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Tuesday, December 17, 2013

Yankees likely to sign Brian Roberts

The Yankees are reportedly on the verge of signing free agent second baseman Brian Roberts, according to Ken Rosenthal. Roberts hasn’t played a full season since 2009, totaling 77 games for the Baltimore Orioles last season. If this is the move to fill the vacancy left by Robinson Cano, it leaves a lot to be desired. The Yankees would be trusting a guy who has proven incapable of staying on the field for multiple consecutive years.

Options are running low for the Yankees to find an everyday second baseman after Omar Infante agreed to a four-year deal with the Royals and Mark Ellis signed a one-year pact with the Cardinals. Even if the pickings are slim, it’s difficult to imagine the Yankees can’t do better, via trade at least, than Roberts.

Thanks to Lee.

Repoz Posted: December 17, 2013 at 06:39 AM | 103 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: orioles, yankees

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   1. Walks Clog Up the Bases Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:28 AM (#4619427)
In other words, Kelly Johnson is going to be the Yankees' starting second baseman.
   2. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:43 AM (#4619434)
I was hoping for Bip Roberts.
   3. micker17 Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:44 AM (#4619435)
If this is the plan, Brett Gardner for Brandon Phillips is starting to look a whole lot better.

If I were Cashman, I'd try to pry Dustin Ackley from Seattle.
   4. TerpNats Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:50 AM (#4619439)
If Danny Espinosa isn't happy as a reserve in spring training, I wouldn't be surprised to see Rizzo call Cashman and see what the Yanks might offer in return -- especially if the Nats can find a way to bring local product Jeff Baker into the fold.
   5. Willard Baseball Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:50 AM (#4619440)
How many guys are they planning on carrying on the MLB roster? It seems that they have tons of guys right now.

2 Catchers
Teixera
Johnson
Jeter
Ryan
Roberts
Whatever they are doing at 3B
Ichiro
Soriano
Wells
Gardner
Ellsbury
Beltran

Is Nunez still around? What about A-Rod? And with that pitching staff, don't they "need" to carry 12?
   6. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:51 AM (#4619441)
In fairness to the Yankees, he was just about the oldest option available, so they've at least got a uniform theme going in their roster construction.

Maybe he and Jeter can play canasta on the bench.
   7. Publius Publicola Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:59 AM (#4619443)
Are the Yankees trying to do stupid #### this winter?

I can just imagine what a Jeter/Roberts DP combo will look like.
   8. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:04 AM (#4619444)
I can just imagine what a Jeter/Roberts DP combo will look like.

Like an old man trying to return soup at a deli?
   9. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:10 AM (#4619446)
When the Yankees win 90 games this year it is going to be funny to see the reaction.
   10. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:13 AM (#4619448)
When the Yankees win 90 games this year it is going to be funny to see the reaction.

They'll probably sign Tanaka, too. They aren't dead yet! 1 year and 2 million for Roberts, BTW.
   11. Pat Rapper's Delight Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:24 AM (#4619454)
And all this time I thought Roberts was a good guy....
   12. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:35 AM (#4619458)
2 Catchers
Teixera
Johnson
Jeter
Ryan
Roberts
Whatever they are doing at 3B
Ichiro
Soriano
Wells
Gardner
Ellsbury
Beltran


Come opening day, not a single one of those players will be on the right side of 30. McCann is the youngest, and he turns 30 in February. (The backup catcher however will probably be under 30 - Romine I'm guessing?)
   13. AROM Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:39 AM (#4619461)
Or Cervelli
   14. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:43 AM (#4619463)
If the Bud-cap of $189 million is out the window, and it appears to be unless they have some salary-dumping in the works, I wouldn't mind seeing the Yankees being aggressive in their pursuit of Tanaka. Even if he winds up being just a mid-rotation starter that's still probably money better spent than on backup infielders.
   15. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:51 AM (#4619465)
With this signing, Roberts will end his legendary status as a career Oriole.

No A-Rod suspension has been announced/agreed to yet, right?
   16. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: December 17, 2013 at 10:56 AM (#4619469)
As an orioles fan, this makes me happy. I was worried the orioles would blow a roster spot on him and that Showalter would be tempted to give him a lot of playing time.
   17. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:09 AM (#4619474)
Roberts looks like a really nice platoon partner for Kelly Johnson.

Roberts had a 109 wRC+ vs. LH last year, while KJ was at 103 vs RHP (and should get a boost from DNYS).

Johnson has also been good vs. LHP in his career, so maybe he slides to 3B vs. LHP.
   18. Ray (RDP) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:12 AM (#4619477)
No A-Rod suspension has been announced/agreed to yet, right?


January.
   19. zonk Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:14 AM (#4619480)
Is Celebrex considered a performance enhancing drug?
   20. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:16 AM (#4619481)
I made a visualization of when the current Yankees peaked. (assuming Beltran and Roberts are on the team)
   21. The Clarence Thomas of BBTF (scott) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:19 AM (#4619482)
1/2m is actually good value. Johnson/Roberts should make a pretty nice platoon, as Snapper notes, at 1/5th the price of Cano.

The new market inefficiency is old players?
   22. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:22 AM (#4619484)
I can see Roberts as a way of keeping the payroll down, and if (ho, ho) he can stay healthy he's not really that bad a temp until a better value comes along. And by "better value" I don't mean Brandon Phillips.

And of course the Jeter - Roberts combination will be embarrassing, but so will pretty much every position but the outfield, the catcher, a pitcher or two, and with equally good health luck, the first baseman. What's that starting rotation going to look like come midseason, or even come opening day? And what's the bullpen going to look like by May?
   23. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:23 AM (#4619485)
1/2m is actually good value. Johnson/Roberts should make a pretty nice platoon, as Snapper notes, at 1/5th the price of Cano.

Maybe, but Roberts has had trouble staying healthy for several years now and he doesn't offer much positional flexibility. The Yankees are being forced to roll the dice on a move with pretty low upside.
   24. Hang down your head, Tom Foley Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:27 AM (#4619489)
I remember reading "Yankees likely to sign Brian Roberts in 2014" in 2005.
   25. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:30 AM (#4619491)
Maybe, but Roberts has had trouble staying healthy for several years now and he doesn't offer much positional flexibility. The Yankees are being forced to roll the dice on a move with pretty low upside.

True, but if you only ask him to give you 300 PAs, he's much more likely to stay healthy.

Looking at Johnson, he has almost no platoon split. If they could sign Eric Chavez (go all in on 2005!), a Roberts/Chavez/KJ 3for 2 semi platoon at 2B/3B could be a cheap way to get a ~105-110 wRC+ from the two positions.
   26. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:30 AM (#4619493)
if Roberts is managed properly he could be a positive contributor in a part-time capacity. obviously he cannot play every day or even the majority of the time.
   27. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:35 AM (#4619498)
How many guys are they planning on carrying on the MLB roster? It seems that they have tons of guys right now.

2 Catchers
Teixera
Johnson
Jeter
Ryan
Roberts
Whatever they are doing at 3B
Ichiro
Soriano
Wells
Gardner
Ellsbury
Beltran


Wells is gone. Probably Ichiro too. Johnson can play OF in a pinch.

That means they can add one more backup, and a 3B, and still carry 12 pitchers.
   28. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:38 AM (#4619503)
a Roberts/Chavez/KJ 3for 2 semi platoon at 2B/3B could be a cheap way to get a ~105-110 wRC+ from the two positions.

Sure, it's worth a try, but my larger point is that that 105-110 is the absolute best the Yankees can get and they are taking on a lot of risk (not financial, but opportunity) to try to get it. It's just weird to see the Yankees cornered like this.
   29. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 11:40 AM (#4619505)
Sure, it's worth a try, but my larger point is that that 105-110 is the absolute best the Yankees can get and they are taking on a lot of risk (not financial, but opportunity) to try to get it. It's just weird to see the Yankees cornered like this.

Yeah, that's what happens when your farm system produces absolutely nothing for several years; you need to take risks to fill holes. We're just use to the Yankees taking financial risks instead of the other kinds.
   30. GeoffB Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:00 PM (#4619527)
Assuming that ARod gets in some games at the end of the year (50- or 100-game suspension), you could very well see a starting infield with the following ages late next season:

Teixeira 34
Brian Roberts 36
ARod 39
Jeter 40

Would that be the oldest set of infielders to start a game in MLB history?
   31. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:09 PM (#4619535)
Roberts and Jeter in the same infield will be interesting. I guess with Ellsbury and Gardner they can pitch up a lot.
   32. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:17 PM (#4619541)
Roberts and Jeter in the same infield will be interesting.

TBF, I think there's a good chance Brendan Ryan plays more than Jeter.
   33. Lassus Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:20 PM (#4619547)
I can't be the only one who in an Active or Retired? game show question on Roberts would have guessed the latter, can I?
   34. Harveys Wallbangers Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:27 PM (#4619557)
lassus

the guy played in almost half his team's games last season. kind of surprised you thought he was out of the league
   35. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:34 PM (#4619566)
#30, I'm starting to feel really good about the Phillies rolling youngsters Ruiz, Howard, Utley, Rollins and Byrd every day. Oh, wait, not really.
   36. Lassus Posted: December 17, 2013 at 12:45 PM (#4619573)
the guy played in almost half his team's games last season. kind of surprised you thought he was out of the league

Yeah, obviously. I guess he hadn't been in the news much vs. in the past where I heard about him quite a bit. Also, AL, etc.
   37. Jolly Old St. Nick Still Gags in October Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:08 PM (#4619597)
Teixeira 34
Brian Roberts 36
ARod 39
Jeter 40

Would that be the oldest set of infielders to start a game in MLB history?


Probably, but then come back in 2015 and you might well see the record broken again.
   38. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:17 PM (#4619606)
Teixeira 34
Brian Roberts 36
ARod 39
Jeter 40

Would that be the oldest set of infielders to start a game in MLB history?



Some old man infields - these aren't all primary lineups, but they were used more than a few times

1945 White Sox
Kerby Farrell 31
Roy Schalk 36
Luke Appling 38
Tony Cuccinello 37

1983 Phillies
Pete Rose 42/Tony Perez 41
Joe Morgan 39
Ivan de Jesus 30
Mike Schmidt 33

1984 Angels
Rod Carew 38
Bobby Grich 35
Rob Picciolo 31
Doug DeCinces 33

1984 Cubs had one game of
Keith Moreland 30
Davey Lopes 39
Larry Bowa 38
Ron Cey 36

1986 Reds
Pete Rose 45/Tony Perez 44
Ron Oester 30
Dave Concepcion 38
Buddy Bell 34

1987 Tigers
Darrell Evans 40
Lou Whitaker 30
Alan Trammell 29
Tom Brookens 33

1999 Cubs
Mark Grace 35
Mickey Morandini 33
Jeff Blauser 33
Gary Gaetti 40

1999 Orioles
Jeff Conine 33/Will Clark 35
Delino DeShields 30/Jeff Reboulet 35
Mike Bordick 33
Cal Ripken 38

2001 Braves
Julio Franco 42
Keith Lockhart 36
Rey Sanchez 33
Ken Caminiti 38

2007 Giants
Ryan Klesko 36
Ray Durham 35
Omar Vizquel 40
Rich Aurilia 35
   39. Michael J. Binkley's anxiety closet Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:19 PM (#4619608)
The obvious ones that come close in total age, but not quite- the 1983 "Wheeze Kids":

1b - Pete Rose 42
2b - Joe Morgan 39
ss - Ivan DeJesus 30
3b - Mike Schmidt 33

With 41 year old backup 1b Tony Perez.

Edit : beverage to RoyalsRetro
   40. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:21 PM (#4619610)
Couple teams had 3 old guys, but always one young guy with them (mid 90s Tigers with Fielder/Trammell/Whitaker, mid 90s Cubs with Grace/Sandberg/Dunston)
   41. fra paolo Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:28 PM (#4619615)
I made a visualization of when the current Yankees peaked. (assuming Beltran and Roberts are on the team)

Have the Yankees joined the Ruben Amaro School of Scouting?
   42. Dingbat_Charlie Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:30 PM (#4619617)
He's still bright-eyed, but no longer bushy-tailed.
   43. JJ1986 Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:38 PM (#4619626)
The Yankees finally are making a move to get younger - they ink 37-year old Matt Thornton for two years.
   44. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:43 PM (#4619629)
Let's be serious - short-term deal, veteran guy at a positional need. I don't actually see how this is a bad thing for the Yankees.

At worst, it's a signal that they don't have another wonderful plan for 2B. But the move itself doesn't concern me. The money doesn't mean anything to this team.
   45. Shooty Survived the Shutdown of '14! Posted: December 17, 2013 at 01:43 PM (#4619631)
The Yankees finally are making a move to get younger - they ink 37-year old Matt Thornton for two years.

You know, it will be nice to see a team playing Colecovision to bond instead of X-Box.
   46. Nasty Nate Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:07 PM (#4619640)
A decent old team is better than a younger, but worse at baseball, team. I'm not sure whether or not that will apply to the Yankees this year.
   47. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:20 PM (#4619642)
Let's be serious - short-term deal, veteran guy at a positional need.

Is "terrible left-handed no out guy" a positional need?

EDIT: Whoops, you were referring to Roberts. I just wanted to snark on giving Thornton anything more than a minor league contract.
   48. Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:42 PM (#4619653)
I saw Thornton pitch with Boston after the trade last summer. Andrew Miller was pitching really well, and when he went down for the season with an injury, they got Thornton to fill the role.

He did not. He was pretty unimpressive. I can't believe somebody would give him a two-year deal. But he's only 37, so why not, right?
   49. Blastin Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:47 PM (#4619658)
Overall, Thornton held LHP to an under 700 ops each of the last two years. That's fine with me for a LOOGY.
   50. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:48 PM (#4619659)
Have the Yankees joined the Ruben Amaro School of Scouting?


And… here's a direct comparison!
   51. AROM Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:50 PM (#4619661)
But he's only 37, so why not, right?


Plus, he throws left handed.
   52. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 17, 2013 at 02:58 PM (#4619668)
Is "terrible left-handed no out guy" a positional need?

No, but TLH NOG is a seasonal delicacy.
   53. The Yankee Clapper Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:16 PM (#4619692)
Let's be serious - short-term deal, veteran guy at a positional need. I don't actually see how this is a bad thing for the Yankees.

Agreed. Lots of misplaced snark in this thread. In the somewhat unlikely event Roberts is actually healthy for most of the season, he could be quite useful. Not much money at risk here.
   54. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:28 PM (#4619702)
Thornton's K rate and velocity have both been trending down since 2010.

He's probably not as bad as people in this thread think, but I'd be worried about him still being productive in the second year of that deal.
   55. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:41 PM (#4619715)
Overall, Thornton held LHP to an under 700 ops each of the last two years. That's fine with me for a LOOGY.

Even LOOGYs don't face LHB all that often. Thornton has usually faced more lefties than righties.

Thornton was absolutely abysmal after being traded to Boston and didn't feature in the postseason at all, and now the Yankees are giving him $7M over 2 years instead of just using a random left-handed minor leaguer. Hilarious!
   56. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:52 PM (#4619728)
Even LOOGYs don't face LHB all that often. Thornton has usually faced more lefties than righties.

Thornton was absolutely abysmal after being traded to Boston and didn't feature in the postseason at all, and now the Yankees are giving him $7M over 2 years instead of just using a random left-handed minor leaguer. Hilarious!


RLYW has a write up on Thornton. CAIRO projects: 2014 3.89 RA, 3.32 ERA, 3.14 FIP. That's far from shabby

Thornton had a 3.52 ERA with Boston, and was still averaging 94. I don't know where the narrative that he is done comes from?
   57. zonk Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:55 PM (#4619733)
Stop picking on the Yankees -- that's elder abuse!
   58. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 03:57 PM (#4619736)
I don't know where the narrative that he is done comes from?


See #54.
   59. Nasty Nate Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:02 PM (#4619741)
I don't know where the narrative that he is done comes from?


See #54.


Trending down from 160 ERA+ level doesn't immediately make you abysmal.
   60. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:02 PM (#4619742)
See #54.

Understood. He had a subpar year. But, he still throws 94.

He might suck, but he might bounce back. He projects better than Boone Logan, who got ~3/15.
   61. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:04 PM (#4619745)
I picture the 2014 Yankees running from first to second at 5 MPH with their left blinker on
   62. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:14 PM (#4619754)
Having trouble posting this, but Rany thinks the Yanks are going to wallow in mediocrity for awhile.

There simply won't be enough talent available via free agency to replenish the Yankees' needs. There's nothing on the farm. And as a result of the new CBA, the Yankees can't flex their financial muscle in the draft or on the international market. There's a perception that the new CBA hurts small-market teams that want to spend on amateur players, but it actually hurts rich teams that want to blow the market away on elite young players. Carlos Rodon, the presumptive no. 1 overall pick in the next draft, could be a better version of David Price in a perfect world. In the old days, Scott Boras6 could work his magic, tell the world that his client wants $25 million to sign, and scare away enough teams to allow Rodon to fall to wherever the Yankees are picking.

The spending limits in the new CBA make that much more difficult. If Rodon is the top player in the draft, he will almost certainly go no. 1 overall. The Yankees will have to settle for the best player on the board when they draft — and thanks to all the free agents they've signed, they will forfeit their first-round pick next year anyway.

Even signing players from Japan has become more difficult; it used to be that teams submitted a blind posting bid in an auction, but now any team that posts the $20 million maximum can negotiate freely with the player involved. When ace right-hander Masahiro Tanaka gets posted — whether it's this year or next — the Yankees will have to negotiate like everyone else. And if they do sign Tanaka, more of the money they commit to him will count against their payroll for luxury tax purposes because of the lower posting bid.

The Yankees dug their own hole by making mistakes in drafting and player development. They're even worse off now, however, because the ladders they used to climb out of a similar hole 20 years ago have been removed.
   63. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:16 PM (#4619757)
I agree with most of that, but not this.

Even signing players from Japan has become more difficult; it used to be that teams submitted a blind posting bid in an auction, but now any team that posts the $20 million maximum can negotiate freely with the player involved. When ace right-hander Masahiro Tanaka gets posted — whether it's this year or next — the Yankees will have to negotiate like everyone else. And if they do sign Tanaka, more of the money they commit to him will count against their payroll for luxury tax purposes because of the lower posting bid.

The Yankees have never obtained a significant player through posting.

They are far more likely to get Tanaka, if they want him, under the new system.
   64. Nasty Nate Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:21 PM (#4619763)
I think it is a myth that teams in general won't be able to use financial clout to acquire talent.
   65. Nasty Nate Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:22 PM (#4619765)
Carlos Rodon, the presumptive no. 1 overall pick in the next draft, could be a better version of David Price in a perfect world. In the old days, Scott Boras6 could work his magic, tell the world that his client wants $25 million to sign, and scare away enough teams to allow Rodon to fall to wherever the Yankees are picking.


Just like they did with the original version of David Price....
   66. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:23 PM (#4619766)
Thornton had a 3.52 ERA with Boston, and was still averaging 94. I don't know where the narrative that he is done comes from?

I wouldn't put much stock in the ERA. It's not like he was pitching whole innings. He doesn't get the credit for the people relieving him keeping his runners from scoring. I know WHIP is a silly fantasy stat, but his for Boston was 1.76. And he was getting hit hard, believe me.
   67. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:25 PM (#4619769)
Carlos Rodon, the presumptive no. 1 overall pick in the next draft, could be a better version of David Price in a perfect world. In the old days, Scott Boras6 could work his magic, tell the world that his client wants $25 million to sign, and scare away enough teams to allow Rodon to fall to wherever the Yankees are picking.

It worked for Andrew Brackman!
   68. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:26 PM (#4619771)
There's a perception that the new CBA hurts small-market teams that want to spend on amateur players


A perception espoused by fools who haven't given the subject any thought.

In the old days, Scott Boras6 could work his magic, tell the world that his client wants $25 million to sign, and scare away enough teams to allow Rodon to fall to wherever the Yankees are picking.


When has this ever happened? No, the pernicious effect of Budshovism isn't that the Yankees can't pay some hypothetical player $25 million, it's that nobody can pay that hypothetical player $25 million.

And if they do sign Tanaka, more of the money they commit to him will count against their payroll for luxury tax purposes because of the lower posting bid.


Yes, that is the plan isn't it.

The Yankees dug their own hole by making mistakes in drafting and player development.


And Bud Selig and his plutocratic cronies quickly shoved the team in the hole and are now furiously shoveling in dirt as fast as they can, having already removed any gold fillings and purloined the money belt from the victim.
   69. Nasty Nate Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:27 PM (#4619774)
And he was getting hit hard, believe me.


Unless I am reading his stat page wrong, of his 22 hits allowed there was 1 double and 21 singles.
   70. BDC Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:30 PM (#4619778)
FW little IW, through-age-35 comps for Brian Roberts: middle infielders, centered on him in terms of OPS+ and PA:

Player            Rfield OPS+   PA WAR/pos  SB        Pos
Art Fletcher         142  101 5606    45.9 157     
*6/54H
Freddy Parent         70   99 5571    35.8 184   
*68/7495
Lonny Frey            58  105 6260    38.5 102  
*46/H9587
Max Bishop            50  103 5789    37.3  40     
*4/H36
Tony Cuccinello       27  103 6291    32.2  36     
*45/H6
Phil Garner           26  101 5720    27.4 203    
*45/H6D
Johnny Ray            15  101 5664    24.0  80     
*4/H7D
Brian Roberts         13  102 5905    28.9 278     
*4/6HD
Rich Aurilia           1  100 5705    19.7  22   
*6543/HD
Jhonny Peralta       
-20  101 5680    24.7  13   *65/HD37
Denis Menke          
-30  103 5936    28.2  34  *6543/H79
Carlos Baerga        
-31  101 5721    19.9  59   *4H5/6D3
Mark Loretta         
-35  100 6057    18.9  46 *4635H/D71
Ron Hunt             
-39  105 6158    32.7  65     *45H/


That's sort of the Hall of the Not Bad. But most of the players on the list, like Roberts himself, had a window of 2-3 years mid-career where they were very strong all-round ballplayers who could improve most clubs.
   71. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:30 PM (#4619779)
When has this ever happened? No, the pernicious effect of Budshovism isn't that the Yankees can't pay some hypothetical player $25 million, it's that nobody can pay that hypothetical player $25 million.


Yea, that gets mentioned a lot in arguments, but I can't think of too many guys that had ridiculous bonus demands that fell in the draft, and the ones that did didn't necessarily turn into game-changing players. Off the top of my head, Matt Wieters, Rick Porcello, J.D. Drew all fell, and all are nice players, but not megastars or anything. And the Yankees didn't get any of them.
   72. spycake Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:30 PM (#4619780)
For Roberts, $2 mil plus incentives, per MLBTR. Also they note:
finishing a four-year, $40MM extension this past season that saw him play just 192 games and slash just .246/.310/.359

0.9 WAR total during those 4 years. And he was one of the most durable players in the game his whole career before that.
   73. Bitter Mouse Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:31 PM (#4619782)
And Bud Selig and his plutocratic cronies quickly shoved the team in the hole and are now furiously shoveling in dirt as fast as they can, having already removed any gold filling and purloined the money belt from the victim.


If only they had thrown the Dodgers in with them :(
   74. SG Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:31 PM (#4619783)
Unless I am reading his stat page wrong, of his 22 hits allowed there was 1 double and 21 singles.


But they were hard singles.
   75. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:38 PM (#4619788)
But they were hard singles.

Yeah, with Boston: 60% GB rate, 20% LD-rate (vs. 19.6% career) and a .386 BABIP (vs. .299 career, .320 ish in recent years).

I think he'll be OK
   76. The Non-Catching Molina (sjs1959) Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:44 PM (#4619793)
And Bud Selig and his plutocratic cronies quickly shoved the team in the hole and are now furiously shoveling in dirt as fast as they can, having already removed any gold fillings and purloined the money belt from the victim.


So, this makes Hank and Hal Steinbrenner descendants of Tom Joad? What next, Sterling and Waldman leading a chorus of THIS LAND IS YOUR LAND?
   77. Yeaarrgghhhh Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:45 PM (#4619794)
Orioles signed Grant Balfour for 2 years, $15M. They basically traded Johnson to the A's for Balfour, Weeks, and Ryan Webb. Nice set of moves.
   78. tfbg9 Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:45 PM (#4619795)
.400 BABIP with the Sox. And he was quite good at cashing in the previous guys' runners: 57%
   79. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: December 17, 2013 at 04:51 PM (#4619801)
Well, maybe I'm overselling his badness, but Farrell/Cherington sure seemed to feel the same way since Thornton never pitched in the playoffs. Even Franklin Morales was preferred.

Although I'm not sure I want to be basing my case on the managerial acumen of Farrell.
   80. Curse of the Andino Posted: December 17, 2013 at 07:26 PM (#4619899)
I called this one weeks ago. And am glad he's no longer an O. He might be good offensively for the Yanks again. So many other old players are up there, but he was horrid on defense this year, and putrid in previous years. Team's definitely better off with Flaherty/Weeks while Schoop's still at AAA.
   81. willcarrolldoesnotsuk Posted: December 17, 2013 at 07:33 PM (#4619905)
Knoblauch's probably over the yips by now.
   82. donlock Posted: December 17, 2013 at 07:47 PM (#4619912)
Not sure how many middle infielders Yanks can carry to platoon. A lot of teams carry one extra catcher one infielder, one outfielder and one guy who might be able to cover 1b and OF. Nunez, Ryan, Jeter, Roberts, and Johnson (plus ARod)? Most of these guys can't cover another defensive infield position.
   83. Gonfalon B. Posted: December 17, 2013 at 08:00 PM (#4619918)
Obviously the plan is to get five groundball pitchers, and leave just one guy out there roaming the outfield.
   84. John DiFool2 Posted: December 17, 2013 at 09:15 PM (#4619954)
I can just imagine what a Jeter/Roberts DP combo will look like.

Like an old man trying to return soup at a deli?


Tim Conway's old man.
   85. KT's Pot Arb Posted: December 18, 2013 at 02:44 AM (#4620045)
If this is the plan, Brett Gardner for Brandon Phillips is starting to look a whole lot better.


If they are forced to trade Gardner for anyone, the Yankees end up spending a huge amount of money to get slightly better in CF and far worse at 2B.
   86. TVerik, the gum-snappin' hairdresser Posted: December 18, 2013 at 09:38 AM (#4620060)
If they are forced to trade Gardner for anyone, the Yankees end up spending a huge amount of money to get slightly better in CF and far worse at 2B.


I don't know if I agree with that. If they trade him for a stud starting pitcher, the merry-go-round is more defensible (though possibly still not optimal).
   87. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 10:08 AM (#4620076)
I thought the Gardner-for-Phillips rumors were shot down fairly directly over the winter meetings.

Yankees Reject Phillips for Gardner
   88. zonk Posted: December 18, 2013 at 10:17 AM (#4620078)
Knoblauch's probably over the yips by now.


Steve Sax, too, for that matter.
   89. Ray (RDP) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 11:58 AM (#4620136)
This is a lot of analysis for a non-issue. Almost 100 posts? The last time Roberts has been both healthy and good was 2009. And I think he's older now. He's managed 192 games over the past four seasons, to the tune of an 82 OPS+.

This feels a lot like the Kevin Youkilis signing, and will end that way.
   90. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 11:59 AM (#4620137)
This feels a lot like the Kevin Youkilis signing, and will end that way.

Nah. They gave Youkilis ~$10M. That was a disaster. This is virtually no risk at $2M.

All you're asking for is 300 decent PAs, mostly against LHP.
   91. SG Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:09 PM (#4620142)
This is a lot of analysis for a non-issue.


You should have posted this earlier and saved us the trouble.
   92. zonk Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:24 PM (#4620152)
Oh, were we supposed to be delivering analysis?

I was just using this as an opportunity to snark on the Yankees.

Where is that thread - because that's the one I'm looking for... Ahh.... never mind, I see it comprises 1/3 of the Hot Topics!
   93. Bitter Mouse Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:31 PM (#4620160)
I was just using this as an opportunity to snark on the Yankees.


Schadenfreude is evergreen.
   94. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:51 PM (#4620170)
This is a lot of analysis for a non-issue.


Anyway to make this the tagline for the site?
   95. Swoboda is freedom Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:51 PM (#4620171)
This is a lot of analysis for a non-issue.


You should have posted this earlier and saved us the trouble.


You might say that for this whole site. Or even the internet.
   96. JE (Jason Epstein) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:51 PM (#4620172)
I don't know if I agree with that. If they trade him for a stud starting pitcher, the merry-go-round is more defensible (though possibly still not optimal).

One year of Brett Gardner somehow gets the Yankees a "stud starting pitcher," Erik? Please explain.
   97. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 12:55 PM (#4620173)
Schadenfreude is evergreen.


Indeed, is there a more fitting analysis of the green-eyed monster that stalks every pinstriped utterance on this forum?
   98. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: December 18, 2013 at 01:39 PM (#4620200)
All you're asking for is 300 decent PAs, mostly against LHP.


You're asking for 300 PA from a guy who hasn't reached that PT threshold in any of the last four seasons, and it's not like he's gotten any sturdier since then.
   99. Nasty Nate Posted: December 18, 2013 at 01:48 PM (#4620210)
Speaking of Matt Thornton, there is a Q & A with him at Fangraphs.
   100. Avoid running at all times.-S. Paige Posted: December 18, 2013 at 02:42 PM (#4620235)
I find the non-signing of Infante the most baffling move by the Yanks this offseason.
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