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Monday, July 17, 2017

Taking Back the Ballparks - San Francisco Giants

Welcome to the initial nominating thread of Taking Back the Ballparks, where today’s palatial, taxpayer-funded ballyards will be reclaimed from Fortune 500 companies, in-pocket politicians and onerous owners, and returned to the fans who fill them. Over the course of however long this takes, we’re going to select new, distinct and appropriate names for each of the 30 major league ballparks instead of the corporate-sponsored monstrosities they currently call themselves. And, in some cases, we might determine the old sobriquet was just fine.

To get this series started correctly, we’re going right to the stadium in most need of a permanent moniker makeover: AT&T Park, a ballpark that’s already had more legal name changes than a member of the extended Kardashian Klan.

One of the absolute gems* of the HOK era, the stadium has been an upgrade over the Giants previous home in every way but one. Candlestick was a glorious name for a ballpark, either in its full or nicknamed version (the Stick). AT&T will never be anything but the name of a phone company.

Now, you can fix that. In this thread, suggest a replacement for the Giants stadium, and make a case why this new name is preferable. Given the source material (San Francisco and the Bay Area and a history-rich franchise), there should be no shortage of potentially evocative names just waiting to be tapped.

In two weeks, we’ll close nominations here, at my blog and anywhere else that might piggyback onto this exercise. With the help of a few other Primates, we’ll select up to four finalists from the nominees and we’ll begin a full vote to be taken exclusively here at BTF.

* By all other accounts. As with the case with most of the parks, I haven’t been there, so I can only go on the reports of others. The baseball writing staff at the Washington Post just slotted it No. 1 among the MLB 30, for instance.


Ballpark History
Name: AT&T Park (previously Pacific Bell Park, SBC Park)
Built: 2000
Capacity: 41,915
Other ballparks used by club in its current city: Candlestick (aka 3Com Park), 1960-1999, Seals Stadium 1958-1959)
Distinctive Features: As many as you’ll find anywhere. The Coke Bottle and Glove in Left; 24-foot high brick wall in right; McCovey Cove.

Ballpark Highlights:
Giants have played in four World Series since park opened in 2000, winning three. However, none of the title-clinching games took place there, nor was the Game 7 loss to Anaheim in the 2002 Fall Classic.
Matt Cain threw baseball’s 22nd perfect game there in 2012.
Neifi Perez scored on an infield fly.
Ruben Rivera engaged in “the worst baserunning in the history of the game.”
Barry Bonds played a lot of games at the place.

SoSH U at work Posted: July 17, 2017 at 10:00 AM | 188 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: giants, stadium names

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   1. OsunaSakata Posted: July 17, 2017 at 10:44 AM (#5494546)
China Basin.
   2. BDC Posted: July 17, 2017 at 10:51 AM (#5494550)
Mays Field.
   3. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:14 AM (#5494556)
Cepeda Stadium
   4. Lassus Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:33 AM (#5494566)
Giants Stadium

Yes, that's goddamned right.
   5. Rennie's Tenet Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:37 AM (#5494571)
It possible to mock re-name ballparks because they're lousy names, without the mock anti-corporate chip on the shoulder. I'm opposed to taxpayer funding, and can do without palatial ballparks, but ballparks are just one symptom of broader trend toward changing cities into theme parks for the prosperous. Most of those facilities, or parts of them, have sold some sort of naming rights.

Just call it Lefty O'Doul's.
   6. SoSH U at work Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:42 AM (#5494573)
Most of those facilities, or parts of them, have sold some sort of naming rights.


True, but in a lot of cases, the corporate money goes back to the municipality, rather than the person/company that was already gifted with taxpayer largesse.

   7. Batman Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:48 AM (#5494579)
They need a deal with a Spanish chicken restaurant chain, so they can name it:

Pollo Grounds

   8. Bote Man Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:52 AM (#5494582)
King Street Field.

I would've suggested China Basin Park, but I got Coke'd on that one.
   9. Cargo Cultist Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:55 AM (#5494584)
Please don't post links to sites requiring logins. Thank you.
   10. SoSH U at work Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:58 AM (#5494586)
There's no log-in required. It was simply the wrong link.

And, for the record, the content there is the same as the lead-in, so it's not like anyone has to go there.
   11. Nasty Nate Posted: July 17, 2017 at 12:11 PM (#5494595)
Coveside Park

Would it make sense to have it be called ____ Grounds as a callback to the franchise's NYC roots?

eg China Basin Grounds, Coveside Grounds, Mays Grounds
   12. Rusty Priske Posted: July 17, 2017 at 01:05 PM (#5494650)
Candlestick Park.

If you need to think of it as "New Candlestick Park" or "Candlestick II" feel free.
   13. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 17, 2017 at 01:09 PM (#5494655)
The House That Barry Built
   14. Omineca Greg Posted: July 17, 2017 at 01:29 PM (#5494679)
I'm with #12, I like the name "Candlestick" but I suppose you just can't re-use it. New Candlestick would be too boring. So I got to thinking...

What was the technological innovation in illumination that followed the Candlestick?(or more technically the candle (just stopping some of the neighbourhood pedants before they start)).

It was the whale-oil lamp!

How wonderful. American whaling started out in New York, but when business conditions changed, it moved to San Francisco, so hunting whales has a lot of common with the Giants already. San Franciscans are very proud of their heritage, they're always going on about sourdough and rice-a-roni, so I'm sure they'll embrace their romantic history of whaling too, a noble profession if ever there was one. Totally renewable too, so those ####### self-righteous hippies (yes, the Bay Area is full of them) will be all over it, "Look, dude! We're tired of your petro-fascism! Burn whales, not oil!" Think about the planet for once!". All the hipsters (yes, the Bay Area is full of them) can go all steam-punk with baleen skirts and corsets and ####, it will bring women out like crazy, and if there's one thing I know from experience, wherever there's corseted women, there's guys. So it's a marketing and merchandising opportunity extraordinaire! We could even get favourite son, Marty Baleen, to come out to sing his signature tune..."if only you'd believe in Miracles...so would I...", it would make for epic pennant races, no doubt.

But I see one problem.

"Whale Oil Lamp" is not catchy. "The Lamp" is alright I guess, but you can make lamps from all sorts of things, we really want to be bringing out the whaling part.

So here's an idea.

"Spermaceti"...well l don't know...it has a certain charm, but I'm afraid some of the more immature among us, would find some humour in that name. What's humourous about the 500 gallons of waxy oil found inside physeter macrocephalus' head, you ask? Well, you don't see the issue, dear reader, because you are a mature and adult individual. But there would be those who would endlessly titter on about "sperm" (and probably they'd start in and how whalers are seamen, some people are like that). And let's face it, we're already going to have problems with these boorish boobs laughing about "blowholes", so it's best not to give them any more ammunition than they have already.

So what do we do for a name?

I got it!

There's one artistic masterwork in American whaling that rises above everything. It's so important that self indulgent limey rock drummers name drum solos over it, that a vegan (hippie and hipster in the same person! perfect for the Bay!) DJ and singer took his name (in part) from it, and it's such a vital part of American literature, that it's already successfully endured the slings and arrows of small minded juveniles from when Melville wrote it in 1851, the irony being that it's impossible for me, and presumably anybody else, to come up with any way to mock or cheapen the name.

It's unassailable.

So gentlemen, I bring you the next name for the San Francisco ballpark...

The Dick.
   15. Chris Fluit Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:08 PM (#5494710)
Pacific Park

The original name for the stadium was Pac Bell Park. Get rid of the corporate telecom sponsor and you're left with a pretty good name (even if the stadium is on the bay side of town and not the ocean proper).
   16. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:10 PM (#5494715)
The Dick.


Seconded... :-)
   17. SoSH U at work Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:16 PM (#5494724)

Seconded... :-)


It was a roundabout way, which is the only route Omineca Greg ever takes, of getting to the New 'Stick.
   18. BDC Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:27 PM (#5494735)
Would it make sense to have it be called ____ Grounds

Yes, except I can't get Walt's "Starbucks Grounds" out of my head.
   19. Davoice of Dapeople Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:28 PM (#5494736)
I'm with #12. I already always call it "Candlestick Park" even though I know it's wrong.
   20. Benji Gil Gamesh VII - The Opt-Out Awakens Posted: July 17, 2017 at 02:36 PM (#5494746)
Pacific Park

The original name for the stadium was Pac Bell Park. Get rid of the corporate telecom sponsor and you're left with a pretty good name (even if the stadium is on the bay side of town and not the ocean proper).
+1
   21. An Athletic in Powderhorn™ Posted: July 17, 2017 at 03:29 PM (#5494795)
I've always called it China Basin Park. Pacific Park's a good choice too. Probably the best name would be Golden Gate Park, but that's already spoken for.
   22. villageidiom Posted: July 17, 2017 at 03:58 PM (#5494823)
The Dock Of The Bay.

I don't care that it doesn't have "grounds", "park", "field", or "stadium" in the name. If you must, name it Giants Field at The Dock Of The Bay, a la OPACY. It's the Dock.

I'm not sure that the imagery from the Otis Redding song works for Giants fans. I don't care. It's the Dock.
   23. SoSH U at work Posted: July 17, 2017 at 04:14 PM (#5494830)
I don't care that it doesn't have "grounds", "park", "field", or "stadium" in the name.


I don't think one of those is required for a good stadium name.
   24. Lassus Posted: July 17, 2017 at 04:22 PM (#5494837)
I'm decidedly not with #12.

Candlestick was a specific park with specific features (like the weather) that were specific to that location. AT&T is nowhere near Candlestick and has none of those features.

Even if I don't think it's required, calling Citifield New Shea makes a BIT of sense as it was built basically on top of old Shea. That is really REALLY not the case with AT&T and it's relationship to Candlestick, and it should therefore be counted out as a possibility.
   25. Lassus Posted: July 17, 2017 at 04:35 PM (#5494845)
I'd completely love Pacific Park as a name if they had built the stadium in the Sunset, on the ocean. (Which probably would have been kinda cool, if a logistical nightmare.) As it is, Pacific Park doesn't really make any sense.
   26. Nasty Nate Posted: July 17, 2017 at 04:54 PM (#5494850)
Candlestick was a specific park with specific features (like the weather) that were specific to that location. AT&T is nowhere near Candlestick and has none of those features.

Even if I don't think it's required, calling Citifield New Shea makes a BIT of sense as it was built basically on top of old Shea. That is really REALLY not the case with AT&T and it's relationship to Candlestick, and it should therefore be counted out as a possibility.
I agree. I think Yankee Stadium is acceptable for the new place, as it is on the same site and emulates some features of the old version(s). But calling the Giants' place Candlestick or the Tigers' place Tiger Stadium seems just wrong to me.
   27. Dale Sams Posted: July 17, 2017 at 04:58 PM (#5494852)
Say Hey Stadium
   28. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 17, 2017 at 05:03 PM (#5494855)
Even if I don't think it's required, calling Citifield New Shea makes a BIT of sense as it was built basically on top of old Shea. That is really REALLY not the case with AT&T and it's relationship to Candlestick, and it should therefore be counted out as a possibility.


Hmm. Are most new parks built (essentially) on the grounds of the old park, or are they at a different location?

Same location:

YSII
Citi Field
Busch III
New Comiskey
Target Field
Arlington
Safeco
Citizen's bank
Great American



Different location:

Pac Bell
Petco
Marlins Park
OPACY
New Braves Field, whatever it's called
Comerica
Progressive Field
Miller Park
Enron

Oakland and Tampa Bay, should either or both get new stadiums, will likely be at different locations. PNC park is in the same general area as Three Rivers, but in a decidedly different location.





   29. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 17, 2017 at 05:15 PM (#5494863)
Different location:

[snip]
Miller Park


Miller Park is in the same location at County Stadium.
   30. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 17, 2017 at 05:18 PM (#5494864)
Miller Park is in the same location at County Stadium.


I though County stadium was much further east. At the intersection of I 94 and I 43.
   31. Cowboy Popup Posted: July 17, 2017 at 05:21 PM (#5494868)
The original name for the stadium was Pac Bell Park. Get rid of the corporate telecom sponsor and you're left with a pretty good name (even if the stadium is on the bay side of town and not the ocean proper).

I actually like PacBell Park as a name and that's how I currently refer to it.

I'm fairly indifferent about this name but if I'm online the day we discuss Houston, I am going to vote for Enron Field. I don't even know what it is called now. It's Enron field.
   32. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:12 PM (#5494898)
I though County stadium was much further east. At the intersection of I 94 and I 43.

I went to County in its last season. They were building Miller Park right next to it. The parking lot they used for County is the exact same parking lot they use for Miller.
   33. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:15 PM (#5494901)
OK. I sit corrected. Never been to Miller, but I had been to County many times. But it's been a while, and my memory has failed me yet again.
   34. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:16 PM (#5494902)
As for a name for the Giants' pad, of the ideas given so far my favorite is Pacific Park.

Personally, a name should ideally be about more than just the franchise, but also about the town. Without the fans and the town, the franchise has no point. It's the link between the two that gives the team a special place in civic identity. I mean, I can accept a baseball-only name, but only if we can't think of a good city-related one.

I'd doubly oppose Mays Field. From what I know, the fans didn't really embrace him when he came here. He was New York's Willie Mays for them. Orlando Cepeda was more popular at the time.
   35. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:18 PM (#5494905)
I'd doubly oppose Mays Field. From what I know, the fans didn't really embrace him when he came here. He was New York's Willie Mays for them. Orlando Cepeda was more popular at the time.


McCovey even moreso, no? I mean, it's not Mays Cove.
   36. QLE Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:19 PM (#5494906)
China Basin Park, or the King Street Grounds if we want it to have an 1890s feel to it.
   37. Infinite Yost (Voxter) Posted: July 17, 2017 at 06:25 PM (#5494909)
Target Field is on the other side of downtown from the Metrodome.
   38. Benji Gil Gamesh VII - The Opt-Out Awakens Posted: July 17, 2017 at 07:52 PM (#5494957)
McCovey even moreso, no? I mean, it's not Mays Cove.
I don't know anything about Mays vs Cepeda's vs McCovey's relative belovedness in SF, but I assume it isn't Mays Cove because he was a righty.
   39. Bote Man Posted: July 17, 2017 at 07:53 PM (#5494958)
Other unconventional names:

- Bacsik's Breakdown

- The 756 [Club]
   40. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:07 PM (#5494963)
Target Field is on the other side of downtown from the Metrodome.


Target Field is no more than a couple of blocks from the Humpdome.

edit: Once again, my memory fails me and I sit corrected. Target Field is a couple of blocks from the Target Center, not the Humpdome. So, move one from each side, and i'm still correct :)
   41. Omineca Greg Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:23 PM (#5494966)
I get why people are suggesting "King Street" and "China Basin", but I'm thinking those are kind of low impact. Maybe if I got used to hearing them they would get to be more meaningful to me, but as it sits now they seem kind of ho-hum.

Now, "Embarcadero", that's a good name. Can we do something with that?
   42. Bote Man Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:29 PM (#5494973)
Now, "Embarcadero", that's a good name. Can we do something with that?

Sure. Each time the Giants return from a road trip they could arrive at the Dis-Embarcadero.
   43. Lassus Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:29 PM (#5494974)
(BTW, the speed with which New Sheatifield was built still ranks among modern construction miracles.)
   44. zenbitz Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:30 PM (#5494975)
So AT&T was primarily funded not by tax payers, but by loans taken out by ownership (although the city does lease the the land for basically zero $).

So, as a Giants fan and and SF resident, I am happy to have them lease out the naming rights to whomever gives them the most moolah, assuming they invest it on the team.


But other than that they could call it "Screw you other MLB owners Park"
   45. Lassus Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:31 PM (#5494976)
I'm willing, after some thought, to consider voting for Pacific Park, even if it's a bit of a stretch geographically. it has the best rhythm by far of anything else that's been suggested.
   46. Lance Reddick! Lance him! Posted: July 17, 2017 at 08:51 PM (#5494982)
China Basin.

This. Exactly this. Like Chavez Ravine. No "park" or "field" or "stadium" or...
   47. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 17, 2017 at 09:36 PM (#5495010)
I don't know anything about Mays vs Cepeda's vs McCovey's relative belovedness in SF, but I assume it isn't Mays Cove because he was a righty.

And also just maybe because Mays' name doesn't contain the word "cove" in it.
   48. Mefisto Posted: July 17, 2017 at 09:52 PM (#5495016)
Mays Field at Pacific Park.
   49. Bote Man Posted: July 17, 2017 at 09:57 PM (#5495017)
Mays Field at Pacific Park

near China Basin.

Or hows abouts Ballpark by the Bay?

Or Alcatraz Landing??
   50. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: July 17, 2017 at 10:16 PM (#5495021)
Mays Field at Pacific Park

near China Basin.

Or hows abouts Ballpark by the Bay?

Or Alcatraz Landing??


of Aneheim
   51. Bourbon Samurai is disturbed by bagel developments Posted: July 17, 2017 at 10:44 PM (#5495031)
#14 is top notch.

The most memorable thing about the stadium is McCovey Cove, I might just be inclined to call it that.

Whatever its called, its an absolutely fabulous ballpark, my favorite I've ever visited.
   52. Benji Gil Gamesh VII - The Opt-Out Awakens Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:02 PM (#5495036)
And also just maybe because Mays' name doesn't contain the word "cove" in it.
That never occurred to me! And Mays Bay doesn't roll off the tongue as well (too few syllables).
   53. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: July 17, 2017 at 11:22 PM (#5495050)
That never occurred to me!


I'm glad I'm not the only one.

Independent of his Giant status, you can put Cepeda in front of just about anything and it's going to sound good.
   54. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 18, 2017 at 12:31 AM (#5495062)
Will The Thrill Park
   55. Baldrick Posted: July 18, 2017 at 12:58 AM (#5495065)
Matt Cain threw baseball’s 22nd perfect game there in 2012.

I was there; it was awesome.

Pacific Park is best. China Basin is second best.
   56. Petunia inquires about ponies Posted: July 18, 2017 at 01:41 AM (#5495068)
Candlestick was a specific park with specific features (like the weather) that were specific to that location. AT&T is nowhere near Candlestick and has none of those features.


Another feature that AT&T Park doesn't share with Candlestick Park is that it's not built on ####### Candlestick Point. If that suggestion gets any meaningful support at all in the final tally then this project is doomed before it begins. A veto would be preferable - I think I recall the introduction of this idea including reference to the organizers reserving the right to select the candidates for the final vote.

Not that I can do any better - as [44] points out, the corporate naming rights to this particular location actually represent something totally different than in any other case in major-league sports that I'm aware of. Speaking as a local, "AT&T Park" really does carry some cachet around here. I guess I would support China Basin - it's a geographical nickname that is both widely used and recognized, and widely associated with the stadium at this point. Pacific Park sounds good too if a little bland.
   57. SoSHially Unacceptable Posted: July 18, 2017 at 01:49 AM (#5495071)
veto would be preferable - I think I recall the introduction of this idea including reference to the organizers reserving the right to select the candidates for the final vote.


Yes, there will be 3-5 of us picking the final 3-4 choices among all the nominees.
   58. theboyqueen Posted: July 18, 2017 at 02:31 AM (#5495074)
Mccovey cove is easily the best suggestion here; I'm a sucker for metonymy.

Pacific park sounds ridiculous -- it's like naming Yankee Stadium Queens field or something.
   59. theboyqueen Posted: July 18, 2017 at 03:13 AM (#5495076)
I mean, it would be one thing if the stadium were in the middle of town, but it's literally on a body of water that is not the Pacific.

Pacific Park would work well for San Diego.
   60. . . . . . . . . . . Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:12 AM (#5495089)
I don't get why the corporate names are a problem. Who cares either way? You ever look at olde time sports pictures? Hell, I think there were more ads in spirts bafk then than there are today. If they'd thought of naming rights they'd certainly have sold them, they sold damn near anything else associated with the teams back then.
   61. Lassus Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:17 AM (#5495090)
Pacific park sounds ridiculous -- it's like naming Yankee Stadium Queens field or something.

I initially agreed with this, but the stadium is maybe eight miles from the Pacific Ocean, which is 64 million square miles big. I'll accept it.
   62. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:20 AM (#5495092)
I think that McCovey Cove is phenomenal. It should be a landslide winner.

"Pacific Park" has a nice ring to it but exactly 0% of baseball fans would know what the hell you're talking about. It's a non-starter. Plus the stadium is on a large body of water that is decidedly not the Pacific Ocean.
"Giants Park" is better than PacBell or AT&T, and it is useful, but it obviously lacks flair.
"China Basin" is probably my #2.
   63. Nasty Nate Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:27 AM (#5495097)
You ever look at olde time sports pictures? Hell, I think there were more ads in spirts bafk then than there are today.
and if you look at pictures from the 70s and 80s, there were way fewer...
   64. Nasty Nate Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:30 AM (#5495098)
Speaking as a local, "AT&T Park" really does carry some cachet around here.
But will you still want to call it AT&T when it inevitably gets its next corporate name?
   65. Lassus Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:31 AM (#5495099)
I think that McCovey Cove is phenomenal. It should be a landslide winner.

Meh. It makes me think of a small piece of water. A cove doesn't evoke a stadium, IMO.
   66. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:34 AM (#5495101)
This cove does.
   67. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:35 AM (#5495104)
Pacific Park

The original name for the stadium was Pac Bell Park. Get rid of the corporate telecom sponsor and you're left with a pretty good name (even if the stadium is on the bay side of town and not the ocean proper).

Yeah, but it's probably only a matter of time until Trump sells the naming rights to the Pacific Ocean (hell, maybe to himself), and then you're right back where you started.
   68. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:40 AM (#5495107)
Mays Field at Cepeda Stadium on McCovey Cove by the Bay
   69. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:52 AM (#5495115)
I don't get why the corporate names are a problem. Who cares either way? You ever look at olde time sports pictures? Hell, I think there were more ads in sports bafk then than there are today. If they'd thought of naming rights they'd certainly have sold them, they sold damn near anything else associated with the teams back then.

Two differences between billboard ads and corporate stadium names: The media don't repeat those billboard sponsors' names in every game story; and a sizable percentage of corporate names are just ugly to a normally attuned ear. Miller Park or Busch Stadium are at least somewhat euphonious, but names like "PNC Park" or "Guaranteed Rate Field" should've been rejected without a second thought.

Now if the media grew a pair and simply refused to mention those corporate names, and substituted generic names like "Pirates Park" or "White Sox Park" in their game stories, it might not be so bad. The teams and the corporations would sputter and fume, but in truth if the media hung together there's nothing they could do about it. Teams aren't going to refuse all that free publicity over anything as trivial as this. There are several NFL teams whose home town newspapers refuse to print the "Redskins" name, and none of them have been subject to retaliation on the park of either the league or the Redskins themselves. This is also true for several sports columnists, including (IIRC) at least one from the Washington Post.
   70. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:55 AM (#5495118)
I don't get why the corporate names are a problem.


They sound dumb.
   71. Don August(us) Cesar Geronimo Berroa Posted: July 18, 2017 at 08:58 AM (#5495121)
MadBum Stadium

Posey Park at Cepeda Stadium on McCovey Cove

Or in honor of San Fran's favorite band, who also Have their own night with the Giants, I give you Master of Puppets Park at Seek and Destroy Stadium
   72. Sean Forman Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:09 AM (#5495124)
I like Pacific Park a lot. I'm not from the area, but I've always seen LA as facing mostly southward culturally and San Francisco as an impt (the most impt?, probably tokyo) city on the Pacific Rim.
   73. Lassus Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:15 AM (#5495126)
Seek and Destroy Stadium

You can leave out the former Park name, this works.
   74. Rennie's Tenet Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:21 AM (#5495129)
I'm an out-of-town fan now, but my sense is that "PNC Park" is liked in Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh National Corp. traces farther back in the city than the Pirates do.
   75. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:25 AM (#5495132)
San Francisco as an impt (the most impt?, probably tokyo) city on the Pacific Rim.


I think it's fair to say that it's culturally oriented towards the pacific, but I don't know if SF is even in the top 10. Well I mean Silicon Valley is globally important for its own reasons but I think SF's economic pull and influence is not particularly notable. Shanghai has like 20 times as many people!
   76. Nasty Nate Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:25 AM (#5495133)
Or in honor of San Fran's favorite band, who also Have their own night with the Giants, I give you Master of Puppets Park at Seek and Destroy Stadium
I thought you were headed in a different direction, like Ripple Park or Dark Star Stadium.
   77. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:29 AM (#5495135)
Well I mean Silicon Valley is globally important for its own reasons but I think SF's economic pull and influence is not particularly notable. Shanghai has like 20 times as many people!

Which brings up another idea:
Silicon Valley Stadium

Sounds nice. It incorporates the area pretty well by discussing what's both a distinguishing feature & an important facet of the area.
   78. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 09:46 AM (#5495142)
But Silicon Valley is somewhere else. That's like calling Yankee Stadium "The Hamptons Stadium." Nonstarter.
   79. There are no words... (Met Fan Charlie) Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:10 AM (#5495153)
Orlando Cepeda was more popular at the time.


Hence my suggestion.
   80. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:21 AM (#5495163)
But Silicon Valley is somewhere else. That's like calling Yankee Stadium "The Hamptons Stadium." Nonstarter.

Is it? My mistake. I thought SF was part of it.
   81. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:24 AM (#5495170)
It's part of the Bay Area but they are quite distinct. Gotta drive south like 45 minutes to get from AT&T to the big Facebook or Apple campuses.
   82. Omineca Greg Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:28 AM (#5495178)
I'm surprised people are being so precise with the difference between the "ocean" side and the "bay" side with regards to "Pacific Park". Maybe it comes from growing up in a place (Vancouver) where none of it borders on the open ocean, but we never draw such fine distinctions like that...

Indian Arm...Pacific Ocean
Burrard Inlet...Pacific Ocean
False Creek...Pacific Ocean
Horseshoe Bay...Pacific Ocean
Howe Sound...Pacific Ocean
Boundary Bay...Pacific Ocean
Deep Cove...Pacific Ocean
Salish Sea..Pacific Ocean
Strait of Georgia...Pacific Ocean

If you live in Nanaimo (on the east coast of Vancouver Island), nobody looks out the window and says, "Shucky darn, I wish that was the Pacific out there, but alas, it is only Departure Bay, and even when I look farther, it's only the Strait of Georgia, and even when I go to the West Coast of the island, I get to Port Alberni, but woe, it's still only Alberni Inlet, but if I keep on going I get to Ucluelet, but if I look East, it's still only Barclay Sound, but if I look West, there it is, finally, the Pacific Ocean!". I'm not saying that's necessarily the wrong way to look at it, but it sure is different than the usage here. If it's salty, it's the Pacific Ocean, baby!
   83. Batman Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:29 AM (#5495179)
The 49ers play in Silicon Valley. Might as well let the Bay Area ride that lie with baseball too.
   84. Petunia inquires about ponies Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:43 AM (#5495193)
The 49ers play in Silicon Valley. Might as well let the Bay Area ride that lie with baseball too.

Not analogous. The 49ers do play in Silicon Valley. The Giants play in San Francisco. The lie goes the other way.

If you live in Nanaimo (on the east coast of Vancouver Island), nobody looks out the window and says, "Shucky darn, I wish that was the Pacific out there, but alas, it is only Departure Bay,

Don't know what to tell ya. It's very distinct to people around here. There's the ocean, and there's the Bay. Maybe it's connected to the fact that there's such a cultural divide between the city and the East Bay? Looking at a map, I feel like SF Bay is also more geographically distinct than the Nanaimo situation. One of the country's most famous landmarks marks the transition from ocean to Bay.

Speaking as a local, "AT&T Park" really does carry some cachet around here.

But will you still want to call it AT&T when it inevitably gets its next corporate name?


'Telecom Park' is also a fairly common nickname among some people I know, although I don't have the sense that it enjoys very much wide popularity.
   85. Bote Man Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:54 AM (#5495200)
San Francisco as an impt (the most impt?, probably tokyo) city on the Pacific Rim.

Rimmer's Park. I mean, it *IS* San Francisco after all.
   86. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 10:57 AM (#5495202)
Speaking of Nanaimo, I feel that Omineca Greg's talent for rollicking storytelling would make him a good candidate for NaNoWriMo.
   87. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:03 AM (#5495207)
I don't get why the corporate names are a problem.


They sound dumb.


Some do, certainly. Guaranteed Rate Field? Yeesh! Minute Maid Park? No thank you please. But many are just fine, and some actually pleasing. Target Field is an example of the former, and Great American Ballpark an example of the latter.
   88. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:14 AM (#5495216)
Ok. The ones that sound dumb sound dumb.
   89. Nasty Nate Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:21 AM (#5495228)
But many are just fine, and some actually pleasing.
Right, but they are also more temporary than non-sponsored names. I doubt this project would even exist if the corporate names lasted a long time. Are you going to still call it Target Field when it's officially UnitedHealth Group Park (or whatever) in a few years?
   90. Misirlou doesn't live in the restaurant Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:28 AM (#5495230)
Right, but they are also more temporary than non-sponsored names. I doubt this project would even exist if the corporate names lasted a long time. Are you going to still call it Target Field when it's officially UnitedHealth Group Park (or whatever) in a few years?


All my south side reletives call the place where the White Sox play Sox Park.
   91. Lassus Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:35 AM (#5495232)
Dark Star Stadium

I really like this, probably because I'm not a Dead fan. It sounds sci-fi.
   92. . . . . . . . . . . Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:38 AM (#5495233)
Two differences between billboard ads and corporate stadium names: The media don't repeat those billboard sponsors' names in every game story; and a sizable percentage of corporate names are just ugly to a normally attuned ear. Miller Park or Busch Stadium are at least somewhat euphonious, but names like "PNC Park" or "Guaranteed Rate Field" should've been rejected without a second thought.


Some do, certainly. Guaranteed Rate Field? Yeesh! Minute Maid Park? No thank you please. But many are just fine, and some actually pleasing. Target Field is an example of the former, and Great American Ballpark an example of the latter.


The latter post is what I mean. Sure, there are stupid corporate names - and some of them probably not worth the added value the stupid company is willing to pay. I'm pretty sure if Guaranteed Rate was willing to pay $2 million more a year than Allstate or ADM or some other Chicago-based blue chip, it'd be better for the Sox to brand themselves with the blue chip and eat the $2M. That's just bad management - short term cash over the long term value of the White Sox brand.

But a tasteful corporate name is fine. Target Field is a great example. Citifield is perfectly fine. Coors Field is downright excellent. Great American Ballpark is fine (and is entirely consistent with historical practice - the Linders own the sponsoring company).

It's really no different than billboards in the outfield. A big ad for the local paper that you see every time the camera follows a can of corn to RF is fine. A big pink ad for the local gentleman's club isn't.
   93. SoSH U at work Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:43 AM (#5495239)
Right, but they are also more temporary than non-sponsored names. I doubt this project would even exist if the corporate names lasted a long time. Are you going to still call it Target Field when it's officially UnitedHealth Group Park (or whatever) in a few years?


That's my bigger issue. I really don't have a problem with a corporate name. I hate having to relearn names for the same building. I shouldn't have to do that.

All my south side reletives call the place where the White Sox play Sox Park.


Sox Park and Cubs Park are the only names I've ever heard my White Sox fan father-in-law call those places (and in the case of the Southside, both old and new).

   94. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:47 AM (#5495244)
I'd doubly oppose Mays Field. From what I know, the fans didn't really embrace him when he came here. He was New York's Willie Mays for them. Orlando Cepeda was more popular at the time.

True, but that didn't last all that long, and by the time he was traded the most popular Giants were Mays and McCovey. And if you took a vote among current Giants fans, it wouldn't shock me to see Bonds the winner.

Actually in this case AT&T isn't all that bad sounding a name, and there's no corporation whose name is easier to remember. The only real problem with it is that it doesn't have any particular connection to San Francisco; AT&T Park could just as well be in Philadelphia or Phoenix.
   95. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:51 AM (#5495248)
I don't get why the corporate names are a problem.

Normal people tend to be repulsed by naked cash grabs, and that's all corporate naming rights are. To me at least, it's tolerable if the park name has at least some tie to the owner or city, but it just sounds stupid when it's temporarily named for the winner of the latest [Your Name Here!] naming rights auction.
   96. Lassus Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:52 AM (#5495249)
Target Field is a great example.

I don't know why people like this name. Target's a latter-day K-Mart, and that's what I think about when I read "Target Field". Yay?
   97. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 18, 2017 at 11:57 AM (#5495258)
It benefits a lot from being a real word that you don't have to associate with the store. Target Field is a hundred times better than K-Mart Field would be.
   98. . . . . . . . . . . Posted: July 18, 2017 at 12:00 PM (#5495259)
Normal people tend to be repulsed by naked cash grabs, and that's all corporate naming rights are. To me at least, it's tolerable if the park name has at least some tie to the owner or city, but it just sounds stupid when it's temporarily named for the winner of the latest [Your Name Here!] naming rights auction.


What's the difference between a "naked cash grab" and selling something appropriately? Is sale of tickets a "naked cash grab"? What about selling Happy Birthday messages on the Jumbotron? Where's the line? Who gets to pick where the line is?
   99. PreservedFish Posted: July 18, 2017 at 12:07 PM (#5495263)
Obviously the stadium naming rights thing is more grating than other similar forms of advertising primarily because we are not used to it. But that doesn't excuse it - advertising can be obnoxious, and we should complain about obnoxious things.
   100. SoSH U at work Posted: July 18, 2017 at 12:10 PM (#5495266)
Obviously the stadium naming rights thing is more grating than other similar forms of advertising because we are not used to it.


It's also because we don't have any choice but to use it. We don't have to talk about the brands on the outfield wall, or in the program, or the commercials on the tee vee. But the name of the stadium comes up routinely, both in conversation and in print. We have to use it to effectively communicate with others.

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