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   1. Toby Posted: September 27, 2004 at 09:24 PM (#880994)
I guess I shouldn't have said he "played" his last game at Fenway. More like he "appeared in uniform for" his last game at Fenway.
   2. bob mong Posted: September 27, 2004 at 11:15 PM (#881114)
Burks for HOF?

He is a centerfielder, and his stats match up okay with the other post-WWII HOF centerfielders: Kirby Puckett, Duke Snider, Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle, Larry Doby, and Richie Ashburn

Those guys put up this average line:
   G    H   2B  3B  HR R+RBI  AVG OBP SLG OPS+
2174 2368  367  86 349  2623  301 388 501 140
Ellis Burks' numbers:
   G    H   2B  3B  HR R+RBI  AVG OBP SLG OPS+
1999 2106  402  63 352  2456  291 363 510 126
Burks' numbers aren't quite as good, but they're close.
   3. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: September 28, 2004 at 12:57 AM (#881391)
Is he dead?
   4. Miko Supports Shane's Spam Habit Posted: September 28, 2004 at 04:35 AM (#881970)
Don't forget context--Burks did a lot of his damage 1993+, when offense increased. (Plus, he played 5 season in CO.)

Also, the last year he played 100+ games in CF was 1991.
   5. bob mong Posted: September 28, 2004 at 04:41 PM (#882655)
Don't forget context--Burks did a lot of his damage 1993+, when offense increased. (Plus, he played 5 season in CO.)

True enough. That's why I provided the OPS+ numbers. I think he really is a bit shy of being a HOF-quality player, but he is close.

Also, the last year he played 100+ games in CF was 1991.

Also true, but he has played more games in CF than anywhere else:
   G  Pos
1062  CF
 360  RF
 290  LF
 298  DH
That's before this year. He hasn't played as many games at CF as the guys I mentioned above (they averaged 1800+ games at CF), but you can't really classify him as anything other than a CF.
   6. Mikαεl Posted: September 28, 2004 at 04:48 PM (#882665)
Burks is a classic Hall of the Very Good.

Because he jumped between teams and peaked in obscurity, it is lost just a bit how excellent a baseball player he was. While comparing Burks to Hall of Famers will show Burks not quite measuring up, it's a testament to his overlooked career that the comparison can reasonably be made.
   7. villageidiom Posted: September 28, 2004 at 05:12 PM (#882702)
Is he dead?

No, but at the game on Sunday we were perplexed by the announcement. Apparently he'd announced his retirement that morning; nobody had heard about it by the time the game started.

When they announced that it was likely his last regular season game at Fenway, the prevailing thought was, "So they already decided they don't want him back, and they're breaking it to him this way? That's cold."

Anyway... mamaidiom accompanied me on Sunday, and Burks was one of her favorite players in his prior stint in Boston. She was thrilled to have the chance to pay her respects, and figured she'd sort out the details later.
   8. Ozzie's gay friend Posted: September 28, 2004 at 05:25 PM (#882728)
If Ellis had stayed healthy I think he'd be a hall of famer.

Growing up Ellis was one of my favorite players, they way he left Boston never sat quite right with me, and I'm glad theo brought him back so he could see how much the Red Sox and Boston have changed.

I hope they can find Ellis a nice position somewhere in the organization, I'd love to see him coaching in fenway someday.
   9. villageidiom Posted: September 28, 2004 at 06:43 PM (#882892)
Growing up Ellis was one of my favorite players, they way he left Boston never sat quite right with me...

I'm right with you on the first part. I was sad to see him go, but not Fisk-to-the-White-Sox sad.

But at the same time, IIRC, they let him go because he always seemed to be injured. Now maybe they were thinking he was faking or otherwise exaggerating his injuries so he could hang out with Mia Enrique someone instead of playing ball. Or maybe they were seriously concerned about true fragility taking away too much of his PT.

Was there more to the story? I don't recall. Joseph, what am I missing?
   10. Sexy Lizard Posted: September 28, 2004 at 08:11 PM (#883077)
I will always recall Ellis throwing a baseball with Mike Dukakis in Brookline on Election Day, 1988. I don't think that helps his case for the Hall.
   11. Phil Riley Posted: September 28, 2004 at 09:37 PM (#883294)
Well, yeah, of course they always consider what candidates a player appeared with when they do the HOF vote. Main criterion, in fact.
   12. bob mong Posted: September 28, 2004 at 10:59 PM (#883401)
Also, the last year he played 100+ games in CF was 1991.

Also true


Small correction: Burks played 114 games in CF in 1998. Prior to that, the last time he played 100+ games in CF was 1991.
   13. Ozzie's gay friend Posted: September 29, 2004 at 07:54 AM (#884676)
a nice goodbye here

village, I always had heard that Ellis was uncomfortable with the racial tension in boston at the time, among other things.

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