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Tuesday, June 30, 2009

Riverfront Stadium Debut Dugout

I did like the type of game those cookie cutter stadiums created even if they were a tad sterile.

Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 11:07 AM | 52 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 01:19 PM (#3237582)
Anybody up for another Ichiro HOF thread? Because he is awesome!
   2. Flynn Posted: June 30, 2009 at 01:44 PM (#3237599)
I did like the type of game those cookie cutter stadiums created even if they were a tad sterile.

A tad? A tad?!?!?
   3. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 02:10 PM (#3237623)
I like hypobole. Flynn.
   4. Jolly Old St. Neck Wound, Moral Idiot Posted: June 30, 2009 at 02:16 PM (#3237629)
I did like the type of game those cookie cutter stadiums created even if they were a tad sterile.

Well, they did help revive the Baltimore chop, and they did create the exciting new category of the Texas League inside the park home run!
   5. Crispix Attacks Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:08 PM (#3237734)
Eric Hinske to Yankees. The final piece!

I now see why the Pirates signed Hinske instead of Mientkiewicz. They wouldn't be able to trade Mientkiewicz at the deadline without pissing off the fans again. Fans didn't develop an irrational attraction to Hinske.
   6. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:11 PM (#3237738)
Has Hinske ever been an Oriole? He played for every other AL East team except the Yanks.
   7. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:15 PM (#3237748)
Eric Hinske to Yankees. The final piece!

Are NY sports talk hosts already saying A-Rod should be benched in favor of him?
   8. Craig in MN Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:16 PM (#3237751)
Eric Hinske to Yankees. The final piece!

I was kind of hoping that he would become a Twin, since the Pirates had said they were interested in Luis Ayala and they make a similar amount of money. Twins fans have been seeing way too much of Brian Buscher. Oh well.
   9. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:18 PM (#3237755)
Forget Hinske, the Yanks signed WBC hero Yurendell DeCaster.
   10. Randy Jones Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:19 PM (#3237757)
from the Hinske to the Yankees link:

In addition, the Pirates will give the Yankees cash.


Never thought I'd see that one.
   11. The District Attorney Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:25 PM (#3237764)
What role does Hinske serve? They already have a 1B, 3B, LF, RF, and DH...
   12. PowerPoint Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:27 PM (#3237767)
Anybody up for another Ichiro HOF thread? Because he is awesome!


Sure! I haven't banged my head against a wall enough lately.

While we're at it, could we also discuss whether baseball is better with or without a DH? I think we're only one good thousand post thread away from coming to an agreement on that one.

(But Ichiro really is awesome)
   13. Randy Jones Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:28 PM (#3237768)
better backup than Ransom or Pena or Berroa on days they want to rest A-Rod or have A-Rod DH.
   14. PowerPoint Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:28 PM (#3237769)
What role does Hinske serve? They already have a 1B, 3B, LF, RF, and DH...


Backup at all of those positions, and bat off the bench?
   15. aleskel Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:30 PM (#3237771)
What role does Hinske serve? They already have a 1B, 3B, LF, RF, and DH...

1) Spelling ARod, now that it's guarunteed that he needs days off
2) Spelling Damon and Swisher in the OF, since one or both are bound to wear down.
   16. Chipper Jonestown Massacre Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:33 PM (#3237776)
Forget Hinske, the Yanks signed WBC hero Yurendell DeCaster.


WHAT...?!?!?

THE Yurendell DeCaster???
   17. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:35 PM (#3237779)
Sure! I haven't banged my head against a wall enough lately.

While we're at it, could we also discuss whether baseball is better with or without a DH? I think we're only one good thousand post thread away from coming to an agreement on that one.


There's only one Francouer thread on Hot Topics right now. Surely, their must be another news item on him that needs linking. God, we get it. He sucks! Can we talk about someone like Clint Zavada instead?
   18. RJ in TO Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:40 PM (#3237784)
Hey! There can never be enough Francoeur threads. Yes, he sucks, and we know he sucks, but there are so many ways in which he sucks, and it is vitally important that we ranks those ways as precisely as possible.

Does he suck most because he can't hit? Or is it his inflated sense of his own abilities? Or is it that he inspires the AJC to write thousands of articles to the great glory that is he? Or is it that he's a Delta shill?

Personally, I'm going with the last one. Delta sucks.
   19. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:43 PM (#3237791)
What about a thread about how stupid Murray Chass/Joe Morgan/John Sterling/Rick Sutcliffe/Buzz Bissinger/Furman Bisher/Bill Plaschke/Richard Justice/Jay Mariotti/Steve Phillips is?
   20. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:48 PM (#3237798)
What about a thread about how stupid Murray Chass/Joe Morgan/John Sterling/Rick Sutcliffe/Buzz Bissinger/Furman Bisher/Bill Plaschke/Richard Justice/Jay Mariotti/Steve Phillips is?

But...but...Ichiro is hitting .372, his UZR is off the chart and he's probably going to get over 200 hits again!

But as a secondary topic, is there any chance Mauer might win the MVP finally? How are the writers going to screw him this time?

edit: As a third topic, any chance Scutaro makes the all star team? (Thanks for that, Billy. Man, I miss Scooter.)
   21. aleskel Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:52 PM (#3237800)
know what I could use some good discussion on? Steroids. Or maybe politics.
   22. esseff Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:52 PM (#3237802)
Anyone know why Jamie McOwen, with a 36-game hitting streak in the Cal League, didn't play last night? It seems like an odd time to give him a breather.
   23. Randy Jones Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:55 PM (#3237806)
But...but...Ichiro is hitting .372, his UZR is off the chart and he's probably going to get over 200 hits again!

I still hate watching him bat. That swing is ugly as all hell.

But as a secondary topic, is there any chance Mauer might win the MVP finally? How are the writers going to screw him this time?

Twins miss the playoffs, Tex wins the MVP.

edit: As a third topic, any chance Scutaro makes the all star team? (Thanks for that, Billy. Man, I miss Scooter.)

no
   24. The cushions are crowded for Edmundo Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:59 PM (#3237809)
I did like the type of game those cookie cutter stadiums created even if they were a tad sterile.
You obviously never entered one of the Vet's bathrooms.
   25. RJ in TO Posted: June 30, 2009 at 04:59 PM (#3237811)
But...but...Ichiro is hitting .372, his UZR is off the chart and he's probably going to get over 200 hits again!

I still hate watching him bat. That swing is ugly as all hell.


At this very moment, I am ashamed to know that we're somehow related.

Okay, so his swing is occasionally awful looking, but there's still something wonderful about the way he just seems to be able to hack away at anything, and still get a hit out of it.
   26. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 30, 2009 at 05:00 PM (#3237813)
is there any chance Mauer might win the MVP finally?


There's a chance. I mean, if he ends the season hitting .386 with a .670 SLG and both lead the league, he's probably the favorite. But Ichiro! is batting .442 over his last 32 games (61-138). If he gets close enough to .400 for people to notice, especially if he manages to touch .400 for his season average at some point, then I think he would immediately become the favorite for MVP. If he actually hit .400 for the season, he'd more likely than not win the thing unanimously.
   27. Randy Jones Posted: June 30, 2009 at 05:00 PM (#3237814)
At this very moment, I am ashamed to know that we're somehow related.


If it makes you feel any better, my real name is not Jones.









It does make me feel better to know that I am not distantly related to some filthy Canadian.
   28. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 05:00 PM (#3237815)
edit: As a third topic, any chance Scutaro makes the all star team? (Thanks for that, Billy. Man, I miss Scooter.)

no


He's 3rd in the AL in VORP. Scutaro, Jeter and Bartlett are the class of the AL. If the AL goes with three SS's (which isn't uncommon) he should make it.
   29. RJ in TO Posted: June 30, 2009 at 05:07 PM (#3237823)
If it makes you feel any better, my real name is not Jones.


Yeah, I remember the discussion, when we were trying to figure out what relatively bland pitcher from the 70s I should take as my new handle. I believe that we decided that "Dave Roberts" would be suitably generic.

It does make me feel better to know that I am not distantly related to some filthy Canadian.


If it makes you feel better, I've started bathing regularly.
   30. Don't want the truth; just wanna see some dingers Posted: June 30, 2009 at 05:56 PM (#3237888)
If it makes you feel any better, my real name is not Jones.


But the question remains, are you Randy?

Also, I don't think there's any way Ichiro wins the MVP on such a god awful team.
   31. Don't want the truth; just wanna see some dingers Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:12 PM (#3237915)
And, I probably should have checked the standings, as the Mariners are over .500 and only 3.5 back.
   32. puck Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:15 PM (#3237922)
when we were trying to figure out what relatively bland pitcher from the 70s I should take as my new handle. I believe that we decided that "Dave Roberts" would be suitably generic.


The utility infielder Dave Roberts seems even more generic. Though I guess there's the #1 pick in the draft and no minor leagues distinctions.
   33. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:33 PM (#3237953)
According to Dejan Kovacevic, the proposed Pirates/Nats swap of Morgan for Milledge is very closet to happening.
   34. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:35 PM (#3237956)
Shortstop: Jason Bartlett*, Derek Jeter, Marco Scutaro. Bartlett, a career .276 hitter entering this year, was batting more than 100 points above his career average. Scutaro, the most patient hitter in the league, is having a breakout year at 33 and could join Alex Rodriguez and Cal Ripken Jr. as the only shortstops in the past 50 years to get 100 walks. And that Jeter guy is still pretty good.

Verducci likes Scutaro, too! Of course, each will have to decide for themselves whether this bolsters my support for Scooter or not.
   35. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:40 PM (#3237966)
Alex Rodriguez and Cal Ripken Jr. as the only shortstops in the past 50 years to get 100 walks


Seriously? Wow, I never would have guessed that (not that I had some specific patient shortstop in mind; I just would have assumed somebody would have done so).
   36. Lassus Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:40 PM (#3237967)
According to Dejan Kovacevic, the proposed Pirates/Nats swap of Morgan for Milledge is very closet to happening.

And who would know better than a Romanian dictator?
   37. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:43 PM (#3237970)
Seriously? Wow, I never would have guessed that (not that I had some specific patient shortstop in mind; I just would have assumed somebody would have done so).

I would have guessed Ozzie, but he peaked at 89.

edit: Petrocelli had 98 in 1969 when he was still a SS. Trammell and Yount never came close to a 100. I can't think of many other guys to check. Fregosi had 93 in 1969.
   38. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:44 PM (#3237972)
I don't think there's any way Ichiro wins the MVP on such a god awful team.


Rod Carew's 1977 MVP would be the closest parallel, I think - the Twins finished 4th that year (84-77, 17.5 GB). Although I do think that in Ichiro's case .388 won't be close enough. But it's very difficult to overstate how wildly popular Ichiro is with sportswriters and it's also, I think, hard to overstate what a big deal it would be for somebody to hit .400.
   39. Mike Emeigh Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:47 PM (#3237978)
I don't think there's any way Ichiro wins the MVP on such a god awful team.


Last time I looked (30 seconds ago) Seattle was still over .500.

-- MWE
   40. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:47 PM (#3237979)
But it's very difficult to overstate how wildly popular Ichiro is with sportswriters and it's also, I think, hard to overstate what a big deal it would be for somebody to hit .400.

But it's a tradition for .400 hitters not to win the MVP.
   41. aleskel Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:48 PM (#3237981)
Petrocelli had 98 in 1969 when he was still a SS. Trammell and Yount never came close to a 100. I can't think of many other guys to check. Fregosi had 93 in 1969.

Larkin came close: 96 once (1996) and 93 another time (1999)
   42. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:54 PM (#3237993)
Most walks by a shortstop since 1969.

1. Cal Ripken 1988 - 102
2. Alex Rodriguez 2000 - 100
3. Walt Weiss 1995 - 98
3. Toby Harrah 1975 - 98
3. Rico Petrocelli 1969 - 98
6. Barry Larkin 1996 - 96
7. Bud Harrelson 1970 - 95
8. Barry Larkin 1999 - 93
9. Jim Fregosi 1969- 93
10.Hanley Ramirez 2008 - 92
   43. WillYoung Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:56 PM (#3237996)
I was kind of hoping that he would become a Twin, since the Pirates had said they were interested in Luis Ayala and they make a similar amount of money. Twins fans have been seeing way too much of Brian Buscher. Oh well.


But then we couldn't be so snarky about the idiocy of this column
   44. Shooty: Applying to be Fearless Leader Posted: June 30, 2009 at 06:58 PM (#3238001)
7. Bud Harrelson 1970 - 95

!!!

I forgot about Harrah's time at SS. Weiss surprises me, too.
   45. DCW3 Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:01 PM (#3238007)
Before Ripken, the last SS to top 100 walks was Eddie Joost, who did it every year from 1947 to 1952.
   46. DCW3 Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:06 PM (#3238021)
But it's very difficult to overstate how wildly popular Ichiro is with sportswriters and it's also, I think, hard to overstate what a big deal it would be for somebody to hit .400.

He's not *that* popular, at least not enough for sportswriters to overcome their bias against MVPs from bad teams. The year that Ichiro hit .372 and set the hits record, he only finished 7th in the MVP vote, because the Mariners were a last-place team. In the very unlikely event that he does hit .400, he'll probably win, but if he doesn't, he's got no chance.
   47. Kiko Sakata Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:15 PM (#3238030)
if he doesn't, he's got no chance.


If he peaks at .372, I agree, no chance. If people start writing articles in August asking if Ichiro can hit .400 this season, then he's an MVP candidate. If people are writing articles in September asking if Ichiro can hit .400 this season, he's the favorite.

EDIT: And, as others have noted, the Mariners have a winning record and are only 3.5 games out of first. They're not THAT bad and if Ichiro hits .420 the rest of the season (which is close to what he'd probably have to do to hit .400 for the year), how much worse are the Mariners likely to be the rest of the way?
   48. Jolly Old St. Neck Wound, Moral Idiot Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:20 PM (#3238038)
Before Ripken, the last SS to top 100 walks was Eddie Joost, who did it every year from 1947 to 1952.

I just looked up Joost on bb-ref, and he must have driven some of his fans crazy. In 1947, he hit .206, with 114 walks but also a league leading 110 strikeouts, and in spite of all those walks he only scored 76 runs in 151 games. His OPS+ was a dismal 87, he made 38 errors at shortstop (second most in the AL), he stole but 6 bases in 11 attempts---and yet he somehow managed to finish 11th in the MVP voting.

My only reaction to that is: What kind of dirt did Joost have on those writers' private lives? I'd hate to see what the other 189 AL players must have been like that year.
   49. The District Attorney Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:30 PM (#3238053)
Speaking as someone who has put together innumerable "all-time" teams in various video games... when I hear "Eddie Joost", I think "good candidate as best SS in A's history." You could also make a strong argument for Bert Campaneris, especially if you emphasize the Rosenheck-esque argument that the other SS of that time period really stunk. Joost will work better in most video games, though, since they don't usually adjust sufficiently (if at all) for offensive context.

Anyway, I don't think people were voting for Joost for MVP on the basis of his standing among the all-time A's shortstops, so I can't explain that part. (I mean, it was still a decent season, but if nothing else, it certainly is not a performance you would expect to be well-appreciated in 1947.)
   50. DCW3 Posted: June 30, 2009 at 07:59 PM (#3238099)
My only reaction to that is: What kind of dirt did Joost have on those writers' private lives? I'd hate to see what the other 189 AL players must have been like that year.

If statheads get mad about MVP voting today, I can only imagine the reaction had we been around in 1947. Eddie Joost got two first-place votes. George McQuinn--a first baseman who hit .304/.395/.437--got three first-place votes, the same number as given to Ted Williams, who hit .343/.499/.634, missed one game all season, and won the friggin' Triple Crown.
   51. Designated Sitter (GGC) Posted: June 30, 2009 at 08:09 PM (#3238113)
Don't #### with Eddie, he was Joost in!
   52. DCW3 Posted: June 30, 2009 at 08:14 PM (#3238123)
Another strange MVP vote from that same period that I recently noticed was Bob Johnson's 5th-place finish in 1943. Johnson had a great career, yes, but 1943 was one of his worst seasons--mostly playing right field, he hit .265/.362/.400 for a 127 OPS+, with seven home runs, 62 RBIs and 11 stolen bases. He also missed 36 games. He did rank 10th in the league on OPS+ that year, but his 8th-place finish in triples was the only stat that people looked at at the time where he finished in the league's top 10. Now, he played for the Senators that year, who finished second in the league after years of futility, so maybe the writers felt it necessary to reward a player from that team--but his teammate Stan Spence, a center fielder, had a higher batting average, OBP and SLG than Johnson, as well as more runs scored, hits, doubles, triples, home runs, RBIs, walks and total bases...and Spence didn't receive *any* MVP votes. Weird.

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