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Monday, June 04, 2018

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 6-4-2018

Harrisburg Telegraph, June 4, 1918:

[The Dodgers-Cardinals game] was one stig-tossled, hornswoggled pasttime, winding up in a protest. In the sixth inning, with Baird on second, Cruise hit a liner to center, which Hickman stopped but could not hold. Baird reached third and, thinking the ball was caught, started back for second.

After going back twenty feet he cut across the diamond to the plate and scored. Umpire Rigler ruled that after a runner had once touched third base he was not compelled to retouch it on his way home.

Olson protested the decision and was put out of the game. Manager Robinson then ordered his men to play under protest.

I don’t know the history of the rule about leaving the basepath, or how it read in 1918, but I don’t see anything in the current rule 5.09(b) that would have made Baird out for leaving the basepath or required him to retouch third. Am I missing something? Is there another rule that applies to this situation?

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: June 04, 2018 at 10:17 AM | 23 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history, rules

Reader Comments and Retorts

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   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: June 04, 2018 at 10:19 AM (#5685412)
If you like catchers playing out of position, you'll love today's Birthday Team.

C: Tony Pena (24.71 WAR)
1B: Rick Wilkins (13.95 WAR)
2B: Lee Magee (10.24 WAR)
3B/Harmonica: Phil Linz (2.07 WAR)
SS: Kurt Stillwell (3.07 WAR)
LF: Terry Kennedy (21.58 WAR)
CF/Punter: Darin Erstad (32.37 WAR)
RF: George Watkins (8.96 WAR)

SP: Bob Klinger (9.94 WAR)
SP: Aaron Nola (8.99 WAR)
SP: Art Mahaffey (7.37 WAR)
SP: Orville Jorgens (2.59 WAR)
SP: Larry Demery (2.37 WAR)
RP: J.C. Romero (7.8 WAR)
RP: Cla Meredith (2.94 WAR)

Manager: John McNamara
Broadcaster: Bill O'Donnell
Coach, in the Japanese Baseball Hall of Fame: Kichiro Shimaoka
Father of that one: Ross Grimsley
Fun names: Jorge Bonifacio, Trace Coquillette
Not that one: George Washington
Prospect Flameout: Steve Searcy (-2.13 WAR)
Umpire: Tony Venzon
   2. Itchy Row Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:11 AM (#5685495)
Joe Posnanski wrote about Chuck Klein yesterday and mentioned that the Phillies got Klein from Fort Wayne, a Cardinals affiliate, for Harvey MacDonald. MacDonald was 30 and, other than the month and a half he'd spent with the Phillies, apparently had no pro baseball experience. He finished the season with Fort Wayne and then disappeared again.
   3. SoSH U at work Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:24 AM (#5685507)
I don’t know the history of the rule about leaving the basepath, or how it read in 1918, but I don’t see anything in the current rule 5.09(b) that would have made Baird out for leaving the basepath or required him to retouch third. Am I missing something? Is there another rule that applies to this situation?


I was wondering the same thing reading that. You have to retouch if you're backtracking on a caught fly ball. But I don't know what part of the rule would force you to retouch going forward. And the baseline only exists if a play is being made on you.

Misirlou's input here would be welcome.

Did you find out what the result of the protest was?

   4. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:37 AM (#5685519)
[The Dodgers-Cardinals game] was one stig-tossled, hornswoggled pasttime,
You know, I've seen games that were stig-tossled. And I've seen games that were hornswoggled. But in all my years, I've never seen a game that was both.
   5. Itchy Row Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:40 AM (#5685524)
I saw Earl Weaver get kicked out of a game for stig-tossling. He tried to come back out to swoggle a horn, but Rick Dempsey stopped him.
   6. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:52 AM (#5685540)
Did you find out what the result of the protest was?


Assuming this is referring to the Dodgers - Cardinals game played on June 4, 1918 (they didn't play on the 3rd), Retrosheet's box score doesn't show a run scoring in the 6th inning or show Baird with a run scored at all in the game. Retrosheet hasn't released play-by-play for 1918 yet, so there could be an error in there somewhere.
   7. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 04, 2018 at 11:57 AM (#5685552)
Following up on #6, the June 4th Brooklyn Eagle has an article about a game the day before between the Dodgers and Cardinals that the Dodgers won 15-12 in 12 innings. That game doesn't exist on Retrosheet's web site, so I assume that means the protest was upheld and the game was thrown out.
   8. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 04, 2018 at 12:04 PM (#5685565)
Okay, last followup: Retrosheet has text files showing original schedules with explanations for cancelled games. The Dodgers - Cardinals game of June 3rd has an explanation of "Game thrown out" with a make-up date of July 27th (the teams played a doubleheader that day).
   9. Itchy Row Posted: June 04, 2018 at 12:08 PM (#5685572)
This SABR journal issue (110-page pdf) has something about the game being thrown out too, on page 10.
   10. SoSH U at work Posted: June 04, 2018 at 12:13 PM (#5685580)
So even absent any specific wording in the rulebook, I assume the upheld protest would serve as precedent.

   11. Rennie's Tenet Posted: June 04, 2018 at 01:21 PM (#5685653)
Larry "Bullfrog" Demery joined the Pirates at age 21, never had a losing season, and was done at 24 with a career 29-23 record.
   12. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: June 04, 2018 at 03:15 PM (#5685736)
In addition to today's article from the Harrisburg Telegraph of June 4, 1918, Google returns two results for "stig-tossled" and they are from the Harrisburg Telegraph of September 1, 1918, and the Harrisburg Telegraph of December 27, 1918.

Removing the hyphen leads to five more mentions, all from the Harrisburg Telegraph between 1918 and 1921.

Please search the whole newspaper database for this word because now I am fascinated.
   13. Ned Garvin: Male Prostitute Posted: June 04, 2018 at 03:49 PM (#5685765)
Take a look at any picture of Larry Demery and it is obvious that he lost his job because he was littering and, littering and, littering and.....smoking the reefer.
   14. Itchy Row Posted: June 04, 2018 at 04:02 PM (#5685777)
This thread is now the top Google result for "stig-tossled." Some editor from the Harrisburg Telegraph is looking down with a stig-tossling smile.
   15. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: June 04, 2018 at 04:18 PM (#5685793)
SP: Bob Klinger (9.94 WAR)
SP: Aaron Nola (8.99 WAR)


So perhaps by July 4, Aaron Nola will be the ace of this birthday staff. Fellows, he is a joy to watch if you haven't seen him pitch yet. Even though he doesn't resemble Roy Halladay by looks or motion, his command and self control on the mound remind me of Doc.
   16. stig-tossled, hornswoggled gef the typing mongoose Posted: June 04, 2018 at 08:43 PM (#5685917)
I just couldn't resist ...
   17. PreservedFish Posted: June 04, 2018 at 08:44 PM (#5685918)
I'm curious why one word gets the hyphen, but not the other.
   18. AndrewJ Posted: June 04, 2018 at 08:45 PM (#5685919)
The Posnaski article mentioned in post #2 mentions Dutch Doyle's campaign to get Chuck Klein into Cooperstown. I met Dutch at my first SABR regional in 1985 -- he was quite a character.
   19. stig-tossled, hornswoggled gef the typing mongoose Posted: June 04, 2018 at 08:50 PM (#5685920)
I'm curious why one word gets the hyphen, but not the other.


Because you can tossle a stig with ease, but swoggling a horn hardly ever happens. Duh.
   20. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: June 04, 2018 at 09:16 PM (#5685937)
 stig-tossled,hornswoggled gef the talking mongoose


As if being a talking mongoose isn't enough
   21. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: June 04, 2018 at 09:19 PM (#5685939)
The Posnaski article mentioned in post #2 mentions Dutch Doyle's campaign to get Chuck Klein into Cooperstown.
Did it consist mostly of trying to destroy all research on park effects?
   22. Walt Davis Posted: June 04, 2018 at 10:28 PM (#5685981)
The OED tosses up only one definition for "stig" as an obsolete and rare verb from the Norse meaning "to start in alarm." It's got no entry for tossled so maybe a misspelling of tousled.

But there is "steg" (and variants), also from Norse, meaning a "gander" or a "clumsy or stupid person." Assuming no ganders were involved, I'm not sure which steg was ... well, "tossing himself about" is the most likely application of "tousled" here. Perhaps manager Olson was the clumsy/stupid person in question.

"hornswoggle" is fine -- to cheat or bamboozle -- with an etymology of "probably fanciful." It seems unfair to accuse Mr. Baird of hornswoggling since even the umps believed he was operating within the rules.
   23. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: June 04, 2018 at 10:45 PM (#5685987)
LF: Terry Kennedy (21.58 WAR)


The entirety of Terry Kennedy's value was as a good fielding catcher. He had -51 batting runs, -13 baserunning runs, and -7 DP avoidance runs. As a LF he would be below replacement value. The same is probably true of Rick Wilkins at 1B.

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