers have an auxiliary site to argue or something?

Except when Sugar Bear disagreed with the terms of the so-called contract, that's not what you told him to do. You told him to leave the country.

The requirement to return "fugitive" slaves to their "owners"? Just part of ye olde social contract.

Perhaps there's a Merriam-Webster DailyKos Edition out there

Nixon's making a conditional concession speech at 3:00 AM just before going to bed, and he's incredibly gracious about it. Of course as it turned out, the race wasn't finally decided until late Wednesday morning.

Though if Romney wins, I might take a few people in this thread off my ignore list just to see their reactions.

I most certainly did not. I only said that was an option.

The "social contract" is a metaphor, and does not involve anything like an actual contract or voluntary consent.

Do you tell gay couples that one "option" they have is to leave the country, or move to another state?

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the people making it are saying something like "if you don't like our system, you can change it through the democratic process. If you can't get enough people to buy into your views, you can also opt out if you feel that the tax system is oppressive and unfair. No one is forcing you to stay here."

This is wrong. Unless you were born in Kenya and pretended to be born in Hawaii, you are not describing the law accurately at all. And, no, you cannot terminate the contract at will. And it's not a contract.

Chris Christie doesn't give a ####.

Obama loses popular vote but wins electoral: GOP has massive meltdown, and begins- unironically- to declare that the EC is un-American and must be destroyed. Dems change mind on EC, think it's great. GOP attempts to propose amendments or compacts or whatever to change EC are slightly more successful than Dem attempts- partially because Dems have already done some of the work- but still fall short. Nate Silver has NYPD protection around him for a few weeks.

Quick, check: do you see my signature at the bottom?

If you know any country club that sends people to your house to collect your dues at gunpoint, let me know, okay?

That's a pretty low bar for taunting. I simply noted that there are two people that I no longer interact with in any way but that, if an unlikely event happens, their writing would possibly cause me to have enjoyment. I'm not one of those people that, after ignoring someone, passive-aggressively responds to the person through someone else's quoted passages or anything. We all have people that we wish to have no interaction with until the day we die.

We all have people that we wish to have no interaction with until the day we die.

Dan is taunting again!

That's a pretty low bar for taunting. I simply noted that there are two people that I no longer interact with in any way but that, if an unlikely event happens, their writing would possibly cause me to have enjoyment. I'm not one of those people that, after ignoring someone, passive-aggressively responds to the person through someone else's quoted passages or anything. We all have people that we wish to have no interaction with until the day we die.

The problem is you essentially need bipartisanship among the *most* partisan states on the left and right. Assuming it surpasses all legal hurdles, the first time the compact elects a different president than the electoral college does, the states on the losing end will revoke it for the next election (if they even go along with it for that one - there's a giant step between an agreement and actually enforcing that agreement).

What is the update on the ominous black panther who is opening doors for old white ladies in Philly?

I know that recent law changes now require a fee (I think it's about $400) -- but all you have to do is go to a US embassy or consulate, sign a few forms, and voila... Unlike many countries, the US will even let you renounce without an alternate citizenship - in effect, becoming stateless.

For me, those people are Nancy Grace, Wendy Murphy, and John Feinstein.

When the government violates our freedom of speech, that we're better than most countries are is an extremely unsatisfying argument to me.

But less tyranny is superior to more tyranny.

“The apus (gods of the hills in indigenous mythology) tell us (Barack) Obama will be reelected,” predicted Juan Osco, known as the Shaman of the Andes on San Cristobal hill overlooking Lima.

AFP reported that "members of the group placed flower petals on photos of the candidates that were also swept over with tobacco smoke. The shamans chewed coca leaves, a traditional ceremonial and medicinal plant since Inca times that helps fight altitude sickness.

And the crew took some swigs of ayahuasca, a psychoactive brew used widely among Amazon basin indigenous people. At least one thing was clear, they said: Obama should defeat Republican Mitt Romney on Tuesday."

we should all be able to agree on Nancy Grace

Earlier this year, approximately 1 percent of visits to the New York Times included FiveThirtyEight. Last week, that number was 13 percent. Yesterday, it was 20 percent. That is, one in five visitors to the sixth-most-trafficked U.S. news site took a look at Silver’s blog.

According to Alexa, a Web information company, “538” is the eighth-most searched-for term that led visitors to the Times last month. And over the previous month, it grew more than any other referral term; other increasingly relevant terms were “nate silver” and “538.com.” Notably, no other Times staffers or brands appear on Alexa's lists of top referral terms or rising referral terms.