This is the Mets and their track record of medical evaluations is not one to be envied. But this almost has to be true, doesn't it? Just based on the fact that Lackey is a pitcher.

Definition:
Durable pitcher: A pitcher who has not yet been injured.

I guess Bay is about to lose both his legs.

Especially a pitcher who wasn't able to start either '08 or '09 on time due to elbow issues. (Or was it forearm?)

//// Clearly WEEI is acting here as a media mouthpiece for the Red Sox front office. Take this as a sign that the Red Sox are trying to unload John Lackey, and are looking to tear down public opinion of Lackey so they'll look good when they drop them.

“I was not concerned,” Minaya said. “We had seen him in the National League. We didn’t see what people were talking about. I can understand it. When you play left field at Fenway Park it’s not easy. Guys can look back at that left field wall. “

Translation: "I scouted him when he was a Padre, and he was a fine defender."

AROM is right, a position player at 4 years is much safer than a pitcher for 5. Inherent in their positions.

So what was the deal with the 2007 season for Bay? Was he playing through a well known injury?

Red Sox viewed Lackey as a better player than Bay.

And it's not WEEI that's a Sox mouthpiece - the Red Sox org doesn't like them, by most accounts - I had thought that was part of the reason why 'EEI lost the radio contract. I tend to doubt this story's going to show up on NESN, but maybe I'm wrong.

Translation: "I scouted him when he was a Padre, and he was a fine defender."

This. A thousand times this.

When you play left field at Fenway Park it’s not easy. Guys can look back at that left field wall

What does that second sentence even mean?

And it's not WEEI that's a Sox mouthpiece - the Red Sox org doesn't like them, by most accounts - I had thought that was part of the reason why 'EEI lost the radio contract. I tend to doubt this story's going to show up on NESN, but maybe I'm wrong.

my post was a joke

I guess Bay is about to lose both his legs.

My money's on scurvy.

Well, at least their money is off the bob-tail nag.

What does that second sentence even mean?

It's quite literal. Omar discovered that Jason Bay will now be able to use his eyes while fielding like he did while in the NL, so his defense should be OK.

What does that second sentence even mean?

It means that because the left field wall at Fenway is so unusual, left fielders don't have their focus entirely on catching the ball because they're not sure where the wall is. This is true mostly for visiting left fielders, but the Red Sox ones take a while to get used to it as well. Geez, stop acting like every sentence Minaya says is evidence of undiagnosed dementia.

I predict Wegener's granulomatosis, or possibly Guillain-Barré syndrome.

I predict Wegener's granulomatosis, or possibly Guillain-Barré syndrome.

Fournier's gangrene, all the way.

Geez, stop acting like every sentence Minaya says is evidence of undiagnosed dementia.

I'm not, I was geniunely baffled as to what that sentence means. Your explanation makes sense, but Minaya's word choice was poor, at best.

Red Sox viewed Lackey as a better player than Bay.

Did they? Or did they view Lackey as a better fit for their 2010 roster than Bay?

every sentence Minaya says is evidence of undiagnosed dementia.

THIS may actually be correct-He did overbid against himself for Oliver Perez, somehow think that Livan would be good for all of 2009, that El Duque would be able to pitch an entire year in 06, or that PEDRO would be able to stay healthy for FOUR years in NY wi the Medical staff headed by Major Burns in charge(Olde M.A.S.H. reference for you youngsters out there)

Fournier's gangrene, all the way.

Scrofula!

Fournier's gangrene, all the way.

Complicated with the Grippe.

As a Red Sox fan, this makes me feel much better about the Lackey signing, and I'm not even kidding. I think that by now the Mets passing on a guy for health concerns is the best possible thing you would want to hear as a fan of that guy's team (either that or it'd be evidence that the guy in question is about to "literally fall off a cliff").

When you play left field at Fenway Park it’s not easy. Guys can look back at that left field wall

What does that second sentence even mean?

I took the second sentence to mean: "Guys can look BAD at that left field wall." It could have been a bad transcribing job, or just a mis-speak. I guess it could be "BACK", but that doesn't make too much sense, even with the explanation from OCD SS.

also, strictly, to look back at the wall they have to be running towards the infield...

What does that second sentence even mean?

"It's a monster!! I'm scared!!"

Scrofula!

The Mets are providing a fine public service. Rather than new med students thinking they or their patients have these exotic diseases they read about, they can apply this hypochondria to the Mets.

And, yes, your average flying Wallenda is a better health risk than an ML pitcher.

With Jose Reyes' thyroid issues, I'm starting to think the Mets are really the Springfield power plant All-Stars. Next week, Johan Santana will start squawking like a chicken, David Wright will fall into a bottomless pit, and K-Rod will suffer radiation poisoning. Jason Bay will spend the rest of the season rescuing women and their player pianos from burning buildings, and Jerry Manuel will kick Beltran off the team for not having that mole removed. The only guy who doesn't fall victim to some bizarre mishap will be the right fielder, Jeff Francoeur.

also, strictly, to look back at the wall they have to be running towards the infield...

or backtracking away from the infield

I'm not, I was geniunely baffled as to what that sentence means. Your explanation makes sense, but Minaya's word choice was poor, at best.

His meaning was obvious, unless you're looking for reasons to sh!t on the guy, which you shouldn't, because there are ample legitimate reasons to do so.

His meaning was obvious, unless you're looking for reasons to sh!t on the guy, which you shouldn't, because there are ample legitimate reasons to do so.

Jesus Christ, no it wasn't. I'm not on some Omar witch-hunt, I thought it was unclear. Because it's unclear.

David Wright will fall into a bottomless pit

It's the Springfield Myserty Spot! Not a bottomless pit

[5]

Translation: "I scouted him when he was a <strike>Padre</strike> Met, and he was a fine defender."

Fixed.

I also couldn't understand Minaya's comment about the wall.

His meaning was obvious, unless you're looking for reasons to sh!t on the guy, which you shouldn't, because there are ample legitimate reasons to do so.

Jesus Christ, no it wasn't. I'm not on some Omar witch-hunt, I thought it was unclear. Because it's unclear.

Don't let Freeboy bother you. He enjoys a steady diet of content-free posting and hassling people for no apparent reason.

“I was not concerned,” Minaya said. “We had seen him in the National League. We didn’t see what people were talking about...“

What's especially troubling about this is there's no mention--and I don't think the Mets FO ever mentions them--of fielding metrics. No balance suggested, such as, "we scouted him and combined our observations with our stats and... etc., etc." This isn't to say categorically that the Mets don't use such statistics, but if they do they clearly feel it's in their best interests to keep that hidden.

33. Omar'sBlackCloud Posted: March 12, 2010 at 09:17 PM (#3478364)
[ Ignored Comment ]

Lemme guess - thinks Omar expressed himself poorly?

Did they? Or did they view Lackey as a better fit for their 2010 roster than Bay?

Given that:

1. We're talking about 4-5 year, $14 mil deals

and

2. Bay was a better fit for their 2010 roster

I'm pretty sure you're mistaken about the motivation. Whether they are right is, of course, an entirely different question

my post was a joke

Thanks for filling in for me on that meme.

I think that it is very likely that the Red Sox made the valuation that Jason Bay was unlikely to be a very good player for more than another year or two. They could be wrong, but I like their risk aversion in his case. He's trending the wrong way.

I think that it is very likely that the Red Sox made the valuation that Jason Bay was unlikely to be a very good player for more than another year or two. They could be wrong, but I like their risk aversion in his case. He's trending the wrong way.

I agree, and that the Red Sox FO chose the pitcher who has started each of the last two years on the DL instead of the OFer who over the last five years has played 162, 159, 145, 155, then 151 games makes me think they must consider Bay either a tremendous injury risk going forward, or simply that he has much less of a chance of being worth his contract than does Lackey. I don't know that we have to believe the former--something none of us can do much more than guess at without access to Bay's medical records--in order to believe the latter. I think CHONE's latest has Bay as a 3 WAR player in 2010. A simple 1/2 win age regression yields 9 wins for Bay over the next four years (and ten wins over the next five), making him worth 9 * $3.5 million per win = $31.5 million. I think that at least as much as any injury risk is why the Red Sox stayed away from Bay. Under normal circumstances a healthy Bay doesn't come close to being worth the 4/66 or 5/82 the Mets are going to pay him.

At the same time 5/82.5 seems like a hell of a lot of money for John Lackey's age 31 through 35 seasons, though I suppose the injury clause knocks the total down by a few million.

It looks like CHONE tweaked Bay's projection to 3.7 for 2010. It's hardly science but if accurate that base adds another 2.8 wins to his four year total. Still not great but better, and it's not out of the question that Bay remains a 3 WAR hitter into his mid-30s. He's a hell of a hitter and kept his OPS above .900 even away from Fenway last year, fwiw.

Ah.

Manny's UZR improved quite a bit playing for the Dodgers. I wonder how much of that is due to moving away from Fenway.

So what was the deal with the 2007 season for Bay? Was he playing through a well known injury?

Yeah, he had a knee injury that year.