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Thursday, July 28, 2022

Gorman would be keystone piece of Cardinals’ bid to trade for Juan Soto, sources say

As Major League Baseball’s trade deadline approaches and the baseball world focuses its attention on Washington Nationals outfielder Juan Soto, the St. Louis Cardinals have ratcheted up their attempts to acquire the young slugger.

Multiple sources have described negotiations between the clubs that includes Cardinals slugging second baseman Nolan Gorman, and a rejoinder from the Nationals that includes starting pitcher Patrick Corbin in an attempt to shed salary.

Gorman, 22, made his major league debut this season and has nine home runs in 53 games. He has, however, slowed at the plate recently, batting just .193 with a .266 on base percentage since June 1. His vulnerability to high fastballs has resulted in 51 strikeouts in his last 154 plate appearances, but his defense has been steadier than expected at second, where he was moved before the 2021 season, thanks to the Cardinals’ acquisition of third baseman Nolan Arenado.

Though he’s since graduated from the list due to his big league experience, Gorman started the year as the 29th-ranked prospect in all of baseball, according to MLB Pipeline. Some adjustments to his swing once he reached the majors were expected, and the Cardinals have been encouraged that his defensive progress hasn’t slowed even as he’s worked through a fallow period at the plate.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: July 28, 2022 at 04:04 PM | 8 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: cardinals, juan soto, nolan gorman

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   1. Walt Davis Posted: July 28, 2022 at 10:48 PM (#6088825)
All I know is that if the Cards trade Gorman, he will suck; if they keep Gorman, he will give them 7 WAR over the next two years, then likely suck but it won't matter to them because then they'll just call up somebody named Morgan Lanno or Damen Thommas who will give them 7 WAR over two years.

I do find it a bit hard to believe that the Cards would take on $55-60 M for two arb years of Sosa and any substantial portion of the 2/$60 owed to Corbin. Even if they took on only $40 M of Corbin, that would drive payroll over $200 M.

Who are the big FAs this year? Judge, Correa maybe, Contreras. Judge seems much more a Cards fit -- sort of the over-sized love child of Matt Holliday and Mark McGwire, will cost less than $50 M for 23-24 and then Goldschmidt is off the books. If they're not planning to sign Soto long-term ...
   2. The Yankee Clapper Posted: July 29, 2022 at 12:01 AM (#6088838)
Multiple sources have described negotiations between the clubs that includes Cardinals slugging second baseman Nolan Gorman, and a rejoinder from the Nationals that includes starting pitcher Patrick Corbin in an attempt to shed salary.
Not to cast aspersions on the reporting of the Belleville News-Democrat, but Nationals GM Mike Rizzo emphatically stated just yesterday that the Nationals won’t dilute the return on a potential Soto trade by attaching bad contracts:
“We’ve never contacted teams and talked about Juan Soto and attaching any contract to any player,” said Rizzo. “We’re not going to dilute a return for any player by adding a bad contract. That’s not where we’re at in our organization at this time. We want to get the most for each and every trade that we do, so we certainly are not going to tack on anybody’s contract to anybody’s deal, including Juan Soto’s or Josh Bell’s or anybody.”
The Cardinals package also sounds a bit light.
   3. Howie Menckel Posted: July 29, 2022 at 12:08 AM (#6088841)
not clear whether Rizzo is lying, or if he is stupid.
   4. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: July 29, 2022 at 01:24 AM (#6088851)
I agree with Walt, whoever the Cardinals give up will just suck until traded 5 years later for some magic beans to either the Yankees or back to St. Louis whereby they'll put up 2 consecutive 3.5 WAR seasons.

Corbin will go 8-2 the rest of the year for the Cardinals, posting an ERA+ of 124. Soto will have a slightly down 2nd half, only posting an OPS+ of 148.

   5. Ivo Shandor Posted: July 29, 2022 at 12:29 PM (#6088878)
Young players the Cardinals have traded away for meager returns in the past few years include:

- the 2020 MLB home run champion
- the 2021 AL Rookie of the Year
- the fourth-place finishers in 2021 Rookie of the Year voting in the AL *and* NL
- the current favorite for the 2022 NL Cy Young
- another starter with a 125 ERA+ in 69 career starts

The idea that everyone the Cardinals trade away ends up sucking is outdated, if it was ever true.
   6. ReggieThomasLives Posted: July 29, 2022 at 12:37 PM (#6088881)
"not clear whether Rizzo is lying, or if he is stupid"


I'm not a follower of the Nationals but aren't they in total rebuild mode? Wouldn't it be smart to just pay off Strasburg and Corbin over time while they develop young talent to maximize the youg talent you aquire?

Corbin at least gives you a 5th starter and his contract is done in two years. And maybe Strasburg has a miracle recovery or accepts a buyout in lieu of having to do four more years of rehab.
   7. Walt Davis Posted: July 29, 2022 at 04:15 PM (#6088898)
Fine ... the Cards are so overflowing with minor-league talent on a regular basis that it doesn't matter who they trade away.
   8. cardsfanboy Posted: July 29, 2022 at 06:20 PM (#6088911)
Fine ... the Cards are so overflowing with minor-league talent on a regular basis that it doesn't matter who they trade away.


I'm fine with that assessment, heck I've been reading up pretty heavily on the Cardinals prospect list and youth list and it really does look like the Cardinals can put out a 3+ war player at every position in 2024 using just their minors and 1.5 or less major league experience players. Obviously that is cardinal colored glasses, but
C. Herrera
1b. Jordan Walker
2b. Brendan Donovan
SS. Masyn Winn
3b. Nolan Gorman
Cof. Juan Yepez
CF. Dylan Carlson
Cof. Alec Burleson.

I know of course some of that is probably a stretch/Cardinal shade glasses and some will not live to the hype, but outside of Yepez and Donovan, both who have produced at the major league level, I think pretty much everyone else on that list is capable of putting up an all star season or two.

The rotation would be a bit thin though (Libetore, Graceffo, Hjerpe, both the latter might not even be ready by 2024)(Tink Hence has jumped up the prospect board, but he's still just in single A)

Edit: and it's possible that every team feels that way about their minors if they put the glasses on with the proper shading.

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