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Tuesday, July 14, 2009

The Columnists: Fox: Big Angels deal coming? Like maybe English class?

Holy shitdoggies!...I linked to ReNew America by mistake!

Dash the Spanish: I’m tired of Angel players who don’t speak English. At least not with a mike in from of them.

This Kendry Morales ignoring our language for Spanish the way Vlad does is outrageous. This is an American team with American fans paying them American millions.

Learn to speak to us without a Jose Mota dictionary, for crying out loud.

Follow hockey’s lead. Guy Lafleur and Mario Lemieux were two French Canadians who entered the NHL knowing hardly any English. The Habs and Penguins made sure they learned it. Simple marketing. They knew their fan base spoke English, so get with the program, guys.

The Angels should do the same. So should every team in baseball, which has crashing attendance as it is.

Fans want players they can relate to. It sure would help if they could understand them.

Repoz Posted: July 14, 2009 at 01:51 PM | 153 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: angels, media, special topics

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   101. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 14, 2009 at 08:43 PM (#3253596)
"But then I saw In Bruges, and I stopped hating him."

You saw what in Bruges?
   102. RJ in TO Posted: July 14, 2009 at 08:43 PM (#3253598)
And nobody bothered to read the article so it's not like the trolling got page views for the host site.


Read the article? Are you crazy? Hell, half the people here don't even read the quoted excerpt.
   103. Hang down your head, Tom Foley Posted: July 14, 2009 at 08:47 PM (#3253603)
Read the article? Are you crazy? Hell, half the people here don't even read the quoted excerpt.


I'm not going to read your post or even my response.
   104. Stevis Posted: July 14, 2009 at 09:00 PM (#3253610)
You saw what in Bruges?

No, I saw what on second.
   105. Gambling Rent Czar Posted: July 14, 2009 at 09:21 PM (#3253621)
Read the article? Are you crazy? Hell, half the people here don't even read the quoted excerpt.
I didn't get past the first sentence. Still haven't.

I did click the link though, I wanted to see what sort of website this was. Curiosity I guess.

But as for the article, nope. Still haven't gotten past the first quoted sentence.
   106. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: July 14, 2009 at 09:23 PM (#3253624)
No, I saw what on second.

Who?
   107. kthejoker Posted: July 14, 2009 at 09:31 PM (#3253636)
Only vaguely related to the article: I visit a taqueria here in Houston where the proprietor and his two assistants speak no English. I can speak enough Spanish to be dangerous, but luckily I don't have to. I can hold up two fingers, get two tacos, pay, smile, and be on my way.

Communicating with fans of baseball with waves, smiles, and autographs can't be that hard, either.
   108. 'zop sympathizes with the wrong ####### people Posted: July 14, 2009 at 09:42 PM (#3253642)
My father grew up a poor refugee in Israel. He left when he was in his teens. When he returned after 20 years, he visited a woman whom he was friends with as a child for dinner. She was married and had a small farm with horses. At dinner with her, her husband, and her kids, he decided to compliment her on her horse, to tell her how much fun he'd had playing with it, how pretty it was.

The word for horse in Hebrew, according to my father's tale, is "sus". Apparently, the word for "pu.ssy" in Hebrew is "kus". Unfortunately, after 20 years my father had confused the two.
   109. GregQ Posted: July 14, 2009 at 10:38 PM (#3253670)
In the first year that Moreno owned the team didn't some sportswriter-possibly from Mich. complain that the team was too Hispanic and that this was a growing issue in America? I am pretty sure I read it here but cannot find it.
   110. Dr. Vaux Posted: July 14, 2009 at 10:42 PM (#3253671)
Anybody know where the All-Star Game can be heard on the radio in the Baltimore area? Probably no where.
   111. Howie Menckel Posted: July 14, 2009 at 10:51 PM (#3253674)
I don't even care about this topic, I'll just note I lol-ed maybe a dozen times as I read it.

A prototypical BBTF thread.....
   112. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 14, 2009 at 11:42 PM (#3253711)
"My father grew up a poor refugee in Israel. He left when he was in his teens. When he returned after 20 years, he visited a woman whom he was friends with as a child for dinner. She was married and had a small farm with horses. At dinner with her, her husband, and her kids, he decided to compliment her on her horse, to tell her how much fun he'd had playing with it, how pretty it was.

The word for horse in Hebrew, according to my father's tale, is "sus". Apparently, the word for "pu.ssy" in Hebrew is "kus". Unfortunately, after 20 years my father had confused the two."


One time, I got slapped by a random Japanese lady on the street for saying that she had a scary/creepy child (kowai) instead of a cute one (kawaii). And one of my father's college friends made a Japanese girl cry on a date when he said that he despised her (kirai) when he tried to say that she was pretty (kirei).

It's tricky stuff, languages.
   113. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 14, 2009 at 11:43 PM (#3253712)
You may also enjoy: Zug.com's Chinese tattoo prank.
   114. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 12:19 AM (#3253765)
Look guys, do you know how hard of a language English is to learn? Think about it--it's a mongrel language, combining Romance and Germanic influences, filled with non-sensical rules that have huge exceptions that nearly make such rules useless. Think about how hard it would be to be a full-time baseball player, with all the time commitment that entails, and have to learn such a particularly difficult language.
The guy who came this close to entering a Ph.D program in comparative Indo-European linguistics has to jump in and point out how really, really wrong this is in every objective sense.

1.) First of all, English isn't a "mongrel" language (in fact, aside from true creoles, i.e. synthetic languages pidgined together, there is no such thing as a "mongrel" language), it's a Germanic language.

2.) Second, although it has transformed radically from its West Saxon/Old English roots due to influence by Norman French, this hasn't made it harder to learn, but rather much, much easier: because of the havoc that Norman French (and its Italic background) wreaked, it has almost completely lost the complicated case system of declensions, genders and tenses that the other German languages still largely retain. (Latin has these too, and while most Romance languages have dropped noun declensions -- Romanian is the outlier -- they retain gender and a whole system of verb conjugation and usage that befuddles a fresh crop of English-speaking high school students every year.)

This has made English into one of the easier -- if not THE EASIEST -- major languages to master grammatically. Aside from a couple irregular verb inflections (all holdovers from an Old English conjugation scheme that NHG and Dutch still retain), it's remarkably easy to figure out word order and grammar in English. We only have TWO proper verb tenses at this point (that is to say, tenses with unique conjugations unto themselves): present and preterit. Present/preterit progressive as well, I suppose (i.e. "is/was walking") but that's regular as heck. We don't even have a future tense anymore! (We just add auxiliary verbs like "will" and "shall" and "going to")

3.) The one area in which English is difficult -- difficult even for native speakers -- is in spelling and pronunciation. THIS is the heritage of our uniquely acquisitive language: we've sucked in so many words from so many other languages, and frozen our older ones in spellings which reflect pronunciations no longer in use (the classic example is pretty much every word that ends in "-ough" -- notice how almost none of them rhyme?), that saying words the right way can be kind of a nightmare. By contrast, Spanish is one of the most appealingly 'regular' major languages on the planet when it comes to pronunciation: so long as you know the basic ground rules ("h" is silent, "j" is h, "ll" is a liquid pronounced like "y," etc.) you can look at a word on the page and pronounce it correctly every single time.

But it's not vocabulary or pronunciation that gives new speakers real problems (as anyone who can remember their old language classes will testify, you mostly memorize that stuff by rote anyway), rather the grammar. And English grammar is so simple that even caveman could master it. A few weird exceptions, but most of it's been beaten out of us by 1000 years of Italic family influence.

4.) None of this is related to the topic, really. I just love talking about languages. Especially Indo-European languages. I'm cool like that.
   115. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: July 15, 2009 at 12:30 AM (#3253810)
The guy who came this close to entering a Ph.D program in comparative Indo-European linguistics

So where do you get off calling yourself "Esoteric"?
   116. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 12:35 AM (#3253833)
So where do you get off calling yourself "Esoteric"?
Ha. Oddly enough, that has nothing to do with my love of reconstructive linguistics, but is rather an old, old in-joke. It dates back to my first week of college when a musically-ignorant kid was paging through my music collection, held up a Rolling Stones disc, and complained about how all I had were "esoteric CDs."

And that was BEFORE I ever got into Pavement or Can or Wire or The Stranglers!
   117. 1k5v3L Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:25 AM (#3254124)
Dash the Spanish
Y tu mama tambien.
   118. The Keith Law Blog Blah Blah (battlekow) Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:31 AM (#3254149)
This is a 'merican team with 'merican fans paying them 'merican millions.

Fixed
We flipped our finger to the King of England
Stole our country from the Indians
With God on our side and guns in our hands
We took it for our own
   119. Forsch 10 From Navarone (Dayn) Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:42 AM (#3254199)
a musically-ignorant kid was paging through my music collection, held up a Rolling Stones disc, and complained about how all I had were "esoteric CDs."

Too bad he didn't run across some Captain Beefheart or something.
   120. RollingWave Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:56 AM (#3254254)
Anyone who think English is a difficult language have never learned Chinese
   121. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: July 15, 2009 at 02:55 AM (#3254569)
You may also enjoy: Zug.com's Chinese tattoo prank.

Priceless. Sadistic, but priceless.
   122. base ball chick Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:24 PM (#3254793)
just out of curiousity

how many of yall who think fox is teh uck-say for saying that baseball stars should try to learn to espeek a leedle of da eeengleesh for their primarily english speaking fans

1 - pronounced sammy sosa guilty of shooting drugs because he took a translator with him to face congress because we all know that wouldn't nobody who speaks as good spanish as sammy does english take a translator to talk in front of the dominican government government officials

2 - proudly proclaimed that he absolutely refuses to read what i write because of my imperfect grammar and diction, so different from the perfect prose of every other intaleckshuule here
   123. Jack Keefe Posted: July 15, 2009 at 01:54 PM (#3254848)
Well now Al they are all up set because some ball players does not speak English and what of it Al. We can not all be masters of the tongue like me and the Base Ball Chick and so some must settle for Baby Steps. Now on the Sox over the years we have had little Gucci who speaks Asian American and Jose Contrary who speaks Cuban American and A.J. Pierogi who speaks in a series of grunts. Now there is a poaster called Esoteric and he says that English is a Indo European language and in Chi. this is true Al there are lots of Indos and they run Take Aways where you can buy Somozas and and Pickwhoras and Goo Lap Chow Mein which is like little round nuggits of Aunt Jemima Pancake in a special Sirop. And they have no problem speaking language only some times they try to give me some kind of Beer Yanni they say is Lamb but you don't see any kitty cats around the back of their shops if you know what I mean Al. Well I guess we should either all be happy to be in the US of A or go back where we came from which in my case would be County Monaghan where my old Mam was born and in that case I would not be playing ball at all but probably a star Hurler and playing in matches for All Ireland against the Rest of Ireland and would the world be better off for it Your Milledge May Vary.
   124. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 03:47 PM (#3255006)
I blame another stupid Jack Keefe post (least funny schtick on Primer) for killing what I hoped to turn into another great Indo-European language thread.
   125. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:03 PM (#3255025)
Hey, I read the article. I even pointed out that most of the article was actually about what a bad announcer Steve Physioc was, but even this didn't make people like the writer.
   126. Jack Keefe Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:07 PM (#3255033)
Hey, the plural form of the English noun cognate with West Frisian nút, Middle Dutch noit, noot, note, nuete, (Flemish, Brabantic) not (Dutch noot, (now rare except in compounds) not, (now chiefly regional) neut), Middle Low German not, nut, Old High German hnuz, nuz (Middle High German nuz, German Nuss), Old Icelandic hnot, Old Swedish noth, nut, nyt (Swedish nöt), Danish nød, probably < a Germanic base showing an extended form of the same Indo-European base as Old Irish cnú nut (Irish cnó), Welsh cnau to you pal.
   127. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:09 PM (#3255039)
Way to copy/paste, schtick.
   128. Jeff K. Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:12 PM (#3255044)
Thankfully, this represents a minority of Angel fandom.

That there looks like a Spanish word to me, sonny. We need to 'mercanize it. First, that g has to go. I see them Mespanos or whatever they want to be called these days mispronounce that letter. We'll make it a j, for Jesus, cause Jesus is an American. Then that 'el' at the end, that's a Tejexinic word too. That'll be a 3, for the greatest man to ever live (sides Jesus), Dale Earnhardt. The 'An' is just stupid Hianican nonsense. We'll add the ultimate American word at the end, so nobody forgets it. A 'w' for winner, cuz America don't lose.

There you have it. They are now the J3Ws. That's better than them damn foreign heathen devil Angel names. Every real downhome country boy American's gonna love them some J3Ws!
   129. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:15 PM (#3255049)
I blame another stupid Jack Keefe post (least funny schtick on Primer) for killing what I hoped to turn into another great Indo-European language thread.

Wow - that crticism didn't even try to be clever. Eso either you are in a real bad mood or really don't like Ring Lardner.

Jack may not be for everyone (when our Jack is on he/she is gold IMHO) but you can hardly call our Jack Keefe a thread killer. Of all of our "problem" contributors Jack wouldn't crack the top ten.
   130. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:22 PM (#3255059)
Oh and the story of how you (Esoteric) got your nickname is hilarious.
   131. 'zop sympathizes with the wrong ####### people Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:26 PM (#3255065)
Jack may not be for everyone (when our Jack is on he/she is gold IMHO) but you can hardly call our Jack Keefe a thread killer. Of all of our "problem" contributors Jack wouldn't crack the top ten.

The next post in which "Jack Keefe" is funny will be the first. And I say that as someone who has read and enjoyed Ring Lardner.

Recipe for being a "comedian" on a message board:
(1) Post unfunny schtick
(2) Receive compliment on your humor from a few people
(3) Ignore fact that those few people are arrayed against the 1000 others who see the post, roll their eyes, and scroll down
(4) Clap self on back. Continue to post unfunny schtick.
   132. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:29 PM (#3255069)
Well I didn't mean to start a digression on whether or not people appreciate Jack's posts (and I respect that not liking Jack doesn't mean you don't like Ring).

I don't think it is fair to accuse Jack of "killing the thread" (perhaps like I just did). Jack is hardly a prolific thread derailer.
   133. Dr. Nick Riviera Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:29 PM (#3255070)
Holy smokes, 'zop! You need booze!
   134. Jack Keefe Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:38 PM (#3255085)
Hey every 1 needs booze thats why they call it booze. So no hard fillings and if you guys come to Chi. I will buy you a round of Old Styles and there will be no need to punch noses. As Ozzie Guillen always says you catch more flies with dulce de leche and thats my phisolpholy of life from here on In.
   135. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:38 PM (#3255086)
Oh and the story of how you (Esoteric) got your nickname is hilarious.
What always struck me odd about the exchange is that the guy would have used the word "esoteric" to describe the Rolling Stones (it's a fairly erudite word), and yet had never heard of them. I mean, how can anyone be that sheltered?

The album he held up was Exile On Main Street, for what it's worth. Esoteric my ass...that's one of the greatest double albums of all time!
   136. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:41 PM (#3255089)
Hey every 1 needs booze thats why they call it booze. So no hard fillings and if you guys come to Chi. I will buy you a round of Old Styles and there will be no need to punch noses. As Ozzie Guillen always says you catch more flies with dulce de leche and thats my phisolpholy of life from here on In.
But see, I already live on the Southside of Chicago (Hyde Park, to be specific), and I don't grok the humor. Give me "ntr Jeff Francoeur" anyday. At this point all I really care about is finding out who's really behind the Jack Keefe schtick. I wouldn't reveal the truth if I ever found out...it's just that my natural curiosity can't be suppressed.

Oh, and hey...that Italo-Celtic isogloss is something, innit?
   137. rr Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:42 PM (#3255090)
sheltered?


He said "Give me Shelter", and his parents did.
   138. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:47 PM (#3255096)
It's "Gimme Shelter" if you're trying to be proper, my friend. And as a good a song as it is, I still prefer "Monkey Man" and "You Can't Always Get What You Want" from Let It Bleed.
   139. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:49 PM (#3255099)
At this point all I really care about is finding out who's really behind the Jack Keefe schtick. I wouldn't reveal the truth if I ever found out...it's just that my natural curiosity can't be suppressed.

BBC's mom.
   140. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:50 PM (#3255102)
I'm Jack Keefe!
   141. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 04:53 PM (#3255107)
What always struck me odd about the exchange is that the guy would have used the word "esoteric" to describe the Rolling Stones (it's a fairly erudite word), and yet had never heard of them.

Maybe he thought the word meant something else. I would have used "esoteric" at least once every conversation I had with him for a good time afterwards. Of course I can be a jerk that way.
   142. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:11 PM (#3255130)
Maybe he thought the word meant something else. I would have used "esoteric" at least once every conversation I had with him for a good time afterwards. Of course I can be a jerk that way.
Oh, you better believe I did. I complained about having to go to Taco Bell to eat "esoteric food" like quesadillas, and how much I hated "esoteric TV shows" like E.R. and Friends. He was pretty sick of the joke by the end of 1st semester freshman year. Though his musical tastes never did improve.
   143. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:18 PM (#3255136)
Oh, you better believe I did.

Excellent. I feel better knowing he was mocked in such a fashion.
   144. ntr Jeff Francoeur Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:21 PM (#3255143)
Give me "ntr Jeff Francoeur" anyday.
The Stones just ripped off the Delta bluesmen.
   145. rr Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:25 PM (#3255148)
quesadillas,


Learn to say this in English. You're posting on an American web site.
   146. Esoteric Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:34 PM (#3255155)
The Stones just ripped off the Delta bluesmen...
A thousand Primeys for this brilliant synthesis of relevance and humor. Never change, Jeff Francoeur, never change.
   147. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:38 PM (#3255159)
Hey guys. If you haven't already heard I am on a Delta flight headed to New York to join my new team the Mets. I am looking forward to getting up there and playing in front of a packed house every night at Citi Field. Tune in to watch us take on the Reds at tonight at 7:10. More to come...

From Frenchy's blog. (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)
   148. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:52 PM (#3255181)
Is that really from his blog? I can't tell a parody from the real thing.
   149. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: July 15, 2009 at 05:58 PM (#3255190)
Is that really from his blog? I can't tell a parody from the real thing.

Copied and pasted directly from his blog.
   150. base ball chick Posted: July 15, 2009 at 06:07 PM (#3255209)
Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 12:49 PM (#3255099)

At this point all I really care about is finding out who's really behind the Jack Keefe schtick. I wouldn't reveal the truth if I ever found out...it's just that my natural curiosity can't be suppressed.



BBC's mom.

- like i bin telling every 1 for a long time now Al. and this from a woman-American too
   151. Sheer Tim Foli Posted: July 15, 2009 at 06:17 PM (#3255228)
Copied and pasted directly from his blog.

Wow. Just wow. The only thing missing was the rhetorical question. "What team do you want to be traded to?"
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