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Tuesday, July 09, 2019

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 7-9-2019

Pittsburgh Gazette Times, July 9, 1919:

Charles C. Cravath, the hard hitting outfielder, better known to baseball fame as “Gavvy,” was [yesterday] appointed manager of the Philadelphia National League baseball team after announcement was made…that John Coombs had resigned.
...
It was said that when some of the players heard that Coombs was no longer to be manager of the team several of them said they would not play in [yesterday’s] game, but were prevailed upon by Coombs to change their minds.

“Cravath is my manager as long as he lives,” said [Phillies President William F. Baker] after [yesterday’s] game. “There is a man who will be a success.”

Cravath managed the Phillies through the end of the 1920 season, finishing with a career winning percentage below .400. He was alive long enough to see the advent of black-and-white television, color television, and a president who was born during Cravath’s playing career.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 09:55 AM | 54 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history

Reader Comments and Retorts

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Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 10:01 AM (#5860268)
A pretty ho-hum Birthday Team today. Myatt is out of position in right field and much worse than his WAR total suggests; he's a catcher who spent some time as a corner outfielder early in his career.

Looking at J.C. Linares's Cuban stats, I thought he might be a candidate to play right, but I hadn't realized he had defected and never made it to the majors.

C: Miguel Montero (14.0 WAR)
1B: Turner Barber (0.5 WAR)
2B: Mike Andrews (10.9 WAR)
3B/Manager: Buck Herzog (27.4 WAR)
SS: Jimmy Cooney (8.3 WAR)
LF: Wally Post (18.1 WAR)
CF: Willie Wilson (46.1 WAR)
RF: Glenn Myatt (3.9 WAR)

SP: Jack Powell (56.6 WAR)
SP: Phil Cockrell (Negro Leagues star)
SP: George Stone (6.7 WAR)
SP: Tex Clevenger (5.7 WAR)
SP: Guy Hoffman (3.5 WAR)
RP: Hal Haydel (0.6 WAR)

Owner: John Moores
Umpire: Marty Springstead
Fun name: Coot Veal
Not that one: Bud Black
Has perhaps the most Canadian name imaginable, is not Canadian: Gordon MacKenzie
   2. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 09, 2019 at 10:21 AM (#5860275)
Myatt as a corner OF is likely below 0 WAR. His +22 position runs from C become something like -22 as a corner OF, not to mention likely questionable D. Probably better off putting Rusney Castillo there, as his WAR already has the position adjustment baked in, and he appears to have been a good fielder.
   3. Itchy Row Posted: July 09, 2019 at 11:11 AM (#5860283)
Jack Powell has the most wins of any pitcher with a losing record. He was 245-255. Second-most is Bobo Newsom at 211-222. Charlie Hough was 216-216.

Ricky Nolasco is listed as the active wins leader among losers, at 114-118. He hasn't pitched in MLB since 2017, and he hasn't been good in 14 minor league innings this year. Francisco Liriano is 110-112.
   4. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 11:47 AM (#5860292)
Jack Powell has the most wins of any pitcher with a losing record. He was 245-255. Second-most is Bobo Newsom at 211-222. Charlie Hough was 216-216.

the poster boy for that kind of dubious record is Bob Friend: 197-230
   5. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 09, 2019 at 11:57 AM (#5860298)
From 1957-1962, Friend's W/L records were 14-18, 22-14, 8-19, 18-12, 14-19, 18-14. A right proper Bret Saberhagen he was.
   6. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 09, 2019 at 12:52 PM (#5860313)
Today is the 50th anniversary of Jim Qualls' one and only appearance in the spotlight - when his single broke up Tom Seaver's perfect game in the ninth inning. Qualls is one of those guys - Dick Nen, Francisco Cabrera, etc, - whose career will be remembered for one at bat. Better than being forgotten...

I was looking for a Japanese outfielder who could play on today's birthday team, but the best I could come up with is Osamu Hamanaka. He played 15 seasons in NPB, from 1997 to 2011, and he wasn't a bad player, but he wasn't a star, or even a regular most years. He only cleared 400 PA three times. His lifetime line was .268/.336/.444, with 85 HR. He did have two good seasons - he was hitting .301/.356/.511 with 18 HR in 102 games when he broke his thumb in August 2002, and in 2006 he hit .302/.361/.484 with 20 HR in 139 games. But aside from that, his career was pretty nondescript.
   7. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 01:16 PM (#5860330)
the poster boy for that kind of dubious record is Bob Friend: 197-230

I should have added that he attained that terrible W-L record despite a 107 career ERA+ and almost 47 WAR. He pitched against the score, apparently
   8. salvomania Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:05 PM (#5860342)
He pitched against the score, apparently

Or he pitched for a team that didn't win more than 66 games in any of his first seven seasons, and was .500 or better in only 6 of his 16 seasons.
   9. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:19 PM (#5860346)
It probably isn't a record for fewest wins by someone who lost at least a hundred games, but I noticed once Jason Johnson's historic career record of 56-100. Partially due to spending his career on the Devil Rays, the 1999-2003 Orioles, and the 2004-06 Tigers, partially due to pitching badly.
   10. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:42 PM (#5860353)
It probably isn't a record for fewest wins by someone who lost at least a hundred games, but I noticed once Jason Johnson's historic career record of 56-100

Bref shows that Buster Brown (not that one) ended up 51-103
   11. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:44 PM (#5860354)
I should have added that he attained that terrible W-L record despite a 107 career ERA+ and almost 47 WAR. He pitched against the score, apparently

He bears a slight (and only slight) responsiblity for the bad win-loss record, as he was arguably the worst hitting pitcher of his generation.
   12. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:47 PM (#5860356)
Another week, another .....

BASEBALL TRIVIA TIME

Done this for every decade from the 1970s-onward, so today let's do the 1960s.

Below are 18 offensive categories. Can you name the leader in any of them. Guesses should include both the name (full name ideally) and stat for each person you're guessing.

One guy led in five categories.
Two guys led in three categories each.
Two guys led in two categories each.
Three guys led in one category a peice.

Any guesses?

G -
PA -
AB -
H -
2B -
3B -
HR -
R -
RBI -
BB -
IBB -
K -
SB -
CS -
GIDP -
SF -
SH -
HBP -
   13. JJ1986 Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:50 PM (#5860358)
Willie Mays - G, AB, H, PA, HR?
Carl Yasrzemski - 2B
   14. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:50 PM (#5860359)
I know Killebrew led in dingers, but that's all I got
   15. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:53 PM (#5860362)
SB has to be Wills, right?
   16. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:53 PM (#5860364)
Post #13:
Mays led in none of the categories
Yaz - 2B? DING! He's one of the three guys who led in just one stat.

Post #14:
Killebrew for HR? DING! 393. It's one of the two categories he led in.

   17. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:55 PM (#5860366)
Post #15:
Wills for SB? DING! It's one of the categories he leads in. And he's the only non-Hall of Famer on the decade's leaderboard.
   18. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 02:57 PM (#5860367)
Hank Aaron for G, PA, AB, H, RBI?
   19. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:02 PM (#5860369)
Post #18:
Hank Aaron? RBI? DING!
Nope for the others.

He does lead in other categories, but not those German categories.

   20. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:02 PM (#5860370)
Games - Billy Williams.

   21. Man o' Schwar Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:03 PM (#5860371)
Clemente - 3B
   22. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:04 PM (#5860372)
CS also Wills, I presume
   23. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:06 PM (#5860375)
Post #20:
Nope. Billy Williams isn't on the leaderboard at all.

Post #21:
DING! It's one of two categories Clemente leads in.

Reminder: Killebrew, Willis, Aaron, and Clemente all lead in multiple categories - but they've all been named for just one correct category each so far.

   24. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:07 PM (#5860376)
Nope. Billy Williams isn't on the leaderboard at all.


Only playing 12 games in 1960 killed him.
   25. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:07 PM (#5860377)
Post #22:
Wills for CS? DING! That's the second of the three categories he leads in.


Six down, twelve to go.
   26. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:08 PM (#5860378)
Rose - Hits.
   27. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:08 PM (#5860380)
SH - Wills?

   28. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:08 PM (#5860381)
Harmon for K's as well
   29. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:09 PM (#5860383)
for HBP I would have said Ron Hunt, but you said Wills was the only non-HOFer, so I'll guess Frank Robinson
   30. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:14 PM (#5860386)
Post #26:
Nope. Rose doesn't appear on the leaderboard at all. The only non-HoF on the leaderboard is Maury Wills

Post #27:
Wills for SH? DING! That closes out the only non-HoF. He led in SB, CS, & SH.

Post #28:
Killebrew for K? Nope. (looks at it) -- Oh, this guy is also a non-Hall of Famer. Big slugger. But not a Hall of Famer. Killebrew came in 2nd in Ks.

Post #29:
F. Robinson? DING! Helps he played all decade long. It's the only category he led in. Yaz, F. Rob & the Ks guy are the only ones who led in just one category. (Lucky for you I botched up my clue earlier). (Goes and uses the strike function for parts of this post.

   31. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:18 PM (#5860390)
If not Killebrew for K's then Frank Howard?
   32. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:20 PM (#5860392)
Post #31:
DING! Like I said, it's a big slugger.

Still another Killebrew category out there. And another Clemente category. And two more Hank Aaron category. And another guy no one's mentioned yet, who leads all in of the other remaining categories!!.

Nine down, nine to go - so here's the list as it stands:

G -
PA -
AB -
H -
2B - Yaz, 318. JJ1986
3B - Roberto Clemente, 99. Man o'Schwar
HR - Harmon Killebrew, 393. jmac66
R -
RBI - Hank Aaron, 1107. Pat Rapper's Delight
BB -
IBB -
K - Frank Howard, 1103. jmac66
SB - Maury Wills, 535. jmac66
CS - Maury Wills, 183. jmac66
GIDP -
SF -
SH - Maury Wills, 94. SoSH
HBP - Frank Robinson, 113. jmac66

   33. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:21 PM (#5860393)
Still another Killebrew category out there.

GIDP?
   34. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:22 PM (#5860394)
Clemente - Hits?

   35. Rennie's Tenet Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:23 PM (#5860395)
Hits for Clemente
   36. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:23 PM (#5860396)
Games - Kaline?

   37. JJ1986 Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:23 PM (#5860397)
Aaron for IBB?
   38. SandyRiver Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:24 PM (#5860398)
From 1957-1962, Friend's W/L records were 14-18, 22-14, 8-19, 18-12, 14-19, 18-14. A right proper Bret Saberhagen he was.

That sequence has me recalling "The Long Season", as that book chronicled the year Friend went 8-19. Broz wrote about how pitchers would whine if scheduled against Friend, "Why do you always pitch me against the best?!" But not in '59. Brosnan goes on to describe a Friend start in which squibs, seeing-eye-grounders and bloops fell all over before the manager mercifully took him out. One of Brosnan's 'pen pals said, "If that's the way he's been losing, he must be at the end of his rope", another adding, "I think he's crying."

Edit: In Friend's prime, 1955-65, he pitched 2800 innings of 116 ERA+ while going 163-168. ('59, with 95, was his only season of those 11 to finish under 103.) Some pretty bad Pirate teams mixed in there.
   39. Sweatpants Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:24 PM (#5860399)
Killebrew for walks and Aaron for GIDP?
   40. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:25 PM (#5860400)
Post #33:
Nope. Killebrew doesn't lead in GIDP. He's tied for 15th w/ Orlando Cepeda.

Post #34:
DING! Clemente leads in hits. Hank Aaron is 2nd. (and Vada Pinson 3rd!)

   41. JJ1986 Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:27 PM (#5860401)
Brooks Robinson for G, AB, PA?
   42. SoSH U at work Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:27 PM (#5860402)
Nevermind.


   43. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:28 PM (#5860403)
Post #36:
Nope. But the answer is a first ballot Hall of Famer who spent his entire career with one team.

Post #37:
Aaron for IBB? DING!

Post #39:
Killebrew for BB? DING!
Aaron for GIDP? Nope. He was 7th in GIDP (just behind the immortal Jerry Adair). One more Aaron category left.

Six categories left -- five by the same guy (!) who no one has mentioned yet (!!!).
   44. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:29 PM (#5860404)
Brooks Robinson for SF?
   45. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:29 PM (#5860405)
Games: Brooks Robinson?
GIDP: Brooks Robinson?
   46. Man o' Schwar Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:30 PM (#5860406)
Al Kaline - G, AB, H, R, PA

Nevermind - didn't see him already mentioned.
   47. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:30 PM (#5860407)
Post #41:
Brooks Robinson? DING! There's the name we haven't yet. This Hall of Famer led in G, AB, & PA.... and what else?

(notice how the question up top said full name - it's because of Brooks & Frank).

   48. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:32 PM (#5860408)
Post #44:
Brooks for SF? DING!

Post #45:
Brooks for GIDP? DING! (He's also baseball's all-team leader in triple plays, with 3).

That completes the Brooks Robinson portion of the guessing.

One category left: Runs. If you've been following the clues, you should be able to get this one.

   49. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:34 PM (#5860409)
One category left: Runs. If you've been following the clues, you should be able to get this one.

Hammerin Hank?
   50. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:35 PM (#5860411)
Post #49:
DING! Hank Aaron led in runs.

The leaderboard for the 1960s:

G - Brooks Robinson, 1578. JJ1986
PA - Brooks Robinson, 6737. JJ1986
AB - Brooks Robinson, 6093. JJ1986
H - Roberto Clemente, 1877. SoSH
2B - Yaz, 318. JJ1986
3B - Roberto Clemente, 99. Man o'Schwar
HR - Harmon Killebrew, 393. jmac66
R - Hank Aaron, 1091. jmac66
RBI - Hank Aaron, 1107. Pat Rapper's Delight
BB - Harmon Killebrew, 970. Sweatpants
IBB - Hank Aaron, 160. JJ1986
K - Frank Howard, 1103. jmac66
SB - Maury Wills, 535. jmac66
CS - Maury Wills, 183. jmac66
GIDP - Brooks Robinson, 178. Pat Rapper's Delight
SF - Brooks Robinson, 75. Tom Nawrocki
SH - Maury Wills, 94. SoSH
HBP - Frank Robinson, 113. jmac66
   51. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:43 PM (#5860415)
Come on, Dag. Pat Rapper's Delight guessed Brooksie for SF, and I guessed him for GIDP. Try to keep up, here.
   52. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 09, 2019 at 03:51 PM (#5860422)
Come on, Dag. Pat Rapper's Delight guessed Brooksie for SF, and I guessed him for GIDP. Try to keep up, here

Yeah, but he hacked into your account with his guess & you hacked into his account with your guess.
   53. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 09, 2019 at 04:46 PM (#5860450)
Wills for SB? DING! It's one of the categories he leads in. And he's the only non-Hall of Famer on the decade's leaderboard.


One of two - Frank Howard.
   54. Cblau Posted: July 09, 2019 at 09:20 PM (#5860521)
Charles C. Cravath was also better known as Clifford C. Cravath, which was his actual name.

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