The Giants should have open tryouts -- they couldn't do any worse really.

Willie Mays Hayes, Pedro Cerrano, Rick Vaughn, and Jake Taylor would listen if the Giants called.

The Giants should have open tryouts -- they couldn't do any worse really.

Nah, they should go after senior league players. They need to get younger.

As horrible as this club is, I hope Sabean plans on finally using those #1 draft picks. You can't hold onto Michael Tucker forever.

Nah, they should go after senior league players. They need to get younger

The Giants are probably younger than the Mets at this point. It's likely pretty close when you compare the rosters.

The Giants are probably younger than the Mets at this point.

Quiet you!

it's not barry funny

Again, someone explain to my why Sabean's ass hasn't been fired. This team is going to be miserable to watch. My plan was to Caincecum starts only, but watching them lose 1-0 after 1-0 games will not be good for the soul.

Why are the Giants using their #3 as the Opening Day starter?

Again, someone explain to my why Sabean's ass hasn't been fired

It blows my mind.

Considering the inablity of their staff to get the ball over the plate and the young pitching that's not that distant talent-wise that will be at AAA, the Orioles would probably lose to Norfolk, too. Good thing they didn't schedule them.

Again, someone explain to my why Sabean's ass hasn't been fired

I would imagine he's safe for awhile. The team's story seems to be that he had to go with all older players and overlook development to take advantage of Bonds's peak. That didn't get them a championship, but it had them, what, six outs away from one? Now comes the reckoning, which, hey, is to be expected.

Anyone that looks into his record can see where he has done a relatively poor job, but that's the team's story, and it's probably convincing enough for mainstream fans (and ownership) to be pacified and not revolt during the down cycle.

Relegation! Please!

Man, sometimes I get almost annoyed by our lack of relegation in sports as I do by our lack of universal health care.

Easy joke, but I'll take it: I'm pretty sure this will in no way be the Giants' final indignity.

Now comes the reckoning, which, hey, is to be expected.

Well, it was to be expected at least three years ago when a mostly Bonds-free Giants team finished with [edit] 75 wins or whatever it was. Heck, even in 2003 or 2004 Sabean had to realize that Bonds would not play forever and should have been doing things to soften the blow. Given that the man has no spine and/or was ordered not to do anything that would offend Bonds, he didn't, so I'm having a hard time giving him the benefit of the doubt now.

The good part is that if Bonds comes back, this year's team is poised to replicate the glories of the last three Bonds teams.

it's probably convincing enough for mainstream fans (and ownership) to be pacified and not revolt during the down cycle.

I don't think so at all. There's a nasty stench around the team in San Francisco. I wouldn't be surprised if attendance completely collapsed in the next two years.

I wouldn't be surprised if attendance completely collapsed in the next two years.

Official attendance -- as distinguished from butts in the seats -- probably won't suffer as much as you'd think this year because people have said that any season ticket holder who wanted All Star Game tickets last year was required to buy 2008 season tickets as well. Still, based on Craigslist posts, there are PLENTY of Giants tickets available this year and many fans will be going disguised as green chairs.

I heard Gary Cohen saying that Zito's fastball was around 80 mph this spring the other day. I thought the guy was overrated as a pitcher and his best days were past him, but if that's true, there's got to be something wrong. He's a better pitcher than that.

Official attendance -- as distinguished from butts in the seats -- probably won't suffer as much as you'd think this year because people have said that any season ticket holder who wanted All Star Game tickets last year was required to buy 2008 season tickets as well. Still, based on Craigslist posts, there are PLENTY of Giants tickets available this year and many fans will be going disguised as green chairs.

That's why I said the next two years. There's probably been enough people who got their application forms with Bonds on the cover, got the warm fuzzies, and said f**k it. But this team is in with a good shout of losing 100 games, and while it's a wonderful baseball stadium, new park shine is gone now. You just won't be able to convince people to part with $30-40 a game to watch a terrible team.

And yeah, the park has been trending empty for a few years now, but it'll be even worse this year. A bad start and a late April cold snap could see 10,000 in the park for a game.

I heard Gary Cohen saying that Zito's fastball was around 80 mph this spring the other day. I thought the guy was overrated as a pitcher and his best days were past him, but if that's true, there's got to be something wrong. He's a better pitcher than that.

I've been wondering if he's hurt. People don't lose that much juice off their fastball - remember Zito used to be able to dial it up to 90, 91 - without something being wrong, and it's not like Zito's put on 50 pounds or is 40 years old.

His contract is so long that I almost want him to be hurt, if you know what I mean. The team sucks now, and it'll be better if Zito goes off and has shoulder surgery and rehabs so that he can be at least an average pitcher the last few years of his contract when maybe there's enough of a supporting cast that the Giants can think about .500.

people have said that any season ticket holder who wanted All Star Game tickets last year was required to buy 2008 season tickets as well.

Which people? Are you asserting this is true, or just saying you've heard it? Because I'm local to the situation and heard much about the AS game saving attendance last season but nothing about 2008.

Well, it was to be expected at least three years ago when a mostly Bonds-free Giants team finished with [edit] 75 wins or whatever it was. Heck, even in 2003 or 2004 Sabean had to realize that Bonds would not play forever and should have been doing things to soften the blow. Given that the man has no spine and/or was ordered not to do anything that would offend Bonds, he didn't

"shaundarbie: Did you ever make an offer for Vladimir Guerrero?

Sabean: In a word: No. If we had signed Guerrero or [Gary] Sheffield, we would have been without [Jim] Brower, [Scott] Eyre, [Matt] Herges, [Dustin] Hermanson, [Brett] Tomko, [A.J.] Pierzynski, Feliz, [J.T.] Snow, [Jeffrey] Hammonds, [Dustan] Mohr and Tucker -- obviously not being able to field a competitive team, especially from an experience standpoint, given our level of spending."

"nick_gee: Can you elaborate on the reason for signing Michael Tucker just hours before the deadline for offering players arbitration expired, thus forfeiting this year's first-round draft pick. Was it a mistake? Or was it just a way of saving money?

Sabean: We were able to use the first-round draft pick money to apply to our Major League payroll and figured, by where we pick in the first round, we can get the same type of player or pitcher for half the price with our second selection."

Yes, it is Bonds' fault.

Not only was Sabes not fired, but he was extended!

These are going to be dark days for the Giants. I don't think that he's capable of rebuilding this team. In fact, I think he's going to make things worse.

We could be looking at a real nasty 5+ year stretch here as he founders around for the next 2-3 and thouroughly makes a mess of the team before they are rid of him and have a chance at a good rebuild.

Which people? Are you asserting this is true, or just saying you've heard it? Because I'm local to the situation and heard much about the AS game saving attendance last season but nothing about 2008.

Just saying I heard it. A commenter on my blog (and what's more reliable than that!) said he was a Giants' season ticket holder and that that was the deal. He may be full of it, but no one has disputed him (at least not on my blog, which, you know may as well be the Word of God).

Quoted from the SF Chronicle article recently linked on the newsblog:
And some of those season tickets were purchased before last season, because if a new season-ticket buyer wanted to buy tickets to last year's All-Star Game at AT&T;Park, he also had to purchase a season ticket for 2008.

Just saw that myself and was coming to say mystery solved. So the Giants simply wouldn't let new buyers hit it and quit it for the ASG. That makes sense.

So the Giants simply wouldn't let new buyers hit it and quit it for the ASG.

Also known as "The Spitzer"

So the Giants simply wouldn't let new buyers hit it and quit it for the ASG. That makes sense.

It makes sense in the way extortion makes sense.

But this team is in with a good shout of losing 100 games
Shouting distance from which side of 100 games though? <ducks>

This could be one of the great train wrecks if something happens to Cain and/or Lincecum. As it is, the Giants might have a 2-headed '72 Carlton on an otherwise dreadful for the ages team.

I showed someone at work this, and he asked whether it was traditional for the teams to exchange uniforms after this sort of game.

I showed someone at work this, and he asked whether it was traditional for the teams to exchange uniforms after this sort of game.

Wasn't that the premise of Major League 3?

"This team is going to be miserable to watch. My plan was to Caincecum starts only, but watching them lose 1-0 after 1-0 games will not be good for the soul."

I wouldn't count on Cain or Lincecum being that good, in part because of the players behind them. It is not unlikely that San Francisco will be significantly worse defensively at 3rd, SS and 2nd base. Bengie Molina is 33.5, and that is often a breakdown age for catchers. With Rowand in center and Bonds "retired", their outfield defense should improve. But if Rowand breaks his leg...

I wouldn't count on Cain or Lincecum being that good, in part because of that sub-mediocre bullpen. Yeah, they might leave games in the 6th inning with the score 0-1; but those same games might end up being blow-outs...

I wouldn't count on Cain or Lincecum being that good, in part because Lincecum is unproven, in terms of durability. He's a slightly built guy. He might prove he's got Pedro Martinez fortitude. But starting a full season in the majors, a year after he threw 177.3 innings (by far his most), might wear him down by August...

I think Cain had no wins in games where he allowed exactly 1 one run last year.

He's a slightly built guy. He might prove he's got Pedro Martinez fortitude. But starting a full season in the majors, a year after he threw 177.3 innings (by far his most), might wear him down by August...

Lincecum might wear down, but that has more to do with his age/experience than it does with his build. And the general nature of throwing a ball in the mid 90s and snapping that curve.

I've seen no evidence that small build pitchers are more susceptible to injury than larger built ones. I beleive that this is just a selection bias situation, much like hitters who "look good" rather than just the results.

"I think Cain had no wins in games where he allowed exactly 1 one run last year."

Nope. Cain had only 7 wins in 2007 and in most of them he allowed exactly 1 run:

Cain allowed one run on April 22 against Arizona and got the win.
Cain allowed one run on May 13 against Colorado and got the win.
Cain allowed one run on August 23 against Chicago (N) and got the win.
Cain allowed one run on August 28 against Colorado and got the win.

"I've seen no evidence that small build pitchers are more susceptible to injury than larger built ones. I beleive that this is just a selection bias situation, much like hitters who "look good" rather than just the results."

I don't know the evidence, either. However, it makes intuitive sense: If a pitcher has little muscle mass, all else held equal, he will use a more violent arm and body motion to achieve the same velocity. And because of that more violent motion, the odds of an injury would seem higher.* If you watch Lincecum pitch, he seems to fit this mold: In order to throw hard, he vigorously twists his torso and springs out violently upon delivery. My guess is that will make it hard for him to last very long.... By contrast, Cain is a big guy with an easy throwing motion. I would think his chances of durability are higher.

* I realize that not all smallish pitchers use a violent body motion to pitch. And some big guys do.