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Friday, January 15, 2021

Jimmy Rollins

Eligible 2022

DL from MN Posted: January 15, 2021 at 11:23 AM | 11 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. Al Peterson Posted: January 15, 2021 at 02:56 PM (#5999965)
Probably not going to gain any HOM traction but a passing glance at J-Roll. Take the 30 year window (1990-2020)...where does he rank among SS? Below the ARod/Ripken/Jeter/Larkin set, then you start to get the peak-type players (Nomar, Tejeda, Tulowitzki) where he accumulates similar career value.

Rollins ended up 6th in all-time defensive games at SS, just ahead of fellow Phillies SS Larry Bowa.
   2. Jaack Posted: January 15, 2021 at 03:30 PM (#5999974)
I'd definitely take Tejada or Nomar before Rollins. Tulo is pretty close, and Jay Bell and Jose Reyes are in similar territory too.
   3. Dr. Chaleeko Posted: January 15, 2021 at 07:18 PM (#6000013)
Put Rollins in the way back machine and set it for the 1970s or 1980s, and i think he might have stolen 80 bases a couple times and hit a lot better than a typical shortstop of the time. Hard to know how he’d do on turf, however. Rfield likes him (+43 runs), but DRA says he’s one third of a Jeter at short (-114). Given the positional va competition in the 1970s, if he could stay at shortstop, he’d have stood out much more from the crowd. But playing at the same time as A-Rod, Jeter, Nomar, Tejada, and later Tulo it’s hard to be a big deal.
   4. The Honorable Ardo Posted: January 15, 2021 at 09:30 PM (#6000037)
Rollins is ahead of Tejada for me on speed, defense, and DP avoidance. He's ahead of Bancroft. Very close to Campaneris who is sometimes on/sometimes off my ballot. Nomar is a difficult peak vs. career argument.

Definitely one of the top 50 eligible players.
   5. DL from MN Posted: January 15, 2021 at 10:27 PM (#6000047)
DRA says he’s one third of a Jeter at short (-114)


Who does DRA like at shortstop?
   6. bachslunch Posted: January 15, 2021 at 10:54 PM (#6000055)
Rollins will end up sixth in my SS depth chart when he's eligible, behind Aparicio, Tinker, Campaneris, Bancroft, and Fregosi. He'll be a long ways from my ballot.

   7. Bleed the Freak Posted: January 15, 2021 at 11:32 PM (#6000059)
DL: https://www.thebaseballgauge.com/history.php?first=min&last=max&tab=fld_dra_at&pos=SS&lgID=All&division=All&age_low=16&age_high=59&HOF=All&active=All&living=All&results=100&sort=Runs_a&page=1#metric

DRA shortstop leaderboard:

Rk Runs Player
01 358.3 Germany Smith
02 315.4 Joe Tinker
03 287.0 Art Fletcher
04 242.7 Bill Dahlen
05 228.4 Jack Glasscock
06 198.6 Mark Belanger
07 162.0 Mickey Doolin
08 150.0 Herman Long
09 148.1 Dave Bancroft
10 147.6 Ozzie Smith
11 145.8 Rey Sanchez
12 145.1 Roger Peckinpaugh
13 138.4 Luke Appling
14 134.2 Lou Boudreau
15 132.8 Bobby Wallace
16 129.2 Rabbit Maranville
17 125.8 Andrelton Simmons
18 125.8 Tommy Corcoran
19 118.2 Roy McMillan
20 113.6 Barry Larkin
21 111.1 Arthur Irwin
22 110.2 Joe Cronin
23 103.1 Hughie Jennings
24 102.6 Garry Templeton
25 101.9 George Wright
26 100.7 Phil Rizzuto
27 98.6 George McBride
28 97.7 Dave Concepcion
29 95.1 Greg Gagne
30 94.7 Brendan Ryan
31 93.5 Billy Rogell
32 93.2 Jose Valentin
33 92.5 Bert Campaneris
34 91.1 Dal Maxvill
35 90.4 Marty Marion
36 90.3 Travis Jackson
37 88.6 Dick Bartell
38 84.2 Everett Scott
39 83.5 Neifi Perez
40 83.1 Glenn Wright
41 81.5 Honus Wagner
42 81.1 Johnny Logan
43 80.9 Bill Russell
44 79.4 Jack Wilson
45 77.7 Ozzie Guillen
46 76.5 Jose Uribe
47 74.2 Granny Hamner
48 74.0 Bob Allen
49 72.6 Billy Jurges
50 69.2 Chris Speier
51 68.4 George Davis
52 66.7 Adam Everett
53 65.9 Frank Fennelly
54 65.7 Rafael Furcal
55 64.4 Monte Ward
56 64.0 Phil Tomney
57 64.0 Craig Reynolds
58 63.6 Alan Trammell
59 63.6 Ron Hansen
60 62.7 Alexei Ramirez
61 62.3 Ed Brinkman
62 59.3 Buddy Kerr
63 59.3 Tony Kubek
64 58.7 Dickie Thon
65 58.5 Ernie Johnson
66 58.5 Maury Wills
67 57.8 Nick Ahmed
68 57.4 Alex Gonzalez
69 57.3 Hal Lanier
70 57.1 Marcus Semien
71 56.6 Bobby Wheelock
72 55.1 Arky Vaughan
73 54.3 Pee Wee Reese
74 54.1 Freddy Parent
75 54.1 Mark Koenig
76 53.5 Brandon Crawford
77 51.6 Scott Fletcher
78 51.5 Ollie Beard
79 51.4 Frankie Crosetti
80 51.1 Cal Ripken
81 51.0 Jimmy Cooney
82 50.2 Lee Tannehill
83 49.8 Bones Ely
84 49.7 Jean Segura
85 49.5 Chick Fulmer
86 48.8 Mike Bordick
87 48.4 Troy Tulowitzki
88 48.4 Henry Easterday
89 47.5 Sadie Houck
90 47.2 Buck Herzog
91 46.9 Kevin Stocker
92 45.9 Davy Force
93 45.9 Mike Benjamin
94 44.7 Gene Alley
95 44.4 George Strickland
96 42.6 Rick Burleson
97 42.3 Todd Cruz
98 42.2 Chico Carrasquel
99 41.4 Bucky Dent
100 41.3 Doc Lavan

Rk Runs Player
1 (349.8) Derek Jeter
2 (155.2) Ed McKean
3 (123.5) Ivy Olson
4 (116.1) Jimmy Rollins
5 (112.6) Heinie Sand
06 (97.5) Larry Kopf
07 (97.2) Rudy Hulswitt
08 (91.8) Monte Cross
09 (87.3) Jeff Blauser
10 (87.1) Kurt Stillwell
11 (86.3) Chick Galloway
12 (81.5) Hanley Ramirez
13 (80.9) Joe Sullivan
14 (77.3) Jose Reyes
15 (70.1) Xander Bogaerts
16 (69.2) Jack Rowe
17 (66.3) Red Kress
18 (64.6) Ed Abbaticchio
19 (64.0) Ricky Gutierrez
20 (61.4) Phil Lewis
21 (61.1) Jim Levey
22 (57.7) Edgar Renteria
23 (56.9) Bill Gleason
24 (56.2) Don Buddin
25 (56.1) Tom Veryzer
26 (55.6) Dick Howser
27 (55.0) Larry Bowa
28 (54.0) Al Bridwell
29 (52.3) Billy Urbanski
30 (51.0) Ian Desmond
31 (49.5) Art Butler
32 (49.3) Bill McClellan
33 (49.1) Joe Boley
34 (48.8) Oyster Burns
35 (47.9) Aledmys Diaz
36 (47.6) Eric McNair
37 (47.1) Jackie Gutierrez
38 (46.6) John Sullivan
39 (46.3) Bob Fisher
40 (46.0) Johnnie LeMaster
41 (45.5) Leo Durocher
42 (45.2) Frank Taveras
43 (44.9) Felipe Lopez
44 (44.4) Felix Fermin
45 (43.7) Don Kessinger
46 (41.7) Ollie O'Mara
47 (41.7) John McGraw
48 (41.5) Ernie Riles
49 (41.4) Eddie Joost
50 (40.7) Harvey Kuenn
51 (40.6) Ned Williamson
52 (39.9) Jose Offerman
53 (39.2) Asdrubal Cabrera
54 (38.9) Dave Altizer
55 (37.7) Sonny Jackson
56 (37.3) Roy Smalley
57 (37.1) Chris Gomez
58 (37.0) Frankie Gustine
59 (36.3) Frank Scheibeck
60 (36.2) Jimmy Macullar
61 (36.2) Michael Young
62 (35.2) Jack Heidemann
63 (34.7) Ken Hamlin
64 (34.3) Neal Ball
65 (34.0) Steve Jeltz
66 (34.0) Harry Lochhead
67 (34.0) Glenn Hoffman
68 (33.8) Eduardo Nunez
69 (33.8) Rafael Ramirez
70 (33.6) Marty Perez
71 (33.5) Jose Pagan
72 (33.4) Mark Christman
73 (33.3) Amed Rosario
74 (33.1) Pepe Frias
75 (33.1) Lyn Lary
76 (32.2) Joe Dugan
77 (31.6) Eddie Bressoud
78 (31.5) Hubie Brooks
79 (31.4) Frank Shugart
80 (31.2) Charley O'Leary
81 (30.5) Candy Nelson
82 (30.1) Virgil Stallcup
83 (29.8) Jimmy Esmond
84 (29.6) Wil Cordero
85 (29.4) Ivan de Jesus
86 (29.3) Bobby Bragan
87 (29.3) Chris Owings
88 (29.2) Ike Caveney
89 (28.8) Sam Wise
90 (27.7) Jim Holdsworth
91 (27.7) Eddie Lake
92 (27.6) Barry McCormick
93 (27.5) Chuck Wortman
94 (27.4) Jorge Polanco
95 (27.2) Yuniesky Betancourt
96 (27.1) Billy Gilbert
97 (26.8) Eduardo Escobar
98 (26.5) Johnny Berardino
99 (26.2) Doc Farrell
100 (26.0) Pat Rockett

   8. kcgard2 Posted: January 16, 2021 at 09:20 AM (#6000083)
Good enough to rank, but not close to a ballot spot for me, 11th best available shortstop, #123 overall.

The surprising thing to me, looking back at his career, there was only one season where his batting was even moderately better than average, and even including baserunning, there are only 3 seasons in his career where he was 10 runs above average. Career only 26 offensive runs above average. I guess that's less than I would have thought. But I remember thinking during Rollins' career, this guy is way overrated, then thinking maybe the fans were on to something, he's pretty good, then thinking ok people have gone overboard again and he's overrated...and all in all maybe everybody turned out to be right, somehow.
   9. cookiedabookie Posted: January 16, 2021 at 12:32 PM (#6000103)
Outside the top 150 on my eligible players ranking, in the top 200. Not enough here to warrant too much discussion for me.
   10. The Honorable Ardo Posted: January 22, 2021 at 10:30 PM (#6001331)
Career only 26 offensive runs above average. I guess that's less than I would have thought.
Less than I thought too. Rollins, though, ate up a TON of outs. He was a full-time player for 15 seasons and averaged 668 PA/year, including the single-season record, with a below average walk rate.

Interesting historical comp: Joe Cronin, who did everything Rollins did maybe 10-15% better.

I have him seventh among backlog SS, behind Rizzuto, Campaneris, Garciaparra, Clarkson, Bancroft, and Vizquel (in that order), and about 65th overall.
   11. Carl Goetz Posted: January 29, 2021 at 02:32 PM (#6002659)
"I have him seventh among backlog SS, behind Rizzuto, Campaneris, Garciaparra, Clarkson, Bancroft, and Vizquel (in that order), and about 65th overall."

I have Rollins ahead of Vizquel, but behind the other guys you mentioned plus Art Fletcher and Joe Tinker. I haven't ranked that deep, but 65th overall feels about right for me too.

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