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Saturday, November 30, 2019

Mike Piazza taking cues from Tommy Lasorda for Italy’s team

ROME (AP) — When Mike Piazza was hired to manage Italy’s national baseball team, one of the first people he shared the news with was Tommy Lasorda.

Now 92, the former Los Angeles Dodgers manager had persuaded Piazza to switch from first base to catcher at the start of what would be a Hall of Fame career.

“His style may be a little dated for lack of a better term, but he was very inspiring and the way he ran the team was he inspired you to achieve more than you thought you were capable of achieving,” Piazza said of his mentor, a fellow Italian-American. “So that’s the one thing I want to bring in.”

The 51-year-old Piazza, who was born in Norristown, Pennsylvania, holds dual American and Italian citizenship. While the contract for Piazza’s first managing job expires at the end of next year, Piazza is expected to remain with Italy at least through the 2021 World Baseball Classic.

If Tommy Lasorda is dumber than ten dogs, how dumb does that make Piazza?

 

QLE Posted: November 30, 2019 at 09:44 PM | 37 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: managing, mike piazza, tommy lasorda

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   1. eric Posted: November 30, 2019 at 11:58 PM (#5904660)
Now 92, the former Los Angeles Dodgers manager


Man, has Lasorda lived much longer than anyone would expect given his, er, girth.

   2. Howie Menckel Posted: December 01, 2019 at 12:21 AM (#5904665)
I was thinking the same thing.

my Dad also made it to age 92, but he was 6-foot, 180 pounds for 70 years - then "slimmed down" to 175 or so in his last couple of years. proper diet, proper exercise, proper attitude. he checked all the boxes.

so it's Lasorda, clearly, who is the real inspiration for the average Joe.
:)
   3. donlock Posted: December 01, 2019 at 12:47 PM (#5904685)
Does Piazza speak Italian?
   4. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:05 PM (#5904686)
Man, has Lasorda lived much longer than anyone would expect given his, er, girth.


Once you pass age 65, being overweight, in and of itself, is no longer an actuarial risk factor. Being underweight is a risk factor. Given equal health, a fat 70 y.o. will probably live longer than a skinny 70 y.o.
   5. PreservedFish Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:14 PM (#5904687)
I've read that too. But Lasorda must have edged up to or over the obesity line. There must be a point where mortality risk must once again increase with BMI.
   6. PreservedFish Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:17 PM (#5904688)
Huh.

Our findings indicate that obesity has little effect on life expectancy in adults aged 70 years and older. However, the obese are more likely to become disabled. This means that obese older adults live both more years and a higher proportion of their remaining lives disabled.


PubMed
   7. Bote Man Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:23 PM (#5904689)
Keep your eyes on the meatball!!
   8. PreservedFish Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:26 PM (#5904690)
On the other hand, Lasorda was a dramatic example of the type of man that carries most of his extra weight around his belly, which is supposed to be the least healthy body type. And I don't know how round he was before his senior years, when being overweight is clearly a health negative.
   9. Tin Angel Posted: December 01, 2019 at 01:32 PM (#5904693)
Does Piazza speak Italian?


No, he just uses his hands when he talks and says "capiche?" a lot.
   10. DCA Posted: December 01, 2019 at 02:17 PM (#5904697)
Once you pass age 65, being overweight, in and of itself, is no longer an actuarial risk factor. Being underweight is a risk factor.

I always thought that was because being underweight is a symptom of actively dying. If the overall risk of death is low, as it is for young people, then the long-term health consequences of obesity prevail in the data. But when the overall risk of death is high, the skinny/sick correlation dominates.

Given equal health, a fat 70 y.o. will probably live longer than a skinny 70 y.o.

So basically what I'm saying is that I don't think this is right. The skinny 70 y/o is likely to be in poorer health. If you control for health, I suspect the skinny guy will live longer, just as for younger folks.
   11. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 01, 2019 at 02:39 PM (#5904700)
So basically what I'm saying is that I don't think this is right. The skinny 70 y/o is likely to be in poorer health. If you control for health, I suspect the skinny guy will live longer, just as for younger folks.

I don't think so. I work in life insurance, and low BMI is a risk factor for the old, but high BMI is not.

I think the fatter old people have more muscle mass, and more reserves of strength to bounce back from illness.
   12. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 01, 2019 at 02:42 PM (#5904701)
On the other hand, Lasorda was a dramatic example of the type of man that carries most of his extra weight around his belly, which is supposed to be the least healthy body type. And I don't know how round he was before his senior years, when being overweight is clearly a health negative.

Being fat when young is a health negative because it tends to be a precursor to other bad things when you get older (e.g. high blood pressure, bad cholesterol, diabetes, etc.). Once you arrive at old, those bad things have either happened or not. Weight is no longer a predictor of further deterioration. So basically, the damage from Lasorda's "young fat" either happened, or didn't, it's not being "saved up".
   13. PreservedFish Posted: December 01, 2019 at 03:01 PM (#5904702)
So basically what I'm saying is that I don't think this is right. The skinny 70 y/o is likely to be in poorer health. If you control for health, I suspect the skinny guy will live longer, just as for younger folks.


They're very aware of this, and they try to control for it, but that's easier said than done. The article I read goes into detail on weight loss from cancer, smoking, depression, etc etc. "Unhealthy skinny" may explain some of the phenomenon, but they can't pin down how much of it, and it doesn't explain all of it.

Snapper is correct - muscle mass is hugely important for health among the elderly - and fat does appear to give the oldsters something of a buffer zone to help them deal with illness.

Basically the "obesity paradox" is complex and partially unexplained, but at the moment doctors are cautious about telling their fat elderly patients to lose weight.
   14. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: December 01, 2019 at 03:27 PM (#5904704)
Snapper is correct - muscle mass is hugely important for health among the elderly - and fat does appear to give the oldsters something of a buffer zone to help them deal with illness.

If you think about it, it sorta makes sense. A lot of illnesses and medications basically turn people off food for weeks and months. If you've got 20-30 lbs of extra fat on you, you've got a much better shot of making it out the other side.
   15. Ziggy is done with Dominican discotheques Posted: December 01, 2019 at 04:18 PM (#5904710)
Okay, new plan: eat healthy and work out assiduously until I'm 70, and thereafter live on a diet of deep-fried Crisco. I can do this. At least that last part.
   16. Commissioner Bud Black Beltre Hillman Fred Posted: December 01, 2019 at 06:13 PM (#5904716)
My dad was extremely active and ate a greens-heavy healthy diet. His dad was mostly sedentary, and from 70 he exclusively ate french fries and ice cream. They both died at the same age.
   17. Howie Menckel Posted: December 01, 2019 at 08:19 PM (#5904732)
from 70 he exclusively ate french fries and ice cream. They both died at the same age.

I think you left out a last sentence - or at least, a number.

my annual consumption of french fries and ice cream is veryvery close to zero. have I made an error there?
   18. Bote Man Posted: December 02, 2019 at 04:30 AM (#5904763)
At least it's not fried chicken.
   19. Howie Menckel Posted: December 02, 2019 at 08:57 AM (#5904768)
I don't eat that, either!
   20. Steve Parris, Je t'aime Posted: December 02, 2019 at 09:11 AM (#5904772)
I was in Japan this summer and there are a LOT of very old, skinny people.
   21. jmurph Posted: December 02, 2019 at 10:40 AM (#5904803)
my annual consumption of french fries and ice cream is veryvery close to zero. have I made an error there?

Unless you're allergic, vegan, or have some medical issue, the answer to this is a resounding yes.
   22. bunyon Posted: December 02, 2019 at 10:49 AM (#5904805)
My dad was extremely active and ate a greens-heavy healthy diet. His dad was mostly sedentary, and from 70 he exclusively ate french fries and ice cream. They both died at the same age.

I'm not a medical doctor but this fits with what I see. I think death is more or less genetically programmed. You're going to live to X no matter what. Maybe if you take care of yourself and eat right, you live to X+1 or +2 and if you eat nothing but fried cheese and never exercise, it's X-1 or -2. (All this barring death by accident). (ok, ok, it's probably more like +2 and -10 on those).

However, the quality of X will vary a lot and the healthier you live, the higher quality those years will be. I've seen a lot of friends' older relatives who live to 97, where you wouldn't sentence the worst criminal on Earth (Steve Garvey, in case you're curious) to the last 25 of those years. I've also seen a lot of older folks (and now some friends) who are active, energetic, fun-loving, very, very, very annoyingly healthy and then die at 62.

The number is probably outside your control. Control what you do with the years.
   23. gef, talking mongoose & vexatious litigant Posted: December 02, 2019 at 10:59 AM (#5904808)
You're going to live to X no matter what. Maybe if you take care of yourself and eat right, you live to X+1 or +2 and if you eat nothing but fried cheese and never exercise, it's X-1 or -2.


I've suspected for awhile now that I bought myself a couple of years by having been a vegetarian for 15ish years & a vegan for 2 or so back in the day. Otherwise, I'm now 3 years & 2.5 months older than my mother was when she died (& her parents checked out circa 49 & 59, respectively) & nearly 26 years older than my dad was (his brother dropped dead at 58, though his sisters mostly attained old age & their parents reached 80 & a bit).

Which means the Grim Reaper should be showing up anyminutenow, I suppose. Probably I should make a point of catching the final two seasons of Man in the High Castle while I can.
   24. PreservedFish Posted: December 02, 2019 at 12:00 PM (#5904821)
This was one of the funniest things I've seen in a while:

Supercentenarians and the oldest-old are concentrated into regions with no birth certificates and short lifespans

There's been a bunch of research and popular exploration of the so-called "blue zones," where people living traditional lifestyles have unusually long lifespans (Okinawa, Sardinia, etc). Many chumps have bought books about these people and have taken up walking, gardening, drinking bitter tea, eating more dark leafy vegetables or whatever in an effort to live as healthy as possible.

The paper I linked above states that basically the only thing these places actually have in common is a high rate of pension fraud. The "blue zones" are concentrated in places with high poverty, high smoking, low employment, low education, etc ... almost everything that usually correlates with low lifespan, but also happens to correlate with high rates of crime and shitty or nonexistent recordkeeping.
   25. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: December 02, 2019 at 12:03 PM (#5904823)
The "blue zones" are concentrated in places with high poverty, high smoking, low employment, low education, etc ... everything that usually correlates with low lifespan, but also happens to correlate with shitty or nonexistent recordkeeping.
So basically, the purported super-oldsters are really just septuagenarians who look older and have no birth certificates and relatively few contemporaries left to call them out on their true age? That's fantastic.
   26. Fernigal McGunnigle Posted: December 02, 2019 at 12:04 PM (#5904824)
I'm not a medical doctor but this fits with what I see. I think death is more or less genetically programmed. You're going to live to X no matter what. Maybe if you take care of yourself and eat right, you live to X+1 or +2 and if you eat nothing but fried cheese and never exercise, it's X-1 or -2.
I think you're basically right, except that there are a lot of ways to shorten your life more than a couple of years. Smoking is the obvious, widespread one, also things like longer term abuse of certain harder drugs, long term anorexia, things like that. Sure there are smokers who live to be 100, but I've known a fair number of smokers who died a decade younger than their siblings.
   27. PreservedFish Posted: December 02, 2019 at 12:19 PM (#5904831)
So basically, the purported super-oldsters are really just septuagenarians who look older and have no birth certificates and relatively few contemporaries left to call them out on their true age? That's fantastic.

Isn't it priceless? It's like asking Wilford Brimley or Earl Weaver in 1980 what he attributed his longevity to.
   28. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: December 02, 2019 at 12:31 PM (#5904841)
Isn't it priceless? It's like asking Wilford Brimley or Earl Weaver in 1980 what he attributed his longevity to.
Diabeetus and smoking/stress/anger, respectively. We could all learn from them.
   29. "RMc", the superbatsman Posted: December 02, 2019 at 01:12 PM (#5904872)
Let's hope Piazza does a better job running an Italian baseball team than he did running an Italian soccer team...
   30. "RMc", the superbatsman Posted: December 02, 2019 at 01:16 PM (#5904877)
Sure there are smokers who live to be 100


Andy Kaufman says hi. (Or is that Tony Clifton?)
   31. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: December 02, 2019 at 02:54 PM (#5904931)
LaSorda is very wealthy, which has the highest correlation of longevity.

Piazza used to be very wealthy, and doing his best to fix that.

   32. Tom Nawrocki Posted: December 02, 2019 at 03:08 PM (#5904940)
Anyone who thinks Tommy Lasorda is obese has clearly never been to Kentucky.
   33. Accent Shallow could make you weep more cheaply Posted: December 02, 2019 at 04:00 PM (#5904968)
Let's hope Piazza does a better job running an Italian baseball team than he did running an Italian soccer team...


I'm actually a bit surprised this thread is about actuarial statistics and life expectancy of the overweight, rather than the above.
   34. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: December 02, 2019 at 04:04 PM (#5904970)
Anyone who thinks Tommy Lasorda is obese has clearly never been to Kentucky.


Hey, Tommy had a delicious shake for breakfast, one for lunch, and a sensible dinner.
   35. gef, talking mongoose & vexatious litigant Posted: December 02, 2019 at 04:09 PM (#5904973)
Anyone who thinks Tommy Lasorda is obese has clearly never been to Kentucky.


Anyone who thinks he's dumber than 10 dogs ... OK, he is dumber than 10 dogs. Even so, Alabama.
   36. bunyon Posted: December 02, 2019 at 04:36 PM (#5904982)
I'm not a medical doctor but this fits with what I see. I think death is more or less genetically programmed. You're going to live to X no matter what. Maybe if you take care of yourself and eat right, you live to X+1 or +2 and if you eat nothing but fried cheese and never exercise, it's X-1 or -2.

I think you're basically right, except that there are a lot of ways to shorten your life more than a couple of years. Smoking is the obvious, widespread one, also things like longer term abuse of certain harder drugs, long term anorexia, things like that. Sure there are smokers who live to be 100, but I've known a fair number of smokers who died a decade younger than their siblings.


That was basically what I was thinking with my following parenthetical (that suggests x+2 or x-10). As you say, you can definitely shorten life easier than lengthening it. I just haven't seen any evidence that lifestyle can take someone who was going to normally die at 70 and make them live to 100. What it can do is make their 70 years way happier and productive. I'd guess smoking and heavy drinking or the biggest two. Stress is up there, too.
   37. "RMc", the superbatsman Posted: December 02, 2019 at 05:45 PM (#5905017)
Let's hope Piazza does a better job running an Italian baseball team than he did running an Italian soccer team...

I'm actually a bit surprised this thread is about actuarial statistics and life expectancy of the overweight, rather than the above.


So was I, until I realized:

(a) People in general hate fatties, and
(b) Primates in particular hate Tommy Lasorda.

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