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Monday, September 03, 2007

XM MLB Chat: Mullen: Joe Borowski for Cy Young—-Buck Martinez said on XM 175

XM Radio: Enjoy commercial free music, original shows, the latest sports coverage…AND THEN DUNK YOUR HEAD IN A VAT OF SCORCHING COLEMAN CAMP FUEL!

On Friday morning’s (8/31) show on XM 175, Buck Martinez suggests names to consider for AL Cy Young this year, and Joe Borowski was on the list. He says Joe has given the Indians a great edge this year with “saves” in many tight games (this is true), acknowledges that in stats other than “saves,” he doesn’t look good, but…

“OH, THOSE “SAVES.” (Buck Martinez’ words).

...An Indian fan then emailed the XM show begging to differ with Buck’s idea for Joe Borowski for Cy Young. They read the email on the air with the Indian fan saying he gets acute stomach pains every time Borowski comes in the game. Buck says, well, I know he looks bad in other stats, but…

“OH, THOSE “SAVES.” (says Buck Martinez again.).

Repoz Posted: September 03, 2007 at 01:26 AM | 23 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: indians

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   1. jamcadbury Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:04 AM (#2509295)
I enjoyed Buck Martinez's commentary in Triple Play '98.
   2. bibigon Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:07 AM (#2509297)
Lets use this thread to debate Cy Young contenders at large, rather than:

1. Buck Martinez's understanding of why the save rule may not be perfect.

2. WPA.
   3. NJ in NY (Now with Big Girl!) Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:10 AM (#2509300)
I second bibigon. Wang is making a push to get himself another nice finish in the CY voting. No, I don't think he'll deserve it.
   4. smileyy Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:19 AM (#2509304)
I thought closers were supposed to win MVPs, not Cy Toungs.
   5. Daryn Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:24 AM (#2509308)
You basically have the eight contenders: Haren, Santana, Escobar, Lackey, Sabathia, Carmona, Beckett and Bedard. Carmona won't get considered because he is not as good as Sabathia. Bedard may be injured. Escobar is overshadowed by Lackey (for no particular reason). Santana is having a subpar season for him. Beckett really isn't that good. Haren's ERA has increased for 15 straight starts.

So, I have no clue who will win. Probably Wakefield or Wang.

September is going to make a difference.
   6. Phil Coorey. Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:45 AM (#2509316)
Lets use this thread to debate Cy Young contenders at large

Agree as well

Bedard for me, so glad me missed him on the weekend.

Have all the voters heard off Bedard??? That might hold him back...
   7. catomi01 Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:47 AM (#2509318)
cy young is another writers award right? joba will get some votes for this and mvp in that case....since he's clearly the reason the yankees will end up in the playoffs....him and andy phillips.
   8. Rough Carrigan Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:53 AM (#2509321)
And Buck Martinez failed as a manager? Really? With such an acute understanding of the game?!?
   9. jolietconvict Posted: September 03, 2007 at 02:54 AM (#2509322)
I heard the exchange on XM Friday morning. I was a bit surprised by Buck's position. It didn't come across as though it was a well thought out or particularly deeply-held notion. Honestly, it's gotta be damned hard to talk about baseball for a minimum of 3 hours every weekday and not say things that in retrospect you'd wish you never said. One more thing, Mark Patrick is a douche. That is all.
   10. Dr. Vaux Posted: September 03, 2007 at 03:19 AM (#2509333)
It's not hard to see why Escobar is overshadowed by Lackey. For one thing, he was known to the media as a not-particularly-good closer before he became a good starter, so they already had an opinion about him. For another, to someone like an average member of the BBWAA, wins are very important when evaluating a starting pitcher. Escobar has never had more than 12 in a season until this year. Lackey, on the other hand, is well-known and considered good because he "won" game 7 of the 2002 World Series as a rookie, and has pitched good games against the Yankees.
   11. alkeiper Posted: September 03, 2007 at 03:36 AM (#2509349)
Remember, Buck's been watching the Orioles all season.
   12. bibigon Posted: September 03, 2007 at 03:44 AM (#2509356)
I think it's simply that Kelvim is a confusing name.
   13. Beauregard Posted: September 03, 2007 at 05:16 AM (#2509378)
Lets use this thread to debate Cy Young contenders at large, rather than:

1. Buck Martinez's understanding of why the save rule may not be perfect.

2. WPA.


Agreed. I think FDR is the greatest president of all time, but even I don't see how the New Deal is relevant here.

Whoever finishes stronger between Bedard and Santana should win the CYA.

Is anyone else on the Hanley for MVP bandwagon or is it just me?
   14. The importance of being Ernest Riles Posted: September 03, 2007 at 05:38 AM (#2509380)
In defense of Borowski (the reliever, not the Cy Young candidate), he does have a 3.94 FIP.
   15. McLovin Posted: September 03, 2007 at 05:41 AM (#2509381)
Whoever finishes stronger between Bedard and Santana should win the CYA.

Not much question who that will be. But there are unquestionably still other candidates.

Is anyone else on the Hanley for MVP bandwagon or is it just me?

*cue 50 posters who have probably never seen him play citing his -653 UZR*
   16. JoeC Posted: September 03, 2007 at 06:02 AM (#2509385)
I don't know, WPA seems awfully applicable to talk radio hosts if you ask me...

"Don't be a fool, working hard is passé
You'll stand from five to six hours a day
Sit down and joke while you smoke -- it's okay!"
   17. DCW3 Posted: September 03, 2007 at 07:20 AM (#2509392)
Is anyone else on the Hanley for MVP bandwagon or is it just me?

Even without considering his stolen bases, he's leading the NL in runs created. Now, raw RC obviously isn't the world's greatest stat (if you want a more useful offensive evaluation, he's got an 11-run lead over the next-best NL position player in VORP), but you know who the last shortstop to lead the NL in runs created was? Arky Vaughan. In 1935.
   18. OrioleJMC Posted: September 03, 2007 at 08:07 AM (#2509397)
Is anyone else on the Hanley for MVP bandwagon or is it just me?

Even without considering his stolen bases, he's leading the NL in runs created. Now, raw RC obviously isn't the world's greatest stat (if you want a more useful offensive evaluation, he's got an 11-run lead over the next-best NL position player in VORP), but you know who the last shortstop to lead the NL in runs created was? Arky Vaughan. In 1935.


Wow, I didn't realize his season was off historic consequence.

Hanley vs Wright for me.
   19. DCW3 Posted: September 03, 2007 at 08:30 AM (#2509401)
Ramirez is on pace to top 140 RC, a level that has only been reached by four shortstops in history: A-Rod did it five times, and Jeter, Yount and Vaughan (the only NL SS on the list) have done it once each. He has a 150 OPS+, which has only been matched by two NL shortstops in the last 70 years: Ernie Banks (who did it three times) and Barry Larkin.
   20. Snowboy Posted: September 03, 2007 at 11:15 AM (#2509407)
I don't have XM radio.
Does it come with a picture?
Can you see a tongue-in-cheek?
   21. stig-tossled, hornswoggled gef the typing mongoose Posted: September 03, 2007 at 12:28 PM (#2509417)
Bedard for me, so glad me missed him on the weekend.


I really, really dig the attempt at Bizarro-speak, but to truly carry it off you should've omitted "the" from the sentence ...
   22. CookieMonster! Posted: September 03, 2007 at 05:19 PM (#2509595)
Bedard for me, so glad me missed him on the weekend.

Hey #######, that Cookie Monster schtick. You got dingo eat baby, me got this. You stay your side, me stay my side.
   23. The NeverEnding Torii (oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh oh) Posted: September 03, 2007 at 06:07 PM (#2509796)
Escobar, Haren and Carmona should at least be getting more Cy Young talk than they're getting. The opposite is true of Beckett, C.C. and Lackey.

In the hopes that some baseball writers read this thread - MAN, IS IT JUST ME OR IS AMERICA BEING SWEPT UP BY BEDARD-MANIA?!?!?!

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