Allow me to reiterate my stance on the Citifield wall complaints from Wright: boo fucking hoo. Cry more.

Boone to propose that In the future the Yankees be allowed to bring their Yankee Stadium Little League RF fences with them on the road.

At that point, Houston should have forfeited the game to New York to help MLB get a marquee team like the Yankees in the World Series, as is their birthright.

Boone may be technically correct, but that open roof didn't cause those 13 strikeouts.

Also pretty sure they didn't just open the roof when the Yankees were batting.

And the story notes the fly ball would have been a HR in just one MLB park. Guess which one.

Hahahahahahahahahahaha.

Boone also requested a recount of the run totals.

The series is effectively over, so I guess I'd be blaming the roof, too.

That's bush league. I'd be very happy if this is Boone last series managing the Yankees.

I'm no Yankee or Boone fan, but to be fair, he was responding to a specific question about whether he thought Judge's ball had a chance. And there's a chance he's right that if the roof were closed it may have been out.

Yeah maybe he should have just tacked on a "but hey both teams were playing in the same conditions" for good measure but this seems like desperately trying to make a big deal out of essentially nothing.

390 feet? oh pls. ball caught right at the wall which isn't even halfway from the LF pole, which is 326' to the LF corner of the bullpen wall, which is 374. so maybe 355' at most.

shoeles joe is dead right if that ball is out in YS it is little league all right

and aaron boone sounds like a whiny parent at a little league game. one of the zillions of reasons i do not root for his team.

marquee grisson >>>>>>>>> marquee franchise

Boone has worn out his welcome in NY.
I am a bit surprised that he outlasted Liz Truss.

It's not over yet . Cole will have game 3 and a game 7 if they get there. Judge and Stanton still aren't hitting - if they can breakout.....

Boone has worn out his welcome in NY.

I've lost count of the number of times that the CW narrative on Boone has changed over the course of his managing career. I'm sure he's responsible for those 30 strikeouts in the last two games, or his team's collective .138 BA.

marquee grisson >>>>>>>>> marquee franchise

LOL

I've lost count of the number of times that the CW narrative on Boone has changed over the course of his managing career. I'm sure he's responsible for those 30 strikeouts in the last two games, or his team's collective .138 BA.

No, that's the fault of the analytics department, which Yankees fans argue should be fired with Boone.

I'm no Yankee or Boone fan, but to be fair, he was responding to a specific question about whether he thought Judge's ball had a chance. And there's a chance he's right that if the roof were closed it may have been out.

Boone merely made the same observation, in response to a direct question, that the broadcasters & postgame analysts did about the roof and effect of the wind. The headline is just clickbait hype.

I've lost count of the number of times that the CW narrative on Boone has changed over the course of his managing career.

Really? It seems to me that Boone has been disliked by Yankee fans pretty much from day one.

This is Boones second ALCS in five years. Most would view that as ok. With their payroll maybe it should be three. 2020 is a weird year so really 2 out of 4.

Yankees are facing an uphill battle for sure. They haven't pitched Cole or Cortes, so maybe they can get back in the series, but man do they look look outclassed in the bullpen and lineup depth.

This is Boones second ALCS in five years. Most would view that as ok. With their payroll maybe it should be three. 2020 is a weird year so really 2 out of 4.

It's good enough for the Yankees, sure. But a Cards manager with that kind of record needs to be shown the door.

And there's a chance he's right that if the roof were closed it may have been out.

No. There's no chance he was right.

Temperatures last night outside the stadium were in the neighborhood of temperatures inside the stadium when the roof is closed. Dew points were low, which also would have been the case with the roof closed. So the air pressure, at least in terms of temperature and humidity, would have been the same either way. The wind above the stadium would have produced lower pressure and caused slightly rising air currents in the stadium, potentially giving the ball greater lift than would have happened with the roof closed, but probably having no material effect. Further, the wind was blowing toward RF, meaning Judge's BIP would have been aided by the wind had it gotten high enough to catch any. Most fly balls in a modern MLB ballpark do not rise high enough to get above the top of the upper deck anyway, so it's unlikely it would have had any effect. We can't say how much it affected the ball, but to whatever degree the roof being open affected the ball in flight it definitely did not hinder its flight one iota. Closing the roof might have hurt it, or might have done effectively nothing to it. It would not have helped. The only things that would have helped it were if it had been hit at Yankee Stadium, or if Judge had hit it farther, or if Jeffrey Maier were out there and replay wasn't used for boundary calls.

Nobody at all should fault Boone for answering a direct question, and nobody should fault him for giving an answer that didn't have the benefit of analysis of the air conditions open vs. closed. But he was wrong about it, so let's at least stop pretending that he might have been right.

21. To be clear, Boone should go. It will just be hard to do it.

Maybe I'm mellowing out in my ooooolllldddd age, but I kind of hate that people are jumping on Boone for saying this. If you interview players, coaches, and managers after games, and you want to hear their real thoughts, don't judge too harshly when they express their frustrations.

From TFA:

In the post-game, Yankees manager Aaron Boone asserted that Judge’s fly-out might have been a two-run homer if not for the open roof at the Astros’ home stadium.

Huh. Okay. Let’s hear him out!

"I think the roof open kind of killed us. I think it's a 390' [foot] ball."

Hard to tell exactly, but it sounds like Boone was speaking specifically about the roof situation killing them on that one fly ball, not that it killed their chances to win or anything. It would be interesting to know what the question to Boone was before he said that.

This is Boones second ALCS in five years. Most would view that as ok. With their payroll maybe it should be three. 2020 is a weird year so really 2 out of 4.

Really? Girardi took A 91 win team, that no one had expected anything from, to g7 of the ALCS and got shown the door. He also got monster years out of very young players Aaron Judge, Gary Sanchez, and Luis Severino. Judge is the only one who's played nearly as well since, and that not until this year.

Boone has had three ~100 win teams and has not gotten that far. How does he survive that if Girardi's firing was at all justified?

Are the ASTROS going to be to the YANKEES what the YANKEES were to the RED SOX pre-2004?

How many times now has HOU taken down NYY in recent history (assuming this ALCS lead holds, which of course it may not)? And each time the Yankee fans had an excuse (trash cans, buzzer in Altuve's shirt, the roof open), which is similar to the Red Sox (B Dent/Pinella, umps robbed us in 99, Pedro left on the mound in 03)

I see parallels.

And each time the Yankee fans had an excuse (trash cans, buzzer in Altuve's shirt, the roof open),

This Yankee fans has no excuses. They've gotten beat by a better team. Better at developing young talent. Better at keeping their players healthy. Better at knowing where to spend their money.

Boone has had three ~100 win teams and has not gotten that far. How does he survive that if Girardi's firing was at all justified?

Here's NJ.com on Steinbrenner, in 2017, after Girardi was not re-signed—different than fired—and before Boone was hired:

Joe had to go, and it wasn't just Brian Cashman who knew it.

Owner Hal Steinbenner felt that Joe Girardi's time in the Bronx was done, too.

"As I told Cash, I wasn't following his recommendation. I agreed with it," Steinbrenner said Wednesday at the Waldorf Astoria, as the GM Meetings ended and Owners Meetings started.

"He and I have had these discussions for a considerable length of time over and over again, with different people involved sometimes, but similar type trends. This isn't something we just decided we wanted to sit down and do at the end of the season. We've had a lot of discussions through the years." Steinbrenner said

What if the Yankees, who made it all the way to Game 7 of the ALCS, would have reached or even won the World Series?

"I felt like my decision was my decision. I can't say that," Steinbrenner said. "I'm sure there would have been more pressure, it would've been a more difficult decision to make, but I still believe I would have made it because I felt that was what was best for the organization going forward."

Here's NJ.com on Steinbrenner, in 2017, after Girardi was not re-signed—different than fired—and before Boone was hired:

There's no difference between firing a manager and not re-signing one. Their salaries are trivial to all but the cheapest MLB teams.

There's no difference between firing a manager and not re-signing one. Their salaries are trivial to all but the cheapest MLB teams.

No one said anything about managerial salaries but you. No one in this thread. Not Cashman. Not Hal. The problem with Girardi wasn't his salary or his successes/defeats in the playoffs. It was his player management as the leader of the clubhouse. Point being, it isn't just the number of postseason games won. For further evidence, look at the other NY team. Here are guys with experience handling NY and and more postseason success on their resumés than Showalter, all of whom were available last winter:

Torre
Piniella
Terry Collins
Davey Johnson
Willie Randolph
Bobby Valentine

By the same criteria, you can now add Mattingly and Girardi to the list of experienced managers capable of handling NY and with more postseason success than Buck.

NY Post:

"Like most of us, Mike Francesa saves his spiciest takes for Twitter.

The broadcasting legend slammed the Yankees after their 3-2 ALCS Game 2 loss to the Astros, after which starting pitcher Luis Severino said Houston “got lucky.”

“Yanks sound like losers after the game. Shut up about exit velo. Try hitting the ball,” Francesa tweeted on Thursday night.

Francesa was referring to Severino citing the exit velocity of Alex Bregman’s home run and Aaron Judge’s long fly ball that was snagged at the right-field fence by Kyle Tucker.

“[Bregman] hit it 91 mph,’’ Severino told reporters of Bregman’s three-run, third-inning blast into the Crawford Boxes in left field. “That’s the only thing I’m gonna say. And Judge hit it 106 [mph] and it didn’t go out. They got lucky.”

Francesa did not appreciate Severino’s dismissive tone as the Yankees are now in a 2-0 hole against their hated rivals."

Verlander is one thing, anybody can lose to Verlander. But no way would St Joe, St Paulie and St Derek lose to a pitcher named Framber. Framber!!

And if you can lose in the ALCS with Judge, you can lose without him. The Yanks need gritty guys like ... Paulie. He would have found a way to get that ball over the wall.

Anyway, I assume construction on the NYS dome will be finished before tomorrow's game.

No one said anything about managerial salaries but you. No one in this thread. Not Cashman. Not Hal. The problem with Girardi wasn't his salary or his successes/defeats in the playoffs. It was his player management as the leader of the clubhouse. Point being, it isn't just the number of postseason games won.

Have you looked ta the team Giradi took the Astros to game 7 with? Duct tape and bailing wire come to mind. Girardi managed the young players on the team to the best years in their careers until Judge's 2022. Boone has been given way more talent, and achieved less.

This Yankee fans has no excuses. They've gotten beat by a better team. Better at developing young talent. Better at keeping their players healthy. Better at knowing where to spend their money.

Right on all three counts.

-----------------

The problem with Girardi wasn't his salary or his successes/defeats in the playoffs. It was his player management as the leader of the clubhouse. Point being, it isn't just the number of postseason games won.

Exactly. Girardi's hardass rigidity made him ill suited for today's players. The Phillies learned that lesson the hard way.

---------------

Have you looked ta the team Giradi took the Astros to game 7 with? Duct tape and bailing wire come to mind. Girardi managed the young players on the team to the best years in their careers until Judge's 2022. Boone has been given way more talent, and achieved less.

That 2017 team won 91 games. Not counting 2020, Boone's have won 100, 103, 92, and 99 in a season where the Yankees suffered one key injury after another. The only year out of 10 that Giradi won more than 99 games was in 2009, when he'd just acquired Sabathia and Burnett and every starter but one (Melky) had an OPS+ of 118 or better. He never came close to repeating that season until 2017. And look at how quickly the Phillies turned it around this year once they got rid of him and replaced him with Thomson.

Boone has worn out his welcome in NY.
I am a bit surprised that he outlasted Liz Truss.

He's only outlasted Truss because no one has put up a webcam of Boone against a piece of produce yet. (Suggestions, anyone?)

Suggestions, anyone?

Aaron Boone job vs Daniel Vogelbach's post-game buffet.

Boone has worn out his welcome in NY.
I am a bit surprised that he outlasted Liz Truss.

Maybe they can switch jobs. (When Truss comes out of the dugout to hand the ump the lineup card, they can play Public Enemy's "Can't Truss It".)

That 2017 team won 91 games. Not counting 2020, Boone's have won 100, 103, 92, and 99

Right, Boone has had much better talent and hasn't done as well in the playoffs. The strength of his teams is an indictment of Boone, not a plus. We all know managers don't affect regular season record by more than a couple of games. No one cares if you win 98 or 102. That level of team is judged in the playoffs.

Andy, you could have taken those teams to the playoffs and gotten knocked out quickly. Didn't need an MLB manager for that.

And look at how quickly the Phillies turned it around this year once they got rid of him and replaced him with Thomson.

We're discussing Girardi as a Yankee manager. He may have sucked in Philly. I don't know. I don't follow them at all.

My only point is every season that Boone has managed has been worse than the one that got Girardi dismissed. No idea why you'd keep Boone.

No idea why you'd keep Boone.

No idea why they'd replace him. I don't remember the specifics, but I have a memory of him having made some blatantly questionable postseason bullpen move [edit: a couple years ago]. Other than that, from what I've seen/read it doesn't seem like his teams are losing because of his decisions. Seems mostly like they've just been outmatched. This season, rain didn't help them in the ALDS, and they've largely held their own against Houston, a team most anyone would say is better on paper.

What is Boone supposed to say? These bums aren't hitting? I fill out the lineup card to give us the best chance of winning but the players just didn't execute then
[channeling some John McKay] I'd be in favor of their execution?

He is supposed to take the heat for the players.

Today NY hasn't scored any runs. That makes it tough to win.

1 hit so far makes it hard to score runs. That plus there's a very good chance they have double-digit Ks for the 3rd game, which I cannot fathom not being a new record.

They made it to 11 k's; couple of hits in the 9th, though.

What was Boone supposed to do in this game to enable NY to win?

Boone is going to keep his job if they keep the front office and he's doing what the front office wants him to do. I think generally speaking the latter is true.

As Baxter and others have indicated, winning or losing these games wasn't a Boone thing. So I guess the question is what was the front office supposed to do to enable the Yankees to win?

1. Did they have enough talent to win? I mean, they made the playoffs and had a great record in the regular season, so in that sense yes they had enough talent to win.

2. Were they prepared for their opponent? That gets into the quality of scouting and analytics. (That also gets into the players buying into the scouting and analytics and adapting their approach accordingly. But trust is earned, and if scouting/analytics earned a lack of trust in the regular season then it goes right back to the quality of scouting/analytics.)

A lot of this stuff isn't anything any of us can know about the team. We're not in a position to know it, and they're not going to just come out and tell us any of this. The main point, though, is that the front office deserves far more scrutiny than Boone. IMO the players deserve more scrutiny than either of them, because it's ultimately on them to perform. But I could see a clearer path to the front office failing to get the job done than Boone failing to get the job done.

Suggestions, anyone?

Aaron Boone job vs Daniel Vogelbach's post-game buffet.

Come on. No one can be asked to survive longer than that.

Some Yankee fans blame Boone, some blame Cashman, and of course some blame both, but wouldn't ya know, hardly any point a finger at Hal. How come?

Maybe because George is dead, and they can't remember the name of the surviving son. Is is Hank, Hal, or Horatio?

Some Yankee fans blame Boone, some blame Cashman, and of course some blame both, but wouldn't ya know, hardly any point a finger at Hal. How come?

a) You can't fire the owner
b) They run a $200-250M payroll every year. No GM can reasonably ask for more under the current system.

a) You can't fire the owner

Millions of former Washington Redskins / Commanders fans hope that you're wrong about this.

Some Yankee fans blame Boone, some blame Cashman, and of course some blame both, but wouldn't ya know, hardly any point a finger at Hal. How come?

If they're blaming Cashman, they're implicitly blaming the guy who chooses to employ him.

If they're blaming Cashman, they're implicitly blaming the guy who chooses to employ him.

Funny how Mets fans during the Wilpon era had no problem directing blame mostly where it was due.

Funny how Mets fans during the Wilpon era had no problem directing blame mostly where it was due.

There's been no equivalent to the Madoff-induced cheapness, and the Steinbrenners don't appear to meddle like Jeff Wilpon did.

There's been no equivalent to the Madoff-induced cheapness, and the Steinbrenners don't appear to meddle like Jeff Wilpon did.

So we know it was Cashman's decision to pass on Correa?

So we know it was Cashman's decision to pass on Correa?


He spent a bunch on Donaldson. I see no reason he couldn't have kept Urshela at 3rd and signed Correa if he wanted to.

He spent a bunch on Donaldson. I see no reason he couldn't have kept Urshela at 3rd and signed Correa if he wanted to.

If he'd done that, it would've been a big improvement over what he got. No question about that.

But in his partial defense, Donaldson was coming off three very good years, and Urshela had slumped badly in 2021 after having given the Yanks two very good years before that. Not to mention that it would've taken much more money to snag Correa, and the Yankees' #1 prospect is a SS.

Not to mention that it would've taken much more money to snag Correa, and the Yankees' #1 prospect is a SS

The Yankees #s 3, 6 & 11 prospects are also shortstops, as well as late-season call-up Oswaldo Cabrera. It certainly appears that the Yankees self-evaluation indicated they would soon have sufficient MLB quality talent available at the position, so they directed their spending elsewhere.

But in his partial defense, Donaldson was coming off three very good years, and Urshela had slumped badly in 2021 after having given the Yanks two very good years before that. Not to mention that it would've taken much more money to snag Correa, and the Yankees' #1 prospect is a SS.

When the Yankees #1 prospect was ready, the club presumably would have moved Correa to 3B. (EDIT: And that's assuming they signed Correa to a long-term deal, not one similar to what the Twins gave him.)

The Yankees #s 3, 6 & 11 prospects are also shortstops, as well as late-season call-up Oswaldo Cabrera. It certainly appears that the Yankees self-evaluation indicated they would soon have sufficient MLB quality talent available at the position, so they directed their spending elsewhere.

Considering Correa's contract with the Twins, would that really have been a problem had he signed with the Yanks on similar terms?

The Yankees #s 3, 6 & 11 prospects are also shortstops, as well as late-season call-up Oswaldo Cabrera. It certainly appears that the Yankees self-evaluation indicated they would soon have sufficient MLB quality talent available at the position, so they directed their spending elsewhere.

Right, that was one of my points in my partial defense of Cashman. But Jesus, did Donaldson ever stink up the joint, even though he remained a very good defensive 3B.

The Yankees #s 3, 6 & 11 prospects are also shortstops, as well as late-season call-up Oswaldo Cabrera. It certainly appears that the Yankees self-evaluation indicated they would soon have sufficient MLB quality talent available at the position, so they directed their spending elsewhere.

They traded for a 3B and a SS. Pretty much any SS can play 3B.

Funny how Mets fans during the Wilpon era had no problem directing blame mostly where it was due.

Mets fans' reputation on rationality is well established.