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Tuesday, April 16, 2019

OT - NBA thread (Playoffs through off-season)

I estimate only 10-12 Primates care about the NBA, and this one only cares about the NBA thread and the Cubs so I have no idea what the rest of the website cares about.

Moses Taylor loves a good maim Posted: April 16, 2019 at 02:18 PM | 6831 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: basketball, nba, off-topic

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   3601. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:19 AM (#5851857)
just gonna say...


GSW will miss the playoffs next year.
   3602. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:55 AM (#5851860)
In the Philadelphia series and first three games of the Bucks series, FVV shot 7-44. 2.4 PPG

He shot 45-88 since. 14.7 PPG
   3603. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:04 AM (#5851863)
Waking up this morning and finding that Klay tore his ACL is a gut punch. It almost feels like the Warriors lost two titles at once. If we had lost this year on poorly timed calf strains and hamstring pulls (and running into a worthy opponent), I think you just light a candle at the alter of the basketball gods, tighten up your Powerpoint deck to Durant and with some luck you're entering next year's season as the favorites again. Of course, anything could have happened, and favorites don't always win, but I agree with STIGGLES -- just making the playoffs is not a given anymore. Are the Warriors as currently healthy better than the Lebron Lakers? They'd be a Curry sprained ankle away from becoming the Suns for a few weeks.

Now, with Durant and Klay out for sure all of next season (minimum recent recovery time for an ACL is 11 months, and as long as 14), and Draymond going into the last year of his contract... does ownership even have the stomach to try to bring both Durant and Klay back, and then potentially commit long term to Dray as well before KD and Klay even step on a court again? At an incremental cost of $250M per year? It's not even my money but those numbers make my eyes water.

On the other hand, not trying to bring back KD definitely ends this team's run as title favorites forever.

Just a gut punch. I can't think of a team losing so much talent for so long during a playoff run happening ever.
   3604. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:05 AM (#5851864)
Man, what a shitty end to the season for the Warriors team. Makes their offseason very interesting.
   3605. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:17 AM (#5851867)
Makes their offseason very interesting.

Am I crazy or do they just obviously bring both back on max deals (or whatever it is Durant would be willing to sign)? I think that's more likely than anything dramatic, honestly.
   3606. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:21 AM (#5851868)
Am I crazy or do they just obviously bring both back on max deals (or whatever it is Durant would be willing to sign)? I think that's more likely than anything dramatic, honestly.


Would you think they just max everyone including Draymond? They'd go pretty quickly into luxury tax hell, for a team that is not really a contender next year (unless one of Klay/Durant comes back for the playoffs) and then pretty much the whole core is in their 30s afterwards, with 2 of their 3 best players (I think Klay may be better/more important as a playoff player than Draymond at this point) coming off major injuries.
   3607. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:25 AM (#5851869)
I think the Klay injury makes it slightly more likely that Durant leaves. Thompson is almost definitely coming back and I'm not sure they will want to pay that much money to a team that has 3 good players on it (even if one of them is Curry) and has to fill out 10 spots on their roster with failing draft picks and free agents that they can't pay much to. I would still guess, though, that they'll bring back KD with the goal being a 2021 championship.
   3608. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:29 AM (#5851870)
For the first time in a long time we have no idea who is even going to be in the conference finals next year. Normally at least 2 or 3 spots are essentially nailed down, but now. Between age, injury, and free agency I can make a case for a bunch of teams making the conference finals and also for those same teams missing out.

The injuries suck and I feel for Warriors fans who were denied the opportunity to defend their title healthy. Though the way the injury bug was going this series it seems either Curry or Green was do for a horrific leg injury in game 7, so maybe it is better we never got there.

It feels like years of extra mileage and relative good health came due all at once for GSW in a burst of evil karma. Still flags fly forever and being the fan of a dynasty is awesome and makes everything worth while (I lived in the Bay Area for most of the 49er run and Chicago for most of Jordan's run, so I have felt the joy).
   3609. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:31 AM (#5851871)
Am I crazy or do they just obviously bring both back on max deals (or whatever it is Durant would be willing to sign)? I think that's more likely than anything dramatic, honestly.
i'm not sure the NBA can allow that to happen.

the ability to sustain a ~400MM payroll is questionable, even if it gets you the 6 best players in the NBA and a 99.6% chance to win the NBA title.

a 400MM payroll, with two guys coming off major injuries, no guarantee of full recovery, and maybe a coinflip chance at missing the playoffs next year, is a damn near guarantee of bankruptcy/foreclosure/seizure in the near future.


   3610. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:34 AM (#5851872)

I admit that I got a bit tired of Warriors dominance, but I really like Kerr and their players. They are handling everything about the past week with class.

As for next year's team, they have Steph, Draymond and Iggy under contract, plus McKinnie. Lots of roster slots to fill, even if KD and/or Klay re-sign (but are still injured). KD technically has a player option for next season.

   3611. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:36 AM (#5851873)
This is probably ruled out somehow by the CBA, but... could the Warriors offer each of Klay and Durant 1/30 contracts as coaches for next year? They get their money, doesn't count against the luxury tax.
   3612. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:37 AM (#5851874)
If you asked me right now who the favorites to win next year's title is, I'd say the Milwaukee bucks. Probably been since Kareem where that's the answer. And it may not be the answer when the FA dust settles. I have gambling sites blocked at work, but I'm curious what the current odds are if anyone can look them up.

That said, my friend and I were discussing this. I don't think it will happen, but if you could convince Giannis of this, I'd be willing to give Durant Middleton's max money, be just a "good" team next year, and then try to print those titles for a 3 year stretch. Of course that assumes Durant would even come to Milwaukee.
   3613. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:42 AM (#5851875)
The Warriors have had some injury luck other seasons, but the bad luck they had with injuries this playoffs and the implications for really the future of the team are unlike anything I can remember. I hate the Warriors, and I still feel awful for the team/players.
   3614. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:44 AM (#5851877)
a 400MM payroll, with two guys coming off major injuries, no guarantee of full recovery, and maybe a coinflip chance at missing the playoffs next year, is a damn near guarantee of bankruptcy/foreclosure/seizure in the near future.

No.
Also, ..... no.
---
This was the first time during the Warriors dynasty that I rooted against them (apart from during some of the Houston/Golden State battles - though I certainly like the GS players more as a collective of people and as a team than Houston; go figure). They generally seem like pretty good and reasonable dudes.
---
Early odds GS favored to win the title next year. No chance that stays true...
GSW +190
MIL +450
TOR +1000
HOU +1200
NYK +1500
BOS/LAC/PHI +1800
LAL +2000
BKN/DEN +2500
DAL/NOP/OKC +4000
POR/UTA +5000
SAS +7000
IND +8000
ATL/CHI/ORL/SAC +10000
MEM +15000
CLE/MIN +25000
MIA +35000
CHA/DET/PHO/WAS +50000
   3615. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:45 AM (#5851879)
I love that fresh Der K content.
   3616. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:46 AM (#5851880)
Would you think they just max everyone including Draymond?

He's still under contract next year, so they don't have to worry about that yet.
   3617. PJ Martinez Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:47 AM (#5851881)
Another wrinkle with Golden State is that they're moving into their shiny new San Francisco arena next year. Do they really want to go into a new home in retooling mode? I'm guessing no, which means they almost certainly bring back Thompson, and I suspect that they will, at the very least, make a show of trying to bring back Durant.
   3618. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:47 AM (#5851883)
i'm not sure the NBA can allow that to happen.

the ability to sustain a ~400MM payroll is questionable, even if it gets you the 6 best players in the NBA and a 99.6% chance to win the NBA title.

a 400MM payroll, with two guys coming off major injuries, no guarantee of full recovery, and maybe a coinflip chance at missing the playoffs next year, is a damn near guarantee of bankruptcy/foreclosure/seizure in the near future.

This is ridiculous, all of it.
   3619. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:48 AM (#5851884)
Very strange vibe for the whole series. Am I right that the home team lost 5 of 6 games? How often does THAT happen?

The Warriors have had some injury luck other seasons, but the bad luck they had with injuries this playoffs and the implications for really the future of the team are unlike anything I can remember. I hate the Warriors, and I still feel awful for the team/players.


Same. I wanted them to lose because the players left to join other teams, or started hating each other.

In the Philadelphia series and first three games of the Bucks series, FVV shot 7-44. 2.4 PPG

He shot 45-88 since. 14.7 PPG


MVB: FVV Jr.

The Warriors ended the game with Steph, Draymond and Iguodala as their three best reasonably healthy players, with an about to retire Livingston and Quinn Cook as the next two by minutes played. That core probably wouldn't even make the playoffs most years.


I don't know about THAT. The core of Steph and Draymond is pretty good.

It would be easier to make the playoffs than win in the playoffs. You can always bring in new guys, buyouts or whatever, to replace the injured players. Except in the playoffs.
   3620. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:49 AM (#5851885)
Warriors under contract for next year:

PG Steph Curry
SG Alfonzo McKinnie
SF Andre Iguodala
PF Draymond Green
C Damian Jones

Bench
SG Jacob Evans

Pending Free Agents with some level of Bird Rights
C Kevon Looney
C Jordan Bell
PG Quinn Cook

They do have Shaun Livingston as well but he is strongly rumored to be retiring.

In addition, they'd have the taxpayer MLE and their first and second round draft picks this year.

And by the way, that roster is already above the cap and pushing the luxury tax -- would be huge for them to get under and reset the repeater tax timeline.
   3621. PJ Martinez Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:49 AM (#5851886)
Seems to me Toronto is the most likely favorite going into next season, with Milwaukee having the second-best chance. Free agency could change things, of course, but I'm not sure it can change things enough to alter that, with Durant off the board for next year. (Obviously if Kawhi leaves then Toronto will not be the favorites. But I suspect he will stay.)

The team currently likely to have the third-best odds might be... Philly? Denver? Houston?
   3622. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:51 AM (#5851887)
ESPN Article on contenders for next year...

...including odds from Caesars:

Bucks 6:1
Raptors 8:1
Sixers: 12:1
Nuggets: 20:1
Clippers 6:1
Warriors 3:1
Rockets 10:1
Lakers 9:2
Celtics 12:1
Blazers 30:1

I know ####-all about gambling, but Houston looks tempting.


   3623. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:52 AM (#5851888)
Seems to me Toronto is the most likely favorite going into next season, with Milwaukee having the second-best chance. Free agency could change things, of course, but I'm not sure it can change things enough to alter that, with Durant off the board for next year.

The team currently likely to have the third-best odds might be... Philly? Denver? Houston?

I'll be surprised if the Bucks can figure out a way to get better, with the obvious exception of another step forward for Giannis. Seems likely they'll lose at least 1 or 2 of the rotation- I think Lopez is survivable, but Brogdon would be a big loss.
   3624. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:53 AM (#5851889)
Am I right that the home team lost 5 of 6 games? How often does THAT happen?


They said on the broadcast that it was the first Finals in which the road team won five consecutive games.
   3625. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:54 AM (#5851890)
Brooklyn is the obvious candidate to significantly improve in the east: the Kyrie stuff gets stronger every day and they have room to operate to add even more.
   3626. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:56 AM (#5851892)
Is that roster better than the Lebron Lakers? I honestly don't know. It's Curry, Draymond, a 36-year-old Iguodala who averaged 6/4/3 in 68 games last season, Kevon Looney (potentially) and a bunch of G League players.

Another wrinkle with Golden State is that they're moving into their shiny new San Francisco arena next year. Do they really want to go into a new home in retooling mode? I'm guessing no, which means they almost certainly bring back Thompson, and I suspect that they will, at the very least, make a show of trying to bring back Durant.


I do think it is important and relevant to ownership's thinking that bringing back KD and Klay (if possible) would potentially keep season ticket sales and hype going, as in "Definitely don't give up your ridiculously priced season ticket packages so you don't miss out on the 2021 title run!"
   3627. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:57 AM (#5851893)
I'll be surprised if the Bucks can figure out a way to get better, with the obvious exception of another step forward for Giannis. Seems likely they'll lose at least 1 or 2 of the rotation- I think Lopez is survivable, but Brogdon would be a big loss.


I don't think the Bucks need to get better besides some Giannis improvements to his game that makes him harder to guard in the playoffs. They only have $77 mill on the books, they should be able to keep Middleton and Brogdon. The main rotation pieces of Hill and Lopez may go, but backup PG and center are two of the easiest spots to fill on the cheap.
   3628. I am going to be Frank Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:08 AM (#5851897)
So according to my gambling app:

Bucks +500
Warriors +700
Lakers +700
Raptors +700
Rockets +800
76ers +1000
Nuggets +1200
Clippers +1400
Celtics +2000
Nets, Knicks, Thunder +2500
Mavs, Pacers, Blazers, Jazz +4000

76ers seem like to play to me, even with the FA uncertainty. I can't believe anyone would bet on the Warriors or Lakers.
   3629. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:19 AM (#5851900)
They only have $77 mill on the books, they should be able to keep Middleton and Brogdon.

What will it cost, combined, to bring those two back? o/u $50 million a year?
   3630. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:23 AM (#5851903)
Someone is going to make a huge offer to Brogdon. I think he's going to get Zach LaVine money.
   3631. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:31 AM (#5851905)
   3632. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:33 AM (#5851908)
Brogdon - he's gpnna get paid. Honestly, I get it - seems like a guy you can slot into any system and he can help you between his shooting, reasonable playmaking, and - in theory - good defense, though said D hasn't necessarily manifested on the floor.
   3633. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:40 AM (#5851912)
What will it cost, combined, to bring those two back? o/u $50 million a year?


Slightly over, probably. You can do that and still stay right around the luxury tax. Snell's money then goes towards the Giannis supermax in a year.
   3634. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:42 AM (#5851914)
I hope the Bucks can bring at least Brogdon and Middleton back. I want that team to win like hell and keep Giannis.
   3635. Edmundo got dem ol' Kozma blues again mama Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:02 AM (#5851929)
GSW is in a weird spot. New arena next year, but an aging cast that would cost a few fortunes to sign, and the injuries. So, let's look at it another way. Have the basketball gods sent a message to start over?

Could they get Zion for Curry in an x-way deal?
Could Draymond bring a mid-range first?
Could Iggy bring a Hinkie special? A second or two and some contract shenanigans?

Granted it would be tanking but if you tank with Zion in hand, that's a pretty good starting point.
   3636. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:17 AM (#5851935)
My predictions!

Champ: GS
MVP: Leonard
CoTY: Nurse or Bud. I guess Nurse.
RoTY: Ayton


I will get all of these wrong - but also don't feel that bad about it.
   3637. Mellow Mouse, Benevolent Space Tyrant Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:34 AM (#5851937)
Could they get Zion for Curry in an x-way deal?


No.
   3638. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:45 AM (#5851940)
GSW is in a weird spot. New arena next year, but an aging cast that would cost a few fortunes to sign, and the injuries. So, let's look at it another way. Have the basketball gods sent a message to start over?

Could they get Zion for Curry in an x-way deal?
Could Draymond bring a mid-range first?
Could Iggy bring a Hinkie special? A second or two and some contract shenanigans?

Granted it would be tanking but if you tank with Zion in hand, that's a pretty good starting point.

I don't know how much of this is serious but you don't trade Steph Curry, ever, for anything. Like, you probably want Giannis's next 5 years more than Steph's next 5 years (I'm actually not certain of this, but just play along), but the Warriors are not going to make that trade.
   3639. PJ Martinez Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:54 AM (#5851942)
3638 is surely correct, but also nobody is trading Zion for anything unless they have big win-now plans, which New Orleans, on account of Davis's preferences, does not have.
   3640. Fourth True Outcome Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:58 AM (#5851944)
I have no idea what Masai Ujiri wants, and kind of assume he's not interested in working for Ted Leonsis, but if he does go to Washington for the money and Kawhi leaves Toronto, that would go down as an all-time post-championship letdown. It would be wild if both teams in the Finals started next year so diminished.

Also, to agree with everyone else, there is no way Curry is being traded for Zion, and also no way Zion is being traded for Curry.
   3641. Moses Taylor loves a good maim Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:59 AM (#5851945)
Man, I'm really bummed about Klay. I hate to see the Warriors dynasty go out like this.

I guess I'd expect Klay to be back on the max, and KD will leave.

I think TOR/MIL are co-favorites at the moment, but FA is going to change that (though I'm not sure I can imagine, at this particular moment) at team that will go from non-contender this year up to favorite (IOW, HOU/BOS/PHI could easily slide up to that group, but even if BKN gets Kyrie/someone else or LAC gets Kawhi they won't).

---

Deadspin: It Appears That Raptors President Ujiri Got Into It With An (Oakland) Cop

Ugh.
   3642. Moses Taylor loves a good maim Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:08 PM (#5851949)
all-time post-championship letdown.

The leader in the clubhouse will never be caught.
   3643. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:11 PM (#5851951)
or LAC gets Kawhi they won't

I do not agree with this after the last 6 weeks he just had.
   3644. Rally Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:13 PM (#5851952)
Is that roster better than the Lebron Lakers? I honestly don't know. It's Curry, Draymond, a 36-year-old Iguodala who averaged 6/4/3 in 68 games last season, Kevon Looney (potentially) and a bunch of G League players.


I think so. It has an elite offensive player and an elite defensive player. Lakers have just an elite offensive player.

   3645. Davo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:13 PM (#5851953)
3614;
BKN/DEN +2500

Um...is Brooklyn expected to add a bunch of free agents or something?
   3646. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:19 PM (#5851958)
On Brooklyn.. so, supposedly they'll add Kyrie and are confident that they'll get another top guy. Who is that guy?
   3647. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:24 PM (#5851962)
What's so weird and sad about the Warriors playoff run now is that knowing that they didn't win, (and honestly, maybe even if they were going to) everything positive that happened from the Houston series on only eventually made things worse.

Anthony Slater did a good job of articulating this, but basically:

- If the Warriors lose Games 5 and 6 to the Rockets, and KD is rehabbing a calf strain and ready for training camp next season, and Klay is frolicking in the ocean somewhere
- If the Warriors lose Game 2 in the Finals at the end with Kawhi swiping Curry's bad pass and the Raptors winning in OT, the Warriors get swept and Klay's ACL is intact

Too bad the Warriors didn’t crumble after the Durant injury. Too bad champs never go quietly. Too bad Klay hit two 3s in the final 2:30 to stun the Raptors. Too bad Kyle Lowry didn’t sky that corner 3 over Draymond Green’s outstretched finger and close the curtain that night.

If he did, Klay isn’t streaking down that left sideline late in the third quarter of Game 6 on Thursday night, a Game 7 squarely in his sights, a revved-up farewell Oracle Arena crowd motivating him enough to soar for an ambitious transition dunk over Danny Green.


   3648. Booey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:29 PM (#5851964)
all-time post-championship letdown.

The leader in the clubhouse will never be caught.


Yeah, the 1998 Bulls have to be the flukiest champion of all time - 62 wins and the title one year, and then 13 wins and last place in the East the following season! ;-)
   3649. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:49 PM (#5851973)
"It is my understanding in talking to people with the Warriors' organization that their intention is to continue to offer Kevin Durant a full five-year max contract and to offer Klay a full five-year max contract," said Brian Windhorst on ESPN's First Take.
   3650. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:50 PM (#5851975)
Harris would make a lot of sense for BKN.
   3651. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 12:56 PM (#5851980)
I have no idea what Masai Ujiri wants
I'm not saying that 19/20 WAS is a better situation than 19/20 TOR, and IDK what are the other NBA PoBO/GM job openings (besides maybe LAL), but doesn't it seem like Ujiri went all-in like a guy who could be moving on?

Somebody upthread said that TOR could really suck, next year, which looks right. Maybe Ujiri should bail?

   3652. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:00 PM (#5851981)
Somebody upthread said that TOR could really suck, next year, which looks right.

I think that's really overstating things. Their core is mostly older and Kawhi might leave, yes, but Siakam is young and very good and has room to grow. If Kawhi walks that's still easily a playoff team in my mind.
   3653. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:05 PM (#5851982)
I see no way Milwaukee doesn't enter the next season as favorites. I wonder if they could pick up some ring chasers with or without Brogdon and/or Middleton? Someone like Millsap, if the Nuggets decline his 30M option (any read on this?), would fit nicely on a ring-chasing contract.

Thinking about this the next day, man, I am really happy for Lowry and Gasol. Two great guys who absolutely deserve a ring.
   3654. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:08 PM (#5851983)
The leader in the clubhouse will never be caught.


Pete Myers and Dickey Simpkins didn't do it for you?
   3655. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:19 PM (#5851986)
Can we start the draft today? Somebody asked me about Josh Jackson, but I couldn't respond because I wasn't logged in.

EDIT: I'm open to any ideas involving any player and package. I'd like to trade up or down (or possibly out) from #6.
   3656. aberg Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:19 PM (#5851987)
That Danny Green play will go down as largely irrelevant, but it was one of the weirder high leverage plays in a long time. I have no idea what he was thinking. If he just stood there with his back to Draymond, there was no option but to foul him.

I will echo the sentiment that I am sad for Klay even though I don't like him or the Warriors. I know it's almost impossible to disklike him, but he went to Wazzu, so my hands are tied.

   3657. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 01:23 PM (#5851990)
but he went to Wazzu
I wonder how many trivia beer-bets one could win with this tidbit.
   3658. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:03 PM (#5852000)
This is uplifting:

Durant was on the line, FaceTiming him from New York, where he's recovering from surgery on his torn Achilles.

"I heard them talking," Klay's father, Mychal, said of the conversation. "But I don't think they'd want me to divulge it."

Durant was probably the only person in the world who could relate to exactly what Thompson was feeling in that moment. His dad knew to give them space.

"They were encouraging each other to come back strong," Mychal Thompson said. "They got unfinished business."


   3659. NJ in NJ Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:20 PM (#5852009)
I don't see how both come back to the Warriors. It feels like GM malpractice to give a max contract to one guy out a year, much less two. I know it's not the same for lots of reasons, but isn't this essentially what happened with Kobe? And now you're asking Myers to heighten the risk factor? I don't see any way this ends well for the Warriors. And as a guy who called the Raptors defeating the Warriors back in October, I know at least as much as Der K.
   3660. CFBF is Obsessed with Art Deco Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:21 PM (#5852010)
   3661. It's regretful that PASTE was able to get out Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:30 PM (#5852019)
I think Satan evidently calling in his end of the deal with the Warriors makes it more likely--and more sensible--that Ainge goes ahead and trades his hoard for one year of Anthony Davis, and goes all-in for the 2020 title. I don't think anyone else can top what Boston has to offer, so in a roundabout way Klay's injury makes it way more likely Davis is a Celtic next year, IMO.
   3662. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:31 PM (#5852020)
Here's the draft list as I have it now. I think I got everyone who asked for a team. Again, anyone who doesn't like their assignment can trade.

1. New Orleans – sardonic
2. Memphis – Willard Baseball
3. New York – JC and NJ
4. Los Angeles Lakers - Hombre/rr
5. Cleveland - Harlond
6. Phoenix – Oriole Tragic
7. Chicago - Moses
8. Atlanta - Der-K
9. Washington – Dandy Little Glove Man
10. Atlanta - Der-K
11. Minnesota - aberg
12. Charlotte - Fridas Boss
13. Miami – Mouse
14. Boston – stevegamer
15. Detroit - Crosseyed and Painless
16. Orlando – Athletic Supporter
17. Atlanta - Der-K
18. Indiana – JJ1986
19. San Antonio – Quaker
20. Boston – stevegamer
21. Oklahoma City – Thok
22. Boston – stevegamer
23. Utah - Booey/Cervo
24. Philadelphia- 57i66135
25. Portland – PASTE
26. Cleveland - Harlond
27. Brooklyn – mike f
28. Golden State - sardonic
29. San Antonio – Quaker
30. Milwaukee – Ken Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw

31. Brooklyn – mike f
32. Phoenix – Oriole Tragic
33. Philadelphia- 57i66135
34. Philadelphia- 57i66135
35. Atlanta - Der-K
36. Charlotte - Fridas Boss
37. Dallas
38. Chicago - Moses
39. New Orleans – sardonic
40. Sacramento - smileyy
41. Atlanta - Der-K
42. Philadelphia- 57i66135
43. Minnesota - aberg
44. Atlanta- Der-K
45. Detroit - Crosseyed and Painless
46. Orlando – Athletic Supporter
47. Sacramento - smileyy
48. LA Clippers
49. San Antonio – Quaker
50. Indiana – JJ1986
51. Boston – stevegamer
52. Charlotte - Fridas Boss
53. Utah - Booey/Cervo
54. Philadelphia- 57i66135
55. New York – JC and NJ
56. LA Clippers
57. New Orleans – sardonic
58. Golden State - sardonic
59. Toronto
60. Sacramento - smileyy
   3663. It's regretful that PASTE was able to get out Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:34 PM (#5852021)
I thought there was a Portland fan in this thread; if so and you want them, I'm fine with taking any team.

If I AM representing Portland, then my pick (#25) and/or anyone on my roster is theoretically available--though I don't think I like this draft class enough to consider moving Lillard or McCollum for any picks in it.
   3664. The Mighty Quintana Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:54 PM (#5852027)
I'll take the Clippers - I am a Celtics fan but live in LA and use Windows and love Doc, so there's that.
   3665. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 02:56 PM (#5852028)
Connor Letourneau @Con_Chron
Just spoke with Klay Thompson's father, Mychal, who said there's "no question" Klay will re-sign with the Warriors. Golden State is expected to still offer him a full five-year maximum deal.
   3666. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 03:14 PM (#5852036)

@Der-K are you interested in trading picks to move up to #6?
   3667. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: June 14, 2019 at 03:16 PM (#5852037)
Here are 2019-20 win total over/under bets from something call PointBet. So I'm sure the lines aren't good/worth much, but here they are anyway

Bucks 55.5
Sixers 54.5
Raptors 53.5
Nets 50.5
Celtics 48.5
Pacers 47.5
Knicks 37.5
Magic 35.5
----
Pistons 34.5
Heat 34.5
Hawks 32.5
Hornets 32.5
Wizards 28.5
Bulls 27.5
Cavaliers 23.5

Rockets 53.5
Clippers 51.5
Lakers 51.5
Nuggets 50.5
Jazz 50.5
Warriors 46.5
Thunder 46.5
Blazers 45.5
----
Spurs 44.5
Mavericks 41.5
Timberwolves 34.5
Kings 33.5
Pelicans 31.5
Grizzlies 27.5
Suns 25.5

Sorry to post this when it's draft time but like putting them out there. Sad that my Pistons are going from bad to worse.
   3668. aberg Posted: June 14, 2019 at 03:19 PM (#5852040)
I will entertain offers for Wiggins!

Teague is an expiring contract and still a decent PG if anyone wants him at 19m (not for free, but cheap). Dieng is has 2/33 left and I'd listen on him. Would love to get some flexibility under my new leadership.
   3669. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 03:26 PM (#5852045)
   3670. jmurph Posted: June 14, 2019 at 03:32 PM (#5852053)
Any teams with no picks this year? Eyeballing it I'm not seeing any.
   3671. JJ1986 Posted: June 14, 2019 at 04:13 PM (#5852075)
Any teams with no picks this year? Eyeballing it I'm not seeing any.
I think just the Nuggets.
   3672. Davo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 04:35 PM (#5852087)
Toronto Raptors Jewish co-owner says team will visit Israel if it wins NBA Finals
Israel’s Sport 5 reported last week that during a low-key visit to Israel in April, Tanenbaum told several people he met in the Jewish state that “If we win the NBA championship, I will come with the Toronto Raptors to visit the Holy Land.”
   3673. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 04:40 PM (#5852090)

@aberg how about Dieng and #11 for Tyler Johnson (2019 player option) and some stuff?

Or something along those lines?

EDIT: fixed the proposal to reflect the right MIN pick.
   3674. aberg Posted: June 14, 2019 at 04:56 PM (#5852100)
@aberg how about Dieng and #11 for Tyler Johnson (2019 player option) and some stuff?


With the amount of cap space that's already available, I think Dieng's negative value is slightly closer to zero than the pick's positive value. I think of Johnson has a net negative with his contract, so I think I'd pass on that.
   3675. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:04 PM (#5852103)

@aberg what if I take Teague off your hands, too? You could probably buy out Johnson's p-opt.
   3676. Tin Angel Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:07 PM (#5852105)
Yahoo Sports @YahooSports
Jimmy Butler will decline his player option with the Sixers and become an unrestricted free agent.


   3677. DCA Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:09 PM (#5852106)
Bucks +500
Warriors +700
Lakers +700
Raptors +700
Rockets +800
76ers +1000
Nuggets +1200
Clippers +1400
Celtics +2000
Nets, Knicks, Thunder +2500
Mavs, Pacers, Blazers, Jazz +4000


At those odds, the Celtics/Blazers/Jazz/Thunder look like the best bets to me.
   3678. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:09 PM (#5852107)
The cap is 109M, by the way.

I'll poke for specific players later, but the Magic are interested in picking up a redraft type point guard. #16 is available. I'm willing to take on some 2-year bad contracts, and have Mozgov's 17M expiring if anyone is trying to clear salary for 2020-21. Fournier and his reasonable 2/34 is also available.
   3679. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:15 PM (#5852113)
Knicks braintrust, how available is DSJ?
   3680. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:16 PM (#5852114)
EDIT: nevermind, I was thinking one of those guys was a first-rdr.
   3681. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:26 PM (#5852117)
Yahoo Sports @YahooSports
Jimmy Butler will decline his player option with the Sixers and become an unrestricted free agent.
bastard.
I will entertain offers for Wiggins!
i would have been interested last year (wouldn't have been worse cap management than spending ~40MM on redick, bayless, muscala, amir johnson and wilson chandler...plus another 17MM on fultz, zhaire smith, jonah bolden and landry shamet), but i think it's a bit too rich for the sixers at this point.

Fournier and his reasonable 2/34 is also available.

about the only things i can offer are draft picks and a cap exception, but if that's enough to get it done, let me know.
   3682. Moses Taylor loves a good maim Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:36 PM (#5852120)
Jimmy Butler will decline his player option with the Sixers and become an unrestricted free agent.

Why, I never
   3683. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:50 PM (#5852124)
1. New Orleans – sardonic


Woohoo! With the first overall pick in the 2019 BBTF NBA Thread Mock Draft, New Orleans selects Zion Williamson. No need to overthink this one.

I am actively entertaining the following offers, you can email me at bryan [dot] p [dot] tsao at gmail if you don't want to post on thread or to make sure I see it.

1. Anthony Davis: Hoping to get three premium draft picks worth of talent. Given the potential need to match salaries, that means at least one should be in the form of a recent draft pick with great potential.

2. Contingent on moving AD, which I am motivated to do, I should be at $91M in salary cap after renouncing Stanley Johnson and his $12M cap hold, and can open up up to $10M more easily, which means we have between $18M and $28M in cap room open. Looking to pick up this year or next year's first round picks at roughly the going rate set by the Nets/Atlanta deal of a late lottery/mid first per $18M or so of cap space.

3. Jrue Holiday: 2 years left at about $26M. The Pels seem to be open to keeping him, so I'll run their virtual team in that spirit. That said, I think he'd be a great value for a contender, and he's a bit on the old side to be a great value to the next good Pels team. You'd be getting his age 29 and 30 years though, which should be pretty good! I'm not considering offers worse than a lottery pick.
   3684. Fourth True Outcome Posted: June 14, 2019 at 05:50 PM (#5852125)
Just going to point out that, after all the pondering of what was going to happen to Patrick McCaw, he ended up getting another ring. Sure, he only played 12 minutes total in the series, but it's still a funny resolution to the weird saga of his year for him to pick up a personal threepeat.
   3685. aberg Posted: June 14, 2019 at 06:08 PM (#5852130)
Yahoo Sports @YahooSports
Jimmy Butler will decline his player option with the Sixers and become an unrestricted free agent.
bastard.


I was expecting you to explain that this actually meant he was opting in.
   3686. sardonic Posted: June 14, 2019 at 06:22 PM (#5852134)
STIGGLES, can I interest you in Jahlil Okafor's non-guaranteed $1.7M deal for a second?
   3687. Your favorite TFTIO, me! Posted: June 14, 2019 at 06:23 PM (#5852135)
God I wish the Wolves could figure out a way to get Jrue.
   3688. Athletic Supporter is USDA certified lean Posted: June 14, 2019 at 06:29 PM (#5852136)
I'll try to figure out specifics later but I wonder if there is a deal where Philly gets Fournier, the Magic get Holiday, NO gets Mozgov and a bunch of picks.
   3689. Davo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 06:47 PM (#5852140)
I don’t follow this very closely, but I suspect negotiating trades with Stiggles is spectacular.
   3690. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 07:27 PM (#5852144)
I’m not necessarily interested in moving up in the draft at this time, but may change my mind.

So, the Hawks are open for business. Every player, every pick is available. Collins, Young and Huerter (who is the closest of anyone on the team to “fitting my system”) are the hardest gets and I think that Len is kind of okay. We still have cap space, so if you want to dump a bad contract - we can still help.

Also, if you’re thinking - they have six picks, they can’t keep six picks on the roster ... we can keep six picks on this roster.
   3691. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:16 PM (#5852157)
I don’t follow this very closely, but I suspect negotiating trades with Stiggles is spectacular.
for what it's worth, i traded dario saric for andre drummond last year, and i'm never not willing to do weird ####.
   3692. Crosseyed and Painless Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:22 PM (#5852159)
I've done mock ideas of just getting rid of Drummond's salary for years! I'm now at the point where I'll just keep him around because Pistons have 0 actual chances to get better so they might as well hold on to him and hope his post-ASB self is a New Drummond.

Most Pistons fans I know are mad they won't rebuild and won't try to Win Now, but I can't see how they rebuild (could move Blake at this point, but for what in picks?), and they aren't anywhere near close enough winning to try to Win Now. So just muddle along.

I won't bore anyone else with any Boring Pistons thoughts, but remember my Drummond for Saric trade fondly. Good luck to all of you with your fake draft picks.
   3693. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:30 PM (#5852161)
Most Pistons fans I know are mad they won't rebuild and won't try to Win Now, but I can't see how they rebuild (could move Blake at this point, but for what in picks?), and they aren't anywhere near close enough winning to try to Win Now. So just muddle along.

best plan i can figure
   3694. spivey Posted: June 14, 2019 at 08:55 PM (#5852168)
God I wish the Wolves could figure out a way to get Jrue.


You can. It involves trading Towns (who is worse than Jrue Holiday, I said it)
   3695. Davo Posted: June 14, 2019 at 09:54 PM (#5852183)
   3696. tshipman Posted: June 14, 2019 at 10:04 PM (#5852187)
Collins, Young and Huerter (who is the closest of anyone on the team to “fitting my system”) are the hardest gets and I think that Len is kind of okay.


Der-K's system appears to be: bomb 3s and play terrible defense.
   3697. Der-K's tired of these fruits from poisoned trees Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:42 PM (#5852199)
Heh. Huerter is the one most like what I tend to look for and can also defend a bit. (My twos tend to be above average from three, good passers, and decent at D but not necessarily creative scorers. That’s this guy to a t.)

Young is a bad fit and Collins’s defense is not what I like, but they’re talented and young enough that I’ll work with it.

My teams (such as I have them) tend to favor defense over, in particular, the ability to create shots. (This is not necessarily good.)
   3698. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 14, 2019 at 11:58 PM (#5852200)
STIGGLES, can I interest you in Jahlil Okafor's non-guaranteed $1.7M deal for a second?
i kind of really want to do that, but i'm 68% sure that jah's dad would track me down and beat me up like some club going masshole if there's even a hint of a rumor that the sixers were going to acquire him again.
   3699. 57i66135 is a hard word for me. Posted: June 15, 2019 at 12:14 AM (#5852201)
#1 overall picks in the last 15 years:

east:
fultz
simmons
wiggins
bennett
kyrie
wall
rose
bargnani
bogut

west:
zion
ayton
towns
davis
griffin
oden


players who weren't massive disappointments (yet) in BOLD.
   3700. Oriole Tragic Posted: June 15, 2019 at 12:21 AM (#5852202)

@sardonic/3686: I'll do that for #32 if you'll send #39 with Jah.
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