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Wednesday, March 06, 2013

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 3-6-2013

Pittsburgh Gazette Times, March 6, 1913:

[Pirates pitchers and catchers] closed the day with leap frog. Leap frog met with Fred Clarke’s enthusiastic approval, and he will probably devote a portion of each practice period to it during the remainder of the week.
...
Each leap frog trip up and down the field exhausted the players, and several of them were groggy while the sport was on. One or two had their ears clipped by the spikes of players jumping over their backs…Mike Simon drew a big laugh by remarking that the boys ought to keep it up, as they might have to go home that way next fall if they fail to win the pennant.

Don’t tell Rooker.

Dan Lee prefers good shortstops to great paintings Posted: March 06, 2013 at 06:49 AM | 23 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history

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   1. Dan Lee prefers good shortstops to great paintings Posted: March 06, 2013 at 06:55 AM (#4381738)
A bunch of personality on today's Birthday Team: Pops Stargell, a center fielder with one arm, a shortstop who injured himself carrying deer meat, and a guy named Cookie.

That Grove fella can pitch a bit too.

C: Bob Swift
1B: Willie Stargell
2B/Manager: Cookie Rojas
3B: Bill Sweeney
SS: Clint Barmes
LF: Marcus Thames
CF: Pete Gray
RF/RP: John Coleman

SP: Lefty Grove
SP: Terry Adams
SP: Eduardo Rodriguez
SP: Bud Podbielan
SP: Bert Husting
RP: Ted Abernathy

Writer: Ring Lardner
Not that one: Roberto Duran, James Lofton
   2. Misirlou is on hiding to nowhere Posted: March 06, 2013 at 09:35 AM (#4381775)
a center fielder with one arm


Sean's got a sense of humor:

"Peter J. Gray
born Peter Wyshner

Position: Outfielder
Bats: Left, Throws: Left , Fields Left as well"

edit: he has the same entry for Jim Abbott.
   3. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 10:40 AM (#4381810)
When Abernathy retired in 1972, he was seventh All-time in saves. He is now 75th, behind guys like Dan Plesac, Greg Minton, and Bobby Jenks.

The Royals released him after '72 when he posted a 1.70 ERA, and no one ever picked him up, so he retired.
   4. salvomania Posted: March 06, 2013 at 12:43 PM (#4381935)
I've got a late '50s Topps card of Abernathy, and a '72 Topps card of Abernathy, and, except for the uniforms (Senators vs. Royals), Abernathy appears identical, unchanged as if frozen in the same pose for a dozen-plus years.



   5. AndrewJ Posted: March 06, 2013 at 01:27 PM (#4381993)
When Abernathy retired in 1972, he was seventh All-time in saves. He is now 75th, behind guys like Dan Plesac, Greg Minton, and Bobby Jenks.

If you're listening, Sean Forman, that might be a nice feature to add to the "Appearances on Leader Boards, Awards, and Honors" subsection of BB-Ref: Where players ranked in career categories at the time they retired.
   6. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 01:36 PM (#4382006)
   7. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 01:42 PM (#4382009)
Great link Der. I had no idea Andy Benes briefly played college hoops or that Tony Clark was pretty good.
   8. Dan Lee prefers good shortstops to great paintings Posted: March 06, 2013 at 02:25 PM (#4382052)
I'm with RoyalsRetro. That's a fantastic link.

I think the biggest surprise was that Ben McDonald started a few games as a Freshman for LSU in '86-'87. That's a really impressive accomplishment. LSU was coming off a Final Four run in '86, so they were the real deal...it's not like he was getting a handful of starts at Southeastern Ohio Mortuary School for the Blind or something.
   9. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 02:30 PM (#4382057)
Thanks!

I have an annual somewhere with mini bios on the top 100 or so players in college basketball that had an entry for Clark.
I remember watching McDonald. Though he looked a little stiff, but that's sooooo long ago, who knows? [EDIT: Here's his stats. Lyle Mouton played for them right afterward as well.]
Never heard of Tom Gastall before - captain of the basketball team, played in the N/S football game, and played for the Orioles - impressive.
Didn't know Hondo was that good of a hoopster. Or Don Kessinger.
Champ Summers played college basketball, served in the military, then more college hoops - then played pro baseball?
   10. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 03:08 PM (#4382107)
Red Sox prospect Ryan Westmoreland, who had brain surgery, announced his retirement today at age 22.

Crass question, but does he get to keep all of his $2 million bonus?
   11. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 03:12 PM (#4382114)
yes
   12. SoSH U at work Posted: March 06, 2013 at 03:12 PM (#4382115)
Crass question, but does he get to keep all of his $2 million bonus?'


I don't see why he wouldn't. It's a signing bonus, isn't it?
   13. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 04:51 PM (#4382213)
I thought they doled out signing bonuses over several years. Or is it only with multi sport athletes?
   14. JJ1986 Posted: March 06, 2013 at 04:54 PM (#4382220)
I thought they doled out signing bonuses over several years. Or is it only with multi sport athletes?


The Mets dole out signing bonuses over 25 years with 8% interest.
   15. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 05:40 PM (#4382291)
Tex out 8-10 weeks. Time for Yankee panic.
   16. AndrewJ Posted: March 06, 2013 at 06:49 PM (#4382373)
So the top college basketball players in MLB history would be... Groat, Jackie R. and Werber?
   17. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 07:28 PM (#4382401)
Groat is the best, of course. (National POTY)

Jackie's not close - I counted a double digit number of guys who were named All Americans at what are now D1 schools, second team All-PAC 10 ain't cutting it.

Um, might depend on timelining. Werber was Duke's 1st AA, but the level of competition wasn't that high then. Here's some candidates for a top 5:

Two recent guys who weren't A-A, but were legit NBA types (if you want to aggressively timeline to come up with your five) are Ryan Minor and Mark Hendrickson.

Ryan Minor was Big-10 POTY as a junior (23.6 ppg, 8.4 reb), and a high 2nd round pick. Absolutely would have had some sort of NBA career had he pursued it.

Mark Hendrickson probably wouldn't make our top 5 here, but he might have made it in the NBA as well, as an end of the bench hustle guy. IIRC, very accurate from the field (66% or so).

Terrell Lowery's stats were a product of system and weak competition, but he was a dominant player for LMU who averaged 28.5 ppg and 9.1 apg as a junior. He might have made it as a 3rd point.

Frank Howard was a first team A-A as a junior, averaging 20.1 ppg and 15.3 rpg, and a 3rd round pick in the NBA draft.

Cotton Nash was first or second team A-A three times for Kentucky. Fringy pro though, a year in the NBA, a year in the ABA.

Joe Gibbon was an A-A, and finished 2nd in the nation in scoring for Mississippi (30 ppg).

Frank Baumholtz earned A-A attention as well, and was a very good pro in pre-NBA leagues.
Bob Gibson wasn't an A-A, but quite good and, of course, a Globetrotter.
Both Eddie and Johnny O'Brien were named to A-A teams (and were drafted by the Hawks). Johnny was the better of the two, first team as a senior and the first player to score >=1000 points in a season.
Ron Reed earned A-A attention at Notre Dame his senior year, averaged 20 pts, 17.7 reb as a junior, and was a 3rd round pick of the Pistons.
Dick Ricketts was a first team A-A at Duquesne, a 1st round pick of the NBA, and played there for three seasons.
Garry Roggenburk was a 3rd team A-A at Dayton. Ernie Andres, Oral Hildebrand, Louis Berger, and Eddie Wineapple were also A-A.
Walt Dropo is still 2nd in career points per game at Providence (20.7)
Gene Conley played only one year (first team in what became the Pac-10) but was a pro basketball player for six.

Unrelated: I need to learn more about Bruce Bochte.
   18. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 08:41 PM (#4382436)
I'm no fan of zirin or the nation, but he has an article on baseball in Venezuela post-Chavez. (H/t John Manuel and Kendall Rogers)
http://www.thenation.com/blog/173233/why-major-league-baseball-owners-will-cheer-death-hugo-chavez
   19. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 06, 2013 at 08:51 PM (#4382444)
Danny Ainge?
   20. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 06, 2013 at 10:04 PM (#4382479)
Never heard of him.

Yeah, I'm a dummy - he was also a national POTY. Stats
   21. AndrewJ Posted: March 06, 2013 at 10:42 PM (#4382500)
So giving equal weight to college basketball career and MLB career, I guess Dick Groat would be the most impressive combo of the two, followed by Frank Howard...
   22. Rennie's Tenet Posted: March 07, 2013 at 12:18 AM (#4382568)
Is Dave DeBusschere ineligible for this thing? 25 points, 19 rebounds at Detroit Mercy, and I'm assuming he played a little defense there.
   23. Der-K: Hipster doofus Posted: March 07, 2013 at 12:27 AM (#4382574)
you're ineligible if you weren't in the link i posted; i wasn't trying to think... :)
i'd meant to look debusschere up and got distracted (and had blanked on ainge). only 3rd team a-a, but a high nba pick (4th overall) and an 8-time all-star.

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