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Monday, August 22, 2022

OMNICHATTER for the week of August 22-28, 2022

Scoreboards for the Major Leagues and all minor leagues,
courtesy of Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee).

Hombre Brotani Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:43 AM | 180 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: omnichatter

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   1. Walt Davis Posted: August 22, 2022 at 04:32 PM (#6092627)
At the end of the last chatter, CFB was complaining about Goldschmidt's defensive ratings. FWIW (don't shoot the messenger), statcast has him rated even worse, among the worst in the league. He's at -5 outs, tied with Alonso, better only than Gurriel, Votto and Nate Lowe ... and I assume Franchy and Tellez based on opportunities. He's even below Rhys Hoskins. Their rating doesn't include anything on receiving throws but I don't know that any of them do. His throw-receiving abilities (if they are superior to other 1B) would show up in other IF ratings and the Cards have two of the best (maybe the two best) by DRS with Arenado at +16 and Edman at +19 (statcast basically agrees). Somebody mentioned problems going to his right and that's certainly what statcast says. That seems a common problem for 1B near the bottom here -- Hoskins, Votto, Gurriel, Lowe are all similarly bad or worse. Makes sense to me -- old, slow, can't position or move too far away from the bag or they'll never get there in time to receive throws.

Now as far as I know, statcast compares to the average IF not the average 1B. But either we have seriously underestimated 1B defense and vastly overstated positional differences or the world has radically changed. It could be all the shifting -- plenty of times these days you'll see 1B lined up light years farther from 1B than Fred McGriff ever got.

Point is, at statcast, Christian Walker is the #1 1B at +11 runs which makes him #7 overall. There's then a big gap to Josh Naylor at +4 (you wouldn't think it looking at him) and usual wunderkind Matt Olson is down at -1 this year. They rank 39 "qualified" 1B with a range of -10 to +11 with a median of -1. Even without setting aside Schoop's +23, that appears to be somewhere between 2 to 4 runs worse than a 2B. It's about 1 run worse than a 3B and only about 2 runs worse than a SS.

It's hard to say because I can't see that (or its opposite) explicitly stated anywhere at baseball savant. But they say the play is rated based on positioning, where the ball was hit, how long the player had to get there, the speed of the runner vs the probability of a hit on similar balls. But it's not entirely clear to me whether that means a ball hit at X MPH that is Y feet to the left of where the SS is standing is rated as the same probability of a hit as a XMPH ball hit Y feet to the left of where the 1B is standing. (Alternatively, the direction of the ball plays into the probability and a ball hit X MPH in direction Z that is usually the responsibility of a 1B is much more likely to become a hit than if hit in direction Q where a SS or other IF has responsibility.)

It's possible. Shifting is not exactly "positionless" but it's getting close. Using 3 guys to cover an area that used to be the responsibility of 2 (or maybe 2.5 -- it's not like there wasn't IF positioning before) may make range less important. We may also be seeing a shift towards more equivalent offense across positions which would be consistent with the defensive similarities. So it's possible that young, hitting SS who in the past would have been moved to 3B or 2B due to defense are no longer moving. If so, then we'd expect more young offense-first 2B and 3B to stay put. (Or maybe they would have stayed put in the old days too, just bulked up less.) With a universal DH teams at least have an option to move a 1B bat off the field more often, replaced with a better glove but I don't know that we ever saw any evidence of that in the AL of the last 50 years. Finally TTO baseball requires bulking up so maybe producing enough with the bat to stick requires surrendering some range at SS, etc.

Another weird thing about this year's statcast numbers -- the top of the list usually features a couple of top CF. But this year, the list is dominated by IFs. The top OFs are tied for 8th in OAA -- Brett Phillips, Jose Siri and Max Kepler. Probably Phillips and Siri would be maybe +15 if they could hit enough to be in the lineup every day. CFs who can run and hit seem in short supply ... and if that's the case, I guess we'd expect SS who can run and hit would also be in short supply.

Anyway, max median min for 1B over the last few years:

2022 +11 -1 -10 (and counting on the extremes)
2021 +7 0 -6
2020 +5 0/-1 -6
2019 +15 0 -11
2018 +6 -1 -10
2017 +11 -1 -7
2016 +13 +1 -9
   2. ReggieThomasLives Posted: August 22, 2022 at 04:43 PM (#6092629)
Who are you going to believe, a bunch of nerd stats or your own long held preconceived notions?
   3. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 04:50 PM (#6092633)
Who are you going to believe, a bunch of nerd stats or your own long held preconceived notions?


Preconceived notions.
   4. The Duke Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:01 PM (#6092640)
Is there a quick and dirty way on FG or BBref to see (for a pitcher ) what proportion of hits given up are extra base hits vs singles ? You can see hits and you can see HR.

I dug into bbref and there was a page (which I now can't find again ) in the splits which showed 2B and 3B and HR it doesn't appear you can find it anywhere in a simple search for a leaderboard or something like that.

   5. NaOH Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:12 PM (#6092646)
This B-Ref Pitching Ratios page includes Extra Base Hit Percentage (XBH%). There's also Percentage of Hits for Extra Bases (X/H%) there, which is percentage of hits for extra bases, unlike the former which is percentage of PA which are for extra bases.
   6. Walt Davis Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:31 PM (#6092650)
Also on each pitcher page you will see a "tab" for "finders and advanced stats" which gives you a sub-tab for "advanced stat" and in there is the "batting against" table. That has the number of H, 2B, 3B, HR, etc. Here's Patrick Corbin and his healthy 2022 line against of 331/387/532 ... how in the world do you give up a 331 BA in a 245 BA league? An OPS nearly 200 points above league-average.
   7. Howie Menckel Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:36 PM (#6092651)
RIP, John Wockenfuss

he was a Tiger from 1974-83, but his greatest contribution was doing enough griping about his salary to induce the Tigers to send Wockenfuss to his preferred destination - as a Delaware guy, he wanted Philadelphia in the spring of 1984 and Glenn Wilson in a trade for, wait for it, reliever Willie Hernandez.

35-5 start to season, yada yada, World Series title and a Cy Young Award.

'Fuss was a good hitter - a lefty masher - who played C, 1B, and corner OF. Good year for the Phillies in 1984, too.

12 years in the bigs, 115 OPS+, never got very close to qualifying for a batting title and more often would get about halfway there.

I have yet to read a good description of his unorthodox batting stance, and I also am unable to provide one.

   8. The Duke Posted: August 22, 2022 at 05:50 PM (#6092653)
5/6 thanks.

The pitching ratio page is great but doesn't work when you drill down by team unfortunately. Still, great help

Cards fans want to run hudson out of rotation but he's had a historical difference where his era is much better than his fip (which is terrible ). There's a full run difference. Practically it means he walks a tightrope every game: walks people, high pitch counts, lots of runners on base etc. yet, he finds a way through mostly.

My theory is that it's not just the "park" or the "defense" but that he had this special sauce of high groundball rates, and very low extra base hit rates and high DP rates. Most pitchers "pay" for walks but because Hudson suppresses extra base hits while also throwing ground balls for double plays he never gets hurt too bad by the walks. It takes 3, sometimes 4 walks/singles to net a run and sooner our later be wriggles out of the mess

Thoughts ?
   9. HBO disappeared Oscar Posted: August 22, 2022 at 06:37 PM (#6092658)
7: From his sabr bio;

Mariners selected him, however, so Wockenfuss returned to the Tigers in 1977 with a strange new batting stance he had discovered while playing in the Puerto Rican Winter League. From then on, he employed an extreme, closed stance that began with both his feet stationed on the back line of the batter’s box and his backside pointed toward the mound. As he waited for the pitch, he lifted his bat high above his head and wiggled his fingers. “You go monkeying around sometimes, and I said, ‘Well, this is pretty good’,” he explained.22 “It keeps my shoulder into it and keeps my bat level.”

“That guy better not get a hit off me the way he stands at the plate,” remarked Hall of Fame pitcher Ferguson Jenkins. “That stance is out of the caveman days. The last guy who could get away with something like that was Stan Musial, and there ain’t no more Stan Musials. I know. I faced him,”.

FWIW batting stance guy imitated his stance and all kinds of YouTube clips of him batting
   10. HBO disappeared Oscar Posted: August 22, 2022 at 06:56 PM (#6092661)
So not a White Sox fan but stumbled across a discussion of “Should LaRussa be fired?”

These Sox fans didn’t say “will” because per them Reinsdorf is super loyal plus he never admits making a mistake so Tony has the job for life if he wants it

Interesting discussion. The one poster who like most in the chat really despises LaRussa said the one thing on his favor is that the Sox should be under .500 but are really good on one run games and maybe some of that is TLR.

Meaning by runs scored and runs against should be well below .500. But because they do well in one run games the team is just above .500


   11. yo la tengo (the poor man's Ron Darling) Posted: August 22, 2022 at 07:31 PM (#6092668)
I am not clear on the odd play in the Mets - Yankees game in the bottom of the first. Rizzo runs off of first and the Mets booth says time is not in yet. If Max throws accurately to 2nd is Rizzo out or not because time had not been called back in yet?
   12. Walt Davis Posted: August 22, 2022 at 07:51 PM (#6092673)
If time's not in then nothing happens to nobody. Time stops. It's in a Stephen Hawking book somewhere.
   13. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 22, 2022 at 07:58 PM (#6092677)
Judge HR (#47) to RF ends his mini HR drought. 2-0 Yankees in 4th.
   14. Howie Menckel Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:06 PM (#6092679)
11, I believe there was no play no matter what.

so if Rizzo can't run, he also can't be thrown out.

Michael Kay in the YES booth said an overhead replay seemed to show an ump not quite in position yet before the action started.

(a 1950s sort of play: man on third, one out, sac fly. Mets to appeal. if you think your runner will be called out for leaving too soon, you distract the pitcher by having the trailing guy runs to second. he gets the out there - but that ends the chance of an appeal so the run scores. as it happened, the runner wasn't close to leaving too soon anyway. but Max's bad throw to second base would have sent Rizzo to third if the play was live.)
   15. Howie Menckel Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:15 PM (#6092682)
meanwhile, from The Athletic, I believe this was rumored here the other day:

"After being reinstated off MLB’s restricted list Monday afternoon, Yadier Molina addressed reporters in the visitors clubhouse to explain his two-game absence from the Cardinals. Molina, who owns a professional basketball team in Puerto Rico, opted to leave the Cardinals over the weekend, as his team, los Vaqueros de Bayamón, was playing with a chance to clinch a championship.

“It was a business trip,” Molina said. “I had to be there for the team, the city.”

“The Cardinals understood the situation,” he added. “They’ve known I’ve owned the team for many years and that this was important to me. … It was a tough (decision). Obviously you want to be here with your team and doing your job. On the business side, you have to be there with your team and the people too.”

St. Louis played without Molina, who was scheduled to have Saturday off anyway, in their two wins over the Arizona Diamondbacks over the weekend. Molina was back in the lineup for the Cardinals against the Chicago Cubs on Monday, batting eighth, and will catch Game 1 of Tuesday’s double header."

.............

meanwhile, Leslie Nielsen up in heaven is chuckling at this home plate ump in NYM-NYY. "STEEEEE-RIKE!"

German has thrown about 50 pitches in 5 scoreless innings. The YES booth noted before the game that this was a "pitcher's ump" who gives out high strikes and low strikes. he just gave up an outside strike to boot. Announcer David Cone said that whenever he sees that an ump favors pitchers, he finds that - like this guy - he was a former pitcher himself who didn't make it....
   16. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:26 PM (#6092685)
NL player of the week, Paul Goldschmidt and Albert Pujols.
   17. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:27 PM (#6092686)
re: 15

That seems like an abuse of the restricted list, IMHO. If the Cardinals want to give a player a couple of personal days during the season, that’s on them, but why should they be allowed to replace him on the roster when they couldn’t if a player just needed a couple of days to get over a minor injury?
   18. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:31 PM (#6092690)
Kiner-Falefa & Benintendi doubles in 5th make it 3-0, Yankees over Mets.
   19. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:36 PM (#6092691)
That seems like an abuse of the restricted list, IMHO. If the Cardinals want to give a player a couple of personal days during the season, that’s on them, but why should they be allowed to replace him on the roster when they couldn’t if a player just needed a couple of days to get over a minor injury?


Considering that when put on the restricted list, you aren't eligible for pay, there would be heck to pay if a team did that for a minor injury. (by my math, Yadier gave up a little over $100,000 for those two games missed)
   20. yo la tengo (the poor man's Ron Darling) Posted: August 22, 2022 at 08:44 PM (#6092692)
James McCann has an infield single on the 13th pitch of an at bat. After the 12th pitch Gary Cohen calmly observes that he is halfway to a Guillorme. Love this booth
   21. yo la tengo (the poor man's Ron Darling) Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:04 PM (#6092699)
I kind of like the Daniel Vogelbach experience so far
   22. JJ1986 Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:08 PM (#6092702)
There are a lot of Mets fans in the crowd.
   23. Howie Menckel Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:13 PM (#6092704)
Blind ump just called a "low strike" on McNeil that was about halfway between the bottom of the strike zone and the dirt, lol.

set off my own personal "B/S Detector."
:)

and Mad Max - 199-99 career record entering the game - can't get to 200 but might get to 100.

   24. HBO disappeared Oscar Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:19 PM (#6092705)
Paul Molitor is 66 today. Lots of Brewers fans online posting on how old they feel at that news
   25. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:41 PM (#6092709)
Albert goes deep, 1-0 for the Cardinals.
   26. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:55 PM (#6092711)
After 7innings, Montgomery is at 79 pitches and has allowed one hit (2 walks)
   27. salvomania Posted: August 22, 2022 at 09:55 PM (#6092713)
After 7innings, Montgomery is at 79 pitches and has allowed one hit (2 walks)

ZERO walks---just two three-ball counts.
   28. Walt Davis Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:22 PM (#6092718)
Pujols 1, Cubs 0. It's like it's 2006 or something except then it would probably be Pujols 2, Cubs 0.

OK, fine, Montgomery had a little bit to do with it.

Around a tidy 2:15 too.
   29. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:22 PM (#6092719)
Cardinals win 1-0, Montgomery a complete game 1 hit shutout.
   30. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:23 PM (#6092720)
ZERO walks---just two three-ball counts.


oops, I think my game day changed pitchers on me when I wasn't looking.
   31. salvomania Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:25 PM (#6092721)
99 pitches, the game didn't start until 8:10, it should be more like 2:10, but somehow the official time is 2:16.

Man, Montgomery has been a godsend for this Cardinals team.

In four starts, he's allowed ONE RUN, and only 17 baserunners in 25.2 ip.
   32. cardsfanboy Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:26 PM (#6092722)
99 pitch complete game shutout, does that qualify as a Maddux?
   33. salvomania Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:27 PM (#6092723)
The home run Pujols hit was on a ridiculous pitch, like 6 inches above the top of the strike zone.
   34. sunday silence (again) Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:39 PM (#6092727)
THere was a thing out somewhere where they said ALbert has a 7% chance of hitting 700 HRs, assuming he continues to play in 59% of the games.

*****
There doesnt seem to be any hard and fast rule about it but I agree with YC, Molina wanting to watch his team play or whatever doesnt seem like the kind of thing that list is for. this quote from Baseball Prospectus:

"Under Major League Rule 15, a team may petition MLB to place a player on the restricted list if he is unable to render his services to his club through some action of his own. Typical circumstances include failure to report, visa problems, domestic abuse situations or treatment for drug or alcohol abuse."

*****

Announcer David Cone said that whenever he sees that an ump favors pitchers, he finds that - like this guy - he was a former pitcher himself who didn't make it....


How do you even write a sentence like that? All sort of pronoun weirdness here.

   35. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: August 22, 2022 at 10:40 PM (#6092729)
Man, Montgomery has been a godsend for this Cardinals team.


This is the same guy who was with NY and had a 105 ERA+ and now has a 713 ERA+!!! with the Cardinals?

So Cardinal pixie dust trumps Yankee fairy magic in this case?
   36. Addie Joss Posted: August 22, 2022 at 11:34 PM (#6092738)
Montgomery is now 4-0 0.35 ERA in 4 starts for the Cardinals. No sign of Harrison Bader yet and Frankie Montas has allowed 14 runs in 14 innings for the Yankees. Right after Monty's trade I posted that it was a terrible deal for the Yankees. Seems like a large part of NYY's poor play in August.
   37. The Duke Posted: August 22, 2022 at 11:39 PM (#6092739)
Monty had three exceptional plays behind him tonight which is the kind of thing you need to thread the needle on a 1-0 game. He just seems to be able to hit his spots right now better than any pitcher I've seen on the Cardinals this year. 90% of his pitches have impeccable command and control. I doubt they kind of efficiency will hold up. I think this is just a very hot streak for Monty.

Does anyone expect he would throw a 99 pitch CGSO? He's definitely over achieving
   38. NaOH Posted: August 22, 2022 at 11:59 PM (#6092741)
I listened to one of Montgomery's starts on the radio and the Cardinals' announcers said Molina had encouraged him to throw his fastball much more.
   39. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: August 23, 2022 at 12:14 AM (#6092743)
Urias took Urias deep.
   40. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 12:56 AM (#6092746)
34

"Announcer David Cone said that whenever he sees that an ump favors pitchers, he finds that - like this guy - he was a former pitcher himself who didn't make it...."

where is the 'pronoun weirdness?'

a great ex-MLB P in the booth responds to a graphic that shows that this particular home-plate ump very much favors pitchers with his ball/strike calls. and as he often experiences, when he looks up the bio of that ump, he sees that - like this guy - the ump is a failed ex-pitcher.

Cone concluded with, "Just putting it out there."

if you are dead-ended by 'he' rather than 'the ump' was a former pitcher himself - then you are getting dead-ended on a daily basis, I suspect. "who didn't make it" eliminates Cone from the options.

if at first believing that was Cone as "a former pitcher himself who didn't make it" makes no sense, and it doesn't, then Occam's Razor comes into play. there are only two characters in this entire story - the ump and Cone. wherever there might be confusion, pick the other guy. that has worked well for me for many years, and saved me a ton of time in my life in reading.

just putting it out there, as Cone - not the ump, to be clear - did tonight in the broadcast booth.

   41. Walt Davis Posted: August 23, 2022 at 01:56 AM (#6092749)
Paul Molitor is 66 today. Lots of Brewers fans online posting on how old they feel at that news

I'm depressed he's only 6 years older than I am. He was an accomplished, adult baseball player when I still felt like a kid. Seems like he's accomplished a bit more, I'd better get cracking.
   42. Tulo's Fishy Mullet (mrams) Posted: August 23, 2022 at 02:06 AM (#6092751)
I think I got Paulie's autograph at Serb Hall when he was about 26.
   43. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:35 AM (#6092766)
I listened to one of Montgomery's starts on the radio and the Cardinals' announcers said Molina had encouraged him to throw his fastball much more.


Montgomery said that Yadier got him to throw the fastball in on right handed batters, a pitch that he had moved away from in the past couple of years.
   44. salvomania Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:38 AM (#6092780)
Montgomery (1.4) just passed Harrison Bader (1.2) on the team's 2022 WAR leaderboard.
   45. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 23, 2022 at 12:56 PM (#6092826)
With yesterday’s HR (#47), Aaron Judge passed Robinson Cano (204), and tied Dave Winfield (205) for 14th on the Yankees Career HR Leaderboard. Next up, Mark Teixeira with 206. That HR also put Judge on-pace for 62 home runs this season, which would break Roger Maris’ American League record.
   46. salvomania Posted: August 23, 2022 at 04:20 PM (#6092862)
Nootbaar with a pair of lead-off doubles today, but Cardinals are 0-for-9 with RISP so far, and the Cubs lead 2-0 going into the bottom of the 5th.

Cubs call on reliever Michael Rucker to face Goldschmidt/Arenado/Gorman with two on nobody out in the top of the inning, and he gets out of it (K, popup, fly out).
   47. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 06:35 PM (#6092899)
Montgomery (1.4) just passed Harrison Bader (1.2) on the team's 2022 WAR leaderboard.


Pujols would be tied with Bader if he didn't have -.1 pitching war.
   48. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 07:35 PM (#6092908)
scoreless first inning for Montas gets his Yankees ERA below 9.00.

but as the Mets so often do, they coaxed 27 pitches out of him in the process.

hoping to get a batter to swing at your first pitch?

MLB leaders in rarest times doing that:

2. Vogelbach 12.0%
5. Ruf 15.2%
6. Guillorme 17.0
19. Lindor 22.2%

Lindor has seen the 4th-most pitches in NL and Nimmo has seen the 9th-most.

Canha is 6th in NL in pitches per AB.

Mets ABs in 1st: 17 minutes
Yankees ABs: 2 minutes, 17 seconds
   49. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:16 PM (#6092914)
Montas with 5 straight Ks.

Keith and Darling in SNY booth didn't get why he didn't use his plus FB more - and then he did, and had 5 straight Ks.

slumping Alonso snaps his bat in half over his knee - and before the half-inning is over, the Mets booth already has talked about the obvious Bo Jackson one, debated if he is the best athlete MLB ever saw, noted that his blocking TE at Auburn was Frank Thomas, recalled a less-famous "Bo" where after a K he just placed the bat atop his helmet - and just pulled down HARD and snapped it that way.

oh, and they showed video of both Bo bat-snaps, again before the half-inning even concluded.
   50. yo la tengo (the poor man's Ron Darling) Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:19 PM (#6092916)
It is such joy getting to watch a game with the Gary Keith Ron booth
   51. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:22 PM (#6092917)
Aaron Judge opens the scoring by gaveling a solo HR (#48) to LF (453’), which departed at a mere 116 MPH. That’s also his 100th run scored & 104th RBI.
   52. yo la tengo (the poor man's Ron Darling) Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:25 PM (#6092918)
A frightening player to pitch to
   53. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:49 PM (#6092922)
So far this Cubs/Cards serious has just been a failure of offense.
   54. stanmvp48 Posted: August 23, 2022 at 08:58 PM (#6092924)
Tootblan by Leudy Taveras
   55. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:03 PM (#6092926)
Arenado makes it 1-0 with a hr.
   56. JJ1986 Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:03 PM (#6092927)
Keith Hernandez is not going to want to do Yankees games anymore after that.
   57. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:06 PM (#6092928)
O'neil makes it 3-0... Hopefully a new start to another winning streak.
   58. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:13 PM (#6092929)
Mets booth is mystified as to why Rizzo is holding Alonso on at first base with 2 outs because the dimensions of Yankee Stadium are such that it is unlikely that Alonso could score on a drive to the RF wall. a deep drive in the gap - maybe.

I believe it was the next pitch when McNeil hits a - yep, a deep drive in the gap. but Judge cuts it off just before the wall.

would score the Polar Bear - except he slips on what I take be tundra just past third base, and is racing the 3B coach back to third. but The Squirrel then scrambles toward second, and the Yankees try in vain to catch a Squirrel in traffic, so the Polar Bear scores after all and it's 2-2.

mid-6th now.
   59. JJ1986 Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:25 PM (#6092931)
You left out the best part; McNeil wasn't running to 2B from 1B, he was running back to 2B.
   60. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:33 PM (#6092932)
ah. had some remote control troubles, couldn't get back to the play (or confirm if the booth specifically said "right-center field gap."
   61. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 09:52 PM (#6092935)
Judge single makes it 4-2 in the 7th, 1st and 3rd, 2 out vs Ottavino.

Mets absolutely begging Judge to steal 2nd - and he complies.

Keith in the booth is disgusted. he knows Rizzo will be walked immediately - and can't believe the Yankees took the bat out of Rizzo's hands vs a righty reliever. he adds this to what he called numerous bonehead plays in this game.

Torres follows with a feeble fly to CF, and the inning is over.

............

Mets 1st and 2nd, nobody out, down 4-2 in 8th.
Vogelbach up, 1-2 count, and THEN Darling in the booth says, "Schmidt would love a double play here - he's a ground ball guy."

on the very next pitch..... whammo.

even Nostradamus probably would go a pitch earlier, at least, to make his prophecies less obvious.
#sorcerors
:)
   62. HBO disappeared Oscar Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:03 PM (#6092937)
Verlander man, that dude is wild. 50 years old and slinging it past the young punks. 10 strikeouts and only in the 6th

Check it out
   63. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:24 PM (#6092942)
ok, maybe Darling is a BBTF fan.

this time he scoffs at the large amount of room on the right side that the Yankees leave Nimmo - with Mets down to their last out and trailing 4-2 with a runner on second.

it took 4-5 pitches for his prophecy to pan out, though the infield hit leaves it 4-2.

..........

what a finish!

NYY rookie Schmidt is just "one strike away" on 3 consecutive hitters, but can't close the deal - yet the Mets still didn't score at that point. Schmidt leaves after 60 pitches in relief (!).

Peralta matched up vs Lindor and the bags loaded, and he too gets thatclose - then allows a liner down the LF line, about 3 feet foul (Mets announcer noted that lead run Marte on 1B was "halfway to 3rd" before the call). then a squib hit 20 feet off the plate that looks like trouble but rolls foul.

finally, a fly ball to CF ends it.
   64. Hombre Brotani Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:35 PM (#6092944)
Mets-Yankees was a helluva game for August.
   65. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:44 PM (#6092945)
the Mets have handled the impudent Braves very nicely since June 1, going 5-2 against them.

but against the rest of MLB, the Braves are a ridiculous 52-16 in that span.

weird to say, but unfortunately for the Mets, they don't get to harsh the Braves' buzz again until the end of September.

Mets take a day off, fatten up on 4 at home vs Rockies, battle for dear life at home next week with 3 vs Dodgers - and then spend 4 weeks vs Little Sisters of the Poor before finally getting the Braves again (then ending with 3 vs the toothless Nationals).

Braves now only 2 games back, but they have a few more games left against legit MLB teams than the Mets do.
   66. JJ1986 Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:46 PM (#6092946)
the Mets have handled the impudent Braves nicely since June 1, going 5-2 against them.
Um...what? The Braves took 3 of 4 from the Mets last week.
   67. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:54 PM (#6092949)
From August 2nd to August 20th, Jordan Montgomery had 3 wins, the Yankees had 3 wins... (move it to August 22nd and it's 5 wins for the Yankees just 4 for Montgomery) :)
   68. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 10:58 PM (#6092950)
the Mets have handled the impudent Braves nicely since June 1, going 5-2 against them.
Um...what? The Braves took 3 of 4 from the Mets last week.


Since June 1st the Mets and Braves are 5-5 against each other.... Mets do have the season series though 9-7
   69. Howie Menckel Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:09 PM (#6092952)
looks like we're both wrong - Mets are 7-5 in that span

so since June 1

Braves 5-7 vs Mets
Braves 49-14 vs everyone else

or something like that (it's getting late early tonight), so further revisions possible
   70. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:12 PM (#6092953)
The Cardinals have really loved the 9th inning lately , 3 more runs to make the game 10-3 Cardinals. Cardinals really need to bring Albert Pujols in to pinch hit with a lefty on the mound... (oops now it's 12-3)
   71. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:15 PM (#6092954)
looks like we're both wrong - Mets are 7-5 in that span


I somehow glossed over both the first and last game of the middle series (Aug 4-7th)
   72. Walt Davis Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:16 PM (#6092955)
Position player pitchng alert ... and it's a doozy. Franmil Reyes on the hill. 13-3 Cards
   73. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:41 PM (#6092957)
Thanks to the Cubs, the Cardinals have caught the Braves and Mets in run differential for the season. (well technically Cards 121, Mets 122, Braves 123)
   74. cardsfanboy Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:54 PM (#6092959)
While looking at run differential on MLB.com standings board, I also noticed something pretty interesting (to me at least) The Yankees have played the most games against + .500 teams in baseball (okay I think the Red Sox actually have that title, but they are second) Obviously you expect the AL East teams to be leading, but even among the AL East teams, the Yankees have a lead. I think the list goes Red Sox, Yankees, Blue Jays and all of them have more than the Mets which is second/third(depending on the Blue Jays) among playoff bound teams.

I don't know if it means anything or not, just an observation.
   75. The Duke Posted: August 23, 2022 at 11:56 PM (#6092960)
Woodford, who has been in the managers doghouse all year, has a perfect 5 batter relief performance 2 days ago and then comes back and is asked to go 6 innings and 70 pitches today and delivers a great quality start

Woodford is a former #1 who has never been treated as important, kind of like Patrick Wisdom. Even though he has great numbers he's only thrown 30 innings this year while manning the "emergency pitcher" role .
   76. cardsfanboy Posted: August 24, 2022 at 12:08 AM (#6092963)
My facebook page just posted "Most homeruns since 2018"....

1. Eugenio Suarez 151
2. Aaron Judge 148
3. Nolan Arenado 146
4. Matt Olson 143
5. Kyle Schwarber 141
6. Jose Ramirez 138
7. Pete ALonso 136
8. Nelson Cruz 135
9. Paul Goldschmidt 135
10. Manny Machado 135

Pretty interesting list (note I think that was as of August 21st)
   77. cardsfanboy Posted: August 24, 2022 at 12:17 AM (#6092964)
Woodford, who has been in the managers doghouse all year, has a perfect 5 batter relief performance 2 days ago and then comes back and is asked to go 6 innings and 70 pitches today and delivers a great quality start

Woodford is a former #1 who has never been treated as important, kind of like Patrick Wisdom. Even though he has great numbers he's only thrown 30 innings this year while manning the "emergency pitcher" role .


He has never performed like a high level pitcher at any level, he made it to AAA simply because he was a first round pick, 300 innings in AAA with a 4+ era, with pretty average(being generous) peripherals doesn't give a player much of a leash to work from. I think you are projecting the doghouse analogy, he's a non-prospect, this is a guy who walked 8 guys in his first 10 appearances this year, totaling 19 innings, he has 130 walks in 290 innings in the AAA, he's never impressed people as anything other than potential back of the bullpen filler.


At no point in time, has he ever had great numbers.
   78. ReggieThomasLives Posted: August 24, 2022 at 12:26 AM (#6092966)
My facebook page just posted "Most homeruns since 2018"....

1. Eugenio Suarez 151
2. Aaron Judge 148
3. Nolan Arenado 146
4. Matt Olson 143
5. Kyle Schwarber 141
6. Jose Ramirez 138
7. Pete ALonso 136
8. Nelson Cruz 135
9. Paul Goldschmidt 135
10. Manny Machado 135

Pretty interesting list (note I think that was as of August 21st)


My future boyfriend Joey Gallo has hit 166 HR since 2017.
   79. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 24, 2022 at 01:08 AM (#6092973)
The Nationals called up 30-year old Joey Meneses for his MLB debut after trading Juan Soto & Josh Bell, and he’s hit .329/.356/.614 in 18 games since then, with 6 HRs, including one tonight in a losing effort @ Seattle. If the Nationals were in the playoff hunt - they’re not - he’d be attracting Shane Spencer type attention. It may not last, but he’s quite the feel good story.
   80. TomH Posted: August 24, 2022 at 09:45 AM (#6092985)
Anyone else had enough Aaron Judge mentions here?
Things Aaron has not yet accomplished in MLB, despite being over 30 yrs old:
won an MVP
hit .300
stolen 15 bases in a season
led his league in OBA, SLG, OPS, RBI, hits, TB, D, T, G, PA...
hit at least 10 home runs or 25 RBI for 4 years in a row

   81. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: August 24, 2022 at 11:24 AM (#6092993)
Get back to us after the season's over, and that list will be quite a bit smaller. And of course the only reason for that "4 years in a row" throw-in was because of the abbreviated 2020 season where Judge only played in 28 games.

P. S. So far this year Judge is 14 for 15 in SB attempts.
   82. The Yankee Clapper Posted: August 24, 2022 at 01:59 PM (#6093011)
Maris (& Mantle) chasing the Babe in 1961 was a big deal, as was McGwire & Sosa going for the HR record in 1998 & Bonds in 2001. Judge threatening the American League HR record this year, and/or what some claim would be the ‘untainted’ MLB record, is also a pretty big story. Judge is also having a season that could make him the unanimous MVP. Seems like something worth keeping an eye on.
   83. The Duke Posted: August 24, 2022 at 02:40 PM (#6093022)
77. Woodford has 2.50 ERA and. 3.5 FIP this year and has given up only 1 HR in 30 innings. The Cardinals have rolled out guys much worse than him for over 200 IP this year without giving him hardly any chances. Then they sit him in the bullpen for a few weeks with no activity, he comes in and gets 5 critical outs and then they shove him out there for a start and leave him for 6+ innings. And he was awesome.

I don't think he's a great pitcher but he's way better than a lot of pitchers we've had out there in critical spots. He's definitely got a Hudson vibe. Low K rates and miniscule HR rates. But much better at walks.

I hope he can fit into the back end of the bullpen - a guy who can throw 3-4 innings or 3 outs is valuable.
   84. Snowboy Posted: August 24, 2022 at 08:09 PM (#6093104)
Oooohhh what an inning ending double play, started by Matt Chapman. TOR@BOS 3rd inning.
   85. Walt Davis Posted: August 24, 2022 at 08:21 PM (#6093105)
I can't prove this but a 3.50 FIP on 1 HR in 30 innings is not that promising. HRs play a big role in FIP (and ERA of course) so a guy with a great HR rate should have an excellent FIP. If his HR/9 longer-term is more around a pretty standard 1 per 9 innings, that FIP goes up to about 4.5, somehwere around a 90 FIP+ (see Woodford 2021) ... definitely not good for a reliever. Still, his main FIP problem is the 4.3 K/9 and everything we know about 2020s baseball tells us he can't survive on that ... and his only hope is that he can do something extreme like give up just 1 HR per 30 innings despite allowing a lot of contact to HR-heavy hitters.

a guy who can throw 3-4 innings or 3 outs is valuable.

But sure, as long as these are your expectations then you're talking about a guy on the AAA/waiver shuttle. Packy Naughton has about the same # of IP and a 3.20 FIP mainly because he Ks more guys. Zack Thompson has given the Cards 22 IP of 3.80 ERA; Nick Wittgren has given them 29. There's nothing in particular that separates these guys from TJ McFarland or Johan Oviedo except for some random fluctuation that broke their way in 2022.

So welcome to 2022 bullpen management. The Cards have 7 (mostly) relievers with between 20 and 33 innings. Those guys have combined for about 189 innings giving up 97 R (+ 6 UER) for an ERA around 4.80 which is an ERA+ around 85 (without the PF adjusted) so replacement level relieving if not a bit worse. McFarland and Witttgren are in their 30s, posted terrible results so were released. Zack Thompson is young so he got sent down (despite excellent results on a mediocre FIP), VerHagen is on the 60-day IL and Oviedo got traded as part of the Quintana deal but Pitt has kept him in the minors.

They have another 63 innings spread across 8 guys. They've given up 29 ER + 2 UER for an ERA about 4.14 which is around a 99 ERA+.

The Cards don't have a single reliever who has hit 50 innings yet and only 3 who have hit 40 yet the team has already thrown 431 innings of relief. They started the season with 9 relief spots then reduced to 8 when the pitcher limit went into effect. This is how you average (to this point in the season) about 50 innings per relief slot without having any individual reliever worked hard. You use 23 different relievers in about 120 games. Some of the guys have success when they step off the shuttle and you usually keep them around until they blow up. Guys who don't have success get sent down or released.

Last year Woodford managed to stick around for nearly the entire year. He was a lousy reliever in the first half, got sent down to build up to starter, came back in the second half as a SP who succeeded pretty well with low Ks, OK BB and low HRs. He repeated that starter success at AAA this year so maybe he's figured it out.
   86. The Duke Posted: August 24, 2022 at 10:52 PM (#6093130)
Corey dickerson with two four hit games back to back. Any idea what the record for consecutive games with 4+ hits ?
   87. The Duke Posted: August 24, 2022 at 10:57 PM (#6093133)
I found this one story

Jeff Stone had 5 4-hit games in 1984 and none in the rest of his career. The first two came within a few days in June and the last 3 in a three week span in September. 3 were against the Mets(2 started by Ron Darling) and 2 were against the late Montreal Expos (both started by Steve Rogers).

It appears that Rafael Furcal and Marcus Giles did it 3X in a row in 2007 and 2003.
   88. The Duke Posted: August 24, 2022 at 11:11 PM (#6093134)
Dickersons 8 hits appear to be consecutive if I read the box scores correctly and I think 12 is the all time record
   89. stanmvp48 Posted: August 25, 2022 at 08:46 AM (#6093161)
Mets are -440 tonight with Degrom at home against the Rockies
   90. salvomania Posted: August 25, 2022 at 02:28 PM (#6093231)
Dickerson just got an RBI single in the first for his ninth consecutive hit.

Now up to .156 on the year.
   91. cardsfanboy Posted: August 25, 2022 at 02:32 PM (#6093233)
More offense in 2/3rds of an inning than 9 yesterday. 3-0 Cardinals top of the first.
   92. salvomania Posted: August 25, 2022 at 02:44 PM (#6093237)
Now up to .156 on the year.

BTW, that was just a joke---Dickerson finally crossed the .200 threshold on July 11 after a lost first half. He's up to .273 now.
   93. salvomania Posted: August 25, 2022 at 02:50 PM (#6093238)
Even Andrew Kninzer---who's been an offensive black hole his entire MLB career---is hitting .344 (21 for 61) in 24 games since July 8.

All the guys---at one point it seemed like half the team---that were under .200 in July have stepped it up since then. (DeJong is still at .169, but he does have a .781 OPS since his return from purgatory.)

It's almost as if regression is a thing!
   94. Addie Joss Posted: August 25, 2022 at 02:57 PM (#6093239)
Nestor Cortes to IL with groin injury. Clark Schmidt goes from effective reliever to questionable starter. Now Cashman's trade of Jordan Montgomery looks even more execrable.
On an unrelated note - at the risk of sounding like an old fogey - Why are so many players continuing to stand at home plate for two or three seconds to admire their long fly balls that do not go over the fence? As an example, Oneil Cruz yesterday hit a ball 122 mph off the RF wall, stood and watched it fly, and despite his 99th percentile sprint speed, settled for probably the hardest hit single of all time.
   95. ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick Posted: August 25, 2022 at 03:12 PM (#6093241)
The Yanks are bringing up Greg Weissert from AAA to replace Cortes. Weissert's been doing fine (1.76 ERA, 13.1 K/9), but he's strictly a reliever. Like Addie says, that Montgomery trade looks dumber and dumber with each passing day.

Schmidt was a starter in the minors, but in 8 starts he barely averaged 4 innings, and his 3.88 FIP in the Majors this year is way, way higher than his nominal 2.18 ERA.
   96. salvomania Posted: August 25, 2022 at 03:15 PM (#6093242)
And Dickerson singles for his 10th straight hit!

Three guys have 12, two guys have 11, and ten other guys have 10 (this from a 2019 mlb.com article, so maybe someone has done it since then).

EDIT: The guys with 10 and 11 hits in a row are the ones to have done it in the "expansion era," so presumably others did it before then.

The three guys with 12 in a row are Johnny Kling (1902), Pinky Higgins (1938) and Walt Dropo (1952).
   97. cardsfanboy Posted: August 25, 2022 at 03:18 PM (#6093244)
And Dickerson singles for his 10th straight hit!

Three guys have 12, two guys have 11, and ten other guys have 10 (this from a 2019 mlb.com article, so maybe someone has done it since then).


This is a ridiculous streak, not really the first guy you would think of to pull this off...
   98. salvomania Posted: August 25, 2022 at 03:42 PM (#6093252)
And the streak is over, as Dickerson reaches on a fielder's choice in his third PA of the day.
This is a ridiculous streak, not really the first guy you would think of to pull this off...

Especially not the guy hitting .183/.246/.269 in 114 PA through mid-July...
   99. cardsfanboy Posted: August 25, 2022 at 04:03 PM (#6093255)
Lhp in, does ALbert ph for Donovan?
   100. cardsfanboy Posted: August 25, 2022 at 04:05 PM (#6093256)
Nope.
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