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This is just embarassing.
And I asked this question in Clutch Hits about the Ron Cook column, but doesn't it seem like a really bad move for Kevin McClatchy to come out in the thick of Dave Littlefield's dealing and state that the Bucs have lost $30 million in the last three years and are going to have to slash payroll? Doesn't that put Littlefield behind the eight ball with GMs? It seems to me that if I were dealing with Littlefield, I'd be less inclined to offer him a legit prospect because he HAS to move Ramirez. Like he doesn't really have a choice in the matter.
This organization just took a HUGE step backwards.
Jb
Surely 1995 and the Phil Nevin trade aren't all that far away.
Other points...
Look, my comment about Cruz was only half-serious and more a statement on how bad this deal looks if it isn't someone of that ilk. I wouldn't have done this deal without Lofton, gettng him thrown in makes Hendry look like Branch Rickey. If I were a Pirate fan, I think I'd start hoping that Tommy Maddox stays healthy for the Steelers so there's something to remember for the next couple of years. "Littledeal" strikes again!
Yes, but my point is that someone, in fact, does remember.
If this is true, yikes! The Pirates get taken here.
Nevertheless, as much as I wish it weren't true, I think LFH will stay on the team even if Goodwin is healthy. As much as I'd like to send him on the next bus out of town, doing so would not only lose a lefty, but would leave the team with 6 OFs. I'd say there's a 99% chance that the guy to drop would be Trenidad Hubbard.
Finally, as for the PTBNL being Hagerty, Vlad reported this rumor based on something he linked from a Pirates message board. I don't believe it, mainly because Hendry mentioned a list of potential candidates and because I believe (?) that transactions involving PTBNLs have to be resolved within 6 months, and Hagerty will be out for another year or so.
He aged 2 years overnight, and had a bad 2002 as a starter in AA.
Not only that, but nothing at all in the way of a backup 1B option for Karros. I don't see it happening either, unless the Cubs do something like pick up Vander Wal or Stairs, who happen to be guys they could use anyway.
This is true. However, he'll need to come off the DL (if only briefly) before the Rule V draft, and he could be exchanged at that time. November 20 (the deadline to finalize rosters) is less than six months away from now.
I actually heard the Hagerty rumor on the radio; the message board thing was just a link because someone asked for a link. It makes intuitive sense, though: there's a valid reason he'd be NL (the injury), it feeds Littlefield's pitching fetish, and he was in the rotation at Ball State when the Pirates were scouting JVB.
Even if it is Hagerty, it's still a sucky trade.
My guess on the Hernandez thing is that the Pirates didn't so much want him as need somebody to cover third base for the rest of the season.
http://www.post-gazette.com/pirates/20030723trade0723p3.asp
Well, I'm certainly glad that's cleared up.
"'Do I think I'm going to be here? I'm thinking about reporting Friday to Latrobe,' Giles said jokingly, referring to the start of Steelers training camp."
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/sports/pirateslive/s_145901.html
He also says that he and his teammates brought this on by not playing better, which is an unusually insightful statement for a player.
Gonzalez had back spasms, which isn't good, but isn't as bad as an arm surgery, either.
After some half-assed investigation, it was 1250 (the local ESPN affiliate) that mentioned Hagerty.
Why I remember stuff like this and forget to buy toothpaste at the market is personally chilling to me.
-- According to MLB's Minor League Transaction Glossary, Hagerty will come off the DL, because the DL period does not extend to the off-season. From that standpoint, I suppose Hagerty could be the PTBNL.
Nevertheless, FYI -- as a 2002 draftee, Hagerty isn't subject to this year's Rule V draft anyway (he will be in 2004).
If Ramirez had a better OBP, he'd be worthwhile for the Bucs to hang on to, but since he doesn't, I'd part with him. My feeling is that the Pirates are insane to be using Kendall behind the plate everyday, but his OBP is too good to rest him. I'd put him at 3rd, I'd put Jose Hernandez at short, bench Jack Wilson or Nunez, and start giving Free Craig Wilson! more playing time, this means behind the plate.
I thought that date of signing wasn't a determining factor for the minor-league portion of the Rule V draft, and that Hagerty would need to be on someone's reserved list. Otherwise, how would anyone ever be taken in the AA portion?
In Hagerty's case, he was 21 when he signed, but it was after the 2002 draft, so he need not be placed on the 40-man roster until just before the 2004 draft.
As for your second question (how would anyone ever be taken in the AA portion), I'm not exactly sure how the minor league reserve lists are set up, but the AAA and AA drafts are taken from the leftovers. What you're left with, though, are essentially minor league roster-fillers -- certainly not major league prospects who are not yet eligible for Rule V protection.
Dan's comment reminded me of some numbers I ran... the AL by DIPS ERA of *starting pitchers* only, park-adjusted using 2003 PFs. A rough estimate of the rank of starting staffs in the AL, with defense taken out of the equation.
Bos 3.71
The Sox currently stand at -24.3 ARP. That's pretty bad. Ramiro Mendoza, Bob Howry, Brandon Lyon, Robert Person, Ryan Rupe, Jason Shiell, Matt White, Steve Woodard, Kevin Tolar, Rudy Saenez, and Hector Almonte were at -45.9. None of those pitchers are the Red Sox' problem in the bullpen any longer. Yet the Sox bullpen is still a weakness, give me a friggin' break.
Can you go a bit more in-depth rather than just throwing this comment out there?
You can't just assume Fox is going to get hurt. Certainly he's an injury risk and has already been hurt, but he has been well rested and his injury could easily be attributable to a minor change in mechanics due to being mindful to past injury. I have personally had shoulder trouble in the past, and even when my shoulder wouldn't be hurt, I'd end up changing my delivery as to not reinjure myself.
As a Brewer fan, I say to you, if you are counting on Chad Fox's arm to remain in one piece for any extended period of time - RECONSIDER :)
I, too, got burned thinking the same thing more often that I care to admit.
I definitely wouldn't bet against him getting hurt, but I think it's quite a reasonable expectation to get 25-30 solid innings out of him from now until the end of September. His arm had quite a rest up until the beginning of July, so I would think that lessens the chance of an injury a little bit.
Honestly, watching Fox when he is on is absolutely amazing. He doesn't have an incredible fastball, but when his curve and slider is working, he's quite a fun pitcher to watch. His slider is one of the best I've seen in recent years.
The frustrating part, as I'm sure you're well aware, is his health. You never know with him if the pitch he's throwing is his last. I remain, however, an optimist that he can give two good months.
Losing him would be a disappointment, but it's not like he's currently being relied on to pitch a boatload of high leverage innings.
What the cubs do have in their system is PITCHERS on top of PITCHERS. I really think that it will be one of these guys that is involved in the trade.
As for all the examples of PTBNLs that were more than "roster fillers" the fact that the examples are 8, 20+ years old does tend to do as much to bolster the point as to refute it.
Speaking of PTBNLs, has Hendry gotten anyone back from the Rangers for the original Alan Benes deal?
On another note, I actually heard a rumor that Corey Patterson was going to be the PTBNL! Does that tell anyone about the validity of "rumors"?
"OK, we'll take him back and send you another player too to make up for his sorry performance. Sorry for the mishap!"
If Hill's the PTBNL, I feel a lot better about the deal, though it still isn't fair value.
I'm not sure if the numbers bear it out, but I'd assume pitchers like Fox are more injury prone than finesse types.
The only way this can be screwed up is if the team decides not to go with Hill now that they've gotten one middle infielder.
Let's not tempt them. DL has finally, finally, finally traded for a hitter (as opposed to Randall Simon). I'm almost afraid to hope we might end up with two.
The Pgh. papers are reporting that DL has said Sanchez will not play 3B. He apparently will play 2B and, as a result, it appears likely the Pirates will take Beltran rather than Hill. I guess having 483 bullpen prospects is more important than having one thirdbaseman.
I realize that he has another year on his contract for good $$$, which might the only thing keeping him around thus far.
1. He's 25 (26 in December)
Williams was going to cost the Pirates $2.3 million for the rest of the season plus his buyout.
I wish they'd get rid of him, if only because I don't like drunk drivers.
Maybe it's not on a level with Schilling and Vazquez, but if you're a Pirate fan it's nice to get a little morsel of news now and then, just to pretend that they're a real big league team.
Apparently it has. Littlefield has figured out that he can get rid of prospects in the Rule 5 draft without having to take on veterans in exchange.
Higgins is cool; he's like an aye-aye with that extra-long finger.
These signings suck. We'd better hope nobody gets hurt this year.
Perrotto also though Bobby Hill was out of options, but Hill has two left. I think he's right about Albaladejo, though.
And in REALLY big news, the Bucs have supposedly signed Daryle Ward.
####, ####, ####. Just when it seems the offseason can't get any worse, DL finds new and interesting ways to surprise me. Acevedo as closer? Ward as Matt Stairs?
Littlefield seemed like such a nice boy; where did his mother go wrong?
He's had a couple of crappy years, but he's still only 28. If he figures out what the hell is wrong, the Pirates get some cheap power.
The Pirates are close to signing Daryle Ward to a minor-league contract. He played 52 games with the Los Angeles Dodgers last year and hit .183 without a home run. He also played in 34 games with the Dodgers' Class AAA affiliate in Las Vegas, hitting .297 with four home runs.
Acevedo's a crappy pitcher, and he's probably got a 50/50 chance at being next year's closer. Ward's got nothing beyond a bit of power, and he's probably in line for a platoon role at first or right field.
Also, Dan, are you sure about de los Santos? I heard that the shortstop was Tomas de la Rosa, not that there's a huge difference between the two.
I'm the last person to accuse anybody of being too negative about Littlefield these days, but last spring he brought in a whole raft of veteran flotsam and most of them saw little or nothing of PNC. Quite a few got released. Mike Holtz spent the year at Nashville, Pat Mahomes spent almost all of it there. I fully expect to get somebody lousy to fill both the closer and LH-power-hitter roles, but I don't think it's going to be Acevedo and especially not Ward. (How does a guy his size go over 100 ABs with one XBH?)
Then again, Littlefield could be the second coming of Larry Doughty.
I also don't mind the Ward signing in the abstract. Hopefully his awful 2003 showing removed the Proven Veteran Magic. It's just that if you're willing to potentially spend $600K on him or a little over $1M on Meadows and Nunez, why wouldn't you be willing to offer Stairs more than $700K?
If he's really that good a prospect, they'll probably lose him in the Rule 5 draft, anyway.
Brad Eldred probably qualifies as remotely interesting, though not much more at this point. Also, Chris Shelton is technically still with the organization (for another day, anyway).
Personally, I think J.R. House would look just fine at third, if you aren't willing to put Sanchez there.
* pitchers Juan Acevedo, Hector Almonte, Nelson Figueroa, Chris Fussell, Paul Maholm, Jose Mesa, Reed, Elio Serrano and Blake Stein;
* catchers Sandy Martinez and Keith McDonald;
* infielders Tomas De La Rosa, Donaldo Mendez and Chris Truby;
* outfielders Andy Abad, Chris Singleton, Luke Allen, and Daryle Ward.
That's a lot of guys we've heard of before. Not exactly a youth movement....
"The existence of both Long and Singleton is something I find troubling for the A's. If the A's don't want Long playing centerfield, there's no reason for him to have a job since I believe Piatt is out of options and I like both Piatt and Byrnes better. If Long can play centerfield, then Byrnes is a perfectly adequate backup and then there's no reason to have Singleton on the team.
Just the idea that Long and Singleton could be 2/3 of the starting OF should be something to chill the blood of A's fans. The A's won't give a minor league award if you walk less than 10% of the time, but they will give you a major league job?"
Yeah, I was *really* gave Beane a pass.
What are the Pirates' options at CF after Redman and Singleton?
I'm still holding out hope for "neither". In which case, it could be Ryan Vogelsong, Josh Fogg, Brian Boehringer, or some still free agent like Willis Roberts.
With any luck, Mesa will look so completely and utterly done in ST that he'll be released or buried in AAA all year.
The best internal non-Singleton CF option is probably either Bay or Tony Alvarez. The organizational buzz on Alvarez is that he's really stretched out of a corner, though I haven't seen him play enough to confirm or deny.
-- MWE
What devastating question should he ask McClendon, preferably involving Wilson?
It's not a Craig Wilson question, but you could probably start a few fights with that one.
If you really want to quiz him about Craig, though, you could ask Lloyd what he means when he says that he doesn't like the way a player "goes about his business". That's his standard criticism of players that he buries on the bench, and nobody here in Pittsburgh can really tell what he's talking about when he says it. Asking him why the team hasn't just let Craig take one position and stick with it could also work, as could asking why the team doesn't let Craig hit against more RHP, given his respectable .790 OPS against them in the past.
Alternatively, if you feel like being nice, you could ask him to talk about his handling of young starters. That's been pretty much his only strong point as a manager, and it's consistently misunderstood by a certain few jack-holes in the local media.
Any input appreciated.
Speaking of the wrong Wilson, my dad screwed up. It's actually Jack, not Craig. Jason Bay will be there do, as will (for some reason) Manny Sanguillen.
This, of course, is the classic Piratethink defense (not that I'm dissing ERH, this is the way the Pirates themselves think). Other teams would look for a manager who can evaluate players, make competent in-game moves, *and* motivate the players to play hard--either that or get players who play hard of their own accord. But the poor, pitiful, small-market Pirates have to settle for saying, "But our crappy team sure plays hard!," as if that's a noteworthy achievement. It's the same mindset that said they had to keep Kevin Young at 1B because of his glove--always settle for second-rate, because you can't afford the real thing.
Here's an example. Pirates/Brewers, game tied, 9-9, bottom of the ninth. Two outs, Scott Podsednik on second, Richie Sexson at bat, Eddie Perez on deck. McClendon brings in Boehringer (taking out Mike Gonzalez), and asks him to get Sexson out.
Now, remember, the ballgame's over when the next run scores, so there's no real harm to be done by putting a man on first. It's all about whom you'd rather have your pitcher face: Sexson, the All-Star 1B who entered the game with a .897 OPS, or Perez, who entered the game on a 1-18 skid that had dropped his OPS to .717. True, bypassing Sexson would've allowed the Brewers to pinch-hit for Perez, but there are several viable reasons to think that the would have declined. One, they had already used Keith Osik earlier in the game, so if they had done so and failed, they would've spent the remainder of the game with a non-catcher behind the plate. Second, the pinch-hitting options remaining weren't all that special: Rule 5 pick Enrique Cruz, who entered the game with a .246 (!) OPS, and Keith Ginter. While Ginter is a better hitter than Perez, he is definitely not a better hitter than Sexson, so the choice seems fairly clear to me.
Anyhow, McClendon has Boehringer pitch to Sexson with first base open, Sexson slaps a single into the outfield, ballgame. When asked to explain his decision after the game, McClendon pointed out that Sexson had been only 2-10 against Boehringer in his career. Brewers' manager Ned Yost expressed surprise and gratitude at the move.
The hugely frustrating thing is that the team already has an excellent in-house managerial candidate: John Russell, who in 2002 was named Baseball America's Minor-League Manager of the Year and was called by that same publication the best managerial prospect in the minors. If he's willing to be a base coach for a team as incompetent as the Pirates, he's probably willing to manage them, right?
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