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Hall of Merit — A Look at Baseball's All-Time Best Monday, May 01, 20061975 Results: Drysdale and Mackey are the Newest Hall of Merit Battery!In his debut year, Dodger flamethrower Don Drysdale easily won the top spot for the Hall of Merit with 55% of all possible points. In his 27th year of eligiblity, NeL catching legend Biz Mackey finally claimed the prize that has eluded him in the last few elections by obtaining 35% of all possible points. He beat NeL slugger Willard Brown by just 1 point, so “Esse Hombre” will have to wait until ‘76. Mackey is now our 24rd Negro Leaguer to be elected. Rounding out the top-ten were: George Sisler, Joe Gordon, José Méndez , Minnie Minoso, Cannonball Dick Redding, Dobie Moore, and Hugh Duffy. RK LY Player PTS Bal 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1 n/e Don Drysdale 659 42 7 3 5 4 4 2 3 2 2 1 1 1 2 2 3 2 6 Biz Mackey 425 32 1 3 3 1 2 3 2 1 2 3 2 2 2 2 3 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3 5 Willard Brown 424 31 2 3 1 3 3 1 4 2 5 3 3 1 4 3 George Sisler 418 31 2 1 3 3 1 3 3 1 2 7 1 1 3 5 7 Joe Gordon 413 29 1 2 5 3 1 2 2 3 2 4 3 1 6 4 José Méndez 413 26 2 4 1 6 1 1 4 3 3 1 7 8 Minnie Minoso 378 32 2 1 3 2 4 1 4 3 2 4 5 1 8 9 Cannonball Dick Redding 356 22 6 1 2 1 4 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 9 12 Dobie Moore 337 21 4 1 3 5 2 1 1 3 1 10 13 Hugh Duffy 315 20 2 2 1 4 1 1 2 4 1 1 1 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 11 10 Ralph Kiner 306 24 2 1 4 1 1 3 1 2 1 2 4 2 12 14 Joe Sewell 300 24 2 2 2 1 3 1 1 4 1 2 1 4 13 17 Pete Browning 272 18 3 3 1 1 1 3 1 1 1 1 2 14 11 George Van Haltren 271 18 1 4 1 1 1 3 1 3 2 1 15 18 Cupid Childs 252 19 1 3 3 1 2 2 2 1 2 2 16 15 Jake Beckley 246 15 4 2 3 2 1 1 1 1 17 19 Rube Waddell 244 17 2 5 1 1 2 2 1 1 2 18 16 Billy Pierce 237 19 1 1 6 1 2 1 5 1 1 19 n/e Ken Boyer 235 20 1 4 1 1 2 2 2 2 5 20 20 Nellie Fox 210 16 1 1 1 2 1 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 21 21 Quincy Trouppe 209 16 2 1 3 2 1 1 2 2 1 1 22 23 Mickey Welch 187 11 3 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 23 27 Edd Roush 186 13 2 1 2 1 1 3 1 1 1 24 22 Bucky Walters 176 15 1 3 3 2 1 1 1 2 1 25 25 Tommy Leach 174 13 3 1 1 1 1 1 2 2 1 26 28 Charley Jones 165 10 1 2 1 1 3 1 1 27 29 Roger Bresnahan 157 12 1 1 1 1 2 1 1 2 1 1 28 24 Alejandro Oms 155 12 1 3 1 2 1 2 1 1 29 30 Bob Johnson 147 13 1 1 2 2 1 5 1 30 26 Gavy Cravath 139 11 1 1 1 1 1 1 3 1 1 31 32 Burleigh Grimes 133 10 1 1 2 1 2 2 1 32 31 Bob Elliott 131 12 2 1 1 1 1 2 1 3 33 33 Larry Doyle 128 8 1 1 1 2 1 2 34 35 Charlie Keller 119 8 1 1 2 1 2 1 35 34 Wally Schang 97 7 1 1 1 1 2 1 36 36 Dizzy Dean 90 9 1 1 1 1 1 1 2 1 37 37 John McGraw 83 5 2 1 1 1 38 42 Tommy Bridges 55 5 1 1 1 1 1 39 38 Vern Stephens 50 4 1 1 1 1 40 40 Addie Joss 49 4 1 1 1 1 41 49T Bill Monroe 46 4 1 1 2 42 52 Vic Willis 45 4 1 1 1 1 43 39 Pie Traynor 44 3 1 1 1 44 57T Sam Rice 43 5 1 1 3 45 48 Jimmy Ryan 42 5 1 1 2 1 46 41 Carl Mays 41 4 1 3 47 59 Ed Williamson 37 4 1 1 2 48 54 Lefty Gomez 35 3 1 1 1 49 45 Phil Rizzuto 34 3 1 1 1 50 55 Ben Taylor 31 2 1 1 51 53 Elston Howard 30 4 1 1 1 1 52 56 Dutch Leonard 30 3 1 1 1 53 43 Fielder Jones 30 2 1 1 54 49T Frank Chance 27 2 1 1 55 44 Tony Mullane 25 3 1 1 1 56T 60 Ed Cicotte 24 2 1 1 56T 46T Ernie Lombardi 24 2 2 58 57T Gil Hodges 23 2 1 1 59 61T Rabbit Maranville 21 2 1 1 60 61T Fred Dunlap 18 2 1 1 61 49T Chuck Klein 14 1 1 62T 67T Sam Leever 13 1 1 62T 67T Red Schoendienst 13 1 1 64T 67T Bob Friend 12 1 1 64T 46T Dizzy Trout 12 1 1 64T 65 Bobby Veach 12 1 1 67T 70 Artie Wilson 11 1 1 67T 72T Herman Long 11 1 1 69T 71 Bus Clarkson 10 1 1 69T 72T Virgil Trucks 10 1 1 71T 72T Wilbur Cooper 9 1 1 71T 77 Hack Wilson 9 1 1 73T 78T Dave Bancroft 8 1 1 73T 72T Dom DiMaggio 8 1 1 75 78T Curt Simmons 7 1 1 Dropped Out: Tommy Bond(66), Luke Easter(63), Johnny Pesky(64), Spot Poles(72T), Al Rosen(78T). Ballots Cast: 50
John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy
Posted: May 01, 2006 at 11:54 PM | 54 comment(s)
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1. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: May 02, 2006 at 12:15 AM (#1999594)Looked like it was going to be Sisler for most of the election, then Mendez made a big move, only to be overtaken by Brown. You know the rest after that. :-)
Average consensus score -13.2, third lowest on record.
Michael Bass: -5
Tiboreau: -7
Ardo: -7
Chris Fluit: -8
SWW: -9
Brent: -9
TomH: -9
Pedro Feliz Navidad: -9
Esteban Rivera: -9
...
OCF: -11
...
Chris Cobb: -12 (his newfound fondness for long-career glove men has its effect - what's he going to say about Aparicio?)
...
danb: -13
Adam Schafer: -13 (medians)
...
Kelly in SD: -17
DanG: -17
Rick A: -17
rawagman: -18
Daryn: -18
EricC: -20
yest: -22
Jim Sp: -22
KJOK: -22
karlmagnus: -25
HOF-not-HOM through 1975
1. Bancroft, Dave
2. Beckley, Jake
3 Bender, Chief
4 Bottomley, Jim
5 Bresnahan, Roger
6 Chance, Frank
7 Chesbro, Jack
8 Clemente, Roberto**
9 Combs, Earle
10 Cuyler, Kiki
11 Dean, Dizzy
12 Duffy, Hugh
13 Evers, Johnny
14 Gomez, Lefty
15 Grimes, Burleigh
16 Hafey, Chick
17 Haines, Jesse
18 Hooper, Harry
19 Hoyt, Waite
20 Johnson, Judy
21 Kelly, George
22 Kiner, Ralph
23 Manush, Heinie
24 Maranville, Rabbit
25 Marquard, Rube
26 McCarthy, Tommy
27 McGraw, John
28 Pennock, Herb
29 Rice, Sam
30 Roush, Edd
31 Schalk, Ray
32 Sisler, George
33 Tinker, Joe
34 Traynor, Pie
35 Waddell, Rube
36 Waner, Lloyd
37 Welch, Mickey
38 Youngs, Ross
And HOM not-HOF
1 Ashburn, Richie
2 Barnes, Ross
3 Beckwith, John
4 Bennett, Charlie
5 Brown, Ray
6 Caruthers, Bob
7 Charleston, Oscar
8 Connor, Roger
9 Dahlen, Bill
10 Davis, George
11 Dihigo, Martin
12 Doby, Larry
13 Doerr, Bobby
14 Drysdale, Don
15 Ferrell, Wes
16 Foster, Rube
17 Foster, Willie
18 Glasscock, Jack
19 Gore, George
20 Grant, Frank
21 Groh, Heinie
22 Hack, Stan
23 Hill, Pete
24 Hines, Paul
25 Jackson, Joe*
26 Johnson, Home Run
27 Lemon, Bob
28 Lloyd, John Henry
29 Mackey, Biz
30 Magee, Sherry
31 Mathews, Eddie
32 McPhee, Bid
33 McVey, Cal
34 Mize, Johnny
35 Newhouser, Hal
36 Pearce, Dickey
37 Pike, Lip
38 Richardson, Hardy
39 Reese, Pee Wee
40 Roberts, Robin
41 Rogan, Bullet Joe
42 Rusie, Amos
43 Santop, Louis
44 Sheckard, Jimmy
45 Slaughter, Enos
46 Snider, Duke
47 Start, Joe
48 Stearnes, Turkey
49 Stovey, Harry
50 Suttles, Mule
51 Sutton, Ezra
52 Torriente, Cristobal
53 Vaughan, Arky
54 Wells, Willie
55 White, Deacon
56 Williams, Smokey Joe
57 Wilson, Jud
* not eligible for the HOF
** not eligible for the HoM until 1978.
HoMers in bold
all HoFers with significant playing careers are included
1936
Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth, Honus Wagner, Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson
1937
Nap Lajoie, Tris Speaker, Cy Young , Connie Mack, John McGraw, George Wright
1938
Pete Alexander
1939
George Sisler, Eddie Collins , Willie Keeler , Lou Gehrig, Cap Anson , Charlie Comiskey , Candy Cummings , Buck Ewing , Charles Radbourn , Al Spalding
1942
Rogers Hornsby
1945
Roger Bresnahan , Dan Brouthers , Fred Clarke , Jimmy Collins , Ed Delahanty , Hugh Duffy , Hughie Jennings , King Kelly , Jim O’Rourke , Wilbert Robinson
1946
Jesse Burkett , Frank Chance , Jack Chesbro , Johnny Evers , , Clark Griffith, , Tommy McCarthy , Joe McGinnity , Eddie Plank , Joe Tinker , Rube Waddell , Ed Walsh
1947
Carl Hubbell , Frankie Frisch , Mickey Cochrane , Lefty Grove
1948
Herb Pennock , Pie Traynor
1949
Charlie Gehringer , Mordecai Brown , Kid Nichols
1951
Mel Ott , Jimmie Foxx
1952
Harry Heilmann , Paul Waner
1953
Al Simmons , Dizzy Dean , Chief Bender , Bobby Wallace , Harry Wright
1954
Rabbit Maranville , Bill Dickey , Bill Terry
1955
Joe DiMaggio , Ted Lyons , Dazzy Vance , Gabby Hartnett , Frank Baker , Ray Schalk
1956
Hank Greenberg , Joe Cronin
1957
Sam Crawford
1959
Zack Wheat
1961
Max Carey , Billy Hamilton
1962
Bob Feller , Jackie Robinson , Bill McKechnie , Edd Roush
1963
John Clarkson , Elmer Flick , Sam Rice , Eppa Rixey
1964
Luke Appling , Red Faber , Burleigh Grimes , Miller Huggins , Tim Keefe , Heinie Manush , Monte Ward
1965
Pud Galvin
1966
Ted Williams , Casey Stengel
1967
Red Ruffing , Lloyd Waner
1968
Joe Medwick , Kiki Cuyler , Goose Goslin
1969
Stan Musial Roy Campanella , Stan Coveleski , , Waite Hoyt,
1970
Lou Boudreau , Earle Combs , Jesse Haines,
1971
Dave Bancroft , Jake Beckley , Chick Hafey , Harry Hooper , Joe Kelley , Rube Marquard , Satchel Paige
1972
Sandy Koufax , Yogi Berra ,Early Wynn, Lefty Gomez , Ross Youngs , Josh Gibson , Buck Leonard
1973
Warren Spahn , George Kelly , Mickey Welch , Monte Irvin
1974
Mickey Mantle , Whitey Ford , Jim Bottomley , Sam Thompson , Cool Papa Bell
1975
Ralph Kiner , Earl Averill , Bucky Harris , Billy Herman , Judy Johnson
1976
Robin Roberts, Bob Lemon , Roger Connor , Freddy Lindstrom , Oscar Charleston
1977
Amos Rusie , Joe Sewell , Al Lopez , Martin Dihigo , Pop Lloyd
1978
Eddie Mathews, Addie Joss
1979
Hack Wilson
1980
Duke Snider, Chuck Klein
1981
Johnny Mize , Rube Foster
1982
Travis Jackson
1983
George Kell
1984
Don Drysdale, Rick Ferrell , Pee Wee Reese
1985
Enos Slaughter , Arky Vaughan
1986
Bobby Doerr, Ernie Lombardi
1987
Ray Dandridge
1989
Red Schoendienst
1991
Tony Lazzeri
1992
Hal Newhouser
1994
Leo Durocher , Phil Rizzuto
1995
Leon Day , Vic Willis , Richie Ashburn
1996
Bill Foster , Ned Hanlon
1997
Nellie Fox, Willie Wells
1998
George Davis , Larry Doby , Joe Rogan
1999
Joe Williams
2000
Bid McPhee , Turkey Stearnes
2001
Hilton Smith
2006
Ray Brown, Willard Brown, Andy Cooper, Biz Mackey, Mule Suttles, Cristobal Torriente, Jud Wilson, Frank Grant, Pete Hill, Jose Mendez Louis Santop, Ben Taylor, Sol White
Name Votes PCT
Ralph Kiner 273 75.41
Robin Roberts 263 72.65
Bob Lemon 233 64.36
Gil Hodges 188 51.93
Enos Slaughter 177 48.90
Hal Newhouser 155 42.82
Pee Wee Reese 154 42.54
Eddie Mathews 148 40.88
Phil Cavarretta 129 35.64
Duke Snider 129 35.64
Johnny Sain 123 33.98
Phil Rizzuto 117 32.32
George Kell 114 31.49
Red Schoendienst 94 25.97
Richie Ashburn 76 20.99
Don Drysdale 76 20.99
Nellie Fox 76 20.99
Roger Maris 70 19.34
Alvin Dark 48 13.26
Vic Raschi 37 10.22
Ted Kluszewski 33 9.12
Elston Howard 23 6.35
Don Larsen 23 6.35
Mickey Vernon 22 6.08
Walker Cooper 13 3.59
Lew Burdette 11 3.04
Don Newcombe 11 3.04
Bobby Thomson 10 2.76
Ken Boyer 9 2.49
Harvey Haddix 8 2.21
Bill White 7 1.93
Vern Law 6 1.66
Vic Wertz 5 1.38
Dick Groat 4 1.10
Johnny Podres 3 0.83
Rocky Colavito 1 0.28
Bill Virdon 1 0.28
Larry Doby 0 0.00
Kiner gets elected in his last year of BBWAA eligibility.
Newhouser, Cavaretta, and Sain receive "last chance" bumps.
Reynolds was passed over to the VC after 1974.
Well, at least my low-key campaign is having some effect :-)
As to Aparicio, I think I'm going to say that he had a long career, but he wasn't good enough with the glove: neither WARP nor WS sees him as being in Long's or Maranville's league with the leather, and his offensive advantage over Maranville is pretty slim, probably non-existent if you measured Maranville over a portion of his career equal to Aparicio's.
It was THAT close.
I'll have charts and such up tomorrow.
Good night...
Mark would have been the key, since Joe had Sisler in the thirties.
I noticed that both Drysdale and Mackey earned votes in every ballot position #1-15. This has happened before, but when and for whom? I don't remember.
In contrast, Billy Pierce's vote distribution looked like this:
1 0 1 0 0 0 6 0 1 2 0 1 0 5 1 1. Go figure.
Of course, I believe that Jose Mendez and Joe Gordon, my #1 and #2 this year, should be voted in ahead of Sisler and Brown in the 1976 election. <b></b>
Also, after the big Keller push by James and I, I am surprised that Charlie eller only garnered 3 more votes and moved up only one measly spot. I had thought that many voters had reconsidered him. Oh well. I may have to go all karl on you guys to make him a serious candidate, don't know why any peak/prime voter wouldn't have him on their ballot at least.
Just curious, was my prelim used? If not I think it would have made a difference. Gordon would have won by 1 point. I would have had him 8th, and no one ahead of him on the ballot.
That prelim ballot was posted last week, so there isn't any 'strategic' voting or anything, it's just a weird confluence of events.
Any strong feelings here either way? I understand rules are rules.
Even with a prelim, we can't give anyone preferential treatment - player or voter, as it were.
And this comes from a guy who never once had Mackey in his top 15.
The families of Biz Mackey and Bob Boone (his closest comp?) would like to thank KJOK for a late 14th-place vote that carried him to the top because none of the other contenders got a vote at all.
Any two of the four could make it in '76 obviously depending on who votes and who doesn't.
I'm more excited about Dobie Moore being in the top 10.
Did you get my IM, Joe?
But there is no precedent for bumping a prelim ballot on to the ballot thread without the voter requesting it.
That's why I didn't use it. Too bad, because I would have loved seeing Gordon go in with Drysdale. Looks like '76 will be his year (I hope).
BTW, several of you have my cell phone number - in the future please don't hesitate to use it if I'm about to miss a ballot . . . thanks! :-)
In the past, you usually posted your ballot at the last second. Didn't work out this time.
TOP 25, ALL-TIME
VAN HALTREN 20324.5
BECKLEY 19103
DUFFY 18655.5
Griffith 17924
Jennings 16976
BROWNING 16519.5
CHILDS 14410
WADDELL 14133
WELCH 13706
Pike 13399
Thompson 12349
SISLER 12133
Bennett 11503
RYAN 11221.5
Rixey 10826
Caruthers 10704
Beckwith 9896
H Stovey 9576
TLEACH 9456
BRESNAHAN 9394
SEWELL 9178
Mackey 8930
CJONES 8880
REDDING 8506
Start 8378.5
OTHERS IN THE TOP 25 ACTIVE
(Mendez 8286, Roush 6396, Moore 6193, Doyle 6074, Monroe 5910, Williamson 4906, Cravath 4862, WBrown 4854, Grimes 4691, Schang 4332, McGraw 4128)
Anyoene have figures on Kiner, Pierce, Trouppe, Walters, and Bob Johnson?
:(
I think Mickey Welch will move into first place in about 2050. He should be the leading active candidate in about 25 years and then will take about 50 years to catch GVH or Beckley.
BTW, several of you have my cell phone number - in the future please don't hesitate to use it if I'm about to miss a ballot . . . thanks! :-)
From the peanut gallery, I mean respected semi-outsider:
I agree strongly with Howie Menckel on the 1975 election but I think that special treatment by Secy Murphy using the cell phone is appropriate. I think it is reasonable that any of JoeD, JohnM and DanG phone each other as a reminder.
jschmeagol:
I am surprised that Charlie Keller only garnered 3 more votes and moved up only one measly spot.
So am I. He has messed up the little group with Schang, Dean, and McGraw, just enough for a bridge game.
Ken Boyer joins the short list of recent major leaguers neither elected nor dismissed.
One quarter of the voters cast unique "number one" votes.
Did anyone have Drysdale/Mackey 1 and 2? Have we ever had an election where no voter had the two electees at the top of his ballot in order? Could easily happen in an upcoming elect-3 ballot I suppose.
I actually dont have Joe's number, though he may have given it to me last year at the SABR convention. I did IM him, but he obviously didn't see it. I always give him some type of reminder, since the Commish should always be involved in this electing jazz. :-)
Now that I think about it, I believe Joe did post it here the week he met Howie. Dont remember which thread, however.
If Joe e-mails it to me, he wont miss another election again.
Welch already owns the record for most votes-to-elect, cumulative.
Most Votes-to-elect (VTE), record progression:
White 1898 27
Wright 1900 27
1901 43
Radbourn 1904 44
1905 58
Spalding 1906 61
Sutton 1908 67
Start 1912 79
Bennett 1921 95
Pike 1939 103
1940 115
Jennings 1958 121
1959 122
1960 130
Welch 1965 131
1966 134
1967 139
1968 144
1970 147
1971 149
1972 153
1973 156
1975 160
Top 12:
160 WELCH
138 BECKLEY
130 Jennings
116 VAN HALTREN
115 Pike
95 Bennett
90 Caruthers
90 Griffith
83 BROWNING
79 Start
79 Thompson
78 Pearce
HOMers with least cumulative VTE:
6 Faber, Terry
7 Ashburn, Wynn
10 Ward, Rusie, Hill, Hack
Members of the one-and-only-one club:
1 Williamson, O'Neill, HWright, Bush, Bond, Cross, Hooper,
1 Dean, Elliott, Minoso, Easter, Boyer*, BJohnson*
* new
Ewing (Brouthers 39/42)
Clarke (Young 45/45)
Plank (Crawford 44/46)
Wheat (WJohnson 54/54)
Hornsby (Ruth 53/53)
Frisch (Gehrig 52/52)
Hartnett (Grove 54/54)
Cronin (Foxx 48/49)
Beckwith (DiMaggio 47/47)
Irvin (Campanella 46/69)
Ruffing (TWilliams 48/48)
Berra (Musial 48/48)
Griffith (Spahn 47/48)
Doerr (Roberts+Koufax 44/50)
Mathews (Mantle 52/52)
Players elected with 1 #1 vote:
Gore (White+Hines 24/29)
Hill (Jackson 17/49)
Speaker (Cobb 52/56)
Faber (-)
Lyons (Hubbell 39/51)
Ott (Gibson 49/50)
Mackey (Drysdale 7/50)
Faber is the only one to lead the point-count with only one #1.
Did you get my IM, Joe?"
Nope. I was gone, but left the computer running. Funny thing is that is wasn't there when I got home last night either. Girlfriend must have deleted it at some point, and never told me.
Email with the cell phone number is on the way . . . :-)
I IMed you in the early afternoon. I even made a comment about your KDBL trade snafu from yesterday. ;-)
Email with the cell phone number is on the way . . . :-)
Great. That should solve that problem.
Voting earlier helps too. The ballots are open for more than seven days.
We leave guys like Jennings, Griffith, and Van Haltren waiting for decades.
I finally won something? When I joined this project, Joe promised me it would make me rich. I didn't know it would take 77 years. I'm almost too old to enjoy it.
True David. But I've gotten into kind of a routine with doing it Mondays. I meant to vote earlier last week (even mentioned it on the prelim), but there were a few last minute things that put that off and then before you knew it, I missed it.
C'est la vie, I just hope Gordon gets in here at some point, not because I support him, but it'd be awful to have a missed vote as the reason why he missed.
I keep trying to, but I'm only one man.
Has there been a subtle shift towards peak-heavy candidates in the past few elections? It seems more than a handful of the candidates who've bypassed GVH are peakers: Sisler, Mendez, Gordon, Moore, Duffy, Kiner, Browning, and one could make an argument for Dick Redding as well. And Sewell's more prime than career.
1 1975 Mackey-WBrown
2 1916 Stovey-Kelley
4 1913 McPhee-McVey
7 1975 Mackey-Sisler *
8+ 1906 Spalding-Sutton
11 1972 Doerr-Mackey
12 1975 Mackey-Gordon *
12 1975 Mackey-Mendez *
13 1929 Thompson-Sheckard
13 1940 Pike-Sewell
13 1960 Jennings-Medwick
13 1961 Averill-Ruffing
14 1934 Speaker-ECollins
16 1916 Stovey-Flick *
21 1901 Wright-Glasscock
21 1961 Averill-Medwick *
24 1966 Ruffing-Medwick
24 1968 Ashburn-Mackey
* there is a closer entry for this election
The loser has been elected at some point in the future, usually the next backlog election or three.
1940 is different from the others; Sewell still waits.
1975 has a decent chance of that happening; there are 4 candidates that just missed.
Well, probably only three more from the backlog will be elected before the next deluge of shoo-in candidates begins in 1980, so at least one candidate who was very close to being elected is likely to wait at least a decade more.
Anyoene have figures on Kiner, Pierce, Trouppe, Walters, and Bob Johnson?
Howie,
Here's what I have.(active candidates between 4500 and 1950)
Schang.......4332
Gordon.......4247
McGraw.......4128
Walters......3561
Kiner........3392
McCormick....3148
Oms..........3062
Joss.........2939
Willis.......2755
Tiernan......2686
Chance.......2636
Trouppe......2331
F. Jones.....2130
Cicotte......2119
Johnson......1980
Also, I have
Duffy with 18755.5 (+100 from your list)
Ryan with 11258.5 (+37)
Rixey with 10789 (-37)
Mendez with 8186(-100)
Looks like one of us just entered the numbers in the wrong spot. I'll check my list and see if I messed up.
He's way behind at 1261
I noticed that both Drysdale and Mackey earned votes in every ballot position #1-15. This has happened before, but when and for whom? I don't remember.
I used to look at stuff like this a lot more; GVH did it several times, IIRC. The last guy I see getting a vote in every slot is Koufax in 1972. Before him was Lemon in 1965, then Mackey in 1961. The last time two players did it was 1960, Medwick and Averill.
With the help of a half-vote, Al Spalding was the first to do it back in 1903. Sam Thompson followed with another half-vote aided 1905 ballot.
Sam Thompson was the first to do it with all full votes in 1918.
Unofficial Tally:
1903 - Spalding(.5)
1905 - SThompson(.5)
1918 - SThompson
1919 - McGinnity
1921 - BWallace
1926 - SThompson, Caruthers
1927 - PHill, VanHaltren
1928 - McGinnity, Caruthers
1930 - JRyan
1931 - VanHaltren
1938 - VanHaltren
1939 - Faber, Sewell, Childs
1942 - Leach
1956 - Beckwith
1958 - Hack
1960 - Medwick, Averill
1961 - Mackey
1965 - Lemon
1972 - Koufax
1975 - Drysdale, Mackey
on a simaler note Mickey Welch got exactly 1 vote at every position beetween 1-10 in 1927
56 in 1934.
You might be right, Daryn, though I wouldn't bet money on it just yet.
I suspect that support for career candidates was relatively greater when Joe Dimino was very active in the discussion and was posting "Pennants Added" ratings. Pennants Added is fundamentally a season measure, like WARP and WS, but people focused more on career PA than they do on career versions of other player ratings, I think.
And Sewell may be more prime than career but he is not a peaker.
If this thesis holds true, it bodes well for Sewell, who made 24 ballots last week, as well as guys like Bucky Walters (15 votes, but only 1 in the top 6), Ken Boyer, maybe even Bob Johnson. It would NOT be good for Dobie Moore and Beckley, if the people who are not voting for them now refuse to move them on to their ballots as we make our way through the backlog.
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