Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Sox Therapy > Discussion
Sox Therapy
— Where Thinking Red Sox Fans Obsess about the Sox

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Fancy Pants Handles lap changes with class Posted: April 11, 2010 at 12:55 PM (#3499870)
Tek's 2 HR's against Greinke clearly show that TF is smarter than you Darren.

*La La La - sticks fingers in ears*
   2. RobertMachemer Posted: April 11, 2010 at 02:02 PM (#3499885)
Well, Francona has the 'advantage' of (or at least the information gained from) talking to the men in the clubhouse and the upper management. I can come up with plenty of reasons why Francona might have played the lineup he did that involve some of those sorts of reasons that go beyond what we know of their splits against righties/lefties...

* Perhaps Varitek hits certain righties (power/groundball/etc.) better than others. Perhaps Ortiz hits some worse.
* Perhaps Ortiz wasn't feeling well. Perhaps Varitek's well-known sleep ailment affects him least on Saturdays in the central time zone.
* Perhaps Beckett has a strong preference to pitch to Varitek. And perhaps Francona believes that the advantage of having regularly-scheduled rests during the regular season (every Beckett start, every other Beckett start) outweighs the platoon advantage lost/gained.

Most of the same sorts of ideas work for Lowell/Martinez vs. Beltre/Ortiz too. Plus there are the ideas of...

* Maybe Lowell strongly prefers playing the field to DHing and feels he'll contribute more as a hitter if he's also in the game defensively.
* Maybe Youkilis's arm was sore. Maybe Beltre asked for the day off. Maybe Martinez wasn't feeling up to playing first.
* Maybe the Red Sox recognize that trading Lowell would be mutually beneficial both to Lowell and the Red Sox, and the advantage gained by demonstrating that he can still play the field is worth quite a bit to them in the long run.

It's one game. It may have been the optimal lineup for clubhouse cohesion and/or future trade possibilities. And they won. *shrugs*
   3. Dale Sams Posted: April 11, 2010 at 02:07 PM (#3499888)
And maybe Francona went 'eeenie-meenie miny moe'.
   4. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: April 11, 2010 at 03:35 PM (#3499908)
2009 #s;

Beckett pitching to VMart - 1.021 OPS
Beckett pitching to Varitek - .625 OPS

For a lot of reasons I don't put much stock in those numbers but I think the Sox are at least skeptical of Martinez/Beckett as a combination.

I think the rest of what you are talking about can be explained by personnel management, not statistical management. Lowell makes more sense as a DH but if one night as a third baseman keeps him motivated and from becoming a clubhouse disruption it is not a big deal.

Ortiz is a similar thing. The decision has been made not to platoon Lowell/Ortiz. Again, we can quibble about that but for now that is the decision. Thus, if Ortiz is your DH he has to start Opening Night and then Pettitte has never been a lefty-killer so you feed the media/fans the juicy story they want by sitting him against Pettitte.

Ultimately I think you are right more than you are wrong but;

- it's five games
- the personalities involved I think make these decisions a bit more complex than they otherwise might/should be.
   5. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: April 11, 2010 at 03:57 PM (#3499915)
the personalities involved I think make these decisions a bit more complex than they otherwise might/should be.

Stupid human beings. When is the Robot Revolution?
   6. Matt Clement of Alexandria Posted: April 11, 2010 at 04:31 PM (#3499921)
The Varitek thing is explicable - the Red Sox are clearly better with Varitek on the bench, so he didn't play against the Yankees. While Varitek is better against LHP, the Red Sox don't face a lefty until Liriano next Thursday. Martinez can't catch every day, so Varitek was going to start against a right-hander at some point this weekend.

If Ortiz turned out to need a rest, again, they couldn't wait until the next lefty to give it to him. Perhaps he wouldn't have needed a rest if he'd sat against Pettitte, though.

I don't know what was up with Lowell at 3B - I missed most of the game, how bad did he look over there?
   7. rLr Is King Of The Romans And Above Grammar Posted: April 11, 2010 at 04:37 PM (#3499924)
Stupid human beings. When is the Robot Revolution?

Gustavo Chacin broke down.
   8. Dale Sams Posted: April 11, 2010 at 04:42 PM (#3499932)
how bad did he look over there?


This bad
   9. Hugh Jorgan Posted: April 12, 2010 at 02:07 AM (#3500359)
Ortiz looks so bad he shouldn't be starting against underhand pitching, nevermind the leftie/righty thing.
That whole Beck to Tek pitching/catching combo seems to work...and as mentioned above, Vmart can't catch everyday anyway. If Beckett is going to be more successful throwing to Tek, well then I say make it a regular thing and see how it's going half way through the season.
   10. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: April 12, 2010 at 03:21 PM (#3500569)
This bad


Pathetic. He didn't come close to ending up in the stands.
   11. Nasty Nate Posted: April 12, 2010 at 03:36 PM (#3500578)
unrelated: its kind of fund to have a hacker on the team again (Beltre). Of course it will get frustrating, but for now i like the novelty of his free-swinging.
   12. Styles P. Deadball Posted: April 12, 2010 at 03:49 PM (#3500587)
the personalities involved I think make these decisions a bit more complex than they otherwise might/should be.

Stupid human beings. When is the Robot Revolution?


Yeah, but you could end up with Ultron. He's the Milton Bradley of self-aware maniacal robots.
   13. Infinite Joost (Voxter) Posted: April 12, 2010 at 03:56 PM (#3500594)
I AM ULTRON. I KNOW YOU. #### TO YOU.
   14. tfbg9 Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:17 AM (#3501209)
You forgot to mention how much better Lowell hits at home vs the road. Missing key things like this
shows me you're not quite ready to skipper our beloved, scruffy Red Sox.

Fome the internet play-by-play accounts of today's game, it sounded like Lester's control was mostly absent, and he got
nickled and dimed to death by keenly placed dribblers. And that Victah is going to challenge Jimbo's record. All true?
   15. Joel W Posted: April 13, 2010 at 04:31 AM (#3501287)
Lester was bad in the first couple innings, and then was a bit better from them. I remain unconcerned as he's still striking batters out.
   16. tfbg9 Posted: April 13, 2010 at 12:50 PM (#3501370)
Fair enough, but look at your handle.
   17. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:06 PM (#3501379)
Fome the internet play-by-play accounts of today's game, it sounded like Lester's control was mostly absent, and he got
nickled and dimed to death by keenly placed dribblers. And that Victah is going to challenge Jimbo's record. All true?


Listening on the radio it sounded like the Twins hit some shots. Mauer's out in the first for example was a bullet according to Joe and the inning could have been a lot worse.

Victah's not challenging anything, he's set to go shooting past it by the All Star Break.

I'm with Joel re: Lester. He'll be fine.
   18. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:24 PM (#3501400)
Speaking of radio, I was fearing the worst when I heard John Rish the first few games. Good to hear Dave O'Brien the past few. He said something that was almost poetic Friday nite.
   19. Mattbert Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:24 PM (#3501402)
I think it's as simple as Tito playing only his "best" guys in the opening series at home vs the Yanks, while looking ahead to the trip to KC as an opportunity to play the house money lineup without totally throwing away a chance at a win. If the Sox had opened up against pretty much any other team, I reckon Tito might've played those games a bit less conservatively. But there was no way he was going to "embarrass" Papi by sitting him in any of the first few games of the year...against the Yankees...at Fenway. Not under that spotlight. No way.
   20. Famous Original Joe C Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:32 PM (#3501411)
Speaking of radio, I was fearing the worst when I heard John Rish the first few games. Good to hear Dave O'Brien the past few. He said something that was almost poetic Friday nite.

I have to assume this is because O'Brien is in demand for national broadcasts as well?
   21. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: April 13, 2010 at 01:36 PM (#3501419)
Yeah, he must've had some assignments last week. Rish (sp) rubs me the same way Gefner rubbed most of us a couple years back.
   22. Hugh Jorgan Posted: April 13, 2010 at 11:53 PM (#3502001)
I AM ULTRON. I KNOW YOU. #### TO YOU

Holy crap Voxter, I thought you have morphed into TOLAXER for a minute there.
   23. GGC don't think it can get longer than a novella Posted: April 14, 2010 at 05:16 PM (#3502554)
Rish (sp) is doing the game today. O'Brien must be on ESPN tonite.
   24. RobertMachemer Posted: April 18, 2010 at 10:47 PM (#3506753)
The Red Sox have begun the season 4-8.

The last time they began a season this poorly was 1996 (when, after winning the East, they dug such a hole for themselves in the early going that they could not get back to the playoffs).

Of Red Sox teams, only the 1903 team started the year off with a sub-.500 record in its first 12 decisions and went on to win the World Series.
   25. Darren Posted: April 18, 2010 at 10:57 PM (#3506759)
I just can't get that worked up about this, which says a lot more about my attitude this year than anything else. They've had a comically bad start to the season but haven't dug nearly a deep enough hole to bury themselves yet. Ortiz looks like he's coming around (maybe?) and Lester's better than this. Cameron and Beltre will not continue to make stupid errors on routine plays.
   26. Hugh Jorgan Posted: April 18, 2010 at 11:06 PM (#3506763)
The last time they began a season this poorly was 1996 (when, after winning the East, they dug such a hole for themselves in the early going that they could not get back to the playoffs).

Of Red Sox teams, only the 1903 team started the year off with a sub-.500 record in its first 12 decisions and went on to win the World Series


Gee, thanks Robert for that positive news...

The only positive I can take from it right now is that 3 of their first 4 series, have been played against some seriously good squads and they've been ambushed a little bit. I haven't checked the schedule, but hopefully they'll have a nice run soon against some of the...let's call them crappier teams. Where's Baltimore when you need them?
   27. Biff, highly-regarded young guy Posted: April 18, 2010 at 11:17 PM (#3506767)
Everyone just breathe. The season is young. The start is troubling, of course, but there's still quite a long way to go.
   28. Darren Posted: April 18, 2010 at 11:18 PM (#3506769)
We're Baltimore right now. They haven't just lost, they've done it by playing maddeningly awful baseball on several levels. They blew the suspended game in about 10 different ways.
   29. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: April 18, 2010 at 11:40 PM (#3506781)
Baltimore comes to town on Friday.

I'm with Biff, it's too early to get too worked up though with Tampa and the Bombers off to good starts (thanks in part to our malaise) we can't afford to fall too far back. Still, I'd be more worried if this were happening while Lester was pitching well and guys like Youk and Martinez were swinging hot bats.

While I assume Robert is right about the bad start, every team of the last decade has had a similar stretch at some point in the season. It's always a bit easier to take when it happens in June or July but 4-8 over 12 games is not particularly unusual.

And I agree with Darren on Ortiz, I think he is starting to look alright.

Worst case, my friends who are getting married in October might not be on my shitlist for making me miss a playoff game and I'll give them a gift after all.
   30. Infinite Joost (Voxter) Posted: April 19, 2010 at 12:09 AM (#3506797)
Lester's better than this


This feels so familiar, too: he did the same thing last year. Solid -- sometimes great -- perhipherals, millions of hits, ludicrously high ERA. And then from May he was Sandy Koufax for four months. I keep telling myself it's a fluke.

Anyway, it's still early. I think this is a team that was built on some gambles that may have turned into flaws -- but it's also a front office that has shown a consistent ability to correct mistakes on the fly. Even if Ortiz is warming up a little (and I can't deny it's possible -- he looked just as done last April as he has for most of this one), I still think there's a strong possiblity that a change is made, particularly if we're in third place come May.
   31. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: April 19, 2010 at 01:12 AM (#3506887)
Same thing in 2008 too Dal, 5.40 ERA in his first six starts, under 3.00 the rest of the way.
   32. RobertMachemer Posted: April 19, 2010 at 03:29 AM (#3507182)
Oh, I'm not especially worried. I do think that the talent on the Rays and Yankees is high enough that a bad start is worse than it would be in other years -- there's no guarantee that the Red Sox have even the second best team in the division, so it's entirely possible they won't make up the ground -- but even good teams lose games from time to time.
   33. Jolly Old St. Nick Is A Jolly Old St. Crip Posted: April 19, 2010 at 03:47 AM (#3507202)
Oh, I'm not especially worried. I do think that the talent on the Rays and Yankees is high enough that a bad start is worse than it would be in other years -- there's no guarantee that the Red Sox have even the second best team in the division, so it's entirely possible they won't make up the ground -- but even good teams lose games from time to time.

What would concern me if I were hoping for the Yankees to fall back is their defense. Ten straight games without an error, vastly improved LF and CF, and what looks like a far more confident Cano. They've also taken their offensive pitch wasting skills to a new plateau (Nick Johnson has a .176 BA / .429 OBP), and only two opposing starters have made it into the 7th inning. Way too early to say anything definite, but to my eyes, at least, they look like they're playing for the first time in years with that monkey off their backs, and look like they've got the potential to be the best MLB team since 1998.

And that'll be fifty bucks from each of you for this premium first class whammy. They'll probably now go out West and get swept by the A's and Angels.
   34. Hugh Jorgan Posted: April 19, 2010 at 04:06 AM (#3507217)
Even if Ortiz is warming up a little

Sorry, it's a false dawn...and I'm generally an optimist. I reckon Ortiz is done and these last few games are the anomaly not the norm. The team has had a rough start against quality opposition which is amplifying the situation. A simple stretch of 10-12 games against lousy opposition; 10 wins in 12 games and the problem will be behind them.
   35. Crispix reaches boiling point with lackluster play Posted: April 19, 2010 at 04:18 AM (#3507221)
Way too early to say anything definite, but to my eyes, at least, they look like they're playing for the first time in years with that monkey off their backs, and look like they've got the potential to be the best MLB team since 1998.


117 wins?
   36. Phil Coorey is a T-Shirt Salesman Posted: April 19, 2010 at 04:23 AM (#3507222)
Screww the tough opposition - the annoying thing is without a doubt how frustrating some of the losses have been and how a few can be attributed to the new 'defence'. The crap the media went on and on about with in the off season made me think that this was always going to bite the Sox in the ass.

I can't wait to play Texas and lose 2/3 after watching them lie down like dogs (as they always do ) for the Yankees
   37. Jose Can Still Seabiscuit Posted: April 19, 2010 at 11:49 AM (#3507275)
33 - Thanks dude, check'll be in the mail Sunday night.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
JE (Jason)
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Syndicate

Page rendered in 0.4177 seconds
41 querie(s) executed