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Tuesday, November 08, 2011

The Miami Herald: Marlins Talking to Jose Reyes

  The Marlins are so enamored with All-Star shortstop Jose Reyes that they were in contact with the player at 12:01 a.m. Thursday, the moment the free agent signing period could begin. A contingent of high-ranking front office executives for the Marlins were spotted at Miami International Airport on Wednesday headed for New York, where Reyes’ agent, Peter Greenberg, keeps his offices.

    If the Marlins were able to sign the Mets shortstop, it would necessitate a position change for Hanley Ramirez, something he said in September that he would welcome and accept. “It would be nice to play next to him,” Ramirez said at the time. “He’s an energy guy.”

%@&*%$ me.

Arbitol Dijaler Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:04 AM | 35 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: mets, miami

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   1. Arbitol Dijaler Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:12 AM (#3988316)
I can't believe this is happening. Every time you think this franchise can't get any worse.
   2. PreservedFish Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:22 AM (#3988322)
This would infuriate me.

Also, the Marlins were supposedly extra-motivated to defeat the Mets on the last weekends of 2007 and 2008 because of their hatred for Jose Reyes. WTF.
   3. Banta Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:22 AM (#3988323)
God, if Reyes signs with the Marlins, combined with all the other crazy stuff that the Marlins are up to, I might just switch allegiances.
   4. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:29 AM (#3988326)
The Marlins? You would think if a divisional rival were to steal Reyes it would be the Braves with their giant sucking hole of despair they have at short. But of course not, it's the f'ing Marlins.
   5. Mark Armour Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:34 AM (#3988330)
After their gruesome eight-season World Championship drought, the Marlins clearly mean business.
   6. TerpNats Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:36 AM (#3988332)
Reyes and Ramirez would be the Bizarro world's ARod and Jeter.
   7. Lassus Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:45 AM (#3988336)
Also, the Marlins were supposedly extra-motivated to defeat the Mets on the last weekends of 2007 and 2008 because of their hatred for Jose Reyes. WTF.

Always destroy the enemy from within, grasshopper.

I have no idea how I feel about this. It seems pretty likely we're losing Jose to somebody. Honestly, based on nothing, it kinda seems like he wants to leave, maybe?

But does Jose really want to play for the spinning loon of crazy that is Ozzie Guillen? Not that he's not good to his players, but isn't he prone to turning on them at a moment's notice, also?
   8. Sam M. Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:47 AM (#3988338)
No, you see this is just letting the other clubs set the market. That is why the Mets didn't make an offer during the time they had exclusive negotiating rights. They are savvy enough to know that other teams won't go anywhere near the price range and years that Jose wants, so the market will come to them. There's no enthusiasm for Reyes . . . no team jumping right in, feet first as soon as they can to wow Reyes and take this home.

Nope. None of that.

And of course, not making an offer has nothing to do with laying off staff. Nothing to do with chasing away the minority investor who would have infused cash, nothing to do with not being able to pay back Selig. Nothing to do with sudden trade rumors surrounding David Wright, nothing to do with being unwilling to say a word about the mysterious new minority investors who have a strange invisibility cloak, so effective that even the Wilpons' house organ, the Daily News, can't cite "unnamed sources" who can actually state, unequivocally, that a single person has actually ponied up any actual, you know, dollars as part of this "Get Fred Less Poor Quick" scheme.

Here's my test:

If Reyes signs with some other club for five or fewer years, and less than $17.5M/year, I will be so furious it will be Kazmir-like. There will be nothing to convince me that the Mets shouldn't have signed him to that deal, and that the poverty of the Wilpons is the only explanation.

If Reyes signs with some other club for six years, and for no more than $100M, or for five years but for more than $17.5M/year, then it's in a gray area where you could reasonably argue that maybe -- maybe -- the Mets made a baseball decision that he wasn't worth that contract. I'll still be deeply skeptical, but I wouldn't be able to say 100% that it was just their finances that chased Reyes out of town.

If Reyes signs for more than six years, or for six years at more than $100M, then I'd have to be OK with the Mets letting him go. I'd still be angry they didn't even make an effort, but the market will have gone beyond what I think they should have paid.

We shall see.
   9. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 08, 2011 at 03:47 AM (#3988360)
Every indication this winter is that the Marlins are going to spend big with at least one and maybe two top FA signings.

I expect after they win it all in 2012, they'll trade Reyes to the Yankees for Banuelos, Betances and Montero.
   10. The District Attorney Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:10 AM (#3988369)
Every indication this winter is that the Marlins are going to spend big with at least one and maybe two top FA signings.
I'll believe this when I see it. They haven't done that in quite a while. And if they were going to do it, it doesn't make sense to do it for a SS. Even if Hanley is not a great fielder, he is adequate enough to make him a lot more valuable at SS than he is elsewhere. I also would not particularly trust him when he promises to be a good teammate and happily move to accommodate the new guy. (My main point, however, is that I simply don't see the Marlins laying out this much money.)
   11. Benji Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:23 AM (#3988377)
Sam, I wish I could believe that. It just seems like they're gonna do to Reyes what they did with Strawberry. Every demand, no matter what it was, was "unacceptable". I wish that Goldschmidt had told the press Darryl wanted to pay the Mets $10 million a year to stay, just to see how they would refuse that.

Also, it is strange that the Braves aren't in on this. Gonzalez has killed them two years in a row.
   12. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:23 AM (#3988378)
They have a new stadium and want to make a big splash. Well, a bigger splash than this.
   13. Dr. Vaux Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:44 AM (#3988405)
I don't think the Braves sign free-agents anymore.
   14. Sam M. Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:12 AM (#3988414)
Sam, I wish I could believe that. It just seems like they're gonna do to Reyes what they did with Strawberry. Every demand, no matter what it was, was "unacceptable".


Oh, I'm with you, Benji. I was being snarky about Alderson's statements that the Mets would see where the market was and have other teams establish it before engaging with Reyes. I think that's all just a completely implausible cover for the truth of why they didn't and couldn't make even an offer to Reyes: they have no money, and it's all part of the pattern. The next sound you hear, after Reyes gets an offer or two, will be the sound of the Mets saying, "Too rich for our blood. Sorry."
   15. AJMcCringleberry Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:21 AM (#3988417)
Please not the Marlins.
   16. Walt Davis Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:35 AM (#3988423)
C'mon Sam ...

if the Marlins sign Reyes and have that, umm, shall we say, "flamboyant" HR display linked in #12, you're gonna switch allegiance aren't you? :-)
   17. Honkie Kong Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:52 AM (#3988424)
Also, it is strange that the Braves aren't in on this. Gonzalez has killed them two years in a row

Risk because of injuries, and they have invested heavily in SSs in the draft.
Pastornicky ( from the Yunel trade ) in AAA. Simmons in High A.
cpl of prospects in the low minors.
They already moved Lipka to cf and Salcedo to 3B.

They are hoping one of those pans out. Potentially someone like Hicks could just have a serviceable year with the bat to be average ( he is good defensively ).
   18. bookbook Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:59 AM (#3988426)
Well, as a Mariners fan I feel like I have some experience to bring to bear.

When A-Rod, that evil fiend, turned tail and abandoned the Mariners, we had offered him a solid 3-year-60 million dollar contract. I still have no idea why he didn't sign with us, and to this day, I boo lustily as his disloyalty in leaving.
   19. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: November 08, 2011 at 08:52 AM (#3988433)

They are hoping one of those pans out. Potentially someone like Hicks could just have a serviceable year with the bat to be average ( he is good defensively ).


Brandon Hicks? He should be about Plan J. Their not really going to let Pastornicky's fluky batting average from last season trick them into giving him the job are they? To pass on Reyes because Tyler Pastornicky is tapping down the door is just...ah screw it, I shouldn't care about crap like this anymore.
   20. Arbitol Dijaler Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:18 PM (#3988447)
Wait, I thought Plan J was something else.
   21. bobm Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:50 PM (#3988454)
Even if the cash-strapped Mets mat be unwilling to make a real offer, there are two sides to this story. Maybe Reyes is pessimistic and wants out of Flushing, even if we don't think he's taking his talents to South Beach.
   22. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: November 08, 2011 at 02:55 PM (#3988456)
Big Marlins free agent signings of the last 10 years:


Clay Hensley
Jose Veras
Jorge Sosa
John Buck
Javier Vazquez
Greg Dobbs
   23. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: November 08, 2011 at 03:01 PM (#3988457)
Wait, I thought Plan J was something else.
That's Option J
   24. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: November 08, 2011 at 03:09 PM (#3988462)
Big Marlins free agent signings since 2004:

Damion Easley
Lenny Harris
Darren Oliver
Armando Benitez
Todd Jones
Brian Moehler
Al Leiter
Antonio Alfonseca
Carlos Delgado
Alfredo Amezaga
Wes Helms
Miguel Olivo
Wes Obermueller
Aaron Boone
Justin Miller
Wes Helms again
Doug Waechter
Jorge Cantu
Mark Hendrickson
Luis Gonzalez
Brian Sanches
Clay Hensley
Jose Veras
Jorge Sosa
John Buck
Javier Vazquez
Greg Dobbs

I see a bunch of relievers, a bunch of guys who were washed up and about to retire, Greg Dobbs, Wes Helms, a couple fairly good and cheap catchers, and Carlos Delgado. Based on that precedent it looks like Hanley will sign a long-term deal and then one year later be traded for the modern equivalent of Mike Jacobs and Yusmeiro Petit.
   25. Sam M. Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:16 PM (#3988499)
Even if the cash-strapped Mets mat be unwilling to make a real offer, there are two sides to this story. Maybe Reyes is pessimistic and wants out of Flushing, even if we don't think he's taking his talents to South Beach.


I don't believe Reyes "wants out of Flushing" for a second, but even if he does it is up to the Mets to put that possibility to the test by making a reasonable offer that reflects his value on the field and at the gate. If they don't (as I think it's now fairly obvious they won't), it should lay bare the truth of their finances to anyone who wants to bother to look.

And if he does want out of Flushing because the Mets are not competitive, that is just a less direct way of blaming the Wilpons' financial and organizational mess for his departure. The mismanagement of the team both financially and otherwise is why the team is such a mess, and if that is why Reyes wants to leave, and why the Mets can't afford to pay the going rate for a FA of his caliber, it all amounts to the same thing. They can't afford him. He doesn't want to play for a team in disarray.

Every road leads back to the same point.
   26. Arbitol Dijaler Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:31 PM (#3988511)
We should organize a boycott if he leaves without a serious offer from Wilpon - squeeze that old crook out of here.
   27. billyshears Posted: November 08, 2011 at 04:35 PM (#3988514)
This would really suck. So, of course, it will likely happen. The Marlins first round pick is protected, which is super.
   28. bobm Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:10 PM (#3988546)
And if he does want out of Flushing because the Mets are not competitive, that is just a less direct way of blaming the Wilpons' financial and organizational mess for his departure.


The deck chairs are more comfortable than the lifeboats, but what's the best choice aboard the Titanic?
   29. thetailor Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:21 PM (#3988554)
@12: Thank you SO much for posting the link to that thread. It's solid gold, and I would have otherwise missed it.

As far as the idea that Reyes "wants out of Flushing," I couldn't disagree more. Reyes has a lot of valid reasons to want to leave the Mets (non-competitive team, horrible management, no hope for the future in sight) but he seems to be one of the MORE grounded players in the league. He's constantly talking about his family and how he likes it here and he seems less likely than most to be happy with a big move.
   30. Russ Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:22 PM (#3988555)
We should organize a boycott if he leaves without a serious offer from Wilpon - squeeze that old crook out of here.



You could always hope that he and Judy get divorced.
   31. thetailor Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:23 PM (#3988557)
This is an older article, but its things like this that make me think the above about Jose:

In early August, he signed a four-year contract extension worth $23.25 million, but he plans on keeping the same living arrangement he's had while earning $401,500 this season. He shares a three-bedroom apartment in Bayside, Queens, not far from Shea Stadium, with his father, mother Rosa, girlfriend of three years Katerine, and the couple's two daughters, 20-month-old Katerine and 2-month-old Ashley. And when José's sister, Miosoti, and their Uncle Wilfredo visit from the Dominican, there's room for them, too.

For Reyes, nearly every day of a homestand is the same. He sleeps until 1 p.m. (unless there's a day game), often with little Katerine in the crook of his arm. Once awake, he's as fidgety in the house as he is in the dugout. "Oh boy," he says, "I still make my mama crazy." He lunches on rice and beans and fried chicken or whatever comida Rosa cooks up. Then he plays with the girls for an hour before making the eight-minute drive to the ballpark. Link
   32. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: November 08, 2011 at 05:52 PM (#3988580)
We should organize a boycott if he leaves without a serious offer from Wilpon


You're in luck - there's a much more successful and better-managed team on the other side of town!
   33. base ball chick Posted: November 08, 2011 at 06:54 PM (#3988632)
nelson doubleday must be thanking his lucky stars HE got the money and run
   34. thetailor Posted: November 08, 2011 at 09:06 PM (#3988757)
Actually, Doubleday got screwed in his deal. The Wilpons are really, really, really good.
   35. Gotham Dave Posted: November 08, 2011 at 09:22 PM (#3988769)
Reyes and Ramirez would be the Bizarro world's ARod and Jeter.
Kind of funny that clubhouse cancer Ramirez is willing to move for a better fielder but The Greatest Hero in American History wasn't.

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