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— A Look at Baseball's All-Time Best

Monday, February 22, 2016

Most Meritorious Player: 1990 Ballot

For 1990, each voter should rank the top 13 players from all leagues combined.

Balloting is scheduled to close at 4pm EDT on 2 March 2016.

Anyone can vote, even if you do not normally participate in Hall of Merit discussions. If have never participated in an MMP election, just post a preliminary ballot in the discussion thread by 2 February 2016.

For detailed rules see one of our previous ballots.

DL from MN Posted: February 22, 2016 at 10:09 AM | 20 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
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   1. DL from MN Posted: February 22, 2016 at 10:13 AM (#5160963)
I have a spring break vacation so there will not be an extension for this ballot. My first time going to spring training.
   2. DL from MN Posted: February 22, 2016 at 10:39 AM (#5160988)
1990 Ballot

1) Rickey Henderson - gets postseason credit but doesn't need it
2) Roger Clemens - Best pitching performance since Clemens in 1986
3) Barry Bonds - 2nd best hitter, good glove
4) Len Dykstra - Good glove year in CF
5) Cal Ripken - Did everything well
6) Barry Larkin - Postseason bump
7) Alan Trammell - Three consecutive SS
8) Frank Viola - Outpitched Finley but poor hitting drags him down
9) Chuck Finley
10) Ryne Sandberg
11) Ed Whitson
12) Dave Stewart - postseason credit
13) Carlton Fisk - C credit, remarkable season at age 42

14-20) Darryl Strawberry, Cecil Fielder, Jose Canseco, Brett Butler, Matt Williams, Erik Hanson, Julio Franco
21-25) Bip Roberts, Mark McGwire, Fred McGriff, Darren Daulton, Andy Van Slyke
   3. ThickieDon Posted: February 22, 2016 at 01:37 PM (#5161217)
1. Rickey Henderson - 189 OPS+, .439 OBP and 65 SB led league; one of best offensive seasons of the '90s; good glove and baserunning
2. Barry Bonds - 170 OPS+, still superior in the outfield
3. Roger Clemens - 211 ERA+ (next best was 169 by a guy who barely qualified)
4. Lenny Dykstra - top 5 both offensively and defensively
5. Ryne Sandberg
6. Cal Ripken
7. Cecil Fielder
8. Alan Trammell - well above average both offensively and defensively
9. Darryl Strawberry - good season with the bat and improved defense
10. Julio Franco - solid across board (top 30 in offense, defense, and BsR)
11. Eddie Murray
12. Barry Larkin - good glove and baserunning make up for lack of power or OBP; solid post-season numbers
13. Dave Stewart - post-season credit
   4. Qufini Posted: February 22, 2016 at 03:29 PM (#5161381)
1990 Ballot

1. Rickey Henderson, LF, Oakland A's: one of the great seasons of all-time, 1st in OPS+ and RC while adding massive advantages on the bases (+6) and with the glove (+16)
2. Barry Bonds, LF, Pittsburgh Pirates: 1st in NL in OPS+ and RC with +28 fielding
3. Roger Clemens, P, Boston Red Sox: 211 ERA+ laps the field
4. Cecil Fielder, 1B, Detroit Tigers: the Detroit faithful thought that Fielder was robbed of the MVP after hitting 50 home runs for the first time in a generation but the writers got this one right
5. Ryne Sandberg, 2B, Chicago Cubs: 2nd in NL RC from the keystone position
6. Lenny Dykstra, CF, Philadelphia Phillies: 3rd in NL RC with +25 defense from CF
7. Dennis Eckersley, RP, Oakland A's: a 0.61 ERA (and 603 ERA+) is absolutely ridiculous, WPA puts him second among AL pitchers behind Clemens
8. Eddie Murray, 1B, Los Angeles Dodgers: 2nd in OPS+ with 159
9. Dave Stewart, P, Oakland A's
10. Chuck Finley, P, California Angels: Stewart's 31 extra IP are worth more than Finley's 14 pt ERA+ advantage
11. Alan Trammell, SS, Detroit Tigers: top ten in RC and a 130 OPS+ while adding +10 runs on defense
12. Fred McGriff, 1B, Toronto Blue Jays: 2nd in OPS+ and RC
13. Carlton Fisk, C, Chicago White Sox: top ten in OPS+ while adding +6 fielding from behind the plate

14. Frank Viola, P, New York Mets: top pitcher in the NL due to league-leading 249 IP and top five ERA+
15. Cal Ripken Jr., SS, Baltimore Orioles: +22 defense and not shabby with the bat either (114 OPS+)
16. Darryl Strawberry, RF, New York Mets: top ten in OPS+ and RC with +18 fielding
17. Ed Whitson, P, San Diego Padres: 148 ERA+ is 3rd in NL
18. Jose Canseco, RF, Oakland A's
19. Julio Franco, 2B, Texas Rangers
t-20. George Brett, 1B, Kansas City Royals; Mark McGwire, 1B, Oakland A's
   5. Qufini Posted: February 22, 2016 at 03:30 PM (#5161382)
8) Frank Viola - Outpitched Finley but poor hitting drags him down
9) Chuck Finley

DL, your comment is a little confusing. Did you mean to move Finley ahead of Viola? Or were simply commenting on a narrower gap than pitching alone would indicate?
   6. DL from MN Posted: February 22, 2016 at 04:10 PM (#5161415)
Narrow gap, Viola and Finley are basically tied.
   7. bjhanke Posted: February 24, 2016 at 01:49 PM (#5162888)
Sigh. This here is Brock Hanke's final ballot for 1990. I tried to take a look at the candidates for this year and make adjustments to the non-consensus of Win Shares and WAR. However, this is as bad as 1989 was, and I would, essentially, have to make up my own system to do the job well. I don't have a personal system. I did do a check to see that I was not systematically screwing WAR. I am not. Of the WAR top ten, there is only one who doesn't even get a vote. Ed Whitson (8th and 45th). Of the top ten in Win Shares, FOUR don't get a vote. Eddie Murray (5th and 32nd), Fred McGriff (7th and in a six-way tie for 26th-31st), Brett Butler (9th and 34th) and Carlton Fisk (10th and 37th). You will note that the guys who ranked high in WAR but not in Win Shares were pitchers, and the Win Shares favorites were position players. This is depressingly normal, and it's where I keep getting the idea that WAR overrates starting pitchers. WAR thinks that Doug Drabek was just a bit better than Carlton Fisk, and that Mike Harkey was better still. Win Shares thinks that Fisk was tenth in the game, and that Harkey and Drabek were not competitive at that level. I realize that pitchers vary a lot more than position players do, but still. Basically, Win Shares keeps thinking that Hall of Famers are the best players in the game, while WAR does not. Yes, these are yearly ballots, but I'm always going to have a problem with rankings like that. Anyway, for you WAR fans to roll your eyes at, here's my ballot:

1. Rickey! Henderson
2. Barry Bonds
3. Lenny the Dykstra
4. Roger Clemens
5. Ryne Sandberg
6. Cecil Fielder
7. Julio Franco
8. Darryl Strawberry
9. Alan Trammell
10. Cal Ripken, Jr.
11. Mark McGwire
12. Jose Canseco
13. Chuck Finley

- Brock Hanke
   8. caiman Posted: February 24, 2016 at 05:30 PM (#5163135)
Here's my RPA ratings based upon run value above the average:

1. Rickey Henderson 71.26 runs
2. Mark McGwire 47.49 runs
3. Barry Bonds 46.77 runs
4. Cecil Fielder 43.25 runs
5. Jose Canseco 42.72 runs
6. Fred McGriff 39.68 runs
7. Kal Daniels 34.78 runs
8. Roger Clemens 33.83 runs
9. Lenny Dykstra 33.71 rruns
10. Eddie Murray 32.74 runs
   9. DL from MN Posted: February 24, 2016 at 05:43 PM (#5163146)
caiman - the ballot is 13 names deep
   10. bjhanke Posted: February 26, 2016 at 11:41 AM (#5164619)
caiman - Are you SURE you think Rickey Henderson stood THAT far atop the mountain of mortal men? I mean, the difference between Rickey (! that he is) is much greater than the difference between McGwire, whom you have second, and Murray, whom you have tenth. I don't think adding the next three names is going to close that gap. Are you SURE Rickey was THAT much better? - Brock
   11. EricC Posted: February 27, 2016 at 10:10 AM (#5165311)
1990 MMP ballot, unchanged from prelim.

1. Rickey Henderson
2. Barry Bonds
3. Roger Clemens
4. Lenny Dykstra
5. Alan Trammell
6. Ryne Sandberg
7. Chuck Finley
8. Jose Canseco
9. Dave Stewart
10. Cecil Fielder
11. Eddie Murray
12. Lance Parrish
13. Ed Whitson, almost tied with #14 Frank Viola for NL MMPi
   12. Michael J. Binkley's anxiety closet Posted: February 27, 2016 at 12:13 PM (#5165372)
1990 MMP Ballot:

1. Rickey! thinks Rickey! Should be 1990 MMRickey!
2. Roger Clemens - MMPitcher
3. Barry Bonds - NL MMP
4. Lenny Dykstra
5. Frank Viola - NL MMPitcher
6. Alan Trammell
7. Cal Ripken, Jr.
8. Barry Larkin
9. Ryne Sandberg
10. Ed Whitson
11. Chuck Finley
12. Cecil Fielder
13. Fred McGriff

14-20. Doug Drabek, Dave Stewart, Jose Canseco, Erik Hnasen, Julio Franco, Jose Rijo, Carlton Fisk.
   13. Tubbs is Bobby Grich when he flys off the handle Posted: February 28, 2016 at 05:44 PM (#5165894)
Final ballot, same as preliminary
1. Bonds
2. R Henderson--Rickey not happy to finish 2nd for MMRickey! to this Bonds guy who Rickey thought retired in 1981
3. Fielder
4. Clemens
5. Sandberg
6. Dykstra
7. Strawberry
8. Murray
9. Stewart
13.C Finley
   14. lieiam Posted: February 29, 2016 at 11:32 PM (#5166661)
Same as my prelim ballot:

1 Henderson, Rickey 9759
2 Bonds, Barry 8731
3 Clemens, Roger 8503
4 Dykstra, Lenny 7558
5 Sandberg, Ryne 6702
6 Fielder, Cecil 6361
7 Finley, Chuck 5952
8 McGriff, Fred 5950
9 Trammell, Alan 5949
10 Murray, Eddie 5876
11 Ripken, Cal 5726
12 Fisk, Carlton 5601
13 Larkin, Barry 5596

Next 5: Canseco, Viola, Strawberry, McGwire, Stewart
   15. DL from MN Posted: March 01, 2016 at 09:46 AM (#5166788)
Voted recently, no ballot yet:

John Murphy

I also can't count the ballot from caiman as it does not have 13 names.
   16. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: March 02, 2016 at 09:51 AM (#5167876)
Is it possible you can hold off voting at least another day? I could definitely get it in tomorrow.
   17. DL from MN Posted: March 02, 2016 at 10:15 AM (#5167909)
Ugh. I can extend a day but I need to close at noon Eastern.
   18. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: March 02, 2016 at 12:04 PM (#5168055)
Thanks, Dan. Sorry about that. Too busy around here. BTW, it's possible I could get it in tonight.
   19. John (You Can Call Me Grandma) Murphy Posted: March 02, 2016 at 06:11 PM (#5168452)
Official 1990 MMP Ballot (no postseason bonuses):

1) Rickey Henderson: Best ML player and left fielder.
2) Barry Bonds: Best NL player and left fielder.
3) Lenny Dykstra: Best ML center fielder.
4) Ryne Sandberg: Best ML second baseman.
5) Roger Clemens: Best ML pitcher.
6) Alan Trammell: Best ML shortstop.
7) Eddie Murray: Best ML first baseman.
8) Cecil Fielder: Best AL first baseman.
9) Darryl Strawberry: Best ML right fielder.
10) Fred McGriff
11) Jose Canseco: Best AL right fielder.
12) Lance Parrish: Best ML catcher.
13) Chuck Finley

Best NL pitcher: Frank Viola

Thanks again, Dan!
   20. DL from MN Posted: March 03, 2016 at 12:02 PM (#5168833)
Ballot is closed

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