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Thursday, August 06, 2020

OT - NBA Bubble Thread

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, and hopefully none of them get caught leaving the bubble for strip club wings.

Moses Taylor hashes out the rumpus Posted: August 06, 2020 at 06:04 PM | 4089 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: bubbles, nba, off-topic

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   2701. Booey Posted: September 19, 2020 at 12:56 AM (#5977641)
Flip
   2702. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 19, 2020 at 12:44 PM (#5977670)
Sam Amico @AmicoHoops
Free agent guard Ty Lawson banned from Chinese Basketball Association after what league called “inappropriate” post with woman. si.com/nba/cavaliers/…
   2703. tshipman Posted: September 19, 2020 at 04:14 PM (#5977680)
After watching a few more clips and looking at some post-game stuff from Lakers/Denver:

1. The Lakers' plan defensively was to take away the Jokic pick and pop first and foremost. This is the same thing the Clippers tried to do, but the Lakers executed it differently. While the Clippers tried to blitz the pick and pop, the Lakers instead switched it. I saw a stat that was pretty crazy: 63% of Jokic's PnR possessions are pick and pop. This kind of makes sense, because Jokic was mediocre as a roll man, but has been elite in off screen action in the playoffs.
2. It was harder to see what Denver's plan was on the Lakers. There was a lot of foul trouble, which sort of blew stuff up, but even in the first quarter, I couldn't really see what the Nuggets were trying to take away. They were kind of switching on LeBron PnR, unless Murray was involved. When Murray was involved, they tried to blitz LeBron, which went absolutely terribly. They clearly wanted to have Millsap on AD and Jerami Grant on LeBron. A couple of times Gary Harris tried to switch on LeBron and it was disastrous.
3. I don't really know how to describe Jokic's PnR coverage. He mostly just kind of stands under the basket. He doesn't really protect the rim, though, just takes up space and tries to box out. Whenever Jokic was on AD, the Lakers tried to draw him out into space. As soon as that happened, it seemed like no one on the Nuggets rotated or reacted to a cut, and the Lakers could just send back cuts straight to the rim with very little resistance. All the Nuggets guards in particular looked late on every rotation. When the Lakers pulled the bigs out, and made the smalls have the primary help responsibility, they whiffed every single time. Markieff Morris was just as good as AD at doing this.


I actually felt like the Nuggets were scoring pretty well, with high percentage and sustainable offense until Murray/Jokic went out with foul trouble. Switching Jokic was effective at disrupting the Jokic pick and pop, and cut down his passing, but still allowed high percentage shots for both Murray and Jokic.

The biggest adjustments the Nuggets need to make are all on defense. Can you teach a bunch of guards how to make a defensive rotation in one day? Otherwise LeBron is just going to maul them with passes to cutters until the end of time with this PnR scheme. Maybe the Nuggets can just have their bigs sag a bit more on these switches, like adjust by one step and concede everything outside of 20 feet. Can you really give up 40 open 3s per game tho? Blitzing with Murray didn't work. Switching with Harris didn't work. The Lakers didn't even need to put Jokic into PnR coverage, because they just made him a non-factor whenever he was guarding AD.

The Nuggets need a much better game plan on defense and need to make an adjustment to their PnR coverages, because they let LeBron coast in game 1.
   2704. PJ Martinez Posted: September 19, 2020 at 04:56 PM (#5977682)
Barring a setback in pregame warmups, there’s significant optimism within the Celtics that forward Gordon Hayward (right ankle sprain) will be active to play in Game 3 vs. Miami tonight, sources tell ESPN. After missing a month, Hayward offers a sizable boost for Boston’s bench.
   2705. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 19, 2020 at 06:04 PM (#5977686)
The Nuggets need a much better game plan on defense and need to make an adjustment to their PnR coverages, because they let LeBron coast in game 1.
I think, for the Nuggets, the best defense is a great offense. They just don't have the personnel to match-up with Davis or James on switches, and trying to just ended up landing them in deep foul trouble. They should just start Porter, stay out of foul trouble, and try and put up 140 points.
   2706. smileyy Posted: September 19, 2020 at 06:51 PM (#5977690)
If that's the gear they play in to bring out 40/15/12-on-16-shots LeBron then I heartily endorse this option.
   2707. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 19, 2020 at 07:02 PM (#5977691)
That Lebron's gonna show up no matter what.
   2708. tshipman Posted: September 19, 2020 at 07:32 PM (#5977694)
I think, for the Nuggets, the best defense is a great offense. They just don't have the personnel to match-up with Davis or James on switches, and trying to just ended up landing them in deep foul trouble. They should just start Porter, stay out of foul trouble, and try and put up 140 points.


I mean, I guess, but does that #### ever work in the conference finals?
   2709. SteveF Posted: September 19, 2020 at 07:41 PM (#5977696)
Jokic can only play drop coverage and can't protect the rim. Their options on defense are pretty limited.

Lakers haven't had to play a good defense yet, really. Portland was 27th, Houston 14th, Denver 16th. Miami would be the toughest defense yet at 10th, but good luck zoning up the Lakers.

I kind of hope we see it. Miami would never get a defensive rebound.
   2710. tshipman Posted: September 19, 2020 at 09:23 PM (#5977722)
Celtics came out with a lot of intensity, and since that early flurry the game has been very choppy and back and forth. No clear rhythm.

Celtics are playing very physical, and Hayward has helped against the zone. Kanter also looking good in limited minutes.
   2711. tshipman Posted: September 19, 2020 at 09:39 PM (#5977725)
Pretty typical "one team is down 0-2" whistle in this game.
   2712. PJ Martinez Posted: September 19, 2020 at 09:41 PM (#5977726)
C's went small with Hayward and immediately went on a little run. Interesting to see how Spoelstra counters.
   2713. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 19, 2020 at 09:41 PM (#5977727)
Good to have Luigi back.
   2714. nick swisher hygiene Posted: September 19, 2020 at 10:02 PM (#5977730)
Butler can look so ordinary when he's not getting calls...
   2715. SteveF Posted: September 19, 2020 at 10:18 PM (#5977731)
First game Boston has really made Miami pay for playing zone on the offensive glass.
   2716. spivey Posted: September 19, 2020 at 11:00 PM (#5977737)
Celtics are making this a bit more nerve-wrecking than they need to.

But presuming they don't #### the bed, I'd like to see Jimmy Butler be a bit more aggressive. He has an ability to drift in games. Which I don't necessarily hate. I think it can allow a more coherent offense to run. But it's not been a great offensive night.
   2717. spivey Posted: September 19, 2020 at 11:02 PM (#5977738)
Spoelstra is such a good coach.
   2718. SteveF Posted: September 19, 2020 at 11:26 PM (#5977741)
Herro started 4-4 from 3 and ended 4-12. Crowder missed a bunch of 3s.

I'll have to check the shot quality metrics, but my guess is that Miami got worse shots this game than in the first two games.
   2719. tshipman Posted: September 19, 2020 at 11:32 PM (#5977742)
Dragic kind of turned into a pumpkin this game. Boston was *extremely* physical with him, and largely got away with it, really affected his shot and his decision making.
   2720. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: September 20, 2020 at 12:44 AM (#5977745)
Celtics are playing very physical, and Hayward has helped against the zone.


C's went small with Hayward and immediately went on a little run.


Who?
   2721. PJ Martinez Posted: September 20, 2020 at 08:24 AM (#5977748)
Boston's Best Five lineup of Hayward, Smart, Tatum, Brown, and Kemba played just over six minutes together.

They were 8-for-11 from the field and scored 26 points.

They finished with a 162.5 Off Rtg and 76.5 Def Rtg.
   2722. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 07:52 PM (#5977801)
LeBron is in death robot mode early.
   2723. SteveF Posted: September 20, 2020 at 08:04 PM (#5977802)
Denver at 45.5% defensive rebound rate. I suspect that won't be good enough.
   2724. smileyy Posted: September 20, 2020 at 08:24 PM (#5977805)
When LeBron is hitting 3s...yeah.
   2725. smileyy Posted: September 20, 2020 at 08:34 PM (#5977806)
If Giannis and Westbrook could add even 20 points to their 3 point shooting, they'd be...a lot better. Having to guard one of the most explosive players in the game from 25 feet out makes the LeBron assignment even tougher.
   2726. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:03 PM (#5977807)
Feels like the Nuggets are fortunate to only be down 16 here.
   2727. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:05 PM (#5977808)
Feels like the Nuggets are fortunate to only be down 16 here.
THEY ARE. The Lakers have 15 turnovers, and they're up 16. If they clean it up just a bit, this game's over in five minutes.
   2728. SteveF Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:06 PM (#5977809)
Part of the issue with LeBron is the ball pressure his passing alone demands.
   2729. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:08 PM (#5977810)
Or maybe not.
   2730. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:24 PM (#5977811)
So ... should that have been a flagrant on MPJ?

I have no idea what is or is not a flagrant anymore, but I thought any deliberate contact to the head was a flagrant, but I guess not?
   2731. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:26 PM (#5977812)
I see we're back to regular season Rondo.
   2732. SteveF Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:31 PM (#5977813)
I dug this up from an NBA page that no longer exists:

The League Office will consider the following factors (as well as any other relevant facts and circumstances) in determining whether to classify a foul as Flagrant "1" or Flagrant "2", to reclassify a flagrant foul, or to impose a fine and/or suspension on the player involved:

1. The severity of the contact;

2. Whether or not the player was making a legitimate basketball play (e.g., whether a player is making a legitimate effort to block a shot; note, however, that a foul committed during a block attempt can still be considered flagrant if other criteria are present such as recklessness and hard contact to the head);

3. Whether, on a foul committed with a player's arm or hand, the fouling player wound up and/or followed through after making contact;

4. The potential for injury resulting from contact (e.g., a blow to the head and a foul committed while a player is in a vulnerable position);

5. The severity of any injury suffered by the offended player; and

6. The outcome of the contact (e.g., whether it led to an altercation).


That says 'League Office' but if you listen to the explanation given by officials during games you hear some similar factors mentioned.
   2733. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:39 PM (#5977814)
PJ Dozier will forever be filed under “heh, the Celtics have a Terry Rozier and a Perry Dozier at the same time” in my brain.
   2734. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:41 PM (#5977816)
Dozier showing a lot here.
   2735. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:46 PM (#5977817)
Well, not if he keeps this up long enough.
   2736. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 09:53 PM (#5977818)
Lakers going to go to the Hack-a-Dozier down the stretch here.

Edit: All these TNT promos remind me of why broadcast TV is dying.
   2737. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:02 PM (#5977822)
The Nuggets just keep coming.
   2738. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:04 PM (#5977823)
Even after coming back from 3-1 twice, we keep underestimating Denver.

Damn. Joker is amazing.
   2739. PJ Martinez Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:05 PM (#5977824)
Quite a finish. (27 seconds to go.)

I don't understand why Denver defenders are closing out hard on Anthony Davis when he's open behind the three-point line. Just let him shoot those, no?
   2740. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:06 PM (#5977825)
Jokic with one of the best tips I’ve ever seen to take a last minute lead. And then the Lakers come right back. What a great stretch to the finish. Surprised Jokic went so early on that shot to retake the lead. 20.8 to go.
   2741. PJ Martinez Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:08 PM (#5977826)
Just let him shoot those, no?
I guess not!
   2742. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:09 PM (#5977827)
A! D!
   2743. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:09 PM (#5977828)
Well, that's an extremely tough loss for the Nuggets.
   2744. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:10 PM (#5977829)
Quite a game.
   2745. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:10 PM (#5977830)
Just very fortunate to escape there with a win.
   2746. jmurph Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:10 PM (#5977831)
Anthony Davis drilling tough threes feels a little unfair. Unsporting even. Come on.
   2747. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:11 PM (#5977832)
What a battle between Jokic and AD though.
   2748. PJ Martinez Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:12 PM (#5977833)
Hollinger:
Defensive sub Plumlee just completely blew that coverage. Wasn't even screened and just pointed for Grant to switch off LeBron.
   2749. KronicFatigue Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:12 PM (#5977834)
Jokic left a lot of time on the clock, but one of the reason that happened IMO was b/c the Lakers were so smart w/ their 2 for 1 strategy in the shot prior. Lakers put themselves in a position to get the last shot, so at that point it's not a terrible idea for Denver to take a really good shot if it presents itself.
   2750. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:13 PM (#5977836)
Defensive sub Plumlee just completely blew that coverage. Wasn't even screened and just pointed for Grant to switch off LeBron.


Plumlee is really awful on defense.

***

LeBron kinda got bailed out. After the superhuman start, Bron was pretty poor.
   2751. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:15 PM (#5977837)
On replay, it is very clear that Mason Plumlee thought there was going to be a switch. Bad mistake, hell of a shot, game.
   2752. Russlan thinks deGrom is da bomb Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:16 PM (#5977840)
LeBron kinda got bailed out. After the superhuman start, Bron was pretty poor.

Yeah, that was not a great second half.

Normally, I'd say that this would be a backbreaking loss for the Nuggets but I don't think it is. The Nuggets aren't going to fold.
   2753. PJ Martinez Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:19 PM (#5977841)
On replay, it is very clear that Mason Plumlee thought there was going to be a switch.
Right, but there was no screen, and Grant was between LeBron and the basket. Why would he switch? Really baffling.
   2754. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:20 PM (#5977842)
Really baffling


The Mason Plumlee Story
   2755. smileyy Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:23 PM (#5977844)
Just watched those replays over and over. Wtf was Plumlee doing?
   2756. tshipman Posted: September 20, 2020 at 10:34 PM (#5977845)
Wtf was Plumlee doing?


So the design of the play was for AD to get the ball and lob it to LeBron over the top.

Plumlee was trying to switch because they wanted to prevent the lob, but he never got screened, so Grant never knew to switch.

The whole thing was stupid because (as he showed) AD is fully capable of just taking the shot. That said, it had an idea behind it, which was to avoid getting beat by the lob.
   2757. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 20, 2020 at 11:08 PM (#5977851)
So the design of the play was for AD to get the ball and lob it to LeBron over the top.
So basically what OKC was trying to run, except they were terrible at it in all the ways?
   2758. tshipman Posted: September 21, 2020 at 01:46 AM (#5977858)
Looking over the box score now, I'm not sure what to take away from the game.

1. I didn't see many adjustments from either coach. The Lakers had the same approach of trying to take away the pick and pop 3, and switch the Jokic/Murray PnR. Denver basically had the same approach with LeBron as before, they just never let Gary Harris or Murray stay on LeBron.
2. I think Denver was at least trying to get in the passing lanes more? But a lot of that was just bad Laker offense, too. Rondo just threw the ball away like 3 times, so did LeBron.
3. Both teams shot about the same, once you take out heaves. The Nuggets got a slightly favorable whistle, but the Lakers made a higher percentage of their FTs than you'd expect. Seems like mostly a wash.
4. Weirdly, the Lakers won Jokic's minutes, and the Nuggets won LeBron's minutes. Both players were a net negative.
5. The AD at Center minutes were way better for the Lakers. That seems like the biggest mismatch of the series, honestly.
6. Gary Harris was terrible again tonight, and this just seems like an awful matchup. He can't handle LeBron on a switch, and he can't do anything on offense. The Nuggets looked so much better with Dozier or Morris or Craig. I have to wonder if he gets benched.
   2759. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 21, 2020 at 02:44 AM (#5977860)
I think the most important box score stat is Murray's +16 in 44 minutes. That means in the approximately four minutes he was off the floor, the Nuggets were -18.
   2760. spivey Posted: September 21, 2020 at 08:43 AM (#5977868)
So the design of the play was for AD to get the ball and lob it to LeBron over the top.


Did they say that in the post-game? And have they regularly run that action in the regular season? Because that still doesn't make sense to me.

1. That just seems like a weird play to try to draw up with so little time. LeBron is going to be driving to the basket with his back partially or completely to AD. That adds a much higher degree of difficulty to the pass.
2. There were 2 other Nuggets players in the lane, one right at the basket, guarding a Laker who was making a really late run to the top of the key. There would have been really good help defense if LeBron tried to drive.
3. LeBron was locked up with Grant, physical defense is generally allowed off-ball against a big guy. I don't see a path to the basket being easy for him.

It seems like Plumlee just made a massive #### up, not reading the angle of AD's run. I get sometimes the split second decisions you ask defenders to make are challenging. But this was way more straightforward than even the basic rotations that we all took a quiz on.

This was just simply one player executing like ####, and it cost the team. Imo.

   2761. Rally Posted: September 21, 2020 at 09:45 AM (#5977875)
I think the most important box score stat is Murray's +16 in 44 minutes. That means in the approximately four minutes he was off the floor, the Nuggets were -18.


That seems almost impossible, and I wonder what the actual points scored/allowed were. If the Nuggets offense went to an absolute zero with Murray off the floor, they still have to give up points at a 216 per 48 pace to achieve that.
   2762. Der-K's emotional investment is way up Posted: September 21, 2020 at 10:56 AM (#5977892)
Plumlee is really awful on defense.

I don't agree with this. He's bad for a defensive replacement - in part because he commits sins of commission all over the place - but more or less an averagish efender on balance.
More generally, he's just a lot. A lot of running around, a lot of passing, and a complete lack of shooting.
   2763. Moses Taylor hashes out the rumpus Posted: September 21, 2020 at 11:08 AM (#5977895)
That seems almost impossible, and I wonder what the actual points scored/allowed were. If the Nuggets offense went to an absolute zero with Murray off the floor, they still have to give up points at a 216 per 48 pace to achieve that.

Here you go

All these TNT promos remind me of why broadcast TV is dying.

TNT/TBS have always been a weird wasteland.

---

My main thought is that while I think the Lakers are clear favorites, I'm not sure any of the 3 remaining teams have the backcourt to take advantage of the Lakers biggest weaknesses. I've never been a Rondo fan, but he legit is one of the best options for the Lakers in crunch time (though he should NEVER be taking 3 with under 2 minutes left in the game).
   2764. aberg Posted: September 21, 2020 at 11:43 AM (#5977904)
It seemed like the story of the game was that the Lakers built a big lead because Lebron went nuts on offense early. Denver's defense improved in the third quarter, really tightened up in the paint, and the Lakers turned the ball over too much, which allowed Denver back in the game, and that brought it to an even matchup for crunch time. Jokic and Davis went head to head and Davis got the last shot. That's a really fun way for a deep playoff game to play out.

There were lots of really weird plays in this one, like Rondo hitting the Steph step back and Caruso posterizing Grant. Agree with everything said above about the blown coverage on the last shot. Just looked like a brain fart by Plumlee, who is usually a decent/committed defender. It'll be hard for Denver to win four of five, but they've shown that they can compete and make the series entertaining.
   2765. Dandy Little Glove Man Posted: September 21, 2020 at 12:02 PM (#5977907)
I really dislike the Plumlee substitution on principle. I think coaches tend to make 2 types of late-game defensive substitutions:

1. Swapping out a defensive liability for a stronger overall defender.
2. Inserting a different type of defender to guard against a specific play type.

In my view, type 1 substitutions are justified (eg replacing Ray Allen with Tony Allen), whereas type 2 substitutions are almost always bad ideas (eg replacing Tim Duncan with Boris Diaw). The players on the court are already engaged and working together with a familiarity for their assignments and roles. If you're bringing in someone cold off the bench, it should be a clear defensive upgrade. The problem with scheming against a particular play is that it may never materialize -- especially as the offense can just decide to run something else -- or it may evolve in a way where you would've been better off sticking with your better overall unit.

Here, Plumlee's in the game because he's better suited to protect against a lob, but he's a lesser overall defender than the guy he replaced, Millsap. He's less mobile and less aware. As long as the Lakers ran something other than a lob, which was a decision entirely within their control, the Nuggets were likely to be worse off with Plumlee.
   2766. Der-K's emotional investment is way up Posted: September 21, 2020 at 12:34 PM (#5977912)
I agree with all of that, DLGM...

(Note - I'm talking in the abstract, I didn't get to watch the game.)
   2767. spivey Posted: September 21, 2020 at 01:36 PM (#5977924)
Is Plumlee less mobile than Millsap? Seems like he may be more mobile, or at least equal. But he's definitely less aware. Plumlee kind of plays like a chicken with his head cut off. As Der K said, a lot of running, but it doesn't always seem like he knows where or why he's running.
   2768. tshipman Posted: September 21, 2020 at 01:55 PM (#5977931)
Is Plumlee less mobile than Millsap? Seems like he may be more mobile, or at least equal. But he's definitely less aware. Plumlee kind of plays like a chicken with his head cut off. As Der K said, a lot of running, but it doesn't always seem like he knows where or why he's running.


Not so much less mobile, but Millsap can't really jump any more.

Plumlee's just in to defend the lob, which, as DLGM points out, is kind of being too clever.
   2769. Der-K's emotional investment is way up Posted: September 21, 2020 at 03:21 PM (#5977940)
I'm going to post the (per 100 possessions) stats of two impending FA wings (neither particularly obscure). Player B is better but the gap last year was smaller than their paychecks imply:
__ FGM  FGA  FG2PM  2PA  2P3PM  3PA  3PFTM FTA  FTORB DRB REB AST STL  TO BLK  PF  PTS
AB 8.8 21.0 .418 5.6 12.8 .439 3.2  8.5 .385 6.4 7.2 .887 1.3 6.4 7.7 5.2 1.7 2.5 0.5 3.5 27.2
BB 9.3 21.0 .440 4.8  8.9 .532 4.5 12.1 .372 2.4 3.2 .741 0.7 5.0 5.7 5.7 1.8 2.8 0.4 3.7 25.4 

Pretty close, right? (It's Alec Burks and Bogdan Bogdanovic, by the way.)

They're similar sizes - a barefoot 6-5 with 6-10 to 6-11 wingspans - and split their time relatively evenly (per bb-ref) between the two wing spots. Bogdan, both last year and in general, is a better shooter from deep (and who can stretch defenses accordingly - he has more gravity than Burks) with a more efficient shot profile. Burks has some old school scorer traits, like his strength at scoring off the dribble relative to spotting up, a varied midrange game, and a solid post game for an ostensible guard - and is far better at driving and getting to the line. Both are above average faciliators for a wing, but not primary playmakers - more like solid secondary playmakers. Both are a little below average on defense, I'd guess - Bogdan is bit better than Burks, both probably better when against guards or on the perimeter. Also, this was just last year's numbers - Burks has been up and down over his career (last year was up) while Bogdan has shown slow, steady improvement. Both are in their late 20s (28 for BB, 29 for AB next year).

So, again, Bogdan is better. (He also has a better track record of health.) But BB might also make mid teens on his next deal (he's an RFA and supposedly Divac was willing to go up to the high teens per year to retain him) while Burks is coming off a minimum contract. I believe the consensus would be that Burks is better than a league min player, but that label can be sticky once you acquire it. He might value winning more than income maximization (see last year's getting out of a deal with OKC once he learned they'd be rebuilding), which could hurt a pursuit for some teams, but I'd definitely talk to him if I needed some wing scoring punch on my bench.
   2770. spivey Posted: September 21, 2020 at 03:38 PM (#5977942)
Burks has a profile that looks very good for Milwaukee.
   2771. tshipman Posted: September 21, 2020 at 03:48 PM (#5977943)
Bogdan is the Bogdanovic on the Kings, if you're like me and had to look it up, btw.

Defense seems to also be a difference not fully captured in the boxscore stats.

By +/-, Bogdan has been a positive the last two years, while Burks has been a net negative the last 5 years.
   2772. My name is Votto, and I love to get blotto Posted: September 21, 2020 at 03:58 PM (#5977945)
It seems like Plumlee just made a massive #### up, not reading the angle of AD's run. I get sometimes the split second decisions you ask defenders to make are challenging. But this was way more straightforward than even the basic rotations that we all took a quiz on.


I think that's right. There probably were instructions to switch everything, but AD was nowhere near the "screener", he cut about 10' behind LeBron.
   2773. NJ in NJ Posted: September 21, 2020 at 04:28 PM (#5977948)
I drafted Alec Burks 5 years in a row in fantasy. He's great in theory, but he cannot stay healthy. Fool me 5 times...
   2774. Der-K's emotional investment is way up Posted: September 21, 2020 at 04:37 PM (#5977949)
Estimates of Bogdan on d vary - I think the consensus is mild negative. I noticed that they've hid him a lot as well.
Burks is definitely a negative but not an eyesore, from my reading of stats and the eye test.
---
Yes!, NJ - I undersold that. Burks has a terrible health record.
--
I like both of these guys, in that I think that you can put them in a lot of systems and next to a lot of guys and they can keep the ship sailing. The reason I linked them, though, was just how similar I think they are (Burks is 85% of Bogdan, imo) relative to price tag.
   2775. aberg Posted: September 21, 2020 at 04:43 PM (#5977950)
To some extent, Bogdanovic's willingness to shoot 12+ 3's/48 is a valuable skill. Some of that is coaching, personnel, scheme, etc but some guys are just really good at getting their shots up.
   2776. tshipman Posted: September 21, 2020 at 06:19 PM (#5977966)
From Shams:


Former Rockets coach Mike D’Antoni, ex-Thunder coach Billy Donovan and Clippers assistant Ty Lue are expected to be part of the next round of interviews and are strongly vying for and interested in the position, according to sources.
   2777. JJ1986 Posted: September 21, 2020 at 06:20 PM (#5977967)
Sixers or Pacers?
   2778. tshipman Posted: September 21, 2020 at 06:27 PM (#5977968)
Oh, Sixers, sorry, I should have included that in the excerpt. My bad.
   2779. jmurph Posted: September 22, 2020 at 09:23 AM (#5978017)
There was a report last week that the Sixers were looking at executives to bring in above Brand, so I'd be surprised if they hire a coach quickly? Or maybe they're just committed to maintaining dysfunction.
   2780. jmurph Posted: September 22, 2020 at 09:24 AM (#5978018)
From Hoops Rumors:
The Sixers are considering a front office shakeup that would include the addition of a president of basketball operations, sources tell Keith Pompey of The Philadelphia Inquirer. One source indicated that Trail Blazers executive Neil Olshey may be interested, but only if he has complete control over basketball decisions as both president and general manager. Rumors have surrounded former Hawks executive Danny Ferry, but the Sixers are denying that he’s a potential candidate. A source says the team plans to ask about Rockets GM Daryl Morey and Pacers president Kevin Pritchard, but the source doesn’t expect either to wind up in Philadelphia.
   2781. aberg Posted: September 22, 2020 at 01:11 PM (#5978043)
There has been somke about Morey being a candidate elsewhere for about three years. Given the situation in Houston, I keep thinking he'll finally leave, but he definitely has the leverage to pick a situation that will be good for him. I don't think Philly is that situation.
   2782. Fourth True Outcome Posted: September 22, 2020 at 02:03 PM (#5978050)
I've decided Morey and Mike Dan Tony should parachute into Philly as a package deal. How many threes can Embiid shoot? How well will Simmons do in a turbocharged Westbrook role? Who knows how it would go, but it wouldn't be boring!
   2783. Moeball Posted: September 22, 2020 at 03:00 PM (#5978061)
I'm hearing a lot of stuff about Clippers wanting to get rid of PG. Is this really a thing? I don't see how they could unload him and get something better in return. I know they're frustrated about how poorly he played against Denver, but do they really have any better options?
   2784. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 22, 2020 at 03:24 PM (#5978064)
I've decided Morey and Mike Dan Tony should parachute into Philly as a package deal. How many threes can Embiid shoot? How well will Simmons do in a turbocharged Westbrook role? Who knows how it would go, but it wouldn't be boring!
yeah, sure. in.
I'm hearing a lot of stuff about Clippers wanting to get rid of PG. Is this really a thing? I don't see how they could unload him and get something better in return. I know they're frustrated about how poorly he played against Denver, but do they really have any better options?
trade machine: who says no?
   2785. If on a winter's night a traveling violation Posted: September 22, 2020 at 04:04 PM (#5978073)
who says no?
Doc Rivers.
   2786. tshipman Posted: September 22, 2020 at 04:30 PM (#5978081)
What the hell is Luke Kennard doing in that deal?

Btw: Stiggles, I think both teams might actually consider a Gary Harris + Will Barton for Tobias + picks swap.
   2787. Slivers of Maranville descends into chaos (SdeB) Posted: September 22, 2020 at 04:39 PM (#5978084)
Now, Paul George for Ben Simmons and Horford, that might work.
   2788. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 22, 2020 at 04:49 PM (#5978087)
Btw: Stiggles, I think both teams might actually consider a Gary Harris + Will Barton for Tobias + picks swap.
yeah, sure. in.
What the hell is Luke Kennard doing in that deal?
i couldn't fit NOP into the deal as a 5th team.
   2789. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 22, 2020 at 05:01 PM (#5978090)
Now, Paul George for Ben Simmons and Horford, that might work.

aside from the nearly half-dozen even larger mistakes the sixers have made over the last 18 months*, the biggest mistake they've made is not getting patrick beverley or lou williams when they traded for tobias harris.


*those bigger mistakes:
trading for harris in the first place
extending harris
shooing jimmy butler away
letting corey brewer leave
signing horford
   2790. Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:03 PM (#5978100)
"Billy Donovan has agreed to a deal to become the next coach of the Chicago Bulls, sources tell ESPN."--Woj
   2791. Moses Taylor hashes out the rumpus Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:14 PM (#5978104)
Woah. That came out of nowhere. Just the other day, Shams had a list of 4 guys for the Bulls and he wasn't on it. It was 3 assistants (Unseld Jr, Ham, Udoka) and Atkinson.

First off, I'm surprised the Bulls are paying whatever it is Billy is gonna cost - and it surely is more than Boylen cost (well, costs, the Bulls still have to pay dumbass Jimbo and that's been a common complaint for Reinsdorf when hiring coaches). Donovan has some very well known limitations, but that doesn't mean he's not a good coach, at least not for this group. It probably also means the Bulls hope (expect?) to be back in the playoffs sooner rather than later - which is a fair hope, but questionable with the current roster. I guess I'll worry about his coaching decisions in a critical playoff situation when the Bulls get there.
   2792. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:22 PM (#5978107)
"Billy Donovan has agreed to a deal to become the next coach of the Chicago Bulls, sources tell ESPN."--Woj
that's actually a pretty good fit, imo.


trade machine: who says no?
   2793. Moses Taylor hashes out the rumpus Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:50 PM (#5978111)
Bulls had a press release ready to go and everything. They really flew under the radar on this hiring. Don't know if that's good or bad, just unusual.
   2794. aberg Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:53 PM (#5978112)
It's a little strange that Donovan left OKC because he didn't want to coach through a rebuild and ended up with a team that has been rebuilding for about 8 years.
   2795. Moses Taylor hashes out the rumpus Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:53 PM (#5978113)
SportsCenter @SportsCenter 52m

Breaking: Billy Donovan has agreed to a deal to become the next coach of the Chicago Bulls, sources tell @wojespn


Reply:

Bradley Beal @RealDealBeal23 50m

Yes!!!!


hmm....
   2796. tshipman Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:54 PM (#5978114)
Donovan probably would have been my second choice (after Atkinson), so not a bad hire.
   2797. ramifications of an exciting 57i66135 Posted: September 22, 2020 at 06:57 PM (#5978115)
It's a little strange that Donovan left OKC because he didn't want to coach through a rebuild and ended up with a team that has been rebuilding for about 8 years 23 years.
ftfy
   2798. tshipman Posted: September 22, 2020 at 07:41 PM (#5978122)
Haven't the Bulls been to the conference finals more recently than the Sixers?
   2799. SteveF Posted: September 22, 2020 at 09:22 PM (#5978135)
I've been thinking...

Maybe playoff Rondo isn't real, guys.
   2800. Los Angeles El Hombre of Anaheim Posted: September 22, 2020 at 09:51 PM (#5978150)
I'm scared. Hold me.
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