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Saturday, April 26, 2014

Ryan Braun hits Jean Segura with bat in dugout

Pictures may say a thousand words, but the only one that comes to mind when looking at this GIF of Ryan Braun accidentally hitting his teammate Jean Segura in the face with a baseball bat is “Ouch.”

While the damage to Segura doesn’t appear too severe, according to Brewers pitching coach Rick Kranitz on the FS Wisconsin telecast and Brewers beat writer Tom Haudricourt on Twitter, the shortstop has a “pretty good gash over his eye.” Although Segura hasn’t exactly been dominant himelf, any time missed by the shortstop may have an adverse effect on what’s been a dominant Brewers squad so far this season.

Thanks to HJ.

Repoz Posted: April 26, 2014 at 10:01 PM | 72 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: brewers

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   1. Pat Rapper's Delight Posted: April 26, 2014 at 10:10 PM (#4695053)
Roid rage
   2. Dag is a salt water fish in fresh water world Posted: April 26, 2014 at 10:19 PM (#4695060)
The headline sure got my attention.
   3. Harry Balsagne, anti-Centaur hate crime division Posted: April 26, 2014 at 10:46 PM (#4695080)
The GIF also ends before Braun really reacts, so he's also an emotionless sociopath.
   4. Random Transaction Generator Posted: April 26, 2014 at 11:47 PM (#4695108)
From the headline, I thought maybe he let go of the bat during a swing and and flew into the dugout.

Nope.

Also, it doesn't look like anyone else was even looking at them when it happened.
   5. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:09 AM (#4695123)
This is the Fed-Ex guy's fault.
   6. Rafael Bellylard: Built like a Panda. Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:37 AM (#4695152)
I watched the game. Segura was the only thing Braun hit hard all night.
   7. NJ in DC (Now with Wife!) Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:58 AM (#4695163)
This headline is extremely misleading.
   8. Drexl Spivey Posted: April 27, 2014 at 05:46 AM (#4695185)
Jean Segura will need plastic surgery after getting hit by Ryan Braun’s bat


That is the title of an article on si.com.

Segura was stitched up by a plastic surgeon. He doesn't need plastic surgery.

   9. Drexl Spivey Posted: April 27, 2014 at 05:58 AM (#4695188)
Tom Haudricourt of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel had a pretty bad twitter day on Saturday.

He posted:

"No concussion or fracture for Segura. But plastic surgery." Followed by:

"@DeanBesiada @Brewers Segura already had a plastic surgeon stitch up his face. That's what I was referring to."

And then:

"Braun has slight intercourse strain." Followed by:

"Learned another lesson about Twitter. Make sure autocorrect doesn't do you in before sending. I-N-T-E-R-C-O-S-T-A-L strain for Braun."
   10. Drexl Spivey Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:17 AM (#4695189)
From the Journal Sentinel:

As for swinging a bat on the top dugout step, Braun said, “I do my warmups every game so I’m actually surprised something doesn’t happen like that more often.”
   11. Publius Publicola Posted: April 27, 2014 at 07:44 AM (#4695191)
Jeepus, I read the headline and assumed he did it on purpose.
   12. Publius Publicola Posted: April 27, 2014 at 07:45 AM (#4695192)
I know it wasn't on purpose but Braun is a dumbass anyway. Christ, be aware of who is around you.
   13. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: April 27, 2014 at 08:15 AM (#4695198)
This headline is extremely misleading.


Disagree. It's factual and tells what happened. If you want context, click on the damned thing.
   14. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: April 27, 2014 at 08:17 AM (#4695199)
as background this bat twirling has been part of Braun's routine since he came to the bigs

so you are the star of the team, you have your routine, you have done it 600 odd times a season since 2007, and you have never had an issue until this incident

pretty sure he figures teammates are watching out for HIM versus the other way around

not saying it's the right mindset

just thinking this is how it plays out
   15. toratoratora Posted: April 27, 2014 at 08:36 AM (#4695202)
Criminy-the headline sounds as if Braun went full Marichal.

What a moron, wildly swinging bats in the dugout. I'm starting to think Ryan isn't quite the sharpest tool in the shed.
   16. The Anthony Kennedy of BBTF (Scott) Posted: April 27, 2014 at 10:03 AM (#4695213)
Yeah, this headline promises vastly more than reality delivers.
   17. TerpNats Posted: April 27, 2014 at 10:04 AM (#4695214)
It really doesn't matter. The damn Cardinals still will either win the NL Central or go further in the postseason.
   18. Shibal Posted: April 27, 2014 at 10:18 AM (#4695217)
It really doesn't matter. The damn Cardinals still will either win the NL Central or go further in the postseason.


Does anything really matter? In the end, we are all dead.
   19. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: April 27, 2014 at 11:41 AM (#4695252)
Disagree. It's factual and tells what happened. If you want context, click on the damned thing.
News flash: it can be both factual and still extremely misleading.
   20. BDC Posted: April 27, 2014 at 11:51 AM (#4695256)
So I guess the only question left is: "would you let Ryan Braun launch a bat in your direction for $1.2M?"
   21. haggard Posted: April 27, 2014 at 11:52 AM (#4695257)
Christ, be aware of who is around you.

I see what you did there. Bigot.
   22. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:01 PM (#4695262)
News flash: it can be both factual and still extremely misleading.


Well, it could. But in this case it isn't. If you say "accidentally", you are climbing into Braun's head and measuring intent. I think it's pretty clear that it was unintentional, but that is a judgment call.
   23. Yastrzemski in left. Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:02 PM (#4695264)
Funny, I always thought there was a thing called an on deck circle. This clown wasn't just loosening up, he was doing calisthenics. Braun reminds me of people who believe no one else exists until they lay eyes on you.
   24. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:10 PM (#4695267)
Well, it could. But in this case it isn't.
Yes, it is, as demonstrated by multiple people just in this thread.

If you say "accidentally", you are climbing into Braun's head and measuring intent. I think it's pretty clear that it was unintentional, but that is a judgment call.
You cannot be serious.
   25. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:10 PM (#4695268)
My understanding is that Braun was "in the hole", up after the on-deck guy. I think he's legally prohibited from stepping onto the field at that time.
   26. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:16 PM (#4695271)
Yes, it is, as demonstrated by multiple people just in this thread.


This is really an interesting strand. The headline, as written, is about as bland and straightforward as possible. It describes, without any added detail, observation or bias, exactly what happened - Ryan Braun hit Jean Segura with a bat in the dugout. Nothing extraneous. No opinions rendered or judgments made. Yet it's that very absence of opinion or extraneous content that has people inferring all sorts of things that are wildly off the mark from the incident in question. It's pretty fascinating, at least to me.
   27. Monty Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:25 PM (#4695272)
people inferring all sorts of things


No, just one thing. Everyone who thinks the headline is misleading feels that it implies that Braun did it deliberately. Because that's the default state for a sentence like "Braun hits Jean Segura with bat." But because it was not, in fact, deliberate, the omission of the word "accidentally" makes the headline misleading.
   28. Monty Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:28 PM (#4695273)
For example, the headline on SI.com is "Watch: Ryan Braun accidentally hits Jean Segura with bat," which describes the situation much better. ESPN goes with "Bad timing: Jean Segura hit by bat," which uses passive voice to avoid attributing intent to Braun.
   29. BDC Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:30 PM (#4695274)
people inferring all sorts of things that are wildly off the mark

To be fair, though, the headline is of the type "Nomar Garciaparra beats Mia Hamm with a nine-iron on the golf course."
   30. Benji Gil Gamesh Rises Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:37 PM (#4695276)
I don't disagree, SoSH.

But the fact that getting hit by a bat in the dugout is not normal, and the headline calling out that someone in particular did the hitting (as opposed to something like "Segura struck by bat in dugout")...it was entirely predictable that some readers will jump to the wrong conclusion without the word "accidentally" or something similar in there.
   31. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:39 PM (#4695277)
Everyone who thinks the headline is misleading feels that it implies that Braun did it deliberately.


But again, it's the complete absence of editorializing that's causing this inference. The headline, as written, is factually indisputable.

If you asked the headline writer, he might very well say that he was trying to avoid any such inferences by writing it in a completely factual way, or that he couldn't imagine such an inference from what he'd written (I can say from experience, both mine and others in the business, that that which is inferred is not always that which was implied). This could be an example of that (I say could be because it's quite possible the headline writer was trying to dupe people).

All I can say with certainty is that I didn't infer that the incident was intentional when I read the headline.

I'm not saying anyone is wrong or right. Just that it's an example of interesting facet of communication.

   32. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:47 PM (#4695281)
That non-racist NBA Clippers who does the commercials just threw water on a dude in the crowd last week in an "accidental" kind of way.

I don't think Braun did this deliberately. But if something about Braun and Segura not getting along came out later, it wouldn't stun me. It's probably safest for the headline writer to stay away from intent-judging like that.
   33. Yastrzemski in left. Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:48 PM (#4695283)
@25. I have often seen a 'hole' batter a couple steps from the dugout, getting prepped to get in the On-Deck circle. And that is why they have an on-deck circle. My thing is he wasn't just twisting with the bat in his hand, he was doing full circle swings and shoulder work ON THE TOP STEP OF A PACKED DUGOUT. Absolutely unintentional, just narcissistic as per the brand.

   34. Monty Posted: April 27, 2014 at 12:49 PM (#4695284)
But again, it's the complete absence of editorializing that's causing this inference. The headline, as written, is factually indisputable.


As has already been pointed out, "Factually accurate" and "misleading" are not contradictory.

If you asked the headline writer, he might very well say that he was trying to avoid any such inferences by writing it in a completely factual way, or that he couldn't imagine such an inference from what he'd written (I can say from experience, both mine and others in the business, that that which is inferred is not always that which was implied). This could be an example of that (I say could be because it's quite possible the headline writer was trying to dupe people).


No one has said the headline writer was intentionally being misleading.

All I can say with certainty is that I didn't infer that the incident was intentional when I read the headline.


And other people did, which means the headline misled them. It is misleading, even if you personally were not misled.
   35. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 27, 2014 at 01:08 PM (#4695293)
As has already been pointed out, "Factually accurate" and "misleading" are not contradictory.


And I didn't say otherwise.

No one has said the headline writer was intentionally being misleading.


And I didn't say otherwise.

And other people did, which means the headline misled them. It is misleading, even if you personally were not misled.


That suggests a more permanent state than I think is warranted (since TVE and I* and presumably others weren't misled). I'd go with potentially misleading.

But again, this isn't about who's right/wrong, or defending/blaming, and never has been. I was merely remarking on an aspect of communication that I find interesting.

*And I only offered my take as an example that one could infer something benign from the same headline.
   36. Ulysses S. Fairsmith Posted: April 27, 2014 at 01:11 PM (#4695296)
At least we know for sure that Braun is clean now; otherwise, Segura's head would have come off.
   37. Random Transaction Generator Posted: April 27, 2014 at 01:15 PM (#4695299)
No, just one thing. Everyone who thinks the headline is misleading feels that it implies that Braun did it deliberately.


Not true.

As I stated in #4, I assumed it was a "whoops!" moment of letting go of the bat and it flew into the dugout (instead of into the crowd as often happens).

I don't think Braun did this deliberately. But if something about Braun and Segura not getting along came out later, it wouldn't stun me. It's probably safest for the headline writer to stay away from intent-judging like that.


There isn't any indication that Braun knew that Segura was there.
We don't seem him look over his shoulder at any time. If he was looking to hit Segura, he would have to have eyes in the back of his head to know that:
1) someone was there to hit
2) that it was Segura and not some other teammate

If he did this "deliberately", then he would have to be psychic to guess exactly who was going to walk behind him, and exactly when that person was in perfect striking distance.
   38. Joe Bivens, Minor Genius Posted: April 27, 2014 at 01:21 PM (#4695300)
It's a stupid headline. Why should I have to RTFA to find out it was an accident? edit...Nothing can be assumed from that headline except Braun hit Segura with the bat. There is no foundation to apply any assumption. It could have been an accident. It could have been on purpose. It could have been a result of horseplay. It could have been a number of other things.

Stupid headline.

re-edit...it was an accident, or it was done on purpose. Horseplay would be a hybrid of the two. But, that's about all there is.
And there's no basis, from the stupid headline, to assume either. Wherever your preconceived notion takes you is what you'll think, if you make any assumption.
   39. Joe Bivens, Minor Genius Posted: April 27, 2014 at 01:43 PM (#4695305)
It's complete clickbait. SB Nation. Inside, the sub-headline uses the word "accidentally". Clickbait.
   40. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: April 27, 2014 at 03:45 PM (#4695359)
Seeing the headline, I naturally assumed as anyone would that Vincent Ludwig triggered his remote control, but had neglected to hide a gun under second base, so Braun had to improvise. I was shocked to learn the actual story.
   41. Walt Davis Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:06 PM (#4695456)
The main issue with the headline is this: Btaun has no business being in the headline. If Matt Lucroy had done it or whatever coach hits fungoes had done it, then the headline is some variation of "Segura hit by bat" with, alas, 90% of the sports fans saying "who's Segura?"

The verb "hits" has no business being attached to Ryan Braun. This verb implies intent. It's true we don't always use it that way ("I hit a deer with my car") but if you read the headline "OJ Simpson hits girlfriend" you're not going to think that he accidentally backed into her car in the driveway.

The phrase "in the dugout" serves no important purpose other than to imply it was a scuffle. That's enough space to put in "accidentally" or, if you dig factual accuracy that's also important (and even more inflammatory), "in the face."

So sure the headline writer was being intentionally misleading -- or he's a dolt. The job of the headline writer is to draw eyeballs so the first thing is to make sure Braun's name is in the headline. The second is to make it sound as bad as possible while remaining factually accurate. (Note the proportion misled is rather beside the point -- con men don't expect to sucker 100% of the marks.)

For those of you who didn't have that reaction to the headline, I bet it's because (like me) you knew this would be much bigger news if Braun had "attacked" Segura (the likely headline) -- you'd have heard about it already. I even considered that Repoz was having a lark and re-writing the headline for us.
   42. Fancy Pants Handles lap changes with class Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:10 PM (#4695458)
This is really an interesting strand. The headline, as written, is about as bland and straightforward as possible. It describes, without any added detail, observation or bias, exactly what happened - Ryan Braun hit Jean Segura with a bat in the dugout. Nothing extraneous. No opinions rendered or judgments made. Yet it's that very absence of opinion or extraneous content that has people inferring all sorts of things that are wildly off the mark from the incident in question. It's pretty fascinating, at least to me.

There is a reason when you take the stand, they ask you for "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth". The headline is the truth and nothing but the truth, but it is not the whole truth.

And I am with #39, in that I strongly suspect the reason it isn't is for clickbait.
   43. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:16 PM (#4695463)
For those of you who didn't have that reaction to the headline, I bet it's because (like me) you knew this would be much bigger news if Braun had "attacked" Segura (the likely headline) -- you'd have heard about it already. I even considered that Repoz was having a lark and re-writing the headline for us.


It's also the fact I can't remember a teammate ever taking a bat to another teammate, so an accidental hit was my default position.

And it's interesting that for all the obvious intent the headline writer had, you were still so much shrewder than the suckers who fell for it. Quite brilliant of you.

Isn't that what you were implying. (-:

   44. A big pile of nonsense (gef the talking mongoose) Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:19 PM (#4695464)
To be fair, though, the headline is of the type "Nomar Garciaparra beats Mia Hamm with a nine-iron on the golf course; pulls muscle, in traction."


Just as likely.
   45. Sunday silence Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:28 PM (#4695472)

It's also the fact I can't remember a teammate ever taking a bat to another teammate


Frank Thomas on Dick Allen. That's the first thing I thought of. The second thing, as I was clicking, was "click bait, else I would have heard this on radio."
   46. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:47 PM (#4695479)
Frank Thomas on Dick Allen.


Before my time.
   47. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: April 27, 2014 at 06:55 PM (#4695482)
didn't the Mitch meluskey vs. Matt mieske involve bats? or was it just around the batting cage and only fists?
   48. BDC Posted: April 27, 2014 at 08:07 PM (#4695508)
The term "click-bait" reminds me of tabloid headlines like "Celebrity Whoever's Desperate Battle with Cancer" where the story is about them raising money for a children's cancer ward. Or my favorite, "Doris Day's Final Days," which is technically correct enough but has been running for about 10,000 days now.
   49. Jose Is The Most Absurd Thing on the Site Posted: April 27, 2014 at 08:45 PM (#4695516)
Just looking at the GIF and wow is that two people being stupid. As noted above assuming Braun has always done this Segura should have a clue and look where he's going. But man is Braun being stupid. That's just a ridiculously dumb place to do that. Pick up a small three pound weight and swing it around, you don't need to wave a 32 inch club around a confined space.
   50. Walt Davis Posted: April 28, 2014 at 03:35 AM (#4695601)
The day I have to _imply_ that I'm brilliant is the day I leave the intertubes.

   51. villageidiom Posted: April 28, 2014 at 08:06 AM (#4695614)
It's complete clickbait. SB Nation. Inside, the sub-headline uses the word "accidentally". Clickbait.

Ryan Braun Did WHAT To Segura With His Bat??

I see that kind of click bait more often now online. Every time I read a line like that, I just think, "He did SOMETHING," and proceed to ignore the click bait. Unless the line is written to imply something sexual, in which case I think, "He did something that ISN'T sexual," and ignore.

Bryce Harper Did WHAT With His Thumb??
Oliver Perez Was Told To Take Off WHAT??
Nomar Garciaparra Did WHAT To Two Women??
   52. Ray (RDP) Posted: April 28, 2014 at 08:50 AM (#4695629)
SoSH is being predictably SoSHy. The headline is misleading. Just because it is literally/factually true does not mean it's not misleading. How about:

"Man slashes woman with knife on the upper east side."

And then you find out from "clicking on the link" that the man is a heart surgeon and was operating on a female patient to replace a malfunctioning valve at Cornell Medical Center.

The word "hits" has various contexts so in order to write a proper headline that is not misleading if you use that word you'd have to go with "accidentally" or something. (And if you're trying to save words, take out Ryan Braun, who really has no business being in the headline in the first place. The story is that Segura was accidentally hit with a bat; since Braun had no intent he is secondary to that.)
   53. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: April 28, 2014 at 09:31 AM (#4695647)
"Man slashes woman with knife on the upper east side."


Well, if she had a knife, he was probably defending himself.
   54. villageidiom Posted: April 28, 2014 at 10:30 AM (#4695708)
"Man slashes woman with knife on the upper east side."
If the surgery is performed by "slashing" with a scalpel, then it probably is newsworthy in the manner inferred from such a headline. Likewise if the headline uses the word "stabs" in place of it. A scalpel incision is not made by slash nor stab in a heart operation.

If the headline had read "Ryan Braun beats Jean Segura with bat in dugout" then your analogy would make more sense. While "beat" and "hit" mean similar things in one context, the latter is much more free of implications of intent.

And that's the thing. If Braun had attacked Segura, there are countless verbs to use in the headline other than "hits". Actually, "hits" would be among the most innocuous way of conveying an attack. I don't know why anyone would infer it from "hits". Either the bat to Segura was accidental or intentional, but if it were intentional they almost certainly would have said something other than "hits". I inferred an accidental hit from first glance, though I certainly didn't guess the nature of the accident. But that's the difference between a headline and an article. One necessarily has all the detail, and the other necessarily has just enough to get you interested in hearing more.

They certainly could have made it more explicit. Your point that they drop Braun and include "accidentally" is a fine one, although I could see that Braun's latest "oh, my actions have impacts on other people?" event could warrant a cite of Braun in the headline as well.

EDIT:
SoSH is being predictably SoSHy. The headline is misleading.
The headline is, at worst, non-leading.
   55. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 28, 2014 at 10:43 AM (#4695730)
Well said Vi. Though I think there's also some ground between accidental and intentional in a case like this. If Braun had just struck out, came back to the dugout and swung at a water cooler and also happened to hit Segura, that would kind of fall in between the two (which almost happened last year with Papi and Pedroia). That wouldn't really be accidental or intentional (and might be the best time to use "Braun hits Segura with bat in the dugout" even if it turned out no one would have guessed the exact circumstances correctly).
   56. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:00 AM (#4695749)
"Nomar Garciaparra beats Mia Hamm with a nine-iron on the golf course; pulls muscle, in traction."


Yeah, but even this one leaves out the part where he rescued a couple people from the water hazard on the 12th hole.
   57. villageidiom Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:07 AM (#4695760)
Though I think there's also some ground between accidental and intentional in a case like this. If Braun had just struck out, came back to the dugout and swung at a water cooler and also happened to hit Segura, that would kind of fall in between the two (which almost happened last year with Papi and Pedroia).
In terms of intent to hit Segura with a bat in the dugout, it would still be accidental. However, it would likely change the headline entirely, not just on verb choice. (Segura Accidental Casualty Of Braun Tirade, or something like that. If it's the NY Post, then COOLER HEADS DON'T PREVAIL.)
   58. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:15 AM (#4695767)
In terms of intent to hit Segura with a bat in the dugout, it would still be accidental.


I'd say that's overly simplified. In this actual situation, Ryan Braun was swinging the bat, but he wasn't intending to hit anything. He was a dumbass, but there wasn't anything malicious about his conduct.

In the hypothetical I mentioned, he'd be swinging the bat in anger, just not at his target. It's kind of the how reckless homicide or manslaughter falls in between accidental death and murder, both in terms of legal outcomes and how most of us view the incidents. To chalk up both the actual incident and the hypothetical as accidental seems insufficient to me.
   59. Charles S. will not yield to this monkey court Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:19 AM (#4695772)
On the broadcast they showed Braun two innings later doing the exact thing while "in the hole". That tells me more about Braun's character than just about any of the steroid stuff. He's the man, and because he's the best hitter on the team, the whole world better just stay the #### out of his way.
   60. Ray (RDP) Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:20 AM (#4695773)
If the surgery is performed by "slashing" with a scalpel, then it probably is newsworthy in the manner inferred from such a headline. Likewise if the headline uses the word "stabs" in place of it. A scalpel incision is not made by slash nor stab in a heart operation.


You could change it to "Man cuts woman with scalpel on the upper east side."

Point being this headline should have been "Segura hit with bat in dugout." And then the fact that the headline doesn't mention who was holding the bat means that the contact was unintentional. Or, again, work "accidental" in there. This isn't that difficult.

On reading the headline I too thought that there was some altercation in the dugout which led to Braun hitting Segura with a bat. Of course, I didn't conclude it definitely, but in clicking on the link I wondered whether Braun actually hit Segura on purpose. That wouldn't have happened if a proper headline had been written.
   61. villageidiom Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:39 AM (#4695793)
To chalk up both the actual incident and the hypothetical as accidental seems insufficient to me.
Which is why I suggested the entire headline, not just the verb choice, would have been different.

On the broadcast they showed Braun two innings later doing the exact thing while "in the hole". That tells me more about Braun's character than just about any of the steroid stuff. He's the man, and because he's the best hitter on the team, the whole world better just stay the #### out of his way.
Did you see video of other players not doing the same thing in the hole? For all we know it's not uncommon on the Brewers for players to do that, in which case all of them should know to stay the #### out of the way.

It wouldn't surprise me if Braun's attitude is exactly as you suspect. These two videos don't tell us that.
   62. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:51 AM (#4695809)
Charles

this will read as a defense of the action which is not the intent but instead frame the behavior

teams (all sports teams) accommodate 'star behavior'. some teams look the other way when the star kind of plays defense but not with max effort (red sox/manny). some teams look the other way when a player is not active in practice (numerous).

star players get handled differently.

in this case you have a player with a quirk in his prep routine. it's not harmless like a wade boggs eating chicken but it's something that can be managed and has been managed by the club throughout different managers and a myriad of teammates.

ryan braun does not need the club to excuse his lack of effort on defense (which is always good) or him lollygagging down the basepath (which also doesn't happen). the club lets him wave his bat around in the dugout to get ready to hit and hitting is why braun is paid oodles of dollars

folks can perceive braun as a jack8ss for having this item as part of his regimen. but I suspect if you ask his teammates do they want an optimal braun at the plate hitting or a suboptimal braun at the plate they will take the former.

hope this feedback is taken as intended
   63. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: April 28, 2014 at 11:56 AM (#4695816)
in this case you have a player with a quirk in his prep routine. it's not harmless like a wade boggs eating chicken but it's something that can be managed and has been managed by the club throughout different managers and a myriad of teammates.


Segura should have known by now, but I sure as hell hope the "Don't Walk Behind Braun When He's In The Hole" is Lesson 1 on the Brewers' New Employee Orientation Tour.

   64. Rob_Wood Posted: April 28, 2014 at 12:16 PM (#4695832)

I do not remember seeing anyone else do that in all the years that I have been watching baseball. Why does Braun feel the need to do that? Does it take him an exceedingly long time to get ready? Where are the Brewers manager and coaches in the dugout? Do they move out of his way every time he is due up?
   65. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: April 28, 2014 at 12:23 PM (#4695838)
Why does Braun feel the need to do that? Does it take him an exceedingly long time to get ready? Where are the Brewers manager and coaches in the dugout? Do they move out of his way every time he is due up?

braun has regularly battled rib and back problems
so yes
away
yes
   66. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: April 28, 2014 at 12:27 PM (#4695843)
rob

as a follow up save for his rookie season and last season braun had played in 150 plus games regularly. even when in 2010 he was battling injuries that by all accounts should have put him on the dl.

I understand that braun is regarded at minimum as a jerk and most likely worse by many posters

but from a fan perspective you have a guy who works really hard to stay in the lineup, he hustles when is on the field, and he produces with good to great output

if the tradeoff is some prep schtick I can understand the brewers making that accomodation
   67. Charles S. will not yield to this monkey court Posted: April 28, 2014 at 02:30 PM (#4695964)
I suspect if you ask his teammates do they want an optimal braun at the plate hitting or a suboptimal braun at the plate they will take the former.

I have no doubt you are correct, but Braun shouldn't put them in the position of having to choose one or the other. The idea that he can't find a path to optimal performance without engaging in behavior that I have yelled at Little Leaguers for is questionable. Also, the fact that he was doing it on the next at-bat after clocking a teammate is, at best, insensitive, and at worst, willfully dickish.

It's a simple rule of life. When you're about to do something, ask yourself, "Does doing this make me an #######?" If the answer is yes, don't do it. I wonder if anyone ever taught Braun that.
   68. Sunday silence Posted: April 28, 2014 at 02:51 PM (#4695987)

I do not remember seeing anyone else do that in all the years that I have been watching baseball


I have not made a survey of this, but I agree his warm up seems odd and quite dangerous Cant imagine why anyone would do that, the risks of just someone like a ball boy or someome not paying attention seem myriad.
   69. Ray (RDP) Posted: April 28, 2014 at 03:29 PM (#4696015)
We had a kid on my high school baseball team who was hit by a full on swing with a metal bat when we were practicing indoors. One kid was swinging off a tee indoors, into the net, and this other kid reached down to pick up a ball and got tagged with a full swing behind his left ear. Went to the hospital and miraculously had no real damage.

Two weeks later, I kid you not, it happened again.... Same kid, different swinger.

Again, he was fine.
   70. Joe Bivens, Minor Genius Posted: April 28, 2014 at 03:51 PM (#4696035)
Went to the hospital and miraculously had no real damage.


Cyborgs repair easily.
   71. villageidiom Posted: April 28, 2014 at 05:21 PM (#4696106)
I do not remember seeing anyone else do that in all the years that I have been watching baseball.
I do not remember watching what the player "in the hole" was doing in all the years I have been watching baseball.

I would think swinging a bat around, far enough that someone still in the dugout can get hit in the head, would not be a typical thing. But honestly I don't have any idea what would actually be typical, because my only data point features someone doing just that.
   72. bunyon Posted: April 28, 2014 at 05:50 PM (#4696130)
Reaching down to pick up a ball around someone hitting off a tee isn't the same as walking through the dugout. If Harvey is right, and I have no reason to suspect otherwise, that Braun always does this, that lessens his blame somewhat. I think swinging a bat like that in the dugout is pretty stupid. But a dugout isn't a safety zone and the lesson I was always taught that you should always and everywhere be on the lookout for bats and balls flying around.

As to kids getting hit, I had a bat slip out of my hands when I was about 9 and to this day I can vividly recall how narrowly the bat missed the on deck hitter's head. He ducked. I have no idea how he was able to duck in time - a wildly spinning bat flung at full force (okay, 9 year old full force) released at a distance of about 30 feet. I'm pretty sure it would have killed him but Ray has me thinking otherwise. Glad I didn't find out.

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