The MVP always comes down almost solely to numbers, which I find silly. There is an intangible nature to the word “valuable.” Voters never seem to take that into consideration.

Willie Stargell in 1979 and Kirk Gibson in 1988 say hi.

There is an intangible nature to the word “valuable.” Voters never seem to take that into consideration.... Alex has never been more valuable to the Yankees.

1. You're kidding right? Voters always take intangibles into consideration.

2. If number crunching is "obsessive" and inappropriate, fine, you can reach any conclusion you want.

3. If intangibles are the be-all, on the other hand, of course ARod is most valuable to the Yankees when he and they are playing in the post-season and specifically in the WS, assuming he's playing at or near his normal level, which he is/was.

4. But the more interesting question to all but total Yankee-philes would be, has he ever been more valuable, period. And the answer would be, of course, he has. He is already in decline, though still among the league's elite players.

So, tell me what you guys think. When was ARod "most valuable," what have been his most valuable seasons?

So, tell me what you guys think. When was ARod "most valuable," what have been his most valuable seasons?

Anyone know why Fangraphs has A-rod's 2002 and 2003 seasons at such low dollar values ($25.4 for 9.8 WAR and $25.3 for 9.0 WAR) compared to his two big years for the Yankees ($32.1 for 9.4 WAR and $39.2 for 9.6 WAR).

Anyway, probably either 96 or 2000. Maybe 02.

Anyone know why Fangraphs has A-rod's 2002 and 2003 seasons at such low dollar values ($25.4 for 9.8 WAR and $25.3 for 9.0 WAR) compared to his two big years for the Yankees ($32.1 for 9.4 WAR and $39.2 for 9.6 WAR).

The salaries was lower back then, so an A-Rod equivalent production was cheaper to buy on the FA market, maybe?

The average team won more games in 2002 and 2003. Duh.

With one swing of the bat he instilled confidence. And regained confidence. You could argue, and I have, that this was his most valuable season as a Yankee. Really.

More than 2005 or 2007? Not buying it.

With one swing of the bat he instilled confidence. And regained confidence. You could argue, and I have, that this was his most valuable season as a Yankee. Really.

More than 2005 or 2007? Not buying it.

I dunno, John, depends on what you mean by "most valuable." In terms of WAR I guess you could say that those two MVP years were "more valuable" than this year, but in terms of what it actually brought the Yankees, I don't think so. In 2005 and 2007, his WAR were instrumental in helping the Yankees get into the postseason, but once they got there, his miserable performance helped sink them in a Big Time way. Whereas this year he wasn't quite so crucial to the Yanks getting into the playoffs, but without him they never would have won those rings.

And whereas in most years the difference in A-Rod's WAR between 2005/2007 and 2009 wouldn't mean the difference between making or not making the postseason, the difference between his 2005/2007 and 2009 postseason numbers would make an enormous difference in terms of winning the World Series. So yes, I would say that to the Yankees this was indeed his most valuable season.

A-Rod has never been <strike>more</strike> valuable to Yankees

There, now it's a repeat from the last few seasons.

Based on the sound logic of that article, A-Rod should demand a raise.

Based on the sound logic of that article, A-Rod should demand a raise.

He should have opted out after the ALCS.

Of course the Yankees played a lot better with A-Rod back in the line up. You replace Cody Ransom(53 OPS+)/Ramiro Pena (83 OPS+) with A-Rod (143 OPS+), you're going to see some improvement.

With A-Rod back in, suddenly the pitcher doesn't catch a break until maybe he gets to the 9th place hitter -- and even then, it's not like in the NL when you get to face a pitcher batting ninth; Cabrera was just around league average.

There is an intangible nature to the word “valuable.”

que?

The very notion of "value" is that you can put a price tag on an object. There is, in the utilitarian economic sense, a subjective aspect to "value" such that you and I might value the same object differently but there's still a price I'm willing to pay and a price you're willing to pay.

It is also perfectly logical to argue that there are aspects of value not captured in a player's on-field production but, as soon as you boost one player with fewer WAR (or whatever) ahead of one with more WAR, you've placed a quantitative value on what those other bits are worth.

This is funny given that it's A-Rod's worst season since he was 20.

A-Rod getting positive coverage in an intangibles article? Now I've seen it all.

The very notion of "value" is that you can put a price tag on an object. There is, in the utilitarian economic sense, a subjective aspect to "value" such that you and I might value the same object differently but there's still a price I'm willing to pay and a price you're willing to pay.

It is also perfectly logical to argue that there are aspects of value not captured in a player's on-field production but, as soon as you boost one player with fewer WAR (or whatever) ahead of one with more WAR, you've placed a quantitative value on what those other bits are worth.

Then it seems as if it's up to sabermetrics to properly weigh (or quantify) the added value of a World Championship, as aided by a player's postseason contributions. Not sure how you'd do it, but it would stop a lot of the apples vs. oranges comparisons, such as show up in those trying to argue the value of A-Rod's 2005 vs 2009 seasons. Because I doubt if there are ten Yankee fans in the entire universe who would rather have the A-Rod of 2005 over the A-Rod of this year, regular season stat lines notwithstanding.

A-Rod getting positive coverage in an intangibles article? Now I've seen it all.

He's been promoted to True Yankee® status. Put your hip boots on, expect a flood of this sort of thing.

If the Yankees had just a mere good season from A-Rod in 2005, they would have been sitting home watching the Indians claim the Wild Card instead in the postseason. That they had a truly great season from him and just made it into the postseason covers all of the multiple definitions of "value" here. Getting to the playoffs is much, much more important than how you perform there.

2005 is A-Rod's most valuable Yankee season, bar none.

By that logic, Andy, Bucky Dent's 1978 was much, much more valuable than Bonds's 2001.

Not really. All I'm saying is that to most Yankee fans I know, these last two years as an entry are far better than a combo of 2005 and 2007. The World Series win erases missing the playoffs more than making the playoffs erases the memory of the way they got blown out of them. This is the Yankees we're talking about, not the Twins or the Rockies.

Obviously John disagrees with this, but then I don't think that John is a Yankee fan. He might not understand the mindset---which BTW I fully share. I'd gladly take 5 championships and 5 sit-at-homes in 10 years over 10 straight first round wipeouts. Perhaps others wouldn't, but I can't imagine why.