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That said, if the topic is foods from The City, I miss real SF sourdough bread. Just fantastic.
Yeah, it's middle class tourist fare.
Are there really inter-state conflicts? I know there are inter-city conflicts, but I'm from Oregon and I can't really think of a state that I'm...y'know...against. Do people from Vermont and New Hampshire get in heated arguments over which state is upside down?
Whoa. Never thought about that before.
No, Vermonters all concede that their state is upside down.
But yeah, I don't think there's much in the way of state rivalries apart from a few obvious exceptions. Texas is clearly an extreme example, and the distaste people feel for it seems unlikely to translate to other circumstances.
North Dakotans do have a serious inferiority complex about their relationship with South Dakota, in my experience. I know a couple Georgians who have something against South Carolina. And Massachusetts and New York definitely have some bad blood. Those are the ones that jump to mind for me.
Oh, and Michiganders are still angry at Ohio over the Toledo war.
I'm frequently in Hoboken, and there's always a massive line of tourists outside his subpar bakery.
Amateurs.
Vermont, clearly.
I'm frequently in Hoboken, and there's always a massive line of tourists outside his subpar bakery.
We used to go around the corner to Pier Platter/Wilton House for rekids n' booze and then stop in for some a nasty cruller substance and then throw-up among the cobblestones.
If the Rangers win, Pelosi has to give Newt Gingrich a sponge bath & massage.
If the Giants win, Barton has to #### Meg Whitman with the lights on.
Think of the tension in Game 7....
Yeah, it's middle class tourist fare.
Agree, BUT. I used to regularly bicycle from the other side of Twin Peaks to the store solely to get their truly exceptional sugar-free chocolate-covered hard toffee (type I diabetic). It was the best I'd ever had, and still is. (However, evidenced by a return trip once, they just up and stopped making it some time after I left town. Maybe I was the only one buying it.)
Seriously, between the hills and very dangerous roads and traffic, bicycling in San Francisco is not for the faint of heart, literally or figuratively.
Why? Ohio ended up with it, didn't they? (I kid, I have friends there, it's not a bad place.)
You bet. Arkansans hate Texans. Oklahomans hate Texans. Louisianans hate Texans. New Mexicans hate Texans. Montanans hate Texans. Ohioans hate Texans. Minnesotans hate Texans. Georgians hate Texans. Vermonters hate Texans. Pennsylvanians hate Texans. Rhode Islanders hate Texans. Those are just a few off the top of my head.
Didn't Oregon have "Don't Californicate Oregon" bumper stickers? I know that before the crash, residents of lots of western states, including Colorado where I live, resented Californians a bit. A lot of Californians went searching elsewhere in the west for the things they used to have -- clean air, open space, etc. -- cashed out of their wildly overpriced houses and flocked to CO and other states, contributing to sprawl, pollution, crowding, and inflated housing prices there. I wouldn't call it hatred or rivalry but there was certainly some resentment of (former) Californians here and in other western states.
“I thought the Rangers winning the World Series for the first time would be sweet enough, but when Speaker Pelosi put some Ghirardelli’s chocolate on the line — I knew victory would be even sweeter!” Barton said.
The good-natured banter quickly became ugly, and, just as quickly, turned into passionate makeup sex.
Teddy Roosevelt NP >>> Mount Rushmore. And the only sports team in either state worth a #### is the UND Fighting Sioux Hockey Team. ND has produced Phil Jackson, Roger Maris, Travis Hafner, Lute Olson. If you can recognize more than 1 or 2 names from the South Dakota Sports HOF you're better than me. North Dakota's capital is named after the man who kicked France's ass. South Dakota's is Pierre.
Well, the football teams of the University of Oregon and the University of Washington aren't exactly chummy...
Oh good lord, I agree with #22. I was in Oregon for three years and they really did seem to hate California quite a bit. They had the traditional "where we live is the best place in America, so stay away, losers" attitude, and vocally so. It was kind of gross.
North Dakotans do have a serious inferiority complex about their relationship with South Dakota, in my experience.
Probably because they don't have the awesome representation of a freakish alien planet landscape that is the Badlands.
As someone who has lived in New Hampshire my whole life, I'm not convinced there is actually such a thing as people from Vermont. Also, we make fun of people who live in Maine (but don't hate them) and spend a lot of time hating on Massachusetts drivers.
If the Giants win, Barton has to #### Meg Whitman with the lights on.
Think of the tension in Game 7....
When men were men and bets were bets ...
But I wouldn't #### Meg Whitman with YOUR d!ck, lights on or off.
Kansas and Missouri clearly have a thing. I think Wisconsinites are against all neighboring states, some more good-naturedly (Iowa) than others (Illinois). Perhaps the sole exception is Michigan, which really is kind of puzzling when you look at the map; I mean, the UP is obviously part of Wisconsin, not Michigan.
Could have something to do with having started the Civil War a few years before all the other states joined in. There's some nasty history there. Of course there's also a metropolitan area that straddles the state line.
I grew up in Oklahoma, and the only other state that mattered was Texas. Always. And the only way to do that as a sporting event lies with college football.
Yeah, now that I think about that I think that was sort of ex-governor Tom McCall's platform. Or, I think it was. I dunno, that was long before my time, but as it's told by my Dad (and as I studied in a freshman-level Winter Term project at my ex-college Oberlin) that was essentially the gist.
Now, Oregon, which one is that--the over or under non-entity state?
You know what, you're right. #### California. I've never liked it either, really. Los Angeles is a hell of lip gloss and concrete, and it's slowly seeping its way into Central Oregon (see: Bend).
Well, the football teams of the University of Oregon and the University of Washington aren't exactly chummy...
I'll get bothered about that as soon as they become any sort of threat.
Sounds like one of those rivalries where one of the participants is in fact unaware that they are even involved.
My college was in two of those - one on the pathetic side, one on the oblivious side.
I would hardly call Kansas City a "metropolitan area."
ugh. This x1000. I really, REALLY don't get it. They're not as good as a really good NYC bakery like Ferrara's or Veniero's. Meh.
In general, Hoboken's food is actually pretty great. Especially if you like big sandwiches (I'm trying to avoid a Hero/Sub/Hoagie/Grinder war here.)
Your answer can be found here.
It's actually a good book, though editing could be better, you should read it with an atlas open on the table. Sourcing could be better, so some suspicion remains. Slavery explains several borders, simple longitude and latitude others. Deals, fights and stupidity some others. Michigan basically received it as compensation for losing out on Toledo.
Maryland and Delaware are my favorites.
Why? Worst case - 30 posts. Best case - a Ken Burns documentary, several casualties, and stories for the grandkids.
I find this somewhat hilarious, as I could have sworn that this is what the people in Bend dismissively said about Portland in the mid to late 90's.
Growing up in San Francisco, my folks wouldn't let me get a bike. By the time I moved out of SF, I had a car.
Hence, I never have learned to ride a bike.
This reminds me of a story I read in the local paper - either the Bay Guardian or the Chronicle - back in the 90s. Some local political player (Clint Reilly type) had a birthday party with a lot of prominent local guests (Willie Brown etc.) Well the hired entertainment included some exotic male dancers, things got a bit crazy, and apparently they performed some anal penetration of each other with a bottle of scotch that had been nearby. The newspaper reporter had called up the various guests who had been at the event, but they all said something to the effect of "oh, mayor brown left before that happened" etc. if they had any comment at all. But Sheriff Hennesey was quoted as saying, "that's a damn waste of a good bottle of scotch." So yeah - I'd #### her with either of your dicks.
EDIT: but we'd need an acronym for it
I don't have that book, and I'm not currently looking at any other sources, but they did make me take Oklahoma history back in the 8th grade, and I even remember a few details. So let's see how well I can explain the Oklahoma panhandle from memory.
The U.S. and Spain signed a treaty in about 1818 or 1819 redefining the border created after the Louisiana Purchase: the Red River west to a certain longitude, north up that longitude to the Arkansas River, then up the Arkansas River. This accounts for the bulk of the the Oklahoma/Texas border, with most of Oklahoma on the U.S. side and Texas - but also what would become the Panhandle - on the Spanish side. Meanwhile the Missouri Compromise of 1820 established a line - the line of latitude constituting the bulk of the Missouri/Arkansas border - and made it the border between slave territories and free territories going west. At that time, that only left Arkansas and the majority of what was to become Oklahoma as territories south of the line. Except that Oklahoma was used for a different purpose - as Indian Territory for housing the tribes forcibly removed from the Southeast. (Some of those Indians did own and keep African-American slaves, including a few Cherokees living in Indian Territory north of the Missouri Compromise line. But Indian Territory didn't really count in those terms.)
Texans fought that 1836 war for independence from Mexico for many reasons, but one of them was slavery: Texans wanted it, Mexico had abolished it. The territory claimed (not without dispute) by the Republic of Texas included everything south/west of the U.S. and north/east of the Rio Grande. This extends up into central Colorado. When Texas was admitted to the Union in 1845 as a slave state, it had to abide by the Missouri Compromise and give up everything north of that line of latitude. At a later date, Kansas was formed, and the latitude line defining the Kansas/Indian Territory border was extended westward to include some parts of ex-Texas. Then the territories that were to become Colorado and New Mexico/Arizona were blocked out further to the west. That left a strip of land between Texas and Kansas that didn't belong to any territory. It seems to have been generally known as "no man's land." It was a chunk of high plains, generally a little too dry for farming and far from cities or transportation routes, and assigning it didn't seem to have been a particularly high priority for anyone.
Meanwhile, in the aftermath of the Civil War, the Cherokee/Creek/Choctaw/Chickasaw/Seminole had significant chunks of their Indian Territory lands taken away, with some of it assigned to yet other tribes from other parts of the continent, but with some significant chunks of territory in the central and western parts of Indian Territory officially unoccupied by any tribe. The federal government responded to many years of agitation by opening these lands to white settlement in a series of land runs and lotteries between 1889 and 1893. Oklahoma Territory - as distinct from Indian Territory - was organized soon after the first (1889) land run. At at that point - in about 1890 - the powers that be finally figured out what they could to with "no man's land," and glued it onto Oklahoma Territory. The final shape of the state didn't appear until 1907, when Congress rebuffed efforts of Oklahoma Territory and Indian Territory to each become separate states and forced a merger as the price for statehood.
Anyhow, that's the Oklahoma Panhandle - a "no man's land" left over from other line-drawing, partly because of the Missouri Compromise of 1820, and not attached as it now is until 1890.
Oh yes. Those of us from California have an abiding hatred for Delaware. Very often, when listing the 50 states, we go so far as to forget it's a state.
I spent some time in western North Carolina, in Appalachia, where tourists from Florida come to get out of that schvitz-bath in the summer, and I got the sense that the hillbillies really hate Florida. I can't imagine the hatred is returned. But anyhow, the western North Carolinians refer to folks from the Sunshine Schvitz-Bath State as Florons. I thought that was a first rate dig ... for hillbilly humor, anyhow.
running stop signs without even slowing down - even when there is cross traffic that has right of way (car, other bike, or pedestrian)
riding on sidewalks
turning left at an intersection not like a car does, but by veering left into oncoming traffic, hugging the left curb and making a tight left into oncoming traffic, then veering right onto the correct side of the road
passing on the right especially passing a car at an intersection when the car is about to make a right turn
all of the above at night with no lights
I consider this behavior to be really amateurish.
You mean 57 states.
I also thought the headline was referring to Daric Barton. I thought - how does he know Nancy Pelosi?
stick their fingers in someone else's peanut butter.
And not even eat it! It's such a waste!
Here's the lede from a write-up from the Chron:
Nevada, according to Sharon Angle.
Sharron.
I really don't understand why anyone would vote for someone who can't even spell their own name right.
Wow, that's a reference I haven't heard in a while. That was what, fifteen years ago?
Fortunately, Pelosi and Barton settled on Ghirardelli's chocolate and pecan pie instead.
Why is always the person who moves in immediately after you who contributes to sprawl, pollution, crowding, and inflated housing prices?
So Dwyane Wade can never be voted NBA MVP? I'm comfortable with that.
Fun fact: Pierre (pronounced "peer") is the only state capital that does not share any letters with the state it's the capital of.
Totally bizarre fact: I once had a dream that I had forgotten this factoid, and called up then-President Clinton to ask him. He was very friendly, and thanked me for calling.
A: You can look across the river and see Vermont.
Q: Why doesn't Maine float away into the ocean?
A: Because New Hampshire sucks.
And yeah, Mass-holes suck at driving. And Connecticut and Rhode Island aren't really in New England. ####### flatlanders.
Rudy Giulani had the right idea.
I think he was referring to the Joplin/Pittsburg metropolis.
The only thing that prevents a good portion of Florida residents from being hillbillies is the lack of any real hills in Florida. The Gulf coast is commonly referred to as the "Redneck Riviera" and there is more than a little truth when people refer to it as "lower Alabama".
Michael says, "Uh-huh."
God says, "And then there's Texas. I gave them the top scientists, the most inventive engineers, the finest symphonies and operas, the most interesting art museums, the best popular music tradition of all the states, and a magnificent literary tradition."
Michael says, "So where's the balance?"
God says, "Well, haven't you ever seen all them dumb sons-of-bitches in Arkansas?"
Why is always the person who moves in immediately after you who contributes to sprawl, pollution, crowding, and inflated housing prices?
You don't know this person like I do.
Not sure whether it really qualifies as a "conflict", as such, but in PA we make a lot of jokes about WV, due to the whole cousin-####### thing.
There was a girl in my high school class who moved here from West Virginia. Her parents were first cousins, and she was born with a vestigal tail. She showed us the scar from where they removed it in biology class one time.
That goes back to the Toledo War -- one of the concessions to Michigan for forfeiting the Toldo Strip was the land of the UP.
You haven't spent much time driving in CT, have you?
Now that's an interesting biology class!
I was driving in Boston a couple of weekends ago and was "impressed" by the aggressiveness of the drivers. But as I inched along I realized that to get anywhere you have to stick your nose out into traffic to force your way in. If you drive like the natives, it all seems to work. People were not obnoxious about letting people in line, at least in most cases. It's kind of like driving amongst big rigs on the interstate in hilly locales -- if you anticipate that trucks will crawl up hill and fly down hill and adjust accordingly, you can have a pleasant experience driving.
Yet another bailout! When will Obama and Pelosi and Reid stop the madness?
Now days, they say, "Would you like me to refresh your cocktail, Sir?"
You've got two unnecessary words at the end of that sentence, you know.
And Connecticut and Rhode Island aren't really in New England. ####### flatlanders.
Connecticut? Isn't that far enough south to have been part of the Confederacy?
A: You can look across the river and see Vermont.
Q: Why doesn't Maine float away into the ocean?
A: Because New Hampshire sucks.
This is a great thread.
I really ought to say that I'm generally ambivalent about California. Nothing out there seems to have a sense of history like New York does, but then again Oberlin, Ohio had a sense of history, but that didn't prevent me from thinking that Ohio sucks ass.
What a ######## state. Whenever anybody's parents came out to visit, it was a given that they would go to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, because there was ####-all else to do around there. And whoever decided to put a college in the middle of a swamp by the Great Lakes must have had some serious masochistic tendencies. It was freezing until May, at which point, for the last two weeks of school, we were suddenly swarmed by mosquitoes spawned in vast cesspools of lukewarm mud.
And if the mosquitoes weren't bad enough, the hippies were worse. Though at least some of the crunchier girls would occasionally get naked in the quad as some sort of social statement.
This fairly describes the intrastate relationship of Northern and Southern California.
Precisely. Northern Californians will stop at nothing to proclaim their hatred of all things Southern Californian. Southern Californians think Northern California is a pretty nice place to visit, if they think about it at all.
I concur. And would like to add that people in Colorado SUCK at merging, it's pretty pathetic to watch. Is the whole 'zipper-merge' thing just not taught when going from 3 lanes to 2?
So were my father's parents (who were from, of course, Alabama, where to my regret I also find myself these days, having exiled myself here some 9 years ago from my native Arkansas, which of course is pretty much the pinnacle of civilization, no matter what those rapscallions in Texas might think). He died a few days before I turned 8 & was hardly ever around before that, so I don't know if he'd ever had a tail or not. AFAIK, I never did.
Me neither. I also can't really whistle & am not very good at snapping my fingers, either. I think there's a decent channce I'm some sort of space alien.
I can ride a bike and snap my fingers just fine. But as for whistling, I'm good at the "whistling a tune" kind of whistling, but can't whistle loud to save my life.
The other crucial skill I never learned was blowing a bubble with bubble gum. Can't do it for sh!t.
Bend has become a South Park parody. Go for the golf; stay to grow old and die.
That sums up San Diego versus Los Angeles also. SD vilifies Los Angeles while Los Angeles regards SD as a sleepy, but clean suburb of Tijuana that has some nice golf courses.
This cracks me up as an east coaster who has been to both places. San Diego is one of the nicest places in the country, and L.A. is a hellhole you couldn't pay me enough money to live in.
And besides, you can't seriously be considered a real American city if you don't have a NFL team.
I think this view of LA vis a vis SD is dated, although it is still out there among older LA residents.
I have lived in both places (SD is now home) and like both.
I can only whistle while sucking air in instead of blowing out. From what I understand this is not the normal way of doing it.
I'd also totally agree with Steve's description of the SoCal/NoCal bit. It's hella lame.
I was at a wedding in Virginia just the other day and amused the locals to no end with my ranting about Southern California and its immense lack of use to the world at large. Why don't you arid anchors on humanity realize your awfulness and just fall into the ocean already?
San Diego is a very nice place to visit -- even a nice place for vanilla people to live. However, SD is off the beaten track, and from the Los Angeleons' perspective, a place where one has never made it, or one goes to be forgotten.
>>>And besides, you can't seriously be considered a real American city if you don't have a NFL team.<<<
Right -- you are not a real American unless you are willing to bend over and take it when billionaires try to extort money from you for stadia. Los Angeles doesn't need the NFL.
This is all part of the government conspiracy to convince people that South Dakota is anything other than a false front for a giant military institution. Think about it. Do you have any relatives in South Dakota? Have you ever been to South Dakota? Do you know any famous people from South Dakota? It's all lies, I tell you.
louisianians just get sick and tired of texas' patronizing attitude towards louisiana and anything else that isn't texas. southern louisianians also note that northern louisianians tend to walk and talk like texans and resent their inability to deal with their inferiority complex.
my contribution to the intersate rivalry joke album:
what's the difference between a coonass* and a dumbass?
the sabine river.
*coonass being a term cajuns use for each other the way african-americans call each other the 'n' word when they are alone together.
all of which probably says more about me than interstate rivalries. oh well.
bingo on the stuff about norcal vs. socal. everybody i know in L.A. loves to visit San Fran. everybody i knew in san fran looked at me like i was crazy when i told them i was moving from santa rosa (sonoma county) to L.A. back in '06.
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