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Friday, July 20, 2018

Stop! Collaborate and OMNICHATTER! for Friday, July 20, 2018.

Scoreboards for the Major Leagues and all minor leagues,
courtesy of Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee).

Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:53 AM | 66 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: omnichatter

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   1. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: July 20, 2018 at 12:02 PM (#5713104)
HOW WILL THE ANGELS LOSE TODAY?!
   2. Perry Posted: July 20, 2018 at 01:05 PM (#5713152)
I've tried submitting this as a news item twice in the last 2 days without success, so I'll drop it here: The New York Times has an article up about newly discovered color film footage from Ted Williams's last game, including the homer. It's going to be shown on PBS Monday as part of their documentary about Williams, but you can see it from a link in the article, and also the story of its discovery. It was shot by a college student from several vantage points in the stands on 8 mm film, then tossed in a drawer and forgotten. He offered it to ESPN and to the Red Sox in recent years, but nobody was interested.

Here's the story.
   3. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 01:28 PM (#5713166)
What a story. I can't believe ESPN and the Red Sox weren't interested. From TFA:
“I took my camera to the front row and shot scenes as I roamed freely around the park all afternoon.”
Definitely a different era. The footage has shots from the front row behind 1B, the stands overlooking LF, and other angles - all during the game. I knew the attendance was lackluster, but it's amazing to see just how empty Fenway was other than the lower deck between the bases.

And is it just me, or was Ted looking a little chunky at that point?
   4. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 20, 2018 at 01:33 PM (#5713171)
I never knew Williams threw right handed.
   5. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 02:35 PM (#5713203)
Matt Carpenter, with that home run:

Since May 26: .322/.424/.701, with 17 homers in 47 games
Before May 26: .200/.318/.367, with 4 homers in 44 games
   6. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 02:37 PM (#5713208)
Rizzo doing his HBP thing again...

I'm amazed he's been able to average 155 games/year... one of these days he's going to lean into a 60-day DL stint...
   7. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 02:55 PM (#5713218)
Matt Carpenter, with that home run:

Since May 26: .326/.427/.720, with 18 homers in 47 games.

He's homered in four straight games, with two (so far) today.
   8. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 02:59 PM (#5713222)
Crap, I had to get on a work call and Lester went and gave up 4 runs while I wasn't listening?? Clearly I need to oversee this game better.
   9. Moses Taylor, aka Hambone Fakenameington Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:22 PM (#5713232)
Rizzo didn't lean into that hbp. It bounced and hit his foot.

Lester is bad today. Just everything is hard hit and no swings and misses. I'm here, and I was at his second worst start last year (not the pirates one, the reds one). Cubs will score at least 5 though, but I don't think the cards are done either.
   10. vortex of dissipation Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:33 PM (#5713241)
That Williams footage is wonderful. And that last season...only 390 PA, but .316/.451/.645 with a 190 OPS+, and 29 HR. At age 41.
   11. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:36 PM (#5713243)
Rizzo didn't lean into that hbp. It bounced and hit his foot.

I'm following on Gameday, and I prefer my mental image of him leaning out over home plate and having the ball glance off his forearm.
   12. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:40 PM (#5713246)
That Williams footage is wonderful. And that last season...only 390 PA, but .316/.451/.645 with a 190 OPS+, and 29 HR. At age 41.

That's the kind of performance that makes me highly skeptical about time-lining player quality. If the league were improving as fast as the time-liners suggest, how is it possible that so many great players sustain the same level of performance into their late 30s.
   13. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:47 PM (#5713251)
Jack Flaherty just completed a 36-pitch inning in which he allowed no runs.

Pretty hard to do.
   14. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:52 PM (#5713252)
That's the kind of performance that makes me highly skeptical about time-lining player quality. If the league were improving as fast as the time-liners suggest, how is it possible that so many great players sustain the same level of performance into their late 30s.
I'm also skeptical that a league would improve huge amount within the span of one player's career - does anyone really make that claim? I think you have to break down "timelining" into two separate components. One would be "external factors" like the introduction of new player pools, which happens gradually. Even with integration happening during Williams' career, it's not like he was facing a lot of top-flight black pitchers near the end of his career that he wasn't at the beginning. There certainly were some, but it wasn't a flood. The "internal factors" like refining mechanics (as we've been discussing), better conditioning, etc. - are done by individual players, so they timeline along with the league. Certainly the great ones would have done that at a rate equal to or greater than league average.

All that said, I am 100% certain that timelining is real. It's just that the external factors don't override a relatively small percentage of players' ability to stay great as they age.
   15. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:56 PM (#5713253)
The "internal factors" like refining mechanics (as we've been discussing), better conditioning, etc. - are done by individual players, so they timeline along with the league. Certainly the great ones would have done that at a rate equal to or greater than league average.

Right, but those factors wouldn't make today's players better than yesterday's players, b/c if they all played at the same time, they'd have the same "Factors".
   16. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:57 PM (#5713254)
Right, but those factors wouldn't make today's players better than yesterday's players, b/c if they all played at the same time, they'd have the same "Factors".
If I read you right, it wouldn't make today's players better relative to each other, but in the absolute sense, it (absolutely!) would make them better than yesterday's players.
   17. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 03:59 PM (#5713256)
Well, that was a bit of foamy diarrhea by Lester. I blame Moses for being there.
   18. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:06 PM (#5713260)
That's the kind of performance that makes me highly skeptical about time-lining player quality. If the league were improving as fast as the time-liners suggest, how is it possible that so many great players sustain the same level of performance into their late 30s.


Steroids. I mean, look at that physique! :-)


More seriously, though, the best players are the best because of their ability to make adjustments. You would think that improvement in the game in any one year would be slight. The vast majority of players would be the same, but, over 20+ years the whole league would turn over. So, why wouldn't the best players be able to make those adjustments and not suffer a drop off?

Plus, in Williams' case, I remember reading (I cannot remember where) that Ted said that early in that season, pitchers kept pitching him away, like he was the Ted Williams of old. But, he was having trouble pulling the ball at that time, so, he kept hitting to the opposite field. If you look at his splits, he hit homeruns in the first 2 games of the season, then barely played the rest of April and May, then hit 12 hr from June 5-July 3. .350/.480/.850 in 102 pa over that span. Then "only .308/.442/.572 over the rest of the season. Which, for Ted Williams is a pretty big drop from his earlier play. :-)

edit: made a little more readable, hopefully.

edit 2: or what Billy Ripken said above. Have an icy, cold Coke, good sir!
   19. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:15 PM (#5713265)
Can I lay down $50 on "position player pitching for the Cubs today"?
   20. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:16 PM (#5713266)
Don Augustus, I'm gonna need something stronger than a Coke.
   21. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:18 PM (#5713268)
At this point the Cubs should just keep putting runners on base so that we don't get to the 5th inning before the rain comes, and then put it in mother nature's hands.
   22. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:18 PM (#5713269)
how long is that rain supposed to last?
   23. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:21 PM (#5713271)
They're taking my advice.
   24. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:22 PM (#5713272)
Carpenter now with four extra-base hits today... and the game is in the 4th inning.
   25. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:24 PM (#5713273)
127 pitches by Cubs' pitchers through 4....
   26. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:25 PM (#5713274)
how long is that rain supposed to last?

Radar suggests this will pass through quickly...
   27. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 20, 2018 at 04:28 PM (#5713276)
Well tell that radar to shut up.
   28. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 05:18 PM (#5713300)
Carpenter now with 5 five hits---5 extra-base hits, including three homers---through six innings.
   29. salvomania Posted: July 20, 2018 at 05:19 PM (#5713301)
And Carpenter's day ends as he is double-switched out in the bottom of the 6th.

This has to be one of the best all-time batting performances through six innings ever.
   30. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: July 20, 2018 at 05:19 PM (#5713302)
Just a day short of the one-year anniversary of a similar game where the Cardinals had a seemingly endless 9-run inning at Wrigley.
   31. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: July 20, 2018 at 05:22 PM (#5713305)
Tommy LaStella with a better outing than Brian Duensing.
   32. Perry Posted: July 20, 2018 at 05:33 PM (#5713309)
5457 -- how many have put up that box score line?

Marp joins Kris Bryant as the only players in MLB history with 3 homers and 2 doubles in a game.

And to think his batting line looked like Dexter's in mid-May.
   33. Kiko Sakata Posted: July 20, 2018 at 06:06 PM (#5713321)
I stopped watching/listening when it was 11-1, but my phone gives me alerts for pitching changes. So, um, what's the record for most non-pitchers pitching for a team in one game? Because 3 seems like a lot.
   34. Spahn Insane Posted: July 20, 2018 at 06:16 PM (#5713326)
Okay then!

So between me and Moses, BBTF Cubdom has personally witnessed both of history’s 3 HR/2-2B games. My experience was preferable.

Actually, for only having attended three Cub games at GAB, I’ve seen a lot of history. The Bryant game in 2016, and this year, perhaps even more amazingly, a Yu Darvish win in a Cub uniform.
   35. TomH Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:02 PM (#5713338)
re: Ted and timelining -
Look at Williams seasons in his 20s (his best were between ages 22 and 28), and then his early 30s, and then late 30s. He was clearly getting worse, whether you use a complex # like WAR or a simple one like OPS+. Yes, he had one great last season and sweet last at bat (by choice, he quit after he hit it.. who knows if he would have come out of the game if his previous at bat when he ALMOST hit a HR had gone out). In fact, Ted Williams' career shows with great clarity how much better the AL was in 1959 than it was in 1939. And we know the NL was better in 59 than the AL.
   36. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:20 PM (#5713339)
Another crap 1st inning from German.
   37. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:25 PM (#5713343)
Look at Williams seasons in his 20s (his best were between ages 22 and 28), and then his early 30s, and then late 30s. He was clearly getting worse, whether you use a complex # like WAR or a simple one like OPS+.

Of course he was getting worse. Athletes hit their physical peak in their mid to late-20's, and it's all downhill from there.

The fact that a 38-40 y.o. Williams, or Mays, or Aaron, could put up seasons that looked an awful lot like their peak is suggestive of league quality not changing all that much.
   38. Howie Menckel Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:30 PM (#5713344)
DOUBLE TROUBLE

Hapless Mets score 3 in first inning after hapless Yankee starter German (Happ-less Yankee?) allows a walk and then 3 doubles.
   39. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:37 PM (#5713346)
Hapless Mets score 3 in first inning after hapless Yankee starter German (Happ-less Yankee?) allows a walk and then 3 doubles.

I'm about done with German. Cashman, get a damn SP. Happ, Ross, hell, I'll even take Hamels at this point.
   40. cardsfanboy Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:53 PM (#5713352)
I'm also skeptical that a league would improve huge amount within the span of one player's career - does anyone really make that claim?


Some timeliners do make that claim. They claim that based upon a variety of factors, that someone like Rogers Hornsby or Honus Wagner would be lucky to make it out of triple A in today's game.
   41. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 07:59 PM (#5713354)
I'm about done with German. Cashman, get a damn SP. Happ, Ross, hell, I'll even take Hamels at this point.


At the least bring up Sheffield at this point.
   42. Batman Posted: July 20, 2018 at 08:08 PM (#5713357)
5457 -- how many have put up that box score line?
Carpenter is the fifth, and the Cubs have been involved in three of the five games: Shea Hillenbrand in 2003, Willie Stargell against the Cubs in 1968, Joe DiMaggio in 1937, and Frank Demaree for the Cubs in 1936.
   43. cardsfanboy Posted: July 20, 2018 at 08:09 PM (#5713358)
Carpenter came into today's game with a 146 OPS+ and a .909 ops... I don't feel like figuring the math for his new ops+, but his ops went up to .957 if everyone else's ops stays the same that moves him from 8th in the NL to 5th ahead of Freeman, but behind Muncy* Suarez, Arenado, and Aguilar....
   44. rconn23 Posted: July 20, 2018 at 08:12 PM (#5713360)
I'm not sure what the Yankees hope to get out of continuing to start German. I understand not wanting to rush Sheffield, but even with his command not fully harnessed, he's a better option than German.
   45. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 09:35 PM (#5713374)
Hey ... this game is only mostly dead!
   46. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: July 20, 2018 at 10:27 PM (#5713378)
The Astros threw a hard shift against Trout. I've never seen any team shift against Trout before. It worked, too.
   47. Howie Menckel Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:00 PM (#5713385)
Lugo and Gsellman throw a combined 90 RP pitches in 4 IP after Thor to beat the Yankees 7-5

Familia watches in the bullpen, gets what seems to be a goodbye hug from Blevins

Familia - destination Oakland?
   48. Howie Menckel Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:22 PM (#5713388)
the Red Sox have not won 100 games since 1946

they are 69-30, so 31-32 gets them there

...............

Steve Popper
‏Verified account @StevePopper
7m7 minutes ago

Callaway said he got word midway through the game a deal was close for Familia and could not use him.
   49. Howie Menckel Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:38 PM (#5713392)
no
   50. The Ghost of Sox Fans Past Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:39 PM (#5713393)
In this game, the LF for the White Sox has made three throws under pressure that I've seen, and none have been on target. I'd run on him.
   51. Count Vorror Rairol Mencoon (CoB) Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:40 PM (#5713394)
From RAB, this sucks:

OF Clint Frazier was placed on the Triple-A disabled list and is going through the league’s concussion protocol. He left last night’s game with concussion symptoms after attempting a diving catch. Frazier missed a bunch of time with a concussion earlier this year. Suffering another one so soon is bad news.


Get better soon, Syndrome!
   52. JJ1986 Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:43 PM (#5713395)
Buster Olney
⚪️
‏ @Buster_FSPM
That's not the real Buster,
   53. Howie Menckel Posted: July 20, 2018 at 11:46 PM (#5713396)
great catch by 52 on 49

I won't even tell you who IS authenticated and retweeted that supposed deal
still, E-10 on Howie - though erased by the double play
I'm warming up for BBTF softball next month
   54. Yonder Alonso in misguided trousers (cardinal) Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:13 AM (#5713401)
I'm not sure what the Yankees hope to get out of continuing to start German. I understand not wanting to rush Sheffield, but even with his command not fully harnessed, he's a better option than German.


They must've heard you-- apparently they've optioned German to AAA.
   55. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:30 AM (#5713410)
Raimel Tapia's pinch-hit grand slam off Archie Bradley puts the Rockies up over the D-Bax 11-8, still batting in the seventh.
   56. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:32 AM (#5713411)
Must have dozed off there for a moment, cuz I had this really weird dream that Raimel Tapia hit a pinch-hit granny off Archie Bradley.

Edit: Coke to Tom.
   57. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:43 AM (#5713416)
1-2-3 7th from Bryan Shaw. A NEW DAY IS DAWNING.
   58. The Yankee Clapper Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:47 AM (#5713419)
They must've heard you-- apparently they've optioned German to AAA.

Luis Cessa to take his spot in the rotation, after pitching 6 innings of 2-hit shutout ball for AAA Scranton tonight. I have a feeling this will merely delay the MLB debut of Justus Sheffield, but we'll see.
   59. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:54 AM (#5713420)
1-2-3 7th from Bryan Shaw. A NEW DAY IS DAWNING.


That's more shocking than a pinch-hit grand slam from Raimel Tapia.
   60. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 21, 2018 at 12:55 AM (#5713421)
Carlos Gonzalez beats the shift with a ball hit right to where the third baseman normally plays.
   61. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:07 AM (#5713423)
Shaw back out for the 8th. If he's figured it out that could be HUGE for this team.
   62. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:17 AM (#5713424)
Or maybe he's just switched bodies with Ottavino, which wouldn't really help.
   63. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:19 AM (#5713425)
Black's a pretty good manager, but that was an unfortunate move to double-switch Wolters out of the game, it turned out.
   64. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:24 AM (#5713426)
Is Davis unavailable to close and he's going to leave Ottavino in? That's the only way that double switch makes sense.
   65. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:29 AM (#5713428)
Okay, yeah, just learned Davis is sick at the hotel.
   66. Perry Posted: July 21, 2018 at 01:47 AM (#5713431)
Whew! Big win. Okay, I'll turn out the lights and lock up.

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