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Baseball Primer Newsblog— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand
Sunday, January 25, 2009
Verducci’s side (I once had that at Mama Leone’s) of the Torre story.
SI.com: Two New York newspapers are reporting that Joe Torre rips Alex Rodriguez and George Steinbrenner in the book, and that Brian Cashman was not as supportive of Torre returning as Yankees manager after the 2007 season as was previously believed. What can you tell us about these reports?
Verducci: I think it’s important to understand context here. The book is not a first-person book by Joe Torre, it’s a third-person narrative based on 12 years of knowing the Yankees and it’s about the changes in the game in that period. Seems to me the New York Post assigned this third-person book entirely to Joe Torre and that’s not the case. In fact, if people saw that Post story they probably noticed there are no quotes from Joe Torre in it. Joe Torre doe not rip anybody in the book. The book really needs to be read in context.
Anybody who knows Joe, especially during his time in New York, knows he’s a very honest man and he is very honest in the pages of this book. People also know Joe Torre doesn’t go around ripping people and he doesn’t do that in the pages of this book. There is a lot of information in this book over a tremendous period of baseball history. It’s been reported out by me as well as informed by Torre’s own insights into that period.
Repoz
Posted: January 25, 2009 at 11:22 PM | 40 comment(s)
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1. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige Posted: January 25, 2009 at 11:51 PM (#3060183)Here, for the first time, Joe Torre and Tom Verducci take us inside the dugout, the
clubhouse, and the front office in a revelatory narrative that shows what it really took to keep the Yankees on top of the baseball world. The high-priced ace who broke down in tears and refused to go back to the mound in the middle of a game. Constant meddling from Yankee executives, many of whom were jealous of Torre’s popularity. The tension that developed between the old guard and the free agents brought in by management. The impact of revenue-sharing and new scouting techniques, which allowed other teams to challenge the Yankees’ dominance. The players who couldn’t resist the after-hours temptations of the Big Apple. The joys of managing Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera, and the challenges of managing Alex Rodriguez and Jason Giambi. Torre’s last year, when constant ultimatums from the front office, devastating injuries, and a freak cloud of bugs on a warm September night in Cleveland forced him from a job he loved.
Because I want information and I'm a Yanks fan and I don't really care about some code of secrecy that should or should not exist inside the dugout, I'm happy that this book is coming out. Sounds like it will be a good read and I'll be interested. But I do think it's pretty remarkable that Torre (whose name is listed as one of the co-authors) decided to be so candid about life behind the scenes, especially since many of these players are still playing and he's still a manager. Maybe the truth is the truth but Torre has to know that talking about "The high-priced ace who broke down in tears and refused to go back to the mound in the middle of a game" is essentially throwing that guy under the bus and is the equivalent of ripping him. What context is going to make it more nuanced for the average sports fan? I think the reaction from his former and current players will be interesting.
jesus--not another Ed Whitson story
It's a little thing but this is the kind of thing that always makes me question other details. The game was played October 5th, not in September. Moreover it is customary to think "October" when one thinks of post-season baseball. If they can't get the easy stuff right, what faith can I put in the hard stuff?
But that's the point -- Verducci is saying that he wasn't THAT candid. Torre didn't "rip" anybody, according to him. None of the nasty stuff cited in the Post article are quotes from Torre, according to him. It's been "reported out" by Verducci.
In short, the juicy stuff is Verducci, possibly his opinion, possibly citing "other sources" (like there's a difference) or possibly Torre off-the-record. Torre's quotes will probably amount to "AROD is a great player who sets impossible standards for himself and gets down on himself when he can't reach them."
Now, it will be interesting to see if Torre has to throw Verducci under the bus.
Gotta be Kevin Brown.
It should make you question the knowledge of the guy who wrote the blurb. I'm not sure it says anything about the book itself.
If Torre's listed as the co-author of the book, then, direct quotes for attribution or not, he has to realize that he's being linked to this stuff, though. Or, as Joe Morgan would have said (and perhaps will say), "Joe Torre shouldn't have written this book."
Good points, although on a collaboration such as this, wouldn't Torre have some kind of final say in what is being written in the final pass? The fact that a named player wept and refused to go back into a game is not simply the expression of Verducci's opinion. You'd have to assume, even if it was leaked to him from some other source, that he did present this information to Torre for inclusion in the book. But I guess I'm assuming there was an agreement about this sort of thing. Maybe Verducci (who is a good writer and lends a lot of credibility to this project) only agreed to do this project with another understanding in mind.
That nearly describes Chuck Knoublauch.
Agreed -- which is why I think Torre might have to throw Verducci under a bus.
It's just all those odd statements by Verducci. How could the book possibly describe AROD, the pitcher, etc. in such ways without Torre taking the blame if Torre is a co-author? Why would Verducci write a book "with Torre" if a big chunk of it isn't attributed (even in a ghost-writerly way) to Torre? And, as noted, why would Torre agree to have this stuff published under his name if it wasn't from him?
Or is this like Marge Simpson's romance novel that Homer only pretended to read before she published? :-)
I'm going with Tom Gordon...
IT WAS reported that he tossed his cookies in the middle of a game when told to warmup
I think Verducci is playing a game here. He is saying that Torre is a good guy who's just honest. He's not ripping anyone, he's just telling you what "really" happened. IOW, Torre could very well be saying a bunch of awful stuff about his former players, and Verducci could be comfortable saying that he's not ripping anybody.
As far as Torre's motives, I'm leaning toward money. Sure, he makes plenty of it as a manager, but that hasn't stopped him from doing a ton of endorsements. This book might have netted him an easy mil or 2. Just let Verducci write it, feed him some info, slap your name on it, and take your money.
#15--Gordon wasn't high priced and relievers aren't usually called aces, are they?
Yeah, it's probably a player whom nobody is much interested in these days. That is, Jimmy Key.
Weaver wasn't exactly "high-priced" during his tenure with New York.
Disagree. It stuck out to Jose, and it sticks out to me. Neither of us are professional writers who spent years covering the Yankees. Something like this in a blog may make you question the knowledge of the relator of this event, but in a published book, the many layers of editors should have caught a basic factual error long before it to this point. Essentially, a book like this tries to create instant credibility (well-known people in the "Author" column is a great start), and small errors like that poke a hole in the credibility instantly.
I'm going with Jeff Weaver.
If only Jeff Weaver had refused to go back to the mound in the middle of a certain 2003 World Series game, Torre might still be managing the Yankees.
"Elliott Maddox couldn't sue his way out of a paper bag."
Are you sure about that? I could see Wells crying in the toilet after eating the post-game buffet during his pre-game warm up.
first!
uh, no. second! by 26 posts
Plural.
oops, i didn't read through on that one. dang.
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