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Baseball Primer Newsblog — The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand Thursday, November 29, 2012Ross Newhan: That’s the Steroid Era Knocking on the Hall Door“It’s hard, but it’s harder to ignore it.
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1. RMc's Unenviable Situation Posted: November 29, 2012 at 07:35 AM (#4312152)I can't vote for it any more
It's getting dark, too dark to see
I'm feelin' like I'm knocking on steroid's door
He has a higher WAR than Alex Sanchez.
I can't be too bothered by a father feeling like his son was treated unfairly. I would think that's a natural reaction.
If he can't put his emotion on the shelf for a simple HOF vote, where the THIRD BEST PLAYER IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL is on the ballot, then he deserves to be pilloried for it.
You think Shawn Green ranks that high?
How does Newhan losing roster spots to proven PED users provide support for the claim that Newhan didn't use steroids?
A father basically never deserves to be pilloried for defending his son against arbitrary and unfair treatment. His son had dreams and goals that appear to have been thwarted by cheaters.
cheatersmajor league pitchingFTFY
You don't know that, and can't know that.
1. You can't show that David Newhan didn't take steroids.
2. You can't show that steroids have much of an impact on baseball performance.
3. Newhan didn't get any better (after accounting for aging) after steroid testing began.
Yeah, I'm not sure what more was expected. And who can say that Newhan wasn't on steroids during his hot month in 2004 when he hit .430? After all, Melky Cabrera shows that steroids can magically improve one's BABIP. And that hot month allowed Newhan to secure a roster spot for 2005. From Baseball Prospectus 2005:
The Orioles rewarded Newhan`s hot month in 2004 with a nearly guaranteed roster spot for 2005. He did just about all he could to make them regret it. Newhan was one of the few Orioles who did not start the season hot-and he never got hot, ever-hitting .220 in his best month. That`s not a reasonable level for a utility infielder; that he was almost entirely playing in the outfield exacerbated matters.
There's no evidence that Newhan wasn't on steroids during his hot month in 2004, and if he was, then he potentially stole a non-user's roster spot in 2005.
Every single clean player was screwed over by every single juicer. The best clean player in baseball? His numbers would have better if the playing field were natural because he would have had less competition. The shlub who lost an MLB roster spot to a juicer? Hugely damaged.
This is why we have drug testing and why we need to keep it sharp. Otherwise, there's immense pressure on clean players to juice to keep up, and unmitigated PED usage is harmful to one's long-term health and longevity.
I have no idea of who he was and neither do you. None of us do. Greg Maddux could have been clean, just like says. Same for Griffey or Jeter or even Clemens for that matter (he certainly acted the way a clean player with substantial resources accused of juicing might.) This is the price for the steroid era.
Do you dispute that PED usage is unfair to clean players? Or that PED usage has negative effects on the playing population of baseball and/or the game as a whole? I'd like an actual answer and not some red herring meant to absolve knowing, willful juicers.
There is a basic truth here: PED's are risky business and their usage creates unfair consequences to the rest of the playing population. Consequently, they ought to be tested for in order to have a cleaner ("clean" is impossible) game. BBTF, or at least a large contingent of the posting populace, seems to have lost sight of that fact.
I am glad that there is testing now for the reasons you point out, but it's pretty hard to sit here and point fingers about who's clean and who wasn't and who suffered and how much from the days when steroids were de facto allowed in baseball.
Steroids were not de facto allowed in baseball. Amps were. One was institutionally promoted (loaded coffee in the clubhouses, etc.) whereas the other was simply allowed to fester through gross negligence.
So, if we agree that PED usage is bad and should be discouraged, why should we allow known PED users (players with bodies of evidence against them such as to form a non-analytical positive like, say, Barry Bonds) to be conferred the greatest honor in baseball? What is disingenuous about that position?
This standard would probably mean voting for players who juiced and got away with it, but it also sends a message that writers will, to the best of their ability, discourage PED usage by punishing those who have been caught.
Perhaps this is a misunderstanding of terms on my part, but I do believe what you just described is something being "de facto allowed"
That's a different discussion--one that has its place but not in this conversation. The position I am attempting to address is the one that is the subject of this article--viz. Mr. Newhan's invective against steroids users by claiming they cost his son a tangible, specific amount because of his son's cleanliness. I reject both aspects of that argument, and I'm not sure where you disagree, given that you agree that we have no way of knowing who did not use steroids nor to what extent steroids aids dirty players and suppresses clean players.
That sounds like another way of saying "de facto allowed".
Edit: Coke.
Huh? Steroids most certainly were de facto allowed.
Yes. That's the de facto part. Except that it wasn't mere "gross negligence," but was a case of teams actually looking the other way as the drug-dealing-trainers were allowed into clubhouses and even employed by the teams. McNamee and Radomski, for example, were both actually employed by the teams - not just by individual players.
We don't.
Because taking illegal drugs to enhance performance has never prevented players from being inducted before. Cite: amps.
Because "cheaters" - if that's what one thinks steroids players were - are already in the Hall of Fame. Cite: Gaylord Perry and all the amps users and Pud Galvin (elixir) and Babe Ruth (elixir and corked bat).
And had they started by punishing amps users, they would have at least had the virtue of being logically consistent instead of intellectually dishonest. But they didn't, so they don't, so they have no soapbox to stand on now.
Only five players (out of 28) drafted in that round that year (1995) even made the majors. I'd say he did OK.
Any reasonable person must take this as proof positive that Newhan was using steroids. Presumably supplied to him by his father, who, as a sportswriter, it must be assumed knew all the dealers.
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