Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Gonfalon Cubs > Discussion
Gonfalon Cubs
— Cubs Baseball for Thinking Fans

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. Dag Nabbit at ExactlyAsOld.com Posted: December 16, 2006 at 02:48 AM (#2262942)
while returning Cub SP Lon Warneke was excellent but unlucky.

In half his dozen starts the Cubs scored 0-2 runs. Admittedly, he didn't help his own cause much with some uncharacteristic weak hitting.

Also, his ERA+ was especially impressive given that 5 of his 12 starts came against the Cards and Dodgers, both of whom won over two-thirds their game that year. Also, the Cards were in the midst of an all-time great pennant run, winning 41 of their last 48. Warneke's 3 starts against his old club all came in that stretch. The Cubs, not surpisingly, lost all those games.

UER did help Warneke's numbers, though.

Departing Veterans—None, really. The Cubs probably kept more pre-war players in 1942 than all the other NL teams.

Did you check the rest of the NL before saying that? The best player in the league who missed 1942 was a guy nicknamed "Losing Pitcher." The AL lost some starts - Greenberg, Feller - but the NL wouldn't be affected until later in the war. There is a reason why the Cubs posted a worse record in '42 than in '41.

Although the Cubs tried their best to get Passeau his 20th win in September, he fell just short.

Both his last starts were against those supersurging Cards. Bummer. He actually won the first for his nineteenth victory. 38,000+ came out to that game in Wrigley in late September with the team well out of the race. I can't imagine that many Cardinals fans would make that trip back then with fuel rationing beginnings. I guess it was the pennant race, though. Must've had good weather, too. Two days later 3,000 showed to see the Reds sweep a doubleheader from the Flubbies.
   2. Fred Garvin is dead to Mug Posted: December 16, 2006 at 04:50 AM (#2263008)
I'm glad you mentioned Warneke's run support, Dag; I was thinking of e-mailing you about it to ask.

The best player in the league who missed 1942 was a guy nicknamed "Losing Pitcher." The AL lost some starts - Greenberg, Feller - but the NL wouldn't be affected until later in the war. There is a reason why the Cubs posted a worse record in '42 than in '41.

Yeah, the AL lost more guys in '42 than the NL. My point was that the Cubs didn't lose *anyone* for most of the year. (Johnny Schmitz enlisted toward the end of the season, but that's it.) I believe I read articles saying that all the other NL teams at least lost someone, even if they weren't stars.

As for Passeau, by the end of the season, the Cubs were just playing out the string and didn't have too many things to shoot for. They got looks at still more youngsters, most of whom didn't stick (Cy Block, Whitey Platt, Marv Rickert, Paul Gillespie), though Hank Wyse was a key man on the staff over the next 4 seasons. Basically, getting 20 wins for Passeau was about it.

Of course, there was another consideration: After being behind by as many as 10 games on August 5, the Cardinals caught fire over the rest of the season, going 43-9 the rest of the way, including winning 5 of 6 against the Dodgers.

By the time the Cubs squared off against the Cardinals for a doubleheader in Wrigley on September 20, they were up 2.5 games on the Dodgers with just eight to play -- four against the Cubs and two each against the Pirates and Reds. The Dodgers, meanwhile, were facing the bottom of the league -- six against the Phillies, two against the Braves, and one against the Giants.

The Cubs clearly would have an impact on the pennant race. Indeed, the last day was yet another doubleheader -- if the Cubs had swept, the Dodgers and Cardinals would go to a 3-game playoff. Weeks earlier, Jimmie Wilson was quite adamant that he would play his regulars against the Cardinals and although they only played Brooklyn once in September, they threw Warneke at them, winning 10-2.
   3. Hammered to the Gap Posted: December 20, 2006 at 04:21 PM (#2265752)
1942 was a transition year for the Cubs

I think you can lead them all off that way, can't you?? When was the last STABLE year they had? Maybe under Durocher, but I think you have to go all the way back to Veeck, Sr, like you did for this article.

Great articles, can't wait to see where we end up next!
   4. Fred Garvin is dead to Mug Posted: December 21, 2006 at 05:57 PM (#2266526)
Thanks, but that's a trade secret. :-)

As for the "transition year" label, what I meant was that 1942 was a year in which the team was still coming off their success in '38, dealing with all the turbulence of World War II, and eventually (after '45) will end up just lousy.

By contrast, I wouldn't say that 1952 was a "transition year"; it was just bad. In my mind, "transition" may or may not mean "rebuilding," but it absolutely doesn't mean "bad." 2004 was a "transition year"; 2006 just sucked.
   5. Paul Posted: December 24, 2006 at 03:37 AM (#2267954)
In May 1941, believing all the hype about hot rookie prospect Lou Stringer, Gallagher made way for him by dealing the (then) seven time All-Star 2B Billy Herman to the Dodgers for IF Johnny Hudson, OF Charlie Gilbert, and $50,000. Neither Stringer, Gilbert, nor Hudson would enjoy much productive success after 1941. Two months later, he dealt All-Star OF Augie Galan to the Dodgers for 32 year old RP Mace Brown and cash.
Herman and Galan would be stalwarts for the Dodgers throughout the ‘40s, leading them to consistently battle the Cardinals for the NL pennant. Fueled with the Herman and Galan acquisitions, the Dodgers would go on to win the pennant in 1941, while the Cubs finished in 6th place with a 70-84 record, 30 games out. Suffice it to say that Branch Rickey “owned” Jim Gallagher and the Cubs.


A very interesting article. But the last sentence should say Larry McPhail, not Branch Rickey. Rickey came to the Dodgers after the 1942 season. In fact, Rickey's sale of Warneke could have cost the Cards the pennant (although it obviously did not)
   6. Fred Garvin is dead to Mug Posted: December 24, 2006 at 04:53 PM (#2268085)
Thanks for the correction -- Rickey fleeced the Cubs on a few occasions, but the deals to which I was referring were MacPhail's.
   7. Dan Evensen Posted: July 15, 2007 at 08:09 PM (#2442095)
Sorry to resurrect such an old thread. These articles were among my favorite at BTF -- any chance this series will be continued in the future?
   8. Famous Original Joe C Posted: July 30, 2007 at 06:03 PM (#2461689)
I'll second that. I realize there's plenty of other things to talk about during the season, but I would love to read a few more of these come winter. Good stuff - thanks for posting these.
   9. Andere Richtingen Posted: July 30, 2007 at 06:08 PM (#2461697)
I'll second that. I realize there's plenty of other things to talk about during the season, but I would love to read a few more of these come winter. Good stuff - thanks for posting these.

Hopefully the trip to SABR will get dJF's creative juices flowing for another one.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Dynasty League Baseball

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Dock Ellis
for his generous support.

Bookmarks

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

Syndicate

Page rendered in 0.1786 seconds
35 querie(s) executed