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Tuesday, November 16, 2021

Noah Syndergaard leaving Mets for Angels on $21 million deal

Noah Syndergaard is changing coasts.

The former Mets star pitcher has agreed to a deal with the Los Angeles Angels pending a physical, The Post’s Joel Sherman confirmed. ESPN reported the deal is for one year and is worth $21 million.

Syndergaard had until Wednesday to accept Mets qualifying offer of $18.4 million. The Mets will receiver a compensatory pick between the second and third round of the MLB Draft if the deal goes through.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 10:41 AM | 52 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: angels, mets, noah syndergaard

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   1. Adam Starblind Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:18 AM (#6053107)
Cross-post:

I'm pretty stunned and upset right now. The team has few players with a real bond with the fanbase right now. It's deGrom, who doesn't play every day (or sometimes any day), and ... maybe Nimmo? After we ("we") paid this f#ck#r for two years not to pitch.

The team is harder to root for than other crappy teams we've had.
   2. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:25 AM (#6053109)
Seems like a lot of dough for a guy who hasn't pitched in two years. Is Moreno still made of money?
   3. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:32 AM (#6053112)

#1 cross-post: Alonso too.

But yeah, frustrating to see Syndergaard go elsewhere.
   4. bfan Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:32 AM (#6053113)
Is Moreno still made of money?


He was quoted as saying at the signing "Can't be any worse than Pujols or Hamilton."
   5. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:44 AM (#6053115)
Yea, I don't get this for the Angels. Should def spend on pitching, but I'd sprinkle it around on lots of guys, rather than give $21M to a guy with a really shaky injury past. Syndergaard should be signed by a team that is a contender now, and are hoping he can stay healthy enough to put them over the top, but aren't depending on him necessarily for depth. That is not how I'd describe the Angels at all.
   6. bunyon Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:53 AM (#6053116)
I don't get worrying about this as a Mets fan. I mean, yeah, it's frustrating to pay guys not to play, but that is the risk you take signing players, especially pitchers.

I think there is a very good chance this is a terrible deal from the team's perspective. If it works out and he's great, well, sure, I'd regret it. But I wouldn't want to pay him 21 million to sit out another year.
   7. bunyon Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:57 AM (#6053118)
I guess my point is: Would you be happy if the Mets signed him for 1/21?
   8. Adam Starblind Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:05 PM (#6053124)
He was a fan favorite. You can't look at him exclusively in terms of $/WAR. He also made multiple statements strongly suggesting he'd be back.
   9. Rally Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:06 PM (#6053125)
I hope he can stay healthy. Big risk and with their track record it very might well blow up. But the Angels’ track record on lower cost free agent starters is an absolute horror.

2021 Quintana 8 mil, 6.75 era
2020 Teheran 9 mil, 10.05 era
2019 Harvey 11 mil, 7.09 era
Cahill 9 mil, 5.98 era
2018 none
2017 J Chavez 5.75 mil, 5.35 era
2016 none
2015 none

Like Thor, all of these were 1 year deals. They’ve had a bit more success in trades, getting decent seasons from Cobb and Bundy. Though Bundy would have worked out better if they just had him for 1 year.
   10. Mayor Blomberg Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:09 PM (#6053128)
Last 4 years 59 Starts (including the 2 one inning jobs last year) and 105 ERA+, 6.8 WAR.
Yeah, it's a big gamble. Yankees gamble on Kluber for $11M netted the equivalent of half a season of 112 ERA+, 1.4 bWAR.
   11. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:18 PM (#6053131)
I guess my point is: Would you be happy if the Mets signed him for 1/21?

Honestly, yes. First, Cohen is not going to miss the money and it is not like the Mets are guaranteed to sign the bigger names that are free agents. If they do, they will have to overpay because they are not in a good spot as an organization right now.

If you were happy to give him a qualifying offer, you are happy with him getting 21 million.
   12. JJ1986 Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:23 PM (#6053132)
I hope this makes them more likely to bring Stroman back.
   13. Adam Starblind Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:25 PM (#6053134)
Maybe they give the Trevor Bauer offer to Max Scherzer. And/or Verlander in his current situation is a better version of Syndergaard, sans the 2 inning pitched in 2021.
   14. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:28 PM (#6053135)
He also made multiple statements strongly suggesting he'd be back.

Yeah, this is the part that's frustrating about it.

It seemed like they made the decision to bet on Syndergaard rather than Wheeler a couple of years ago and that clearly didn't pan out. Now we don't even have Noah.

But it's hard to judge the decision in isolation -- they need starting pitching but if they take this money and resign Stroman and/or bring in some other arms it could be ok.
   15. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:35 PM (#6053137)

I'd make a hard run at Scherzer if I were them, although I expect he will stay in LA and just use other teams to drive up his asking price.
   16. JRVJ Posted: November 16, 2021 at 12:56 PM (#6053143)
The Angels are finally out from the Albert Pujols contract.

Taking $21MM of that and ploughing it into Syndergaard is a little high risk, but it's only one year, and Syndergaard could even be a tradeable assets if he's performing well and the Angels are not.

   17. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 01:16 PM (#6053150)

They also lose a draft pick.
   18. I Am Not a Number Posted: November 16, 2021 at 01:25 PM (#6053155)
Is there any precedence for a player signing a one-year deal after turning down a QO?
   19. Lassus Posted: November 16, 2021 at 01:44 PM (#6053157)
I guess my point is: Would you be happy if the Mets signed him for 1/21?

Honestly? In the "not my money" universe in which we live? Yeah, I would have been, definitely.


If you were happy to give him a qualifying offer, you are happy with him getting 21 million.

And this, yes. Kind of frustrating.


It seemed like they made the decision to bet on Syndergaard rather than Wheeler a couple of years ago and that clearly didn't pan out. Now we don't even have Noah.

And also this. Just personally I was kind of irritated about the Wheeler thing also, so this is doubly irritating.


And, really, I wonder also how this makes deGrom feel.
   20. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 01:49 PM (#6053159)

Is there any precedence for a player signing a one-year deal after turning down a QO?


Well usually its the guys that found no suitors til like April, like Ervin Santana and Kendrys Morales. Not sure someone has signed a one year deal this quickly after rejecting a QO.
   21. reech Posted: November 16, 2021 at 01:50 PM (#6053160)
screw Thor. Good luck in Anaheim! He isn't going to be worth jack-sh!t.
   22. Nasty Nate Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:01 PM (#6053163)
Is there any precedence for a player signing a one-year deal after turning down a QO?
Well usually its the guys that found no suitors til like April, like Ervin Santana and Kendrys Morales. Not sure someone has signed a one year deal this quickly after rejecting a QO.
Marcell Ozuna and Yasmani Grandal signed one-year deals after rejecting the QO. They weren't this quick, but they signed in the winter, not super late.
   23. The Duke Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:11 PM (#6053165)
I think this a risky deal for Angels, BUT how many really high upside pitchers can you sign for 1/21. The Mets were willing to pay 1/18 for him so 1/21, loss of a 2nd rounder and a smaller draft pool overall doesn’t seem that horrible to me. And if he’s nailing it halfway through season you have exclusive negotiating rights to get a bigger deal done. If the angels had come to the Mets and said “I’ll give you a second round draft choice and $3 million for Thor - they say no.
   24. DL from MN Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:19 PM (#6053166)
He also made multiple statements strongly suggesting he'd be back.


I'm pretty sure he also thought nobody would pay him $21M for this season.
   25. Never Give an Inge (Dave) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:28 PM (#6053168)

Once the Mets made the QO, could they have signed him to a bigger deal?
   26. The Gary DiSarcina Fan Club (JAHV) Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:31 PM (#6053170)
Yea, I don't get this for the Angels. Should def spend on pitching, but I'd sprinkle it around on lots of guys,


The Angels have been trying that for the last five years (as Rally lays out above). It not only hasn't worked but has been a spectacular failure.

Which isn't to say that this will work - it almost certainly won't. But I appreciate that they're at least trying to fail in a new way.
   27. bunyon Posted: November 16, 2021 at 02:51 PM (#6053172)
I guess my point is: Would you be happy if the Mets signed him for 1/21?

Honestly, yes. First, Cohen is not going to miss the money and it is not like the Mets are guaranteed to sign the bigger names that are free agents. If they do, they will have to overpay because they are not in a good spot as an organization right now.

If you were happy to give him a qualifying offer, you are happy with him getting 21 million.


Fair.

I guess my point is: Would you be happy if the Mets signed him for 1/21?

Honestly? In the "not my money" universe in which we live? Yeah, I would have been, definitely.


Also fair.
   28. Howie Menckel Posted: November 16, 2021 at 03:05 PM (#6053175)
Thor initially said he would be "happy" to get the qualifying offer.

In a dream world, nobody from the Angels checked in and said, "Um, um, you may not want to take that offer. just sayin', that's all."
   29. . . . . . . Posted: November 16, 2021 at 03:29 PM (#6053178)
I think this is sort of a disaster for the Mets - not in a baseball sense, but in a, you're going to take the media / fan hit for $3M and a second round pick? Doesn't make sense at all. If you were going to pay $18.4, pay $21.5 and build some goodwill.
   30. Hombre Brotani Posted: November 16, 2021 at 03:32 PM (#6053180)
The Angels shouldn't be looking for quick fixes. That rotation is basically Ohtani and a giant hole, so Thor can't actually make things any worse, and he actually has some upside if his arm works again. Sandoval, Suarez, Canning, Barria, Detmers, Rodriguez, and Sam Bachman are all 24-and-under, and they need at least two of them to turn into something (and for Ohtani to stay healthy) before they can start legitimately hunting for big FA arms that can push them over the top. Thor is a one-year lottery ticket, and if he turns into something, the Angels can extend a legit big arm or, like JRVJ said, trade him at the deadline.
   31. Howie Menckel Posted: November 16, 2021 at 03:43 PM (#6053182)
Darren Rovell
@darrenrovell
·
51s
JUST IN: Crypto exchange platform @FTX_Official
has signed an endorsement deal with Angels pitcher/slugger Shohei Ohtani. Ohtani will receive his endorsement compensation in Bitcoin.
   32. JJ1986 Posted: November 16, 2021 at 04:15 PM (#6053189)
Is his salary going up & down with the price of bitcoin? Because otherwise he's being paid in dollars and converting it.
   33. bobm Posted: November 16, 2021 at 04:18 PM (#6053190)
One year QO signings:


2019 ($17.8 million)

• Marcell Ozuna, Cardinals
Where he signed: Braves (one year, $18 million)
Cardinals' compensatory Draft pick: Alec Burleson, OF (No. 70 overall)
2018 ($17.9 million)

• Yasmani Grandal, Dodgers
Where he signed: Brewers (one year, $18.25 million)
Dodgers' compensatory Draft pick: Jimmy Lewis, RHP (No. 78 overall)

• Dallas Keuchel, Astros
Where he signed: Braves (one year, $13 million)
Astros' compensatory Draft pick: None (Keuchel signed after Draft)
2017 ($17.4 million)

• Greg Holland, Rockies
Where he signed: Cardinals (one year, $14 million)
Rockies' compensatory Draft pick: Mitchell Kilkenny, RHP (No. 76 overall)

• Lance Lynn, Cardinals
Where he signed: Twins (one year, $12 million)
Cardinals' compensatory Draft pick: Luken Baker, 1B (No. 75 overall)
Rejected (re-signed with same team)

• Mike Moustakas, Royals
New contract: One year, $6.5 million with incentives up to $22.7 million

2016 ($17.2 million)

Rejected (re-signed with same team)
• Jose Bautista, Blue Jays
New contract: One year, $18 million

2015 ($15.8 million)

• Ian Desmond, Nationals
Where he signed: Rangers (one year, $8 million)
Nationals' compensatory Draft pick: Dane Dunning, RHP (No. 29 overall)

• William Fowler, Cubs
New contract: One year, $8 million

• Hisashi Iwakuma, Mariners
New contract: One year, $11 million

2013 ($14.1 million)

• Nelson Cruz, Rangers
Where he signed: Orioles (one year, $8 million)
Rangers' compensatory Draft pick: Luis Ortiz, RHP (No. 30 overall)

• Kendrys Morales, Mariners
Where he signed: Twins (one year, $7.4 million -- prorated version of $12 million contract signed in June)
Mariners' compensatory Draft pick: None (lost pick for signing Cano)

• Ervin Santana, Royals
Where he signed: Braves (one year, $14.1 million)
Royals' compensatory Draft pick: Foster Griffin, LHP (No. 28 overall)
Rejected (re-signed with same team)

• Stephen Drew, Red Sox
New contract: One year, $10.1 million (prorated version of $14.1 million deal signed in May)
2012 ($13.3 million)

Rejected (re-signed with same team)
• Hiroki Kuroda, Yankees
New contract: One year, $15 million


Source: https://www.mlb.com/news/history-of-mlb-qualifying-offer-decisions-c300602464
   34. Walt Davis Posted: November 16, 2021 at 09:09 PM (#6053225)
• William Fowler, Cubs
New contract: One year, $8 million


Known to actual humans as Dexter. (Who knew William is his first name?) There was a wrinkle here in that he had agreed with the O's on a 3-year contract (I think) that required a physical with the O's trying to back out of the deal or force him into less money (I forget). He told them to FO and the Cubs got a bargain on Feb 25 and a World Series title (I don't think it happens without Dexter). I wonder if there was a grievance filed -- if so, maybe dropped after he signed with the Cards the next year for 5/$75 or whatever which was better than whatever deal he got from the O's.

It would be interesting to dig out some of the players drafted on or just after the pick that the signing team gave up.
   35. Lassus Posted: November 16, 2021 at 10:42 PM (#6053240)
I think this is sort of a disaster for the Mets - not in a baseball sense, but in a, you're going to take the media / fan hit for $3M and a second round pick? Doesn't make sense at all. If you were going to pay $18.4, pay $21.5 and build some goodwill.

Yeah, I also agree with this.
   36. djordan Posted: November 16, 2021 at 10:52 PM (#6053242)
I'm reading an unconfirmed report from WFAN that has Alderson saying that the Mets were never granted "last look" to match the Angels' offer. Kinda shocked that the multiple articles on the story throughout the day haven't referenced this.

Not a great look on Thor nor his handlers if this is the case.

   37. . . . . . . Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:11 PM (#6053248)
Actually probably good work by Thor / agent. If I’m the Angels I’m not in the business of giving offers just to get outbid, so I signal the range the offer will be in, roughly, but then when I give the firm number it’s an exploding offer. Only way to avoid winners curse. Thor increased his take from $18 to 21; if he gives the Mets a last look he might never have gotten that $3M. If you want a last look, don’t lowball me $3M below what you’re willing to pay.
   38. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:12 PM (#6053250)
In some ways, the Angels are an attractive team to play for. They do have Ohtani and Trout already. I mean it is not inconceivable that Thor just decided that it would be more fun to play for the Angels than the Mets.
   39. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: November 16, 2021 at 11:17 PM (#6053253)
I mean it is not inconceivable that Thor just decided that it would be more fun to play for the Angels than the Mets.


Noah is from Texas, maybe he wanted more sunshine each year in his life. Lots of sun in SoCal. Maybe he just wanted a change of scenery? Living and playing in NY is not to everyone's taste, for $21 mil, maybe the offer was attractive enough to get him to try something different.
   40. Walt Davis Posted: November 17, 2021 at 12:20 AM (#6053260)
Once the Mets made the QO, could they have signed him to a bigger deal?

Sure.

By the way, if Mets' fans had gotten their wish and I'd been put in charge, they would be less angst-ridden today ... I wouldn't have made the QO to begin with. You'd have it all out of your system by now. :-)
   41. Starring Bradley Scotchman as RMc Posted: November 17, 2021 at 07:12 AM (#6053265)
Is Moreno still made of money?

He was quoted as saying at the signing "Can't be any worse than Pujols or Hamilton."


Well, the Angels need hitters and pitchers. (Imagine if they could find a guy who could do both...!)
   42. The Duke Posted: November 17, 2021 at 08:29 AM (#6053268)
Everyone thinks the angels biggest issue is pitching. Angels sign a pitcher (probably the first of a few). Writers/fans outraged that angels sign pitcher. It’s a funny world
   43. Lassus Posted: November 17, 2021 at 08:45 AM (#6053270)
Writers and fans of the Angels are outraged?
   44. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 17, 2021 at 11:59 AM (#6053283)

I'm reading an unconfirmed report from WFAN that has Alderson saying that the Mets were never granted "last look" to match the Angels' offer. Kinda shocked that the multiple articles on the story throughout the day haven't referenced this.


How Mets drove Noah Syndergaard away in final days with team: Sherman

His intention was not to leave the Mets.

But in the intermediate period between being given the qualifying offer on Nov. 7 and Wednesday’s 5 p.m. deadline to accept or reject, Syndergaard experienced radio silence from the only team for which he had ever played in the majors while other clubs began to woo him. No team more than the Angels....

But that Syndergaard’s camp did not even go back to try to get the richest owner in the sport, Steve Cohen, to match or exceed that before he said yes to the Angels showed how far the right-hander had drifted in a week. He went from thinking about the Mets only to the need to get away to maximize what will become a platform season for Syndergaard to re-enter free agency next offseason.
   45. JJ1986 Posted: November 17, 2021 at 12:00 PM (#6053284)
Sounds like not having a GM was a bad idea.
   46. The Duke Posted: November 17, 2021 at 12:43 PM (#6053290)
Or, the Mets knew all along/decided that they wanted the draft pick and had already understood that Thor was likely to leave. If your team is in upheaval and you have a chance to have a gonzo draft, this isn’t really a bad idea. I assume this also means Stroman isn’t an option either and that they are hoping Conforto goes as well.
   47. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: November 17, 2021 at 01:19 PM (#6053297)

Sounds like not having a GM was a bad idea.


Bryn Alderson really dropped the ball!
   48. Howie Menckel Posted: November 17, 2021 at 01:26 PM (#6053300)
Thor is not exactly Machiavelli.

he loves NYC and wanted to remain a Met. but he gives off a naive vibe, and I can see him being bothered by getting no feedback from the nonexistent Mets front office and succumbing to another's charms.

would be fascinating if he signed a longterm deal with the Mets a year from now !
   49. Adam Starblind Posted: November 17, 2021 at 01:39 PM (#6053303)
I assume this also means Stroman isn’t an option either


Why not? There's no QO attached to him.
   50. GregD Posted: November 17, 2021 at 01:57 PM (#6053308)
I love the complex explanations for why a player with options chooses not to sign with what appears to be right now pretty clearly the most dysfunctional franchise in baseball
   51. Lassus Posted: November 17, 2021 at 03:32 PM (#6053320)
That Sherman article doesn't sound like any less of a guess than what was proffered here.
   52. bfan Posted: November 17, 2021 at 03:37 PM (#6053322)
Writers/fans outraged that angels sign pitcher.


They were hoping for Verlander, Scherzer and Stroman each on a one year, $21 million deals.

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