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Tuesday, August 14, 2018

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 8-14-2018

Toledo News-Bee, August 14, 1918:

Dazzy Vance, up for the steenth time, proved a hopeless case and Manager Miller Huggins of the Yankees has shipped him to Rochester in the International.

At this point, Vance was 27 years old and had allowed 22 runs and 23 walks in 33 big league innings. He didn’t make it back to the majors until 1922. If Dazzy didn’t have the least likely Hall of Fame career of all time, he’s gotta be close.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 09:59 AM | 35 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history

Reader Comments and Retorts

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   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 10:02 AM (#5726265)
A good pitching staff but not a ton of offense on today's Birthday Team. Earl Weaver's going to be waiting a long time for three-run homers - Mark Loretta is the August 14 leader in career home runs, with 76. Juan Pierre is fifth.

I repeat: Only four people born on August 14 have more career major league home runs than Juan Pierre.

C: Oscar Siemer (-0.59 WAR)
1B: Alex McKinnon (8.89 WAR)
2B: Mark Loretta (19.39 WAR)
3B: Harry Schafer (3.85 WAR)
SS: Billy Myers (13.64 WAR)
LF: David Peralta (11.53 WAR)
CF: Juan Pierre (17.13 WAR)
RF: Current Pirates Josh Bell (1.48 WAR)

SP: Mark Gubicza (37.6 WAR)
SP: Joe Horlen (23.25 WAR)
SP: Clay Buchholz (16.47 WAR)
SP: Mark Fidrych (11.42 WAR)
SP: Paul Dean (10.33 WAR)
RP: Don Carman (5.39 WAR)

Manager: Earl Weaver
Owner: Magic Johnson
Fun name: Skinny Graham
Purveyor of novelty license plates: Babe Borton (3.77 WAR)
Umpires: Dale Scott, Ian Lamplugh
   2. Lindor Truffles Posted: August 14, 2018 at 10:32 AM (#5726286)
Alas, the Tebow (8/14/87) plan will not work this year.

Also, happy 15th to a Travis Hafner cycle and massive blackout.
   3. Tom Nawrocki Posted: August 14, 2018 at 10:35 AM (#5726291)
To be fair, David Peralta is likely to overtake Loretta as the August 14 homer leader early next year. Josh Bell could very well pass up Peralta in about three years.

Mark Fidrych's birthday ought to be a state holiday in Michigan.

   4. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: August 14, 2018 at 10:42 AM (#5726299)
RF: Current Pirates Josh Bell (1.48 WAR)


The previous Josh Bell is a hitting coach and occasional player for the Lancaster Barnstormers. At first, I thought that the luster had dropped off dramatically from the current Josh Bell until I looked a little deeper.
   5. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 11:18 AM (#5726326)
SP: Paul Dean (10.33 WAR)

Wow, I always though Daffy was a lot better than that.
   6. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: August 14, 2018 at 11:22 AM (#5726330)
He was, but his career peaked at 22.
   7. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: August 14, 2018 at 11:34 AM (#5726359)
Purveyor of novelty license plates: Babe Borton
Come on, you really think anyone here needs a link for that reference?
   8. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 11:40 AM (#5726370)
He was, but his career peaked at 22.

Even in his first 2 years, he's ERA+ was only in the 120's. I always thought he had a solid 5 year run at least. Must have conflated my Deans.
   9. Batman Posted: August 14, 2018 at 12:37 PM (#5726452)
By W-L and IP, the Dean brothers combined for a career similar to Justin Verlander, Roy Halladay, or Dwight Gooden.

Deans: 200-117, 3.23 ERA in 2754 IP
Verlander: 199-121, 3.41 in 2703
Halladay: 203-105, 3.38 in 2749
Gooden: 194-112, 3.51 in 2800
   10. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: August 14, 2018 at 12:54 PM (#5726473)
Something interesting (well, maybe just to me):

Joey Votto is has a .428 OB% and a .4275 slg%. If the season were to end as of yesterday, that would be the highest slg% ever for a player who had a higher OB% than slg% in a season.
   11. Nasty Nate Posted: August 14, 2018 at 01:17 PM (#5726495)
Joey Votto is has a .428 OB% and a .4275 slg%. If the season were to end as of yesterday, that would be the highest slg% ever for a player who had a higher OB% than slg% in a season.
What about Eddie Collins in 1912?
   12. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 01:48 PM (#5726535)
What about Eddie Collins in 1912?

1923 is even higher. .455 OBP, .452 SLG.
   13. Batman Posted: August 14, 2018 at 01:48 PM (#5726536)
And Eddie Collins in 1923, 1915, and 1913. He just missed in 1914.
   14. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:31 PM (#5726596)
What about Eddie Collins in 1912?


ah, heck. not sure how I missed that in P-I. Nevermind!
   15. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:31 PM (#5726597)
All-time OBP leaders named "Eddie": name them all

#13. .424 - Eddie, 1906-30
#35. .410 - Eddie, 1943-53
#82. .394 - Eddie, 1944-62
204: .376 - Eddie, 1952-68
332: .366 - Eddie, 1939-50
414: .361 - Eddie, 1936-55
466: .359 - Eddie, 1977-97
589: .353 - Eddie, 1942-57
610: .352 - Eddie, 1890-97
794: .344 - Eddie, 1941-55
   16. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:36 PM (#5726603)
13 Collins
35 Yost
82 Joost
204 Stanky
332
414
466 Murray

edit: it is amazing how many of those careers overlap.
   17. Chris Fluit Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:38 PM (#5726606)
Eddie Mathews
   18. Chris Fluit Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:39 PM (#5726607)
610: Ed McKean?
   19. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:39 PM (#5726609)
I guess it's not fair to ask which is which specifically.

Eddie Joost was a clear step below his other two contemporary Eddies that Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa mentioned.

List does not include Eds. That would add Delahanty, Morgan, Swartwood, McKean, Bailey, and Konetchy. The Eds are a bit more obscure.

13 Collins
35 Stanky
82 Yost
204 Matthews
332
414 Joost
466 Murray
589
610
794
   20. SoSH U at work Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:41 PM (#5726611)
Eddie Lake?

   21. Chris Fluit Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:44 PM (#5726615)
Eddie Robinson
   22. PreservedFish Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:45 PM (#5726616)
Eddie Money
   23. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: August 14, 2018 at 02:51 PM (#5726624)
13 Collins
35 Stanky
82 Yost
204 Matthews
332 Lake
414 Joost
466 Murray
589 Robinson
610
794

Eddie Robinson is still alive at age 97. Eddie Joost died at 94 in 2012.
   24. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:09 PM (#5726646)
Friends of Eddie Coyle
   25. The usual palaver and twaddle (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:10 PM (#5726647)
Courtship of Eddie's Father.
   26. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:12 PM (#5726649)
13 Eddie Collins
35 Eddie Stanky
82 Eddie Yost
204 Eddie Matthews
332 Eddie Lake
414 Eddie Joost
466 Eddie Murray
589 Eddie Robinson
610 - outfielder with John Montgomery Ward's Giants for a couple years, was on the Reds before and after that... once traded for Billy Sunday... only 855 career games played. Led the league in HBP once before Hughie Jennings took over as the HBP king.
794 - this guy is pretty famous
   27. Hank Gillette Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:15 PM (#5726655)
Mookie Betts has taken a lead in bWAR over Mike Trout. I was sensing a disturbance in the Force.
   28. Hank Gillette Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:19 PM (#5726660)
Relative to his peers, no one struck out more batters than Dazzy Vance.

Bill James theorized that Vance had some sort of arm injury when he was younger and an operation for an unrelated arm injury fixed his arm and made him the dominant pitcher that he was.
   29. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:33 PM (#5726682)
Relative to his peers, no one struck out more batters than Dazzy Vance.


More than Feller?
   30. Batman Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:39 PM (#5726690)
I don't think Mr. Ed made any outs in the episode where he played baseball, but the "No Ed" rule leaves him out.
   31. vortex of dissipation Posted: August 14, 2018 at 03:59 PM (#5726714)
794 - Eddie Waitkus.
   32. Sweatpants Posted: August 14, 2018 at 05:03 PM (#5726779)
I don't have a PI subscription, so I'm doing these manually and surely missing a lot of notable ones.

John McGraw had an OBP of .466 and SLG of .410 for his whole career. He peaked with a .547/.446 in 1899.
Billy Hamilton was at .455/.432 for his career, with his best OBP>SLG coming in 1898 with a .480.
Cupid Childs had a .416/.389 career and .475/.459 in 1894.

Post-1900, the record-holder appears indeed to be Eddie Collins, with a .461/.442 in 1925.
Eddie Stanky was at .460/.412 in 1950 and .410/.348 career.
Roy Thomas was at .453/.365 in 1903, .413/.333 career.
Mickey Cochrane was at .452/.450 in 1935.
Richie Ashburn won a batting title while accomplishing this (.449/.448 in 1955, .396/.382 career). Ferris Fain did the same thing but with a lower OBP.
   33. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: August 14, 2018 at 05:11 PM (#5726788)
Whither the Cruisers?
   34. Walt Davis Posted: August 14, 2018 at 08:12 PM (#5726897)
The pitching staff is pretty solid -- Eddie Plank, Eddie Cicotte, Eddie Lopat (116 ERA+ in 2400+ IP), Eddie Rommel (121 in 2500+) with Eddie Fishar and Everyday Eddie Guadardo in the pen ... and those are just names I semi-recognized.

How come nobody has mentioned #1 Eddie Gaedel? :-)
   35. Hank Gillette Posted: August 14, 2018 at 09:18 PM (#5726917)
Relative to his peers, no one struck out more batters than Dazzy Vance.



More than Feller?


Yes.

Other measurements:
https://sabr.org/research/dazzling-dazzy-vance-k-zone
https://www.billjamesonline.com/the_greatest_strikeout_seasons_ever/

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