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Wednesday, October 19, 2022

2022-23 NBA Kick-Off Thread

I estimate there are maybe 10-12 Primates left on this site, and their fathers are all the District Attorney.

Hombre Brotani Posted: October 19, 2022 at 10:09 PM | 561 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: basketball, best shape of his life, nba, off-topic

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   201. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 29, 2022 at 10:34 PM (#6103237)
flip
   202. smileyy Posted: October 29, 2022 at 10:40 PM (#6103239)
There's no rational point to it. The violation of the other person is the appeal.
   203. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 29, 2022 at 11:06 PM (#6103247)
There's no rational point to it. The violation of the other person is the appeal.
for louis ck, yeah...but that's not the only possible motivation for masturbating in the workplace.


..or so i've been told...by people... i'm not an expert, of course...
   204. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 29, 2022 at 11:36 PM (#6103254)
Lauren Rosen @LaurenMRosen
Tobias Harris (@Tobias Harris) on playing alongside @Tyrese Maxey: “Tyrese is special. My wife says, ‘Protect Tyrese at all costs.’ [Tyrese] has this glow about him on the court. Anytime I step on the court with him is an honor.”
   205. asinwreck Posted: October 30, 2022 at 09:51 AM (#6103273)
The Shelburne-Woj story on San Antonio waiving Primo adds this detail.
Also on Saturday, attorney Tony Buzbee told ESPN he has been retained by a woman who worked for the Spurs and has alleged Primo exposed himself to her. Buzbee represented multiple women in the sexual misconduct lawsuits against Cleveland Browns quarterback Deshaun Watson.
I imagine that wanting to distinguish the Spurs response from how Houston's NFL team handled Watson factored into this week's decision. But we'll learn more about the timing, number, severity of, and organizational responses to incidents if this case goes to trial.

Primo's statement:
In a statement to ESPN on Friday night, Primo acknowledged a need to continue "mental health treatment more fully."

"I know that you all are surprised by today's announcement," Primo said in the statement. "I've been seeking help to deal with previous trauma I suffered and will now take this time to focus on my mental health treatment more fully. I hope to be able to discuss these issues in the future so I can help others who have suffered in a similar way. I appreciate privacy at this time."
   206. spivey Posted: October 30, 2022 at 09:58 AM (#6103274)
Is Desmond Bane a top 20 player? He was already a fringe allstar last year, and his stats in the playoffs and so far this year are very good. His percentage of self-created shots per basketball-reference is way, way up to start the year.
   207. bob gee Posted: October 30, 2022 at 12:52 PM (#6103293)
206 - close if not?...dont forget how well memphis did last year without ja. and his defense as well...
   208. Tom Cervo, backup catcher Posted: October 30, 2022 at 05:35 PM (#6103318)
Clippers now have a worse point differential than the Lakers.
   209. tshipman Posted: October 30, 2022 at 06:23 PM (#6103322)
I think every good team has been some level of disappointing so far except the Bucks. Definitely doesn't seem like anyone wants to win 60 games.
   210. spivey Posted: October 30, 2022 at 06:46 PM (#6103324)
I'm legit worried about the Clippers. Well, not really, because I don't care if they don't finish top 6. But I think that is very much on the table for them.

The Bucks baby! Forget if it's been mentioned here, but they've adjusted their defensive scheme a bit. Fighting over screens more to limit 3s. They're now 5th in 3pters allowed, and are an average paced team, so it's not that.

With BroLo back they're back to the #1 opponents 2pt FG%, and are killing teams on the glass. Still need more playmaking. Middleton will provide a lot of that, but I think they'll need more from either Connaughton/Allen/Ingles or someone not on the roster.
   211. PJ Martinez Posted: October 30, 2022 at 08:39 PM (#6103331)
I think every good team has been some level of disappointing so far except the Bucks.
I realize that by "good" you might have meant the five or six teams that were getting touted widely as contenders (or possible 60-game winners) before the season, but I'd add the Cavs and the Pelicans to that list. Maybe Phoenix? (I haven't watched the Suns at all.)

Standard small-sample caveats, of course, but Golden State has a losing record through seven games. And the 2-3 Mavs are fighting Orlando to a draw through one half of basketball in Dallas.
   212. tshipman Posted: October 30, 2022 at 08:59 PM (#6103332)
I realize that by "good" you might have meant the five or six teams that were getting touted widely as contenders (or possible 60-game winners) before the season, but I'd add the Cavs and the Pelicans to that list. Maybe Phoenix? (I haven't watched the Suns at all.)

Standard small-sample caveats, of course, but Golden State has a losing record through seven games. And the 2-3 Mavs are fighting Orlando to a draw through one half of basketball in Dallas.


I think Chris Paul's awful start counteracts any good vibes you might feel in Phoenix. CP may be done.

Pels aren't a real contender, but fair point re: Cleveland.
   213. spivey Posted: October 30, 2022 at 09:58 PM (#6103334)
Pels aren't a real contender, but next year when they add Wembanyama to their core, I think they could go all the way.
   214. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 30, 2022 at 10:32 PM (#6103335)
Ky Carlin @Ky_Carlin
The Magic rolling out a starting lineup where the smallest guy is 6’6” is nuts. Bol Bol is out here running point guard for them.
Khobi Price @khobi_price
Magic's starters vs. Mavericks:
Paolo Banchero, Terrence Ross, Franz Wagner, Bol Bol and Wendell Carter Jr.
   215. tshipman Posted: October 30, 2022 at 11:38 PM (#6103341)
This is the best AD has looked in a while.
   216. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: October 30, 2022 at 11:58 PM (#6103342)
The game is over and the Lakers have more points than the other team Is that allowed?
   217. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: October 30, 2022 at 11:59 PM (#6103343)
And the Lakers got some more regression to the mean on 3s--13/30. Also, Westbrook--18 points on 6/12 in 21 minutes, +18. With that and the Minnesota game, he is definitely gunning for 6MOTY.
   218. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: October 31, 2022 at 02:20 AM (#6103345)
Clippers now have a worse point differential than the Lakers.

The Clippers aren't that good a team if Kawhi is not healthy/good.
   219. Moeball Posted: October 31, 2022 at 02:30 AM (#6103346)
Warriors just lost back to back road games to poor teams they should have beaten easily. 10 point favorite over Charlotte and 8.5 over Detroit. These are the sorts of games that they have won in past years even resting main players. They aren't playing any D at all this season. Kerr keeps referencing this flaw in the post game pressers and says it's being addressed, but there is no indication of improvement so far. We already know that Poole has been trying to model himself as early Steph 2.0, great outside range, great at free throws, and a major liability on defense. But this isn't all on JP, of course. Klay still doesn't look like himself and the second unit, especially, often looks helpless out there and completely unable to get any stops. But the pattern is repeating itself over and over again with regularity. It's early and of course it's better to have your weaknesses exposed early in the season rather than in a 7 game playoff series. There's plenty of time to fix this. But if improvement doesn't come soon Kerr may have to bite the bullet and change his rotations to where the young'uns aren't getting so many minutes. At least that's how I see it.
   220. jmurph Posted: October 31, 2022 at 07:47 AM (#6103348)
But if improvement doesn't come soon Kerr may have to bite the bullet and change his rotations to where the young'uns aren't getting so many minutes. At least that's how I see it.

I understand the point but I think they're going to need those guys to make another run.
   221. jmurph Posted: October 31, 2022 at 08:26 AM (#6103351)
I remember a couple years ago we had a little thread about being in a golden era for smart basketball writing/podcasts. I think it's... probably over? Just me? I think we're at least in a bit of a dip.

(The people responsible for podcasts at The Athletic truly seem to believe we're there for the production. Sound effects, background music while people are talking. I'm currently listening to someone attempting to have a serious discussion about the Kyrie situation while there are animal noises in the background? I genuinely don't understand what's happening.)
   222. asinwreck Posted: October 31, 2022 at 09:00 AM (#6103352)
We'll remember 2023 as Pops' most impressive championship run.
   223. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 09:06 AM (#6103353)
The NBA Athletic podcasts are so annoying. I basically only listen to Nerder She Wrote these days, and it's just to listen to what Partnow has to say. DuFour and Mo Dakhil are more hot take merchants than analysts, I feel. Partnow's other podcast 'Callin' Shots' is much less chaotic. The recent Nerder had a lot of Halloween noise stuff, on top of the normal hosts talking over each other and the hosts trying to be funny - which almost none of the Athletic NBA pod folks are.

Talking Basketball, Lowe Post, The Dunker Spot, and Dunc'd On are my regulars. I'd like to do the pay version of Dunc'd On, but $16/month is really a hell of a lot and I mostly just want the Hollinger content. I guess I'll just take the free ones - I see there are still a few of those. I wish there was more of an in between tier to support them.

Then, depending on the guest or time of year, I may expand out to Old Man and the Three, Callin' Shots, and some of the Ringer stuff.

I still think there's a ton of good content out there, the bar has just been raised in terms of what I consider worthy of my limited podcast time. And I feel like we have hit a bit of a wall in terms of how into the weeds on plays, stats, etc. that podcasts are willing to go.
   224. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 09:09 AM (#6103355)
Very early right now, and I've not been able to watch them play yet, but it seems like the Spurs are running more of a modern offense? They're 9th in 3pa/game, and their 2 cornerstone guys are both getting up like 8 a game. This would be the first year since 14-15 that they're better than 25th in the league.
   225. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 31, 2022 at 09:39 AM (#6103356)
For basketball podcasts, I listen to a couple of local Wolves podcasts (which annoyingly recently started cross-pollinating, so now I keep getting the same people and opinions - I may need to cull the herd) and Dunc'd On and Thinking Basketball.
   226. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: October 31, 2022 at 09:40 AM (#6103357)
The Spurs look so good because they have played the Wolves three times and beat them like a drum twice. Sigh.
   227. jmurph Posted: October 31, 2022 at 10:15 AM (#6103361)
I'd like to do the pay version of Dunc'd On, but $16/month is really a hell of a lot and I mostly just want the Hollinger content.

Godspeed to them, they seem like nice guys and I'm happy for them that they've carved out these careers and seemingly made it work, but it's bonkers to me that people are paying that. $16 per month is more than League Pass costs, think about that. It's significantly more than I pay for the NYTimes. All so they can begin each podcast with 45 minutes of injury "updates" that are a day or more old? And talk over each other more than I hear on any other podcast? I will continue to pass on that.

Agree with the assessment of most of the Athletic podcasts in 223, the Nerder ones are okay, I like the David Aldridge one sometimes. Sam Vecenie can be interesting. The ones where the approach is people who aren't funny trying to be funny (and that includes No Dunks) are not for me.
   228. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: October 31, 2022 at 10:26 AM (#6103363)
I have a left over Dunc'd on subscription that I am going to let lapse. I like it well enough, but more for the mock offseason and trade deadline stuff. The day to day analysis is good but duplicative. Also, who has the time?
   229. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: October 31, 2022 at 10:31 AM (#6103364)
I like the Mismatch on the Ringer, but Kevin O'Connor has gone from the poor man's Zach Lowe to a Skid Row Zach Lowe. At first glance, Chris Vernon sounds like the basketball version of Chris Russo, but he does have some nuance, and I think he has a unique angle among basketball podcasts.

No Dunks is over-saturated, but I usually listen to the Friday shows.

   230. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 11:14 AM (#6103372)
I pay for Dunc'd on, although I don't remember what the impetus was. I think it's okay, but I end up listening to almost every pod.

I also then listen to the Lowe Post and occasionally other stuff. I will say, and maybe this is blasphemy, but Zach has gotten noticeably worse in the last year or so with all the TV work. The guests are worse, particularly the ESPN ones, and Zach seems desperate to avoid talking basketball with some of these people.
   231. jmurph Posted: October 31, 2022 at 11:23 AM (#6103374)
I also then listen to the Lowe Post and occasionally other stuff. I will say, and maybe this is blasphemy, but Zach has gotten noticeably worse in the last year or so with all the TV work. The guests are worse, particularly the ESPN ones, and Zach seems desperate to avoid talking basketball with some of these people.

Totally agree.

I also now feel mildly bad criticizing the idea of paying for Dunc'd On, I should have known some people here were subscribers! Also I subscribe to practically every possible streaming TV service so I'm in no position to judge anyone's media spending habits.
   232. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 11:26 AM (#6103375)
I also then listen to the Lowe Post and occasionally other stuff. I will say, and maybe this is blasphemy, but Zach has gotten noticeably worse in the last year or so with all the TV work. The guests are worse, particularly the ESPN ones, and Zach seems desperate to avoid talking basketball with some of these people.


Yeah, I'll agree on that. It seems like he has Ramona Shelburne, Bobby Marks, or Chris Herring on for like 50% of the episodes. I am fine with any of those guests occasionally but the frequency is too much.

And he makes everyone discuss the Lakers. The #### man, there's nothing left to say. There's been nothing left to say for like 9 months. Let's move on.

I assume he's probably getting a lot of money from ESPN to do this.
   233. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 11:50 AM (#6103384)
I also now feel mildly bad criticizing the idea of paying for Dunc'd On, I should have known some people here were subscribers! Also I subscribe to practically every possible streaming TV service so I'm in no position to judge anyone's media spending habits.


Eh, don't feel bad. I didn't take it personally.

I don't pay for the New York Times (although my wife does, I just can never remember her ####### login details).
   234. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: October 31, 2022 at 11:52 AM (#6103385)
I think Lowe hasn't gotten worse, as much as other folks are catching up with him. I still like his podcast, but there seems to be more pandering to JvG and others. It's ok. Honestly, there's so much decent to good stuff out there that it seems like an embarrassment of riches.
   235. Fourth True Outcome Posted: October 31, 2022 at 01:29 PM (#6103397)
My Lowe Post take is that I think Lowe himself is fine, and probably hasn't changed too much in his approach, but over time the ecosystem he works in has gotten more and more ESPNified, especially now that he's on tv all the time, and the guests and therefore conversations that happen on his podcast have shifted with this. So, as spivey says, too much of his time is spent talking with the same people, mostly about the same topics. He's still great when he's digging in with a guest who has a specific area of expertise, but the ESPN generalists drag the podcast down to their level, and that happens all too much.

This is, of course, the other side of the "Dunc'd On costs more than LP" coin; Lowe has job and financial security thanks to his Bristol overlords that he couldn't really get elsewhere. If the price of that is too many chummy conversations with the ESPN tv crew, I get how it's one he's willing to pay, and can't really criticize that.
   236. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: October 31, 2022 at 01:36 PM (#6103399)
And he makes everyone discuss the Lakers. The #### man, there's nothing left to say.


Ha. Nice. I'll keep this in mind.
   237. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: October 31, 2022 at 01:40 PM (#6103400)
Lowe has job and financial security thanks to his Bristol overlords that he couldn't really get elsewhere.


Indeed, and I think he is more or less the only guy who went from NBA Blogger dude to where he is.
   238. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 02:11 PM (#6103403)
This is, of course, the other side of the "Dunc'd On costs more than LP" coin; Lowe has job and financial security thanks to his Bristol overlords that he couldn't really get elsewhere. If the price of that is too many chummy conversations with the ESPN tv crew, I get how it's one he's willing to pay, and can't really criticize that.


It's just like ... many of these guests have nothing to add. Chiney Ogwumike was the worst, and I actually turned off the podcast. But it's also just less and less good writers like Arnowitz, Pelton and Beck and more and more of these TV people like Richard Jefferson, Shelbourne and McMahon.

I like Zach Lowe because he gives better analysis than the TV guys. So if you bring the TV guys on, you just get the same lazy analysis.
   239. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 02:27 PM (#6103406)
It's just like ... many of these guests have nothing to add. Chiney Ogwumike was the worst

I learned from her that Nurkic averaged 20/20 for Portland.
   240. aberg Posted: October 31, 2022 at 02:54 PM (#6103414)
Does anyone know what happened to Arnovitz? I really enjoyed him and thought he had a unique and interesting way of thinking and talking about basketball. I thought I read that he was trying to write for TV, but don't know if that was just a rumor.
   241. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: October 31, 2022 at 03:18 PM (#6103420)
I thought the Richard Jefferson episode was good! He had some funny anecdotes about his playing time, like the Knicks slogan that he took as a shot at the Nets.
   242. aberg Posted: October 31, 2022 at 04:15 PM (#6103434)
I thought the Richard Jefferson episode was good! He had some funny anecdotes about his playing time, like the Knicks slogan that he took as a shot at the Nets.


Lowe used to be like 90% analysis and 10% fluff (occasional jokes about mascots and court design). I agree that the has become tighter in the ESPN orbit, which adds lots of rumor-mongering and gossip to the menu. The balance has shifted to closer to 50/50 and more of the fluff is the soap opera stuff (and to be fair to Lowe, I think NBA coverage in general has skewed heavily to the soap opera stuff the last several years). He's better than most doing the fluff. I agree with those saying the fluff isn't as good as the analysis, but it's still listenable to me. YMMV.
   243. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 05:10 PM (#6103437)
I liked the Richard Jefferson episode too. It's clear he's at least keeping himself somewhat apprised of analytics, like JJ Reddick also does. Of the talking heads, he's way more thoughtful than most of these other guys.

He ain't just out there Kendrick Perkins-ing about. I did not bother listening to that or the Stephen A Lowe Post episodes.
   244. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 05:56 PM (#6103439)
Sixers lose 2nd round picks for tampering to sign PJ Tucker and Danuel House.

Can't see that Danuel House was worth it, but whatever.
   245. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 31, 2022 at 06:07 PM (#6103441)
According to a league official, the NBA found no wrongdoing related to Philadelphia's re-signing of James Harden this past summer. Harden's return was under some scrutiny in the public sphere as a result of the significant pay cut he took in addition to other factors. That was ultimately probably the most important piece of this investigation in terms of actual punishment — salary cap circumvention would have been a much more damning charge than the Sixers contacting free agents before the legal period opened for business.

link
   246. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 31, 2022 at 06:08 PM (#6103442)
Can't see that Danuel House was worth it, but whatever.
obviously.
   247. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 06:30 PM (#6103446)
Myles Turner openly begging to join the Lakers.

Twitter Link
   248. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 31, 2022 at 06:32 PM (#6103447)
   249. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 06:52 PM (#6103451)
Maybe this is a homer take, but I think Indiana actually has reduced their leverage.

They want to be BAD, and right now they are disturbingly mediocre. Most of the competition for Myles Turner seems less likely to make a deal, and he has now made it clear that he wants to walk away.
   250. DCA Posted: October 31, 2022 at 07:28 PM (#6103458)
They can have Westbrook + 1 FRP for Turner + Hield whenever they want, right? So there's really no loss in leverage until that's off the table (Turner seriously hurt, or AD/LBJ hurt and the Lakers give up 2023).
   251. spivey Posted: October 31, 2022 at 07:29 PM (#6103459)
I agree. Tbh I don't see why Westbrook should be 2 unprotected firsts. There's 1 year left on a deal, and salaries have to (roughly) match anyways, and Westbrook expires, and any team making this deal isn't trying to make the playoffs anyways.

   252. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: October 31, 2022 at 07:40 PM (#6103465)
I agree. Tbh I don't see why Westbrook should be 2 unprotected firsts. There's 1 year left on a deal, and salaries have to (roughly) match anyways, and Westbrook expires, and any team making this deal isn't trying to make the playoffs anyways.
it's still 50 ####### million ####### dollars. it's not just "salary"; it's not just "cap room"; it's actual ####### money.
   253. tshipman Posted: October 31, 2022 at 08:02 PM (#6103471)
it's still 50 ####### million ####### dollars. it's not just "salary"; it's not just "cap room"; it's actual ####### money.


The Pacers would be saving money in the deal.
   254. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: October 31, 2022 at 10:26 PM (#6103478)
How the heck are the Jazz good? They are 5-2 and up 17 points on Memphis at halftime.

Should the Lakers just punt this season and try to rebuild the team next year with more cap space? I understand why any team with the LBJ and AD should be trying to win but can this team even if they can trade Westbrook for the best possible package?

Their defense has been pretty good, 3rd overall in defensive rating, and in a theory an offense with LBJ, AD, and some shooters could be pretty good. I mean, they are 1-5 this year, and were bad last year. That's a lot of evidence that this team just isn't very good.
   255. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: November 01, 2022 at 12:15 AM (#6103486)
Should the Lakers just punt this season and try to rebuild the team next year with more cap space? I understand why any team with the LBJ and AD should be trying to win but can this team even if they can trade Westbrook for the best possible package?


Like people have said, there are no good options. Probably no fanbase in American sports, with the possible exception of Yankees and (and maybe Dodgers) fans, is more "championship or nothing" than Lakers fans, and the trade would not get them there. Hield is pretty bad on D, and Turner has played only a few more games than Anthony Davis has the last three years, including only 2 of 7 this year. But...you can't really "punt" with LeBron James on the roster.

Hield can legit shoot, and Turner has good rim-protection and floor-stretching skills. He could play some with Davis when they were both available and you would hope that you would have at least one of them most nights. With Beverley and the young legs, the team D is better. There are no great teams right now, so I can see why Pelinka would be tempted to do it. The real problem with it, like I said in the off-season, is that James and Davis are now "very good" instead of "unstoppable." But if Pelinka does end up doing it, I would get it. I blame him for the Westbrook/Caruso fiascos and last year's weird and pathetic roster, but this is not an easy call (assuming that Indiana would still do it).
   256. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:52 AM (#6103488)
Tony Huynh @Tony_Huynh
We are disabling LeBron due to a critical bug with him. We will reenable after the bug is fixed. Thank you for your patience. #MultiVersus
   257. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:59 AM (#6103489)
The Pacers would be saving money in the deal.
that's a real late-stage capitalism way of looking at it.
   258. aberg Posted: November 01, 2022 at 10:44 AM (#6103507)
How the heck are the Jazz good? They are 5-2 and up 17 points on Memphis at halftime.


I kind of get it with the offense being good. Offensively, they shoot and they rebound. If this is Markkanen getting back on the developmental trajectory we thought he was on as a rookie, he can be a really solid, stretchy offensive player. Sexton and Clarkson shoot well without turning it over much. Conley is still shooting well even if the rest of his game is deteriorating. Beasley his a high-volume marksman. Vanderbilt rebounds very well and Olynyk is solid inside (and he's at 57% on 3s).

Defensively, I'm not sure they can keep it up. They're taking 11 more 3s per game than their opponents, but opponents are also shooting 32.8%, which won't continue. Maybe Ainge brought that magic three point defense with him. They force a ton of turnovers and that's another thing I'm not sure will continue.

Part of the reason I (and probably most) thought they'd be really bad is that I thought they'd keep sloughing parts for picks. I figured Conley, Clarkson, Beasley, Sexton, Markkanen would all get dumped if they could get anything back. If they stay about .500, I'm less confident they'll drop those guys, but I think they're probably more like a 35-win team as presently constituted.
   259. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: November 01, 2022 at 12:48 PM (#6103517)
Heads-up: Going to go a little political here, but I thought this was worth adding to the thread:

link


Several fans clad in "Fight Antisemitism" shirts were seen sitting courtside at Monday night's basketball game between the Brooklyn Nets and the Indiana Pacers in New York City.

Last Thursday, Nets guard Kyrie Irving took to Twitter to post a link to the 2018 film "Hebrews to Negroes: Wake Up Black America" on Amazon Prime Video. The synopsis states that the movie, which is based on a 2015 book of the same name, "uncovers the true identity of the Children of Israel." The Associated Press reported that the film "includes anti-Jewish tropes."
   260. aberg Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:00 PM (#6103519)
Good for Nash for finding an offramp from the Brooklyn hell hole.
   261. rr would lock Shaq's a$$ up Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:00 PM (#6103520)
Nash out, as per Wojnarowski.
   262. Fourth True Outcome Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:05 PM (#6103522)
Well that is sure to fix everything that has been wrong with the Nets!
   263. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:12 PM (#6103523)
Nash seemed done with the team based on his last couple of postgame pressers.

I suspect that will not be the last departure from the Nets in 2022.
   264. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:21 PM (#6103524)
I think the GM should shoulder much of the blame for the last few years of the dysfunction of the Nets. And by GM I mean Durant.
   265. KronicFatigue Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:22 PM (#6103525)
1) Nash seems like a terrible coach
2) KD's "him or me" demand w/r/t Nash was wrong, and made me want them all there together making each other miserable.
3) Firing Nash in the midst of this Irving situation is terrible timing. One way or another, they need to address Irving before making basketball decisions.
4) This might move the needle a bit, but this team's flaws aren't fixable.
   266. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:54 PM (#6103529)
Shams Charania @ShamsCharania
Ime Udoka has emerged as a strong frontrunner to be the next Brooklyn Nets head coach and the sides have begun discussions, sources tell @TheAthletic @Stadium. Nets are in the midst of their search process and are continuing to do due diligence.
   267. Moses Taylor loves a good maim Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:56 PM (#6103530)
Like, wtf? We never got many more details about the Udoka suspension. What was bad enough that the C's felt justified suspending him for a year but the Nets don't think is bad at all?

I know, I know.
   268. aberg Posted: November 01, 2022 at 01:58 PM (#6103531)
We haven't had a team lean this hard into being bad people for a while. The Bengals had a run like that about 15 years ago. Jailblazers, The U. Going to make for a great documentary someday.

Their only miss was not claiming Primo off waivers.
   269. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:00 PM (#6103532)
This is a moment for discipline from coaching candidates- there will be other jobs, I promise!

Edit: Except for maybe Udoka!
   270. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:00 PM (#6103533)
Their only miss was not claiming Primo off waivers.

Maybe they'll sign him now that the Spurs are on the hook for the salary.
   271. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:08 PM (#6103534)
Udoka getting fired/suspended/whatever and then joining the Nets in the midst of Everything Going On With The Nets really feels like WWE stuff.
   272. Moeball Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:11 PM (#6103535)
Ok, this is my personal bias here, but I was quite happy to see Bos vs GS in the Finals last season, knowing that Kryrie quit on the Celtics and KD quit on the Warriors. It's petty, of course, to view things that way but it's how I felt. I imagined them watching the games together, with KD rooting for Boston and Kryrie rooting for the Ws. I figured they made Ben buy the popcorn.

Now to see the implosion overtaking the Nets my petty side is smiling. I try to be a better human being than this most of the time but these guys really seem to bring out my worst instincts. And each other's.
   273. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:14 PM (#6103537)
I guess they spent a couple minutes doing due diligence.
Shams Charania @ShamsCharania
The Brooklyn Nets plan to hire Ime Udoka as their new head coach, sources tell @TheAthletic @Stadium. Boston granted the Nets permission to speak to Udoka and will allow him to leave freely, sources said.
   274. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:15 PM (#6103538)
The absolute only thing I'll defend Kyrie for is that he didn't do anything wrong by leaving the Celtics- they traded for him, it's not like he chose to go there to begin with (and even if he had, it would still be fine to leave). Obviously he shouldn't have (completely unprompted!) publicly pledged to re-sign with them before changing his mind, that wasn't ideal, but he was a free agent and left, it happens.
   275. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:17 PM (#6103539)
INCREDIBLE. This is genuinely shocking.
   276. Fourth True Outcome Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:18 PM (#6103540)
Everything else aside (and there's PLENTY there, most of which as Moses points out isn't public), Udoka's willingness to bluntly throw players under the bus publicly in the name of accountability is going to be FASCINATING with the Nets roster.
   277. spivey Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:26 PM (#6103541)
IME UDOKA LET'S ####### GOOOOOOOO
   278. spivey Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:34 PM (#6103543)
Twitter reminds me that Joe Tsai is a WNBA owner as well. Man making moves out here.
   279. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:49 PM (#6103544)
This is really a thing that is happening.
   280. KronicFatigue Posted: November 01, 2022 at 02:52 PM (#6103545)
Ok, this is my personal bias here, but I was quite happy to see Bos vs GS in the Finals last season, knowing that Kryrie quit on the Celtics and KD quit on the Warriors. It's petty, of course, to view things that way but it's how I felt. I imagined them watching the games together, with KD rooting for Boston and Kryrie rooting for the Ws. I figured they made Ben buy the popcorn.

Now to see the implosion overtaking the Nets my petty side is smiling. I try to be a better human being than this most of the time but these guys really seem to bring out my worst instincts. And each other's.


You're a better person than me. Things like this are 85% of the reason I follow basketball. I spend the majority of my time rooting against players/teams, etc.
   281. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 03:10 PM (#6103548)
This probably could have used another round of edits before going live (Woj):
The Nets have been vetting the circumstances around Udoka's suspension and believe that he can tighten up the league's 29th-ranked defensive team and command leadership in a difficult locker room, sources said. Udoka spent a season with Ben Simmons -- a player the Nets are desperately trying to get on track -- on the Philadelphia 76ers' coaching staff in 2019-2020.
   282. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: November 01, 2022 at 03:24 PM (#6103549)
   283. Fourth True Outcome Posted: November 01, 2022 at 03:30 PM (#6103551)
Who says no?

Curry and Harris aren't playing now, but it's hard to imagine the Nets trading their two best supporting shooters to pair Draymond up with Ben Simmons...
   284. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: November 01, 2022 at 04:27 PM (#6103557)
Some things are more important than the on-court fit... like team chemistry.
   285. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 04:38 PM (#6103559)
You've got to wonder how much space Marks has to operate, especially with highly regarded former front office guys like Gersson Rosas and Neil Olshey available.
   286. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 04:55 PM (#6103561)
Who says no?
9.6 out of 10, from the bulgarian judge.
   287. bob gee Posted: November 01, 2022 at 04:55 PM (#6103562)
If the Nets deal Kyrie and Durant and have to somewhat rebuild without good draft picks, Marks should stay - he's already accomplished getting them from dregs to 500 without draft picks.

But next time, don't let the superstars fire the coach (Atkinson, I mean).
   288. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: November 01, 2022 at 05:43 PM (#6103563)
You've got to wonder how much space Marks has to operate, especially with highly regarded former front office guys like Gersson Rosas and Neil Olshey available.


Having Gersson and Ime together does seem like a solid match.
   289. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 06:03 PM (#6103566)
Like, wtf? We never got many more details about the Udoka suspension. What was bad enough that the C's felt justified suspending him for a year but the Nets don't think is bad at all?

I know, I know.
i mean, are the nets also hiring the person that udoka did something with (consensually) and then did something(?) to (non-consensually)?

depending on how much of creep udoka was (i don't think the general public was ever made aware of the exact details), it might be reasonable enough for him to get a job somewhere else, just so the person who filed the complaint doesn't have to leave their job, or feel uncomfortable working in the same building anymore.


granted, this is also the M.O. for how serious abusers manage to escape any meaningful consequences for decades on end, as they continue to abuse a near-endless stream of people who are unfortunate enough to come into contact with them.


but i'm sure it'll work for brooklyn.
   290. Thok Posted: November 01, 2022 at 07:48 PM (#6103587)
If the Nets deal Kyrie and Durant


How much trade value does Kyrie have right now?
   291. Fourth True Outcome Posted: November 01, 2022 at 08:33 PM (#6103595)
How much trade value does Kyrie have right now?

He's a 36m expiring contract, but that might be it.
   292. tshipman Posted: November 01, 2022 at 08:38 PM (#6103597)
You've got to wonder how much space Marks has to operate, especially with highly regarded former front office guys like Gersson Rosas and Neil Olshey available.


I feel like this was so subtle it didn't receive the credit it deserved.

***

Imagine being a Jewish woman working for the Nets today.
   293. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 08:50 PM (#6103607)
I think there’s a decent chance they get talked out of the Udoka thing, right? They’re getting trashed everywhere right now, can’t imagine the league is thrilled that their big national tv night is dominated by talk of how disfunctional they are.
   294. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 08:54 PM (#6103608)
I think there’s a decent chance they get talked out of the Udoka thing, right? They’re getting trashed everywhere right now, can’t imagine the league is thrilled that their big national tv night is dominated by talk of how disfunctional they are.
it's like three stooges syndrome.
   295. tshipman Posted: November 01, 2022 at 09:13 PM (#6103612)
The only thing dumber than hiring Udoka would be announcing that you intend to do that and backing down due to criticism.
   296. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: November 01, 2022 at 09:31 PM (#6103618)
The only thing dumber than hiring Udoka would be announcing that you intend to do that and backing down due to criticism.
so you're saying that's the most likely outcome?
   297. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 09:32 PM (#6103619)
At this rate, I am expecting Bobby Knight to lease an apartment in Park Slope by Sunday.
   298. jmurph Posted: November 01, 2022 at 09:49 PM (#6103634)
Well at least they’re playing through it.
   299. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 09:56 PM (#6103643)
Zach LaVine buries the Nets tonight with 20 in the fourth quarter.

   300. asinwreck Posted: November 01, 2022 at 10:00 PM (#6103645)
K.C. Johnson @KCJHoop
LaVine outscored the Nets 20-19 in the 4th
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