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Monday, October 31, 2011

Twitter: Indians acquire Derek Lowe

The offseason moves start?

Creditable sources inform me that #Braves P Derek Lowe is being informed as we speak that he has been traded to the #Indians

Mike Emeigh Posted: October 31, 2011 at 04:47 PM | 57 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: braves, indians

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   1. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 04:54 PM (#3983444)
Indians acquire Derek Lowe

on PURPOSE??!!
   2. Bret Sabermatrician Posted: October 31, 2011 at 04:59 PM (#3983449)
I feel like I should have a celebratory drink
   3. Shooty would run in but these bone spurs hurt! Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:00 PM (#3983451)
How much are the Braves eating? Cash, I mean... It'll be interesting how it shakes out.
   4. spike Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:01 PM (#3983452)
Olney says Indians are paying 5M.
   5. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:05 PM (#3983455)
Olney says Indians are paying 5M.

That sounds creditable.
   6. CFBF Rides The Zombie Ice Dragon Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:06 PM (#3983457)
Forgive me for going back to that hoariest of baseball cliches, but if this isn't your classic "Nice trade. Who'd we get?" news, I don't know what is.
   7. PreservedFish Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:08 PM (#3983461)
Credible sources inform me that Derek Lowe will not put forth a creditable effort for the Indians this season.
   8. Mike Emeigh Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:10 PM (#3983464)
Trade is for a minor league pitcher, with Braves covering $10 million of Lowe's contract, per SI.com.

-- MWE
   9. Kyle S at work Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:12 PM (#3983469)
My reaction was the same as #6. It's $5 million more we can use toward free agents next season.
   10. Shooty would run in but these bone spurs hurt! Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:13 PM (#3983472)
Not a bad gamble for the Indians. Seems like a good deal for both teams.
   11. there isn't anything to do in buffalo but 57i66135 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:18 PM (#3983477)
holy #### that indians rotation could be fierce. carmona, jimenez, masterson, and lowe are 4 of the most extreme sinkerballers in MLB, plus the first 3 can all get their sinker up into the mid-high 90s. that could be a really tough staff if the bullpen can do anything approaching what they did this year.
   12. Mike Emeigh Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:22 PM (#3983481)
It's $5 million more we can use toward free agents next season.


Or $5 million more in Liberty Media's pockets. I can't see the Braves being active in the free agent market; they aren't going to make a play for Reyes and there's really not much else out there that can help where they need help.

-- MWE
   13. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:24 PM (#3983483)
I thought he might be headed to Detroit - isn't he a Michigan kid?

Anyway, seems like a win-win.
   14. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:25 PM (#3983487)
If Choo and Sizemore are healthy, Cleveland has a nice core with Santana and Asdrubal. A full season of Jimenez at his career average will be a good boost. And truly, if Lowe regresses to anywhere near his career average, or even splits the difference between his 2010 and 2011 seasons, he's better than everyone the Tribe was running out last year except for Masterson.
   15. RJ in TO Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:26 PM (#3983488)
holy #### that indians rotation could be fierce. carmona, jimenez, masterson, and lowe are 4 of the most extreme sinkerballers in MLB, plus the first 3 can all get their sinker up into the mid-high 90s. that could be a really tough staff if the bullpen can do anything approaching what they did this year.

Of course, of those four, Lowe and Carmona stank like sun-dried ass all season, and Jimenez was generally brutal in his time with the Indians.

Yeah, that rotation could work out well for the Indians, but there's not a lot of reason to expect it to actually do so.
   16. JJ1986 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:27 PM (#3983491)
If Choo and Sizemore are healthy, Cleveland has a nice core with Santana and Asdrubal.


They declined Sizemore's option this morning. He's a free agent.
   17. ColonelTom Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:29 PM (#3983494)
4 of the most extreme sinkerballers in MLB

They're an odd team to be doing this, at least from the defensive numbers, which were pretty ugly last year. I wonder if they're planning to shift Asdrubal Cabrera to 2B or 3B and bring in a defensive upgrade at shortstop. That would obviously mean moving Kipnis or Chisenhall, though. I'm sure either of those guys would draw significant interest. Maybe they could move Chisenhall for a corner outfielder - I could see the Phils trying to put together something around Chisenhall and Domonic Brown.
   18. Shooty would run in but these bone spurs hurt! Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:30 PM (#3983495)
They declined Sizemore's option this morning. He's a free agent.

Anyone want to wager a guess? I can see him being anything from an NRI to getting stupid money.
   19. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:34 PM (#3983501)
Too bad for Cleveland. Lowe is a decent pitcher, but a horseshit guy. It'd suck to have to watch someone like that wear your favorite team's uniform.
   20. RJ in TO Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:34 PM (#3983502)
Anyone want to wager a guess? I can see him being anything from an NRI to getting stupid money.

1 year, $2M guaranteed, and a ton of bonuses based on PA or time on the active roster, potentially bringing the total value to between $8-10M.
   21. Swedish Chef Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:35 PM (#3983503)
How Lowe can you go?
   22. Tripon Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:39 PM (#3983509)

They're an odd team to be doing this, at least from the defensive numbers, which were pretty ugly last year. I wonder if they're planning to shift Asdrubal Cabrera to 2B or 3B and bring in a defensive upgrade at shortstop. That would obviously mean moving Kipnis or Chisenhall, though. I'm sure either of those guys would draw significant interest. Maybe they could move Chisenhall for a corner outfielder - I could see the Phils trying to put together something around Chisenhall and Domonic Brown.


I don't see the Phillies doing this, maybe the Dodgers can get on this, and do an Ethier for Chisenhall trade.
   23. Jose is an Absurd Force of Nature Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:43 PM (#3983510)
Anyone want to wager a guess? I can see him being anything from an NRI to getting stupid money.


I'm thinking something on the order of what the Red Sox gave Adrian Beltre prior to 2010 though maybe with a bit more protection for the team. For some reason I have Toronto in my head.
   24. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:43 PM (#3983512)
That would obviously mean moving Kipnis or Chisenhall, though. I'm sure either of those guys would draw significant interest. Maybe they could move Chisenhall for a corner outfielder - I could see the Phils trying to put together something around Chisenhall and Domonic Brown.


There is now an opening in CF, where Kipnis played in college.
   25. there isn't anything to do in buffalo but 57i66135 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:43 PM (#3983513)
Maybe they could move Chisenhall for a corner outfielder - I could see the Phils trying to put together something around Chisenhall and Domonic Brown.
i think the phillies are going to hold onto brown, but pulling chisenhall and a reliever could be very attractive for them.
   26. JJ1986 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:44 PM (#3983515)
I'll bet Sizemore ends up on the North side of Chicago.
   27. Cris E Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:44 PM (#3983516)
I expect to see Sizemore coming back to the Indians at a much more reasonable rate.
   28. Randy Jones Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:45 PM (#3983517)
I would think Sizemore could probably get a short guaranteed deal somewhere, with a bunch of options that vest with playing time.
   29. RJ in TO Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:46 PM (#3983518)
I'm thinking something on the order of what the Red Sox gave Adrian Beltre prior to 2010 though maybe with a bit more protection for the team. For some reason I have Toronto in my head.

The Jays have Bautista, Thames, and Rasmus in the OF, with Rajai Davis and possibly Snider as the back ups. It's possible, but it seems unlikely that they'd be interested in Sizemore.
   30. Mike Emeigh Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:48 PM (#3983522)
Pitcher going to Atlanta is LHP Chris Jones. Money pitch is the curve, average stuff otherwise. Probably a LOOGY at best.

-- MWE
   31. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:54 PM (#3983532)
Pitcher going to Atlanta is LHP Chris Jones. Money pitch is the curve, average stuff otherwise. Probably a LOOGY at best.


He's R5 eligible - I'm surprised they didn't call it a PTBNL until after the draft's over. Maybe ATL is planning to add him to their 40-man?
   32. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:57 PM (#3983535)
Or $5 million more in Liberty Media's pockets. I can't see the Braves being active in the free agent market; they aren't going to make a play for Reyes and there's really not much else out there that can help where they need help.


I agree that Atlanta is a dark horse in the Reyes games, but I wouldn't say they're completely out of play. Assuming they don't cut their $101 mil payroll from 2011, they now have $20 mil to spend (Lowe -5, Kawakami -7, McLouth -6.5, a few mil here and there from bullpen arms...) I doubt they put all $20 of that into the Reyes basket, but they have the lee way to play in that game if they like. Long term they have Chipper coming off the books in 2012, which frees up another $15 mil there...)

With that said, I expect a stop gap SS and a play for Josh Willingham, with Prado moving back to super-sub.
   33. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2011 at 05:59 PM (#3983539)
1 year, $2M guaranteed, and a ton of bonuses based on PA or time on the active roster, potentially bringing the total value to between $8-10M.


I can't imagine that it's this low. Every team in baseball would be interested for that price.
   34. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:01 PM (#3983541)
I predict that the Pirates will sign Sizemore to a 3-year contract, he will play zero games due to injuries, and they'll use that as an excuse to never sign another free agent for the next decade.
   35. there isn't anything to do in buffalo but 57i66135 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:04 PM (#3983543)
I can't imagine that it's this low. Every team in baseball would be interested for that price.
he hit .220 this year. he hit .211 in 2010.


personally, i wouldn't touch him at this point.
   36. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:12 PM (#3983553)
I predict that the Pirates will sign Sizemore to a 3-year contract, he will play zero games due to injuries, and they'll use that as an excuse to never sign another free agent for the next decade.


That'd be a terrible idea, but given the amount of stupid #### they've done over the last month or so, I really can't rule it out.
   37. Shooty would run in but these bone spurs hurt! Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:13 PM (#3983554)
he hit .220 this year. he hit .211 in 2010.


personally, i wouldn't touch him at this point.


He has been absolutely terrible. I won't pretend to have any idea what kind of contract he'll get.
   38. bads85 Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:26 PM (#3983570)
Well, at least Pomeranz wasn't the minor league pitcher traded by the Indians.
   39. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: October 31, 2011 at 06:28 PM (#3983571)
Sizemore has only played 100 games total in the last two years. Anyway, his value isn't in his BA, it's in his power from a centerfielder.
   40. The Ghost of Sox Fans Past Posted: October 31, 2011 at 07:09 PM (#3983601)
It's part of a plot for the Indians to get every player that the Mariners traded away for squat when they were young and cheap. Next, they'll acquire Jason Varitek.
   41. McCoy Posted: October 31, 2011 at 07:17 PM (#3983609)
I would imagine sun-dried ass doesn't really stink. Perhaps if it was humid fresh ass it would stink but not sun-dried.
   42. Don Lock Posted: October 31, 2011 at 07:19 PM (#3983614)
Thought the headline said Indians acquire Derrek Lee. They should sign him too, just to confuse headline writers and readers.

And during the season...ground ball to the right side... Derek Lowe tosses to Derrek Lee.
   43. Dan Posted: October 31, 2011 at 07:21 PM (#3983619)
And during the season...ground ball to the right side... Derek Lowe tosses to Derrek Lee.


Kind of like the Braves in the 2nd half of 2010?
   44. CFBF Rides The Zombie Ice Dragon Posted: October 31, 2011 at 09:57 PM (#3983747)
I'll say this for Derek: he didn't do much of anything for Atlanta, but he was a legitimate stud in September 2010 and his one LDS start that October. So there's that.
   45. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: October 31, 2011 at 10:46 PM (#3983784)
I'll say this for Derek: he didn't do much of anything for Atlanta, but he was a legitimate stud in September 2010 and his one LDS start that October. So there's that.


It's easy to harsh on Derek Lowe at this point, but the fact of the matter is he did exactly what Atlanta asked him to do. He took the ball and made his starts and, in a couple of runs, was brilliant. He was horrific in the second half of 2011 - just gape-jaw bad - and I suspect strongly that he is done. But he took the mound and went his 5-6 innings, and he stopped the bleeding for the Braves in 2009. That's worth what they paid for him, and it's only due to the fact that they developed 600 starting pitching prospects in 2 weeks last year that they have the luxury of paying him to pitch elsewhere.
   46. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 10:56 PM (#3983792)
It's easy to harsh on Derek Lowe at this point, but the fact of the matter is he did exactly what Atlanta asked him to do.


Why on earth did they ask him to go out drag racing while drunk? Were they just nostalgic for Furcal?
   47. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: October 31, 2011 at 10:57 PM (#3983793)
But he took the mound and went his 5-6 innings, and he stopped the bleeding for the Braves in 2009. That's worth what they paid for him, and it's only due to the fact that they developed 600 starting pitching prospects in 2 weeks last year that they have the luxury of paying him to pitch elsewhere.

575 innings of 86 ERA+ ball is worth $45 million (plus the $10 million they'll flush this year, so he won't pitch for them)? That's some Frank Wren math right there.

It's easy to harsh on Derek Lowe at this point, but the fact of the matter is he did exactly what Atlanta asked him to do.

If they paid him $15 million a year to suck (yes, I understand he sucked consistently every fifth day), maybe they should have asked him from something else.
   48. The Interdimensional Council of Rickey!'s Posted: October 31, 2011 at 11:01 PM (#3983799)
That's some Frank Wren math right there.


Your continued crusade against one of the best GMs in the game is noted. Mostly for its insanity, but noted nonetheless.
   49. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: October 31, 2011 at 11:04 PM (#3983802)
#48 - Good for you, low expectations are a blessing and a curse.

Because you would have to be out for Frank's head to conclude that he wildly overspent on Derek Lowe. The fact that he spent two solid seasons trying to give the contract away might have been a clue.
   50. AJMcCringleberry Posted: October 31, 2011 at 11:26 PM (#3983810)
Why on earth did they ask him to go out drag racing while drunk?

The charges were dropped because of lack of evidence.
   51. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: October 31, 2011 at 11:47 PM (#3983824)
The charges were dropped because of lack of evidence.


Doesn't mean he didn't do it.
   52. Sweatpants Posted: November 01, 2011 at 01:28 AM (#3983908)
575 innings of 86 ERA+ ball is worth $45 million (plus the $10 million they'll flush this year, so he won't pitch for them)? That's some Frank Wren math right there.
Lowe was bad in two out of his three seasons with the team. The signing was definitely a bust, considering that he was signed to be an ace or at worst a #2 (three Opening Day starts in three seasons!). He was abysmal in 2011; the last Brave to qualify for the ERA title with an ERA+ as bad as Lowe's was this season did it in Milwaukee. He never lost or even came close to losing his starting job, which would have been less distressing had the team not already given the gulag treatment to Kenshin Kawakami in 2010. The only two Braves whose departure I've actively awaited are Lowe and Jeff Francoeur.

That said, I don't think that Frank Wren is a bad GM. They've been running out consistently good teams. In the past year, he's made two big trades to patch up gaping holes (Dan Uggla was supposed to patch up left field in a roundabout way), and I can't ask for much more than that. What horrible things has he done?
   53. Kyle S at work Posted: November 01, 2011 at 01:45 PM (#3984118)
Sam, we don't have that much money to spend - you are forgetting arb raises to Jurrjens, Hanson and others. I read that with this move, we now look like we will be about even on payroll this year vs last year.

I think Prado is either getting traded or demoted. Wren isn't stupid, and there aren't really other places you can improve the team other than SS (which is going to be staffed with a placeholder for Simmons/Pastornicky).
   54. Bourbon Samurai, what price fettucine? Posted: November 01, 2011 at 02:28 PM (#3984144)
Sizemore will be a National for an innapropriately large amount of money.
   55. The Ghost of Sox Fans Past Posted: November 01, 2011 at 06:22 PM (#3984411)
575 innings of 86 ERA+ ball is worth $45 million (plus the $10 million they'll flush this year, so he won't pitch for them)? That's some Frank Wren Scott Boras math right there.

Fixed.
   56. hokieneer Posted: November 01, 2011 at 06:53 PM (#3984440)
That's some Frank Wren Scott Boras math right there.


Boras didn't cut the check(s).
   57. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: November 01, 2011 at 07:14 PM (#3984454)
Sizemore signs with the A's for $3M plus incentives and a 2013 team option for $8M. On day 3 in Arizona he trips over a sprinkler head, breaks his elbow catching his fall, and is out until August, when he comes back, goes 0-for-26 to start the season, catches a cleat in the football-decimated outfield, tears his ACL, and never plays baseball again.

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