Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Baseball Primer Newsblog > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Tuesday, November 28, 2017

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 11-28-2017

New York Sun, November 28, 1917:

[Ban Johnson on scheduled doubleheaders:] “Playing two games for one admission cheapens the sport and creates in the minds of the fans the belief that they are not getting their money’s worth out of a single game of nine innings. Double headers have done more to injure professional baseball than any other one thing.

Some of the minor leagues have played the double header card to the limit and owe much of their financial trouble to that fact.”

Johnson was trying to cut the American League schedule to 140 games in 1918. He was concerned that the National League would stay at 154 games and force the AL to schedule a bunch of doubleheaders in order to prevent ballpark scheduling issues.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 28, 2017 at 10:00 AM | 15 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 28, 2017 at 10:02 AM (#5581898)
No greats on today's Birthday Team, but a solid HOVG third baseman and a bunch of other talented players.

C: Wes Westrum (12.14 WAR)
1B: Max West (13.61 WAR)
2B: Heinie Peitz (18.89 WAR)
3B: Matt Williams (46.4 WAR)
SS: Walt Weiss (16.48 WAR)
LF: Jim Jackson (0.57 WAR)
CF: Nook Logan (3.02 WAR)
RF: Sixto Lezcano (28.11 WAR)

SP: Pedro Astacio (25.97 WAR)
SP: Dave Righetti (21.83 WAR)
SP: John Burkett (19.06 WAR)
SP: Carlos Villanueva (6.15 WAR)
SP: Benn Karr (6.06 WAR)
RP: Robb Nen (15.42 WAR)
RP: Bill Simas (5.31 WAR)

Manager: Lee Fohl
Fun names: Roxey Roach, Kevin Quackenbush, Corky Withrow, Daisy Davis, Purnal Goldy
   2. TDF didn't lie, he just didn't remember Posted: November 28, 2017 at 11:24 AM (#5581924)
On the front page of BBRef today is Eddie Kasko (I assume everyone sees the same pics). Not anyone I recognized, but he's wearing a CIN hat so I clicked on his page. In 1962, he got a single bottom-ballot vote for MVP.

1. He sucked as a hitter (generally but particularly that year)- .683 OPS, 81 OPS+.
2. He wasn't a great fielder (+28 Rfield in his career), but was bad that year (-5). He evidently didn't have a the rep as a great fielder, as he never won a GG.
3. Cinci finished 3rd that year, so he wasn't on a great team. FRob finished 4th in voting that year in a 8.7 bWAR season, SP Bob Purkey (7.1 bWAR) also got some votes, and lots of other Reds were much better than Kasko (0.5 bWAR)

So what was the deal? You could argue that one of the Cinci writers threw him a bone, but as I said there were lots of Reds (like Vada Pinson, 4.7 bWAR) who were much better.
   3. Batman Posted: November 28, 2017 at 11:43 AM (#5581941)
I'd never heard of Kasko, but I'd guess he had a reputation for clutchiness that year. He hit a lot better in Late & Close (.343/.407/.529) and High Leverage (.375/.409/.922) situations than overall. Three of his four HR would have been walkoffs if they'd happened at home:
1. Top of the ninth solo HR to give the Reds a 4-3 lead.
2. Top of the tenth grand slam to give the Reds a 9-5 lead.
3. Three-run HR (off Bob Gibson) in the top of the ninth to turn a 2-0 deficit into a 3-2 lead.
   4. BDC Posted: November 28, 2017 at 12:20 PM (#5581963)
You could do a pretty tough quiz asking for ballplayers' eras based on their names. Roxey Roach and Daisy Davis pretty much have to be real old-timey guys, and they are (1910s and 1880s respectively). But Corky Withrow could be their contemporary, or he could have been Pokey Reese's DP-combo-mate, instead of the 1960s player he was. Purnal Goldy was a contemporary of Withrow's, but he could have been one of Roach's, or for that matter of Nook Logan's. In turn, Nook Logan could either be a white guy from the 1880s or the black guy from the 2000s that he was, but almost nothing in between.

Meanwhile Quackenbush almost has to be an 1890s name, and if it was Horace Quackenbush there would be no doubt, but "Kevin" gives him away as a 21st-century ballplayer.
   5. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: November 28, 2017 at 01:55 PM (#5582071)
Interesting to have a Benn and a Robb on the same pitching staffff.
   6. vortex of dissipation Posted: November 28, 2017 at 02:39 PM (#5582120)
Eddie Kasko was regarded as a very smart ballplayer - he later managed the Red Sox, and was their Director of Scouting for 16 years. He was well regarded within the game. I'm assuming that the voter was rewarding him for what he saw as leadership skills, and a .278 batting average in 1962 would have looked respectable, if not especially good. He moved to third base from shortstop to fill a huge hole when Gene Freese missed almost the entire season. Yes, that's moving down the defensive spectrum, but the voter may have thought that Kasko's move was unselfish (he made way for Leo Cardenas, a much better shortstop). Kasko was also coming off a previous season where he made the All-Star team for a pennant winner in 1961, so he would be more well known than we probably think.
   7. SoSH U at work Posted: November 28, 2017 at 02:44 PM (#5582125)

Interesting to have a Benn and a Robb on the same pitching staffff.


I'd say it's a shame Dann Billardello wasn't a Nov. 28 guy, but Dannnny (0.7 WAR) wasn't making too many birthday teams.

   8. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 28, 2017 at 04:57 PM (#5582265)
Even though I scoured the box scores in my youth, somehow the 9 PAs of Corky WIthrow skipped right on by me.
   9. esseff Posted: November 28, 2017 at 06:02 PM (#5582305)
Even though I scoured the box scores in my youth, somehow the 9 PAs of Corky WIthrow skipped right on by me.



Not too late to catch up
   10. BDC Posted: November 28, 2017 at 06:08 PM (#5582307)
Guys like Withrow and Goldy would have had longer pro careers in the 1920s. As it was, in the days of the greatly reduced minor leagues, they both played a few years but were out of organized ball in their late 20s. Nowadays they'd be out of baseball even quicker, probably, as soon as they clearly had no shot at a ML career.
   11. Tom Nawrocki Posted: November 28, 2017 at 06:25 PM (#5582309)
My son once played on a Little League team with two of Pedro Astacio's sons. They were both named Pedro, although the younger one went by "Pedrine."
   12. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 28, 2017 at 06:41 PM (#5582317)
Even though I scoured the box scores in my youth, somehow the 9 PAs of Corky WIthrow skipped right on by me.



Not too late to catch up


From the liner notes "... who in baseball was later tapped as the player to replace Stan Musial in the St. Louis Cardinals’ outfield" -- that seems like a bit of oversell. ;)

esseff, how in the world did you know of that?
   13. esseff Posted: November 28, 2017 at 08:31 PM (#5582351)
Yes, I suspect he's mostly a Kentucky legend in his own mind.

I don't remember him much, but he did get into two games of the big pennant showdown with the Dodgers that September. That's the series where Stan Musial hit his final home run to give the Cardinals hope in the first game, and Dick Nen, father of bday boy Robb, homered in the third game to virtually clinch LA's pennant.

EDIT: And for what it's worth, Charlie James was really the player tapped to replace Musial, and it worked out for him only marginally better than it worked for Corky Withrow.

   14. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: November 28, 2017 at 10:04 PM (#5582378)
And for what it's worth, Charlie James was really the player tapped to replace Musial, and it worked out for him only marginally better than it worked for Corky Withrow.


Now Charlie James, him I remember.
   15. RMc's Unenviable Situation Posted: November 29, 2017 at 07:20 AM (#5582464)
(Kasko) wasn't a great fielder

Well, in his ten years in MLB (1957-66), he had 7.5 dWAR, good enough for 8th among shortstops and 20th overall. As far as Gold Gloves go, Roy McMillan won three GG from 1957-59, and Maury Wills won two, in 1961-62.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

News

All News | Prime News

Old-School Newsstand


BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogOT - NBA 2017-2018 Tip-off Thread
(2701 - 12:26pm, Jan 19)
Last: jmurph

NewsblogOTP 15 January 2018:Mississippi's anti-gay marriage law is hurting two college baseball teams
(1408 - 12:26pm, Jan 19)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

NewsblogComparing a Player Outside His Era | Articles | Bill James Online
(13 - 12:25pm, Jan 19)
Last: nick swisher hygiene

NewsblogTaking Back the Ballparks - Kansas City Royals
(13 - 12:24pm, Jan 19)
Last: Jarrod HypnerotomachiaPoliphili (TeddyF.Ballgame)

NewsblogAndruw of Center Field
(198 - 12:12pm, Jan 19)
Last: Rally

NewsblogWhy is J.D. Martinez's big bat still available
(4 - 11:59am, Jan 19)
Last: BDC

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 1-19-2018
(8 - 11:33am, Jan 19)
Last: Tom Nawrocki

NewsblogRyan Thibs has his HOF Ballot Tracker Up and Running!
(1529 - 11:10am, Jan 19)
Last: bachslunch

Hall of MeritMost Meritorious Player: 2011 Discussion
(75 - 10:34am, Jan 19)
Last: caiman

NewsblogBenFred: Everybody can find a story about Musial's magic | Ben Frederickson | stltoday.com
(2 - 10:20am, Jan 19)
Last: Batman

NewsblogThe 2017-18 Offseason: Trend or Anomaly? - MLB Trade Rumors
(7 - 10:12am, Jan 19)
Last: JRVJ

NewsblogRubbing Mud: The Evidence of Price Fixing We Have So Far - Baseball Prospectus
(24 - 10:09am, Jan 19)
Last: Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad)

NewsblogHere's why baseball's economic system might be broken
(67 - 6:02am, Jan 19)
Last: You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR)

NewsblogWhat Is Baseball’s Equivalent of the Vikings’ Miraculous Victory?
(69 - 2:16am, Jan 19)
Last: An Athletic in Powderhorn™

NewsblogChristian Yelich can only blame himself for Jeter entanglement | New York Post
(61 - 11:52pm, Jan 18)
Last: Ziggy: The Platonic Form of Russell Branyan

Page rendered in 0.2659 seconds
47 querie(s) executed