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Wednesday, August 03, 2011

SI: A firsthand experience with stem cell treatment in pitching arm

CJ could become a stem-cell innovator, but we’ll all still blame him for being all the Tigers could get for David Wells!

Certainly I hope this procedure gives me the results I’m looking for and a chance to do what I love again. But bigger than that is the future of stem cells in sports medicine. I’m fascinated when I think about what’s going on in my shoulder right now.

I asked Jeremy if he thought this therapy could be used proactively. After a few years of professional baseball, all pitchers have tears in their arm to some degree. When I had my first MRI, Dr. James Andrews told me I had a rotator cuff and a labrum tear, but that the labrum tear had been there for years. I was amazed by this; I’d been pitching full speed for years with a torn labrum.

I wondered if after a long baseball season, stem cell and PRP therapies could be given to seemingly healthy pitchers to strengthen weakened and slightly torn ligaments and tendons. My thought was that they would decrease the chances of a pitcher getting seriously hurt. Jeremy said, “You know, that’s a pretty good idea.”

We’ll see, it’ll be pretty difficult to convince a healthy pitcher to intentionally inflame his arm and make it hurt temporarily because he’ll be better off in the long term. In one form or another though you have to believe stem cell and PRP therapy is about to go mainstream in sports. It will take some more research and open mindedness on the part of those who make decisions, most notably league commissioners and team doctors. It will also take time, but progress always does.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: August 03, 2011 at 05:58 PM | 19 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: business, steroids

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   1. The John Wetland Memorial Death (CoB) Posted: August 03, 2011 at 09:30 PM (#3892094)
Interesting stuff.
   2. valuearbitrageur Posted: August 03, 2011 at 09:34 PM (#3892103)
It's bad enough he's a big fat cheater like that Tommy John, but does he have to slip in a veiled brag?

The first step was to draw the fat. Dr. Purita was concerned that I didn't have enough.


It was interesting to find that the players association, not the MLB, is still the arbiter of what players can put in their bodies, same as before Hysteroidia.

was given a host of natural supplements to take over the next couple months that will also help the stem cells do their work: Shark liver oil, L-Arginine, Melatonin and a product called Stem XCell. Dr. Purita ran these by the Major League Baseball Players' Association to make sure they were OK to take.
   3. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: August 03, 2011 at 09:57 PM (#3892134)
How is this different from steroids? HGH? At all? They all seem to (potentially, maybe) help you heal faster/slow aging effects. What am I missing?
   4. valuearbitrageur Posted: August 03, 2011 at 10:02 PM (#3892142)
How is this different from steroids? HGH? At all? They all seem to (potentially, maybe) help you heal faster/slow aging effects. What am I missing


Sshhh.. the steroid nazis might hear you and then you'll be on their list!
   5. Sam M. Posted: August 03, 2011 at 10:05 PM (#3892145)
How is this different from steroids? HGH? At all? They all seem to (potentially, maybe) help you heal faster/slow aging effects. What am I missing?


There are no proven (or as far as I know, even alleged) harmful consequences from using your own stem cells to help heal from an injury or (potentially) as a preventive against future injuries.
   6. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: August 03, 2011 at 10:12 PM (#3892153)
How is this different from steroids? HGH? At all? They all seem to (potentially, maybe) help you heal faster/slow aging effects. What am I missing?


There are no proven (or as far as I know, even alleged) harmful consequences from using your own stem cells to help heal from an injury or (potentially) as a preventive against future injuries.

And as such, there's no reason why these procedures (if they really work) couldn't be done openly, with whatever risk there is to be openly considered by the player and his team, and the decision to go ahead made jointly by both. This has nothing to do with steroids any more than Tommy John surgery, in spite of the usual idiotic rhetorical comparisons by the usual collection of steroids fanboys.
   7. valuearbitrageur Posted: August 04, 2011 at 05:25 AM (#3892421)
There are no proven (or as far as I know, even alleged) harmful consequences from using your own stem cells to help heal from an injury or (potentially) as a preventive against future injuries.


The exact same things can be said of HGH. And of steroids in typical dosages.

This has nothing to do with steroids any more than Tommy John surgery, in spite of the usual idiotic rhetorical comparisons by the usual collection of steroids fanboys.


Typical of the hysteroiders, you arbitrarily decide some procedures and drugs are good, and steroids are bad, with little logic or sense. None of these procedures are "natural", they are all artificial enhancements, just like Lasik, or steroids.
   8. Heinie Mantush (Krusty) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:02 AM (#3892454)


The exact same things can be said of HGH. And of steroids in typical dosages.


No. Stop being an ostrich. Most competitive athletes who juice (pre-testing baseball players, pre-testing cyclists, bodybuilders, football players) use a very large quantity of anabolics. Further, not all AAS are the same: some are far, far more punishing on your liver, have longer half-lives, etc.

An unstacked cycle or two, kept at a low dose (think the 63 Chargers) is probably not going to do too much harm in the long run (it'll raise your cholesterol in any event.) A full stack without post-cycle therapy is going to do some damage. The question is how much.
   9. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 11:59 AM (#3892461)
And as such, there's no reason why these procedures (if they really work) couldn't be done openly, with whatever risk there is to be openly considered by the player and his team, and the decision to go ahead made jointly by both. This has nothing to do with steroids any more than Tommy John surgery, in spite of the usual idiotic rhetorical comparisons by the usual collection of steroids fanboys.


Sort of like how amphetamines were dealt with until very recently? This is just glorified blood-doping. It's an artificial boost to someone to allow them the ability to compete at a higher level than they otherwise would be able to. Again, how is that in any way different than steroids?
   10. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 12:09 PM (#3892466)
PEDs was a phrase that came out of the MLB roids era. I believe PEDs stands for Performance Enhancing Drugs, with emphasis on Performance Enhancing. There are many things that are performance enhancing. Yes, it is rather arbitrary which performance enhancers are or are not legal.

I get the position that we should ban the enhancers that are harmful to your health, we all understand that. However, if you followed any of the outrage in Bonds or any other player under the cloud of suspicion, like McGwire, the vast majority of the rage was about these guys having an enhanced performance resulting in them smashing records. Few people if any were enraged Bonds/Big Mac might be destroying his thyroid or growing ##### t!ts. It was about the performance.

It most certainly is a great question why this incredibly advanced medical science (stem cells/doping) is accepted and Bonds medically advanced "Clear" ointment is considered a pox on the game..esp when most that objected to Bonds did so on the ground of his performance being enhanced.
   11. rfloh Posted: August 04, 2011 at 12:57 PM (#3892480)
"There are no proven (or as far as I know, even alleged) harmful consequences from using your own stem cells to help heal from an injury or (potentially) as a preventive against future injuries. "

Any medical procedure, any medication has positive and negative effects. You balance the positive vs the negative (and the effective dosage). Except for steroids. The anti-steroid fanbois such as Jolly, are utterly incapable of thinking rationally on steroids.
   12. rfloh Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:01 PM (#3892486)
"No. Stop being an ostrich. Most competitive athletes who juice (pre-testing baseball players, pre-testing cyclists, bodybuilders, football players) use a very large quantity of anabolics. Further, not all AAS are the same: some are far, far more punishing on your liver, have longer half-lives, etc.

An unstacked cycle or two, kept at a low dose (think the 63 Chargers) is probably not going to do too much harm in the long run (it'll raise your cholesterol in any event.) A full stack without post-cycle therapy is going to do some damage. The question is how much."

Definitely. Now, how many of those howling against steroids even consider this? How many of those howling against steroids consider that those steroids that are generally more difficult to detect, that clear the body more quickly, also have more negative health effects, put more stress on the liver, with the result that steroid testing might give extra incentive to some to use those steroids that have much more negative health effects, as long as they can pass the tests?
   13. rfloh Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:02 PM (#3892487)
"No. Stop being an ostrich. Most competitive athletes who juice (pre-testing baseball players, pre-testing cyclists, bodybuilders, football players) use a very large quantity of anabolics. Further, not all AAS are the same: some are far, far more punishing on your liver, have longer half-lives, etc.

An unstacked cycle or two, kept at a low dose (think the 63 Chargers) is probably not going to do too much harm in the long run (it'll raise your cholesterol in any event.) A full stack without post-cycle therapy is going to do some damage. The question is how much."

Definitely. Now, how many of those howling against steroids even consider this? How many of those howling against steroids consider that those steroids that are generally more difficult to detect, that clear the body more quickly, also have more negative health effects, put more stress on the liver, with the result that steroid testing might give extra incentive to some to use those steroids that have much more negative health effects, as long as they can pass the tests?
   14. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:10 PM (#3892495)
There are many doctors that take the position steroids are a wonder drug, administered correctly. Aren't people interested in the sciences interested in hearing this information?

Personally, I'd be very interested to know exactly what Lance Armstrong took and did to beat his cancer. He very well may have taken a boatload of PEDs, if so, it sure did have an incredibly positive side affect, possibly curing him of cancer.
   15. Dr. Phil Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:20 PM (#3892503)
Personally, I'd be very interested to know exactly what Lance Armstrong took and did to beat his cancer. He very well may have taken a boatload of PEDs, if so, it sure did have an incredibly positive side affect, possibly curing him of cancer.


The "PED's" that he took to beat cancer were chemotherapy and radiation. Not freaking HGH. There is a lot of supportive treatment when battling cancer, but they're support, not treatment.
   16. mswift Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:25 PM (#3892508)
Personally, I'd be very interested to know exactly what Lance Armstrong took and did to beat his cancer. He very well may have taken a boatload of PEDs, if so, it sure did have an incredibly positive side affect, possibly curing him of cancer.


Or, maybe his cancer was caused by abusing PEDs.
   17. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:27 PM (#3892510)
The "PED's" that he took to beat cancer were chemotherapy and radiation. Not freaking HGH. There is a lot of supportive treatment when battling cancer, but they're support, not treatment.


We are aware he took chemo and radiation, we have no idea what else (beyond the doctor's prescription). This is a guy that has access to an incredible array of PEDs from his sport, it is possible he took additional drugs and likely he took more during his recovery. Being cancer free is a much longer process than riding yourself of cancer one time. It would be nice if we found out what else he was taking before he gets thrown in prison.
   18. LionoftheSenate (Brewers v A's World Series) Posted: August 04, 2011 at 01:39 PM (#3892524)

Or, maybe his cancer was caused by abusing PEDs.


No question this is possible. But this is the assumed position, that PEDs can only mean harm to the body. I'd like to consider the other approach for once. There are plenty of things one can take that help the body, cure the body. Potassium, vitamin D....I can go on and on. I'm sure science it at the point where many man-made chemicals have mostly or only positive effects. I'm curious to know everything this guy took in his life. I know we will never know those facts, mostly due to a close minded hysteria on science and PEDs.
   19. Randy Jones Posted: August 04, 2011 at 02:48 PM (#3892590)
It was interesting to find that the players association, not the MLB, is still the arbiter of what players can put in their bodies, same as before Hysteroidia.

was given a host of natural supplements to take over the next couple months that will also help the stem cells do their work: Shark liver oil, L-Arginine, Melatonin and a product called Stem XCell. Dr. Purita ran these by the Major League Baseball Players' Association to make sure they were OK to take.


I believe you misinterpreted this. The MLBPA doesn't decide what is and is not allowed, that is part of the CBA. What they do is look at a product and tell the players whether or not it is allowable under the CBA. It's basically a service provided to the players so they don't end up taking some supplement that happens to have an ingredient that is banned.

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