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Saturday, October 20, 2012

Yankees’ Sabathia concerned about elbow discomfort

CC rider plan
Oh see what you have done

Previous MRIs on CC Sabathia’s valuable left elbow have not discovered ligament damage that would necessitate Tommy John surgery.

However, the Yankees’ ace will visit noted surgeon Dr. James Andrews this week to get an explanation why his hinge has been inflamed between starts since August.

Because Sabathia has had a bone spur in the elbow since he pitched for the Indians (his last season in Cleveland was 2008) the 32-year-old might require an arthroscopic procedure to shave or remove the spur. Or he could be told to rest.

...Sabathia spent two weeks on the DL in August with an inflamed elbow. Yesterday, talking outside of Yankee Stadium, Sabathia said the swelling surfaced following every start he made since coming off the DL Aug. 24.

“A little bit because it’s something I have never felt before, never had a problem with the elbow,’’ Sabathia said of being concerned. “I felt it off and on in between starts. But I didn’t feel it on the field.’‘

GM Brian Cashman decided to send Sabathia to Andrews because he knew Sabathia would never complain about an injury following a poor post-season outing.

“He would never say anything in that context,’’ said Cashman, who didn’t seem overly concerned about his ace seeing Andrews.

Repoz Posted: October 20, 2012 at 05:53 PM | 39 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: yankees

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Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Robert in Manhattan Beach Posted: October 20, 2012 at 07:33 PM (#4277651)
The offseason shopping list just got longer
   2. The District Attorney Posted: October 20, 2012 at 07:37 PM (#4277655)
Why, won't they have to buy less food now?
   3. filihok Posted: October 20, 2012 at 08:12 PM (#4277675)
Why, won't they have to buy less food now?

He still has to eat.
   4. Bob Tufts Posted: October 20, 2012 at 08:14 PM (#4277679)
This never would have happened if Brian Cashman had capped CC's innings at 160 or so........
   5. zachtoma Posted: October 20, 2012 at 08:47 PM (#4277695)
CC Sabathia has thrown 180 innings every year since 2001. He's been at 230 or over every year since 2007 (until this year - down to 200 flat). That's impressive.
   6. bunyon Posted: October 20, 2012 at 09:30 PM (#4277712)
Okay, unlike most of the other panic inducing situations currently ongoing with the Yanks, this one would be big.
   7. You Know Nothing JT Snow (YR) Posted: October 20, 2012 at 09:51 PM (#4277722)
A bolt of glee zings through the hearts of Yankee-haters from LA to Tehran.
   8. ellsbury my heart at wounded knee Posted: October 20, 2012 at 09:54 PM (#4277724)
Pineda is expected back in 2013, right? I'm sure they'll be fine.
   9. DKDC Posted: October 20, 2012 at 10:41 PM (#4277750)
Pineda had major shoulder surgery. He's more likely to be out of baseball in 5 years than to ever be a passable major league pitcher again.

If CC is hurt, the Yanks are toast. They are like Old Yeller after he was bit by that rabid wolf, and a CC injury is the final shotgun shell.
   10. Gonfalon B. Posted: October 20, 2012 at 10:47 PM (#4277756)
This is finally the end. The Yankees are too old, too expensive, and too injured, which means they're done.
   11. Monty Predicts a Padres-Mariners WS in 2016 Posted: October 20, 2012 at 11:31 PM (#4277768)
Who's the second-best guy in the elbow surgery game? It seems like Dr. James Andrews gets close to 100% of the business.
   12. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:00 AM (#4277780)
Hey, remember that game 5 when CC threw a CG and there was question as to whether that was wise or not? Good times.
   13. smileyy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:29 AM (#4277795)
[11] Not to make light of your question, but when it comes to MLB player salaries and production, the 2nd best guy may as well be from Hollywood Upstairs Medical College.
   14. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:36 AM (#4277802)
Yocum is that bad?
   15. Howie Menckel Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:54 AM (#4277816)

Other than all that, Mr. Steinbrenner Descendent, how did you like the play..offs?

   16. JL Posted: October 21, 2012 at 09:15 AM (#4277867)
So after one bad start in the playoffs, they send him to a doctor.

The Yankees sure are taking this small sample size overreaction to the extreme.
   17. RMc's desperate, often sordid world Posted: October 21, 2012 at 10:20 AM (#4277885)
CC Sabathia has thrown 180 innings every year since 2001. He's been at 230 or over every year since 2007 (until this year - down to 200 flat). That's impressive.

I would've thought CC was easily the leader in innings pitched since 2001, but he's not. (I'm shocked Livan Hernandez is #4 on this list, despite a 94 ERA+.)

Fun fact: Brad Penny has 1,779.1 IP (and 293 starts) since '01, but only 4 complete games. (Then again, he's also banged Alyssa Milano and Eliza Dushku, so that's gotta count for something...)
   18. Best Regards, President of Comfort Posted: October 21, 2012 at 10:33 AM (#4277890)
So after one bad start in the playoffs, they send him to a doctor.

The Yankees sure are taking this small sample size overreaction to the extreme.


He was on the DL for his elbow and consistently has elbow swelling after starts. You send guys to the doctor for that.
   19. DCA Posted: October 21, 2012 at 11:03 AM (#4277902)
I would've thought CC was easily the leader in innings pitched since 2001, but he's not. (I'm shocked Livan Hernandez is #4 on this list, despite a 94 ERA+.)

Yeah, Buehrle is the obvious choice if you think about it (took me a bit of time to guess, but it was obvious when I the name came to mind). The top of that list is all kind of awesome.

Livan at #4, of course.
Halladay comes in at #3, despite missing significant time and failing to qualify for the ERA title in 4 of the 12 years.
Zito and Hudson are tied at #5, down the fraction of the inning.
   20. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 11:14 AM (#4277906)
[11] Not to make light of your question, but when it comes to MLB player salaries and production, the 2nd best guy may as well be from Hollywood Upstairs Medical College.

That's nonsense. As McCoy says, Dr. Yocum is plenty good.

Among Drs., the top 10 or 20 specialist in any field are going to be practically indistinguishable. The skills required, intelligent, some dexterity for surgery, are not particularly rare.

I doubt you'd find a dime's worth of difference between the best Cardiac surgeon at Mass General, Northwestern Med. Ctr., the Mayo clinic, Johns Hopkins, and Columbia Presbyterian.

The only way you'd find the best being so much better is if the disease/treatment was so rare only one guy specializes in it.
   21. Ned Garvin: Male Prostitute Posted: October 21, 2012 at 11:46 AM (#4277934)
#11: Frank Jobe?
   22. Bob Tufts Posted: October 21, 2012 at 12:01 PM (#4277958)
Gary Waslewski, Jr - who worked with Dr. Andrews and uses his techniques - also does Tommy John surgeries.

And Gary is a former college pitcher from Princeton whose father you may remember.
   23. NJ in DC Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:03 PM (#4278012)
Hey, remember that game 5 when CC threw a CG and there was question as to whether that was wise or not? Good times.

Hey, remember that entire 2012 season when CC pitched hurt showing a loss of velocity and diminished stuff and his going to get scoped wasn't just because of extra pitches thrown in a postseason game? Good times.
   24. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:11 PM (#4278020)
So the defense of overusing him to pick up a meaningless CG in the playoffs is that his elbow was already damaged? Is this the Dusty Baker defense being employed?
   25. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:29 PM (#4278031)
So the defense of overusing him to pick up a meaningless CG in the playoffs is that his elbow was already damaged? Is this the Dusty Baker defense being employed?
Finishing a winner-take-all game with a two-run lead is a pretty funny definition of "meaningless."
   26. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:33 PM (#4278032)
Sorry, meant game 1.
   27. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:37 PM (#4278034)
Sorry, meant game 1.
Game 1 was tied 2-2 through 8, and once the Yankees scored all the runs, Sabathia threw a grand total of 10 extra pitches. You've now shifted to a pretty funny definition of "overusing."
   28. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:42 PM (#4278039)
Game 1 was tied 2-2 through 8, and once the Yankees scored all the runs, Sabathia threw a grand total of 10 extra pitches. You've now shifted to a pretty funny definition of "overusing."

I've shifted nothing. The original argument that I was referring to was about game 1.

But I'm not really sure what the defense is here. Hey, CC is a work horse but he has a bad elbow, but he's a work horse so we'll ignore that. Is that the defense?
   29. Swoboda is freedom Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:45 PM (#4278040)
Game 1 was tied 2-2 through 8, and once the Yankees scored all the runs, Sabathia threw a grand total of 10 extra pitches. You've now shifted to a pretty funny definition of "overusing."

But I got tore a new one when I suggested it was not a wise move to keep him in. There was no upside to leaving him in, especially considering his injury record this year. All I was told was that he was a horse and it was great that he wanted back in.
   30. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:45 PM (#4278041)
But I'm not really sure what the defense is here. Hey, CC is a work horse but he has a bad elbow, but he's a work horse so we'll ignore that. Is that the defense?
No, the defense is "He may have a bad elbow--he may not, of course--but he's our best pitcher and this is the playoffs, so we're taking out best shot at winning." You can go the other way, the Nationals would, I assume--but it's hardly some crazy concept.
   31. Monty Predicts a Padres-Mariners WS in 2016 Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:46 PM (#4278042)
#11: Frank Jobe?


Hmm. You make a valid point.
   32. McCoy Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:48 PM (#4278044)
No, the defense is "He may have a bad elbow--he may not, of course--but he's our best pitcher and this is the playoffs, so we're taking out best shot at winning."

Not according to this guy,

Hey, remember that entire 2012 season when CC pitched hurt showing a loss of velocity and diminished stuff and his going to get scoped wasn't just because of extra pitches thrown in a postseason game? Good times.
   33. NJ in DC Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:53 PM (#4278045)
McCoy, I felt as though you were implying that that one game was the reason why CC has to see someone about his elbow. I was trying to make the point that CC was going to have to see a doctor regardless because he wasn't right the whole season.
   34. RB in NYC (Now Semi-Retired from BBTF) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:55 PM (#4278047)
Not according to this guy,
I don't see how in any way runs contrary to my point. If CC was able to be effective--and he obviously was heading into October (3-0, 24 IP, 1.50 ERA, 28 K, 4 BB in his last three starts before the post-season) then you run your ace out there, even if his elbow may be an issue.
   35. Jim (jimmuscomp) Posted: October 21, 2012 at 01:59 PM (#4278051)
FWIW, rightly or wrongly, I've always equated Andrews as the shoulder guy and Jobe/Yocum as the elbow guys. I'm surely wrong, but that's my memory. It might be clouded by my being on the west coast and Jobe being the go to guy for the Halos because of proximity.
   36. Dag Nabbit: secretary of the World Banana Forum Posted: October 21, 2012 at 02:25 PM (#4278060)
#11: Frank Jobe?

At age 87, I doubt he's in his surgical prime anymore.
   37. Zach Posted: October 21, 2012 at 03:50 PM (#4278127)
I always had the impression that surgery has a star system -- the #1 guy gets a huge amount of business, the #2 guy gets the cases that #1 doesn't take, and so on down the ladder. If you ever read a biography of a surgeon, they're usually hypercompetitive, perfectionist prima donnas. Maybe the star system is just more apparent in the lives of people who get biographies written about them.
   38. something like a train wreck Posted: October 21, 2012 at 07:20 PM (#4278244)
Bedside manner is the new market inefficiency.
   39. LargeBill Posted: October 21, 2012 at 09:20 PM (#4278490)
5. zachtoma Posted: October 20, 2012 at 08:47 PM (#4277695)
CC Sabathia has thrown 180 innings every year since 2001. He's been at 230 or over every year since 2007 (until this year - down to 200 flat). That's impressive.


Ya know what else is impressive? Since having an ERA of 4.39 in his rookie year, Sabathia has managed to lower his career ERA each year thereafter.

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