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Saturday, August 17, 2019

Zach Zagger on Twitter: Minor League Baseball players alleging they should be paid minimum wage and

Jim Furtado Posted: August 17, 2019 at 10:50 AM | 20 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: minor league pay

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   1. The Duke Posted: August 17, 2019 at 11:16 AM (#5872120)
Good
   2. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: August 17, 2019 at 12:08 PM (#5872127)
And about time. MLB teams are swimming in money.
   3. bookbook Posted: August 17, 2019 at 12:31 PM (#5872129)
I know the MLBPA has (unwisely) defined itself such that it doesn’t represent minor league players, but... , the way it can regain popular approval is to start advocating for better working conditions for those ownership takes the most advantage of. The union needs the leverage of popular support to push back against ownership’s near-constant victories over the past decade or more.

We don’t care that much whether Trout gets $300 million or $500. Minor leaguers whose play is needed, if only for the best prospects to have experience against, should gain compensation and decent living conditions for their trouble.
   4. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 17, 2019 at 01:04 PM (#5872133)
I know the MLBPA has (unwisely) defined itself such that it doesn’t represent minor league players, but... , the way it can regain popular approval is to start advocating for better working conditions for those ownership takes the most advantage of. The union needs the leverage of popular support to push back against ownership’s near-constant victories over the past decade or more.

When 50-100 cities lose minor league baseball b/c the owners eliminate minor league teams, or move them to the Caribbean, that not going to be terribly popular with the fans.

I hope the minor leaguers win their lawsuit, but the the MLBPA is right to stay out of it.
   5. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: August 17, 2019 at 01:17 PM (#5872136)
I hope they win. Also, if they do, college baseball programs are about to get a whole lot more support from the Major Leagues.
   6. GregD Posted: August 17, 2019 at 01:33 PM (#5872139)
If teams truly cannot pay minimum wage to their players, they should close. I suspect the balance sheets will turn out to look different when not being used for propaganda purposes.
   7. Jeff Frances the Mute Posted: August 17, 2019 at 03:55 PM (#5872182)
If teams have to pay players an hourly wage that will give them a real incentive to speed up the pace of play. Of course, it also might lead to real changes that eliminate extra innings.
   8. Rally Posted: August 17, 2019 at 04:08 PM (#5872187)
Considering how important minor league standings are, I’m not sure why they don’t just eliminate extra innings in the minors, at least for regular season. Just call it a tie and move on.
   9. Sunday silence Posted: August 17, 2019 at 06:43 PM (#5872208)

When 50-100 cities lose minor league baseball b/c the owners eliminate minor league teams, or move them to the Caribbean, that not going to be terribly popular with the fans.


Because MLB teams are just dying to pay for flights out of Santo DOmingo w/ 6 hour layovers when they need an emergency catcher or spot starter from triple A.
   10. Rennie's Tenet Posted: August 17, 2019 at 08:02 PM (#5872220)
Obviously, they can eliminate a lot more than 100 teams without touching Triple A. All of this will impact independent leagues too, right?
   11. Sunday silence Posted: August 17, 2019 at 08:16 PM (#5872226)
Presumably independent teams are not party to the lawsuit. or are they?

How much would actually cost for teams to play MiLBers a living wage? Im guessing $1M per team. Say they have 100 MiLBers; and they're making say 10k for 6 months of work. maybe boost them 10K for those 6 mos. and that works out to $1M.

That seems awfully petty to be fighting over that much. Maybe Im missing something?
   12. Howie Menckel Posted: August 17, 2019 at 09:25 PM (#5872237)
this ZZ guy follows me on Twitter, so I am glad to see his name in the bright lights
   13. My name is RMc and I feel extremely affected Posted: August 18, 2019 at 07:46 AM (#5872276)
When 50-100 cities lose minor league baseball b/c the owners eliminate minor league teams, or move them to the Caribbean, that not going to be terribly popular with the fans.


More likely, the majors will simply move their minor league teams to central locations or complexes: all minor leagues will be like the AZL and GCL. Or the minor (maybe AAA?) teams will be moved into or near the MLB's team city, a trend we're already seeing in MLS and the NHL.
   14. ReggieThomasLives Posted: August 19, 2019 at 04:10 PM (#5872670)
I'm surprised that people are ignoring the severely negative economic consequences of this change would have for all of baseball.

For example, how can the Marlins afford to pay another $1M to their minor league talent every year? They can barely afford to pay the major-league minimum to their "major league" team. They may have to be contracted if this passes, and Jeter will have to move them in the Independent leagues.

Wait, I mean to talk about negative economic consequences, hmmm, give me a few days to think of some.
   15. GregD Posted: August 19, 2019 at 04:26 PM (#5872675)
When 50-100 cities lose minor league baseball b/c the owners eliminate minor league teams, or move them to the Caribbean, that not going to be terribly popular with the fans.
As Sunday Silence suggests:

The idea that teams are going to take on massive travel costs and a multitude of other costs to hold the line against any small increase in payment to labor is

1) an insane way for businesses to operate since travel costs are, you know, costs, too

2) actually descriptive of the stupid way that many big businesses have run themselves into the ground by racking up massive costs in an effort to hold down labor costs

Given that, I'm sure that's exactly what MLB would do, then lose catastrophic money on it, then end up spending more money to reopen their minor league teams.

A relative who runs commercial lending for a fairly important region for a very big bank says he has two kinds of clients:

1) landlords with stable rent rolls that look a little below market and businesses with stable labor forces with labor costs that look a little above market

2) landlords constantly turning over and sitting on empty properties to hit market and businesses constantly searching for more labor to avoid raising wages $2 an hour

And the ones in #2 think they're geniuses and are in perilous cycles of catastrophe and success, and the ones in #1 are flourishing.
   16. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 19, 2019 at 04:41 PM (#5872679)
Because MLB teams are just dying to pay for flights out of Santo DOmingo w/ 6 hour layovers when they need an emergency catcher or spot starter from triple A.

The idea that teams are going to take on massive travel costs and a multitude of other costs to hold the line against any small increase in payment to labor is

1) an insane way for businesses to operate since travel costs are, you know, costs, too


As Rennie's Tenet already noted, they won't move AAA or AA. They'll move Rookie and A- teams. Half the minor leaguers are already Latin American. Flying them from Panama to the Dominican Republic won't cost any more than flying them to Albuquerque.
   17. GregD Posted: August 19, 2019 at 04:58 PM (#5872686)
As Rennie's Tenet already noted, they won't move AAA or AA. They'll move Rookie and A- teams. Half the minor leaguers are already Latin American. Flying them from Panama to the Dominican Republic won't cost any more than flying them to Albuquerque.
many Rookie League teams already play within a 20-mile radius where they take short and cheap bus rides to each other. Your plan would dramatically raise other costs in order to get a small amount of labor savings. Which sounds like what has driven US businesses into the ground for a few decades, since consultants took over

ed: distances are right for the Arizona league. Gulf Coast League looks more like a 50-mile radius. But still short bus rides. As everyone already knows, there already is a Dominican Summer League for Rookie League level, and that wasn't caused by minimum wage laws.
   18. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: August 19, 2019 at 05:11 PM (#5872692)
many Rookie League teams already play within a 20-mile radius where they take short and cheap bus rides to each other. Your plan would dramatically raise other costs in order to get a small amount of labor savings. Which sounds like what has driven US businesses into the ground for a few decades, since consultants took over

ed: distances are right for the Arizona league. Gulf Coast League looks more like a 50-mile radius. But still short bus rides. As everyone already knows, there already is a Dominican Summer League for Rookie League level, and that wasn't caused by minimum wage laws.


So, they already have one league in the Dominican, clearly the costs aren't prohibitive.

What is the actual increased expense of having 10 A league clubs in a 10 mile radius in Mexico or the Dominican? Heck, they can all play at one compound with 20 fields and dorms for the players. Food will be cheaper. Housing will be cheaper. They'll even get to pay the players Dominican minimum wage, which I'm sure is a lot lower than what they get now.

You talk about "other costs". What are these?
   19. Sunday silence Posted: August 19, 2019 at 05:26 PM (#5872696)
Other costs might be building a new facility, I mean I guess they have training facilities right? Also decreased gate revenue but then again its probably not much. But even worse is if say 10 teams did this and the other 20 didnt, I would imagine those ten would lose a whole lot of ball players after a season or so.

So youre moving your 2 lowest teams? Thats what 50 players? How much do you save 500k? I doubt you'd make any of that back but you might break even.

what about housing? Dont these guys mostly live with locals who take them in? I wonder how that would go over in Santo Domingo or wherever.
   20. GregD Posted: August 19, 2019 at 05:49 PM (#5872702)
How many players do you lose to NCAA scholarships in football before you've decided you've made a horrible mistake? It's completely plausible that a person truly on the fence would decide to give a try to AZ or FL but not to Dominican Republic.

Shoot you could turn your 250k in labor savings into millions in lost value in a heart beat. In fact this would have a chance to go down as one of the worst business decisions in history!

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