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Friday, July 31, 2020

Astros owner Jim Crane opens up on sign-stealing scandal: ‘It weighs on all of us every day”

“People are aggravated the players didn’t get suspended,’’ Crane said, “but I didn’t have anything to do with that. That was (Commissioner) Rob (Manfred’s) call. Listen, it’s always going to be whatever you want to call it. A black mark. An asterisk. It happened. It’s not good for anybody. It’s not good for the game.

“We broke the rules. We got penalized. We were punished. There’s no doubt it weighs on all of us every single day.

“But I don’t know what else they want us to do. I mean, you couldn’t do a lot more. We took a big penalty. Rob (Manfred) sent a message. We accepted the message, and went above and beyond.

“We’re sorry. We apologized. But no matter what happened, it wasn’t going to be enough. People wanted me out of baseball. They wanted players to be suspended. They wanted everything.’’

 

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 11:03 AM | 37 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: astros, jim crane, sign-stealing

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   1. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 11:48 AM (#5967121)
Crane said he also sympathizes with Taubman, the former assistant GM who was fired after the Astros won the American League Championship Series. Taubman yelled "Thank God we got Osuna" and expletive towards a group of female reporters in the clubhouse.

“Brandon Taubman didn’t commit domestic violence,’’ Crane said. “He just made a comment. It’s nothing you can defend. He had a few cocktails. He was happy. There were people constantly coming at him over (Osuna), and he overreacted. Did he do the right thing? No. Everybody makes mistakes. But is he a good, genuine decent person and smart kid? Absolutely.

“I hated to see him lose his job, but we had no choice."
   2. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 31, 2020 at 11:54 AM (#5967123)
We’re sorry. We apologized.
Yeahnotsomuch.

It’s nothing you can defend.
”...but I will certainly try with the rest of this paragraph.”
   3. always extremely 57i66135, but never enough Posted: July 31, 2020 at 11:55 AM (#5967124)
"...it especially weighs down on our 4th phalanges"
   4. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 31, 2020 at 12:00 PM (#5967127)
Gotta love the “people wanted more than the insincere BS we gave them” —> “nothing will ever be good enough so we’re the victims!!” chestnut.
   5. Itchy Row Posted: July 31, 2020 at 12:02 PM (#5967128)
“I think (MLB) had a bigger problem than everybody realized,’’ Crane says. “Two other teams (the Yankees and Red Sox) were doing things and got caught, but we’re the ones who took the bullet.
"In fact, some people say we're heroes. Martyrs, even."
   6. pikepredator Posted: July 31, 2020 at 12:44 PM (#5967138)
“Brandon Taubman didn’t commit domestic violence,’’ Crane said. “He just made a comment. It’s nothing you can defend. He had a few cocktails. He was happy. There were people constantly coming at him over (Osuna), and he overreacted. Did he do the right thing? No. Everybody makes mistakes. But is he a good, genuine decent person and smart kid? Absolutely.


Wow seriously? That reads like something someone here would make up. Mocking women in support of Osuna isn't something a good or decent person would *think* of doing, drunk or sober. If anybody in my friend group ever did something like that in front of the rest of us . . . we would throw him to the wolves.

“If we had to re-run it, we would have had tried to do a better job of apologizing and tried to be more sincere.


Tried to be more sincere? What does that even mean? We were intentionally being insincere? And I love how he pretends that February press conference was somehow spur of the moment . . . "we were under the gun . . ."

That interview reinforces my feeling he should have his team taken away.
   7. CFBF's Overflowing Pathos Posted: July 31, 2020 at 01:00 PM (#5967143)
The reporter who broke the Taubman story wrote in that piece that the Astros had been really defensive and thin-skinned about the Osuna trade, constantly acting like the victims when people would bring it up. I thought that was a really interesting bit of psychology, in that, when it came to Osuna, the Astros won. They got a good pitcher for pennies on the dollar because he was suspended for domestic violence, and MLB didn't sanction or punish them for that at all. They got exactly what they wanted, and the only price they had to pay for it was some people saying mean things about them on the internet and in press conferences. You'd figure they'd be able to totally ignore that. And yet apparently it really pissed them off.
   8. Mayor Blomberg Posted: July 31, 2020 at 01:06 PM (#5967145)
He's got the Whiny trump down really, really good.
It's not Taubman, it's fake news!
But Obama/the Yankees!

a better job of apologizing and tried to be more sincere

If you can fake sincerity you got it made, baby. C'mon, Jim, COVID can't be that hard to catch in Houston.
   9. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 01:24 PM (#5967150)
"Mr. Crane, how do you sleep at night?"

"On top of a pile of money, with many beautiful ladies."

"Just asking."
   10. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: July 31, 2020 at 01:46 PM (#5967153)
Tried to be more sincere? What does that even mean?
It means they weren't sincere then, and they're not sincere now. They'll just be better about pretending to be sincere in the future.
   11. JJ1986 Posted: July 31, 2020 at 01:53 PM (#5967155)
When did Bob Nightengale get a new job printing press releases?
   12. KronicFatigue Posted: July 31, 2020 at 02:27 PM (#5967165)
I don't think it applies in this case (as Crane and the organization are clearly insincere), but there is a way to "try and be more sincere".

I'm writing an apology. I write it from the heart. Then my PR team and lawyers look at it and edit it. I go with their edits. I'm sincere, but the apology, as presented, feels less sincere because other interests are in play. Every public apology has multiple agendas.

Heck, even the layman can get into issues when apologizing, as it might be construed as a legal admission of guilt, I think, in some jurisdictions.
   13. Mayor Blomberg Posted: July 31, 2020 at 03:01 PM (#5967176)
"We apologize if our cheating offended anybody."
   14. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 31, 2020 at 03:05 PM (#5967178)
"We apologize if our cheating unspecified actions offended anybody."
   15. Jeff Frances the Mute Posted: July 31, 2020 at 04:20 PM (#5967191)
This is what happens when you give terrible people a break.
   16. The Yankee Clapper Posted: July 31, 2020 at 04:35 PM (#5967194)
"We apologize if our cheating offended anybody was offended by our prior actions”.
   17. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 05:00 PM (#5967195)
Wow seriously? That reads like something someone here would make up.
"Brandon Taubman was good in the beginning, but he went too far," Crane said.
   18. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 05:00 PM (#5967196)
You can’t make a sincere apology if you aren’t sorry for what you did, and Crane and the Astros aren’t.
   19. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 31, 2020 at 05:06 PM (#5967199)

You can’t make a sincere apology if you aren’t sorry for what you did, and Crane and the Astros aren’t.


Crane's apology
   20. Mayor Blomberg Posted: July 31, 2020 at 05:18 PM (#5967204)
“But the way we were doing it, that was pretty (stupid). I mean, banging on trash cans? You could have found a better way to do it.’’


I take back my snark. He really is sorry.
   21. Walt Davis Posted: July 31, 2020 at 05:56 PM (#5967209)
We’re sorry. We apologized.

It's always a challenge to transcribe spoken words. What he said was "We're sorry we apologized."

Similarly, Trump said we would "get tired of all the whining."
   22. Ron J Posted: July 31, 2020 at 10:16 PM (#5967251)
#4 While I get what you're saying (yeah the Astros have been doing we're sorry we got caught), he is right in that there's nothing that would satisfy people.
   23. Howie Menckel Posted: July 31, 2020 at 10:26 PM (#5967253)
#4 While I get what you're saying (yeah the Astros have been doing we're sorry we got caught), he is right in that there's nothing that would satisfy people.

well, they have never tried the "no more excuses and we will stop being so condescending and defensive" route, so I guess we'll never know.

as I said, I didn't even get fired up over this saga as it played out. not really my thing.

so I think they could have sold me/satisfied me without too much difficulty, actually.

but from the owner on down, there seems to be a fatally-flawed culture of #############.
   24. Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Griffin (Vlad) Posted: August 01, 2020 at 09:55 AM (#5967308)
he is right in that there's nothing that would satisfy people.


I think most people would feel like justice had been done if the Astros voluntarily surrendered the title and Crane sold the team.

But Crane isn’t interested in doing either of those things, so instead the line is that nothing would satisfy the critics. He has too much ego to accept a voluntary punishment with any real teeth because, as previously noted, he doesn’t think that they did anything wrong.
   25. Astroenteritis Posted: August 01, 2020 at 12:06 PM (#5967327)
but from the owner on down, there seems to be a fatally-flawed culture of #############.


This is the thing that was much more disturbing to me than the overblown cheating scandal. I'm much more disturbed by the Taubman incident, the horrible response to it, and what that says about the culture of the organization than by the shocking news that teams were cheating at baseball. Of course, when the owner's enterprises have been implicated (more than implicated, actually) in war profiteering and numerous instances of racial and gender bias, it's not surprising that there would be a rot in the house. I really want to see that change, but I don't have any way of knowing how much difference the post-scandal organizational changes have made.

Being an Astros fan of over 50 years, I don't really post too much about the cheating scandal, because I can understand why my (or any Astros fan's) opinions would be ignored, similar to how the judges' high and low scores are thrown out in diving, but I sure as hell can't defend anything about Crane.



   26. Howie Menckel Posted: August 01, 2020 at 12:18 PM (#5967331)
fair points all, Astro
   27. Mayor Blomberg Posted: August 01, 2020 at 01:27 PM (#5967351)
War profiteering. I forgot about that. I do remember BBC's justified disgust at the time with him.
   28. Gonfalon Bubble Posted: August 01, 2020 at 03:32 PM (#5967388)
Senator Susan Collins says that she believes that Jim Crane has learned a pretty big lesson from this case.
   29. Howie Menckel Posted: August 01, 2020 at 03:39 PM (#5967390)
speaking of contagions and superspreaders, it seems of late that every. single. thread. on BBTF upchucks political references.

do people go on politics website and threads and talk about baseball?

we have an OTP thread for COVID-related stuff (which a number of numbskulls ignore, and vomit up all sorts of irrelevant "observations".)

should we pivot to at least having one BASEBALL-ONLY thread?
   30. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 01, 2020 at 03:47 PM (#5967392)
. . . it seems of late that every. single. thread. on BBTF upchucks political references.
It’s the same people, and mostly the same viewpoint, time after time. Meanwhile, BBTF traffic continues to decline.
   31. frannyzoo Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:04 PM (#5967397)
The decline of BBTF traffic has much more to do with the decline of baseball than the decline of quality in political discourse here and elsewhere. Both falls have been precipitous in recent years, but baseball is just boring as f*ck now, to employ the modern parlance.
   32. Captain Joe Bivens, Elderly Northeastern Jew Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:05 PM (#5967399)
It’s the same people, and mostly the same viewpoint, time after time. Meanwhile, BBTF traffic continues to decline.


If it bothered you that much, you'd stay away from politics in every thread, but you don't, you Dancing Monkey.
   33. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:16 PM (#5967401)
Good to see Bivens tacitly admit that it is his side of the spectrum that politicizes so many threads, even if he thinks it should be allowed to do so without fear of contradiction.
   34. Captain Joe Bivens, Elderly Northeastern Jew Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:20 PM (#5967402)
Good to see Bivens tacitly admit that it is his side of the spectrum that politicizes so many threads, even if he thinks it should be allowed to do so without fear of contradiction.


Nice try. I'll use your weaselly language: I'm merely pointing out that you enthusiastically participate in every thread where politics are injected. That in no way is an admission of anything of the sort that you tried to paint me with.

Ever the Dancing Monkey. "Nothing to see here!"
   35. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:30 PM (#5967403)
I'm merely pointing out that you enthusiastically participate in every thread where politics are injected.
I’m merely pointing out that I’m not the one introducing politics to BBTF threads, but if I or others dare to respond from a non-leftist perspective, those like Bivens typically respond with name-calling & insults. You’re the problem.
   36. Howie Menckel Posted: August 01, 2020 at 04:57 PM (#5967404)
"I'm merely pointing out that you enthusiastically participate in every thread where politics are injected."

you're not quite up to date on that, pal

   37. Captain Joe Bivens, Elderly Northeastern Jew Posted: August 01, 2020 at 05:09 PM (#5967407)
I’m merely pointing out


Weasel words. You give as good as you get. Dancing Monkey, you're just as much the problem.

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