User Comments, Suggestions, or Complaints | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertising
Page rendered in 0.3524 seconds
48 querie(s) executed
| ||||||||
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Discussion
| ||||||||
Baseball Primer Newsblog — The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand Sunday, August 23, 2009Phillies back Pedro, beat Mets on triple playOh, that Frenchy.
Repoz
Posted: August 23, 2009 at 08:43 PM | 82 comment(s)
Login to Bookmark
Tags: game recaps, mets, phillies |
Login to submit news.
You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks. Hot TopicsNewsblog: OMNICHATTER for June 2023
(77 - 11:30pm, Jun 02) Last: frannyzoo Newsblog: Former Los Angeles Dodger Steve Garvey weighs U.S. Senate bid (20 - 11:15pm, Jun 02) Last: baxter Newsblog: MLB managers should be challenging a lot more in 2023 (4 - 10:22pm, Jun 02) Last: The Duke Newsblog: Aaron Boone’s Rate of Ejections Is Embarrassing ... And Historically Significant (2 - 10:18pm, Jun 02) Last: The Duke Newsblog: Jays pitcher Anthony Bass sorry for posting video endorsing anti-LGBTQ boycotts (97 - 10:02pm, Jun 02) Last: baxter Newsblog: The Athletic: After 50 years, is this the San Diego Chicken’s last stand? [$] (14 - 8:23pm, Jun 02) Last: Dag Nabbit: Sockless Psychopath Newsblog: 2023 NBA Playoffs Thread (2539 - 7:27pm, Jun 02) Last: Tom Cervo, backup catcher Newsblog: Economic boost or big business hand-out? Nevada lawmakers consider A’s stadium financing (10 - 6:14pm, Jun 02) Last: McCoy Hall of Merit: Reranking First Basemen: Discussion Thread (35 - 4:10pm, Jun 02) Last: bjhanke Newsblog: 8 big All-Star voting storylines to follow (25 - 3:48pm, Jun 02) Last: cardsfanboy Sox Therapy: Lining Up The Minors (30 - 3:43pm, Jun 02) Last: Darren Newsblog: OT Soccer Thread - The Run In (416 - 3:15pm, Jun 02) Last: Infinite Yost (Voxter) Sox Therapy: The First Third (23 - 2:58pm, Jun 02) Last: pikepredator Newsblog: Diamond Sports Group fails to pay Padres, loses broadcast rights (23 - 2:21pm, Jun 02) Last: Karl from NY Newsblog: ESPN the Magazine: Bat and Ball Games you've never heard of (31 - 1:05pm, Jun 02) Last: gehrig97 |
|||||||
About Baseball Think Factory | Write for Us | Copyright © 1996-2021 Baseball Think Factory
User Comments, Suggestions, or Complaints | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertising
|
| Page rendered in 0.3524 seconds |
Reader Comments and Retorts
Go to end of page
Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.
1. HGM Posted: August 23, 2009 at 08:56 PM (#3302746)If the runners aren't going, that's probably an RBI single. Not his fault.
Pedro didn't look sharp especially early on. He'll get his first real test in his next start against Atlanta.
"I'm pretty confident Francoeur would have hit into a triple play somehow."
Which means the two crappy 9th-inning plays he made were a crafty set up! Just like when Superman tricked Zod into putting him inside the Kryptonian power-eraser chamber!
1909-1927: 7 UTP
1928-1991: 1 UTP
1992-2009: 6 UTP
And three in the past three years.
My default is random chance, but curious if anyone has any other theories.
1909-1927: 7 UTP
1928-1991: 1 UTP
1992-2009: 6 UTP
And three in the past three years.
My default is random chance, but curious if anyone has any other theories.
Steroids.
1909-1927: baserunners were going on the pitch more often
1928-1991: baserunners were not going on the pitch nearly as often
1992-2009: there are more hard lineouts than ever before and nobody knows how to run the bases anymore
Candidate hypotheses (partial, of course):
-More teams so more games
-162 games rather than 154
-(I believe) higher OBP during the last 20 years than in much of the preceding 65
Cumulatively resulting in more 2-on no-out situations.
Also, I would think that the decline of the stolen base and (perhaps) longer PA's resulting in more situations where the hitter has a full count and runners are at first and second and running on the play.
The decline of the stolen base may also lead to (on average) slower/heavier baserunners which have more trouble changing directions, so they can't get back to their base or avoid the infielder's tag.
And there's been both better fielders, and a hell of a lot more baserunners lately.
Random chance is also a pretty good theory.
Seriously, if you gave me one guess as to "Who hit into a game-ending unassisted triple play with the tying runs on base?" I'd immediately answer, "Francoeur". I mean, who else?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unassisted_triple_play
All of the reasons cited in 13, 14, 15 seems like good possibilities. But I'll think I'll go with random chance.
No, actually, Bruntlett didn't move to the bag when the runners started going; he had positioned himself there and only moved to catch the ball after it was hit.
But in the former two years, he was a young clutchmaster prodigy. In the latter two, he's the guy who hits into a game-ending triple play only because there is no quadruple play.
Don't give us any ideas. The Mets laugh at your substantive reality.
There were extenuating circumstances in first baseman Johnny Neun's triple play on May 31, 1927 - shortstop Jimmy Cooney had pulled one off the day before, and Neun read about it in the newspaper. He reportedly had a long discussion about the chances of pulling off such a play at breakfast before the game. When he caught a line drive with the runners on first and second going, he tagged the runner from first, and waved off the second baseman, running to second for the putout instead of throwing the ball, which would have been far easier. He had the unnassisted triple play in mind from the get-go, prompted by Cooney doing it the day before.
It can happen on an appeal play. Did in fact, earlier this year. Though not four outs on one play.
Second and third, no outs. Batter swings at strike three, ball gets away from catcher. Runner on third breaks for home, is tagged out by pitcher, while batter advances to first. Runner on second is thrown out trying for third, and batter is subsequently thrown out trying for second.
C'mon, Mets. You can do this.
I think that this is the play you're thinking of. The Diamondbacks should have appealed the runner at third, invoking the four out rule, but didn't do so, and the Dodgers run stood.
Still the Mariners managed to run into a triple play while never hitting the ball a few years ago. Runners on first and third, none out - batter strikes out, runner from first caught trying to steal second, runner from third caught trying to steal home...
Dropped fly balls. Missed bases. Unassisted Triple Plays.
How do the Mets top that? Because you know they will.
TP4U on my scorecard
You just ensured he'll be traded for Carlos Silva.
Isn't there a movie where a guy scores a touchdown by shooting one of the opposing players? I imagine the Mets will have to lose in some sort of baseball equivalent.
If it's in October, my money's on A-Roid.
Not really. From 2005-2007 he put up a composite OPS+ of 100, with 100 RBIs twice to pretty it up. In 2008-2009 its 77. Big, big difference.
I asked this question of myself after they lost to the Yankees on the Castillo dropped pop fly.
I refuse to contemplate this question ever again.
The possibilities are just too horrendous.
DB
This is just about my favourite Sports Illustrated article.
How do the Mets top that? Because you know they will.
The Aztec calendar (and thus the woirld) ends three years early?
That might have been the worst inside-the-park homer ever. They should have scored it defensive indifference.
Hidden ball trick?
Out by passing the runner?
There are lots of possibilities; the Mets just need to get creative!
The same game, incidentally, also included a player being struck by lightning.
"When interviewed in the 1960s by Lawrence Ritter, for his classic oral history, The Glory of Their Times, Wambsganss recalled: "Funny thing, I played in the big leagues for 13 years, 1914 through 1926, and the only thing that anybody seems to remember is that once I made an unassisted triple play in a World Series. Many don't even remember the team I was on, or the position I played, or anything. Just Wambsganss-unassisted triple play!"
"You'd think I was born on the day before and died on the day after"
Edit: pthomas beat me to the anecdote.
What other unusual ways are there to end an inning (as the batting team) or lose as the fielding team?
Hitting the baserunner with the batted ball with 2 outs?
Outfielders colliding on a routine fly ball for the third out?
Tossing the ball into the stands with only 2 outs?
They'll have to bring Benny Agbayani back to coach this one!
Bottom of the 9th, two outs, down by one. Murphy at second, Slappy at first. Ball in the gap, Slappy is right behind Murphy as they get to the plate. Murphy misses the plate trying to avoid the catcher, Slappy touches it.
If this was Manuel's last game it was worth it.
A Mets hitter could run in to a batted ball while exiting the box. I've only seen this (or even heard of it) twice, both in the same game (opening day 2004 Giants @ Astros).
That's awesome. I can't believe I hadn't heard of that before.
Or...two outs, bottom of the ninth, bases loaded with the Mets down a run. Frenchy's up. With a herculean effort, he's somehow managed to not swing at three pitches out of the strike zone and the count is full. On the money pitch with the runners going, the ball hits Frenchy on the ankle. Unfortunately, he swings at it anyway, and is called out on strikes to end the game.
Wambsganss recalled: "Funny thing, I played in the big leagues for 13 years, 1914 through 1926, and the only thing that anybody seems to remember is that once I made an unassisted triple play in a World Series."
At least that's something. Wambsganss had 6,097 PA in the teens and twenties: a long time ago. Who remembers Jack Fournier, Dode Paskert, Ivy Olson, Ed Konetchy, or Shano Collins?
Who remembers Jack Fournier, Dode Paskert, Ivy Olson, Ed Konetchy, or Shano Collins?
Those five people have all been in my kitchen!
Maybe I just don't remember it as a kid but sending the runners on virtually any 3-2 pitch seems to be a LOT more common over the past 15 years than it was before. I don't remember that being something that was such an accepted part of baseball strategy back in the 80s. That might be my memory playing tricks on me though.
He's the baseball Zelig.
If I'm not mistaken, we've already had a game-winning run score this way this year (just not as a walk-off).
I assume we're the only team to lose a playoff series on a walk?
One time, Honus Wagner was called out at home on an interference call after a throw to the catcher bounced up into his shirt sleeve. That could work.
The same game, incidentally, also included a player being struck by lightning.
Do you know when this game was? Is there a retro-sheet info available? I have a friend who is very interested in this.
Not to nitpick, buy every NYer knows there's no 'r' in "woild."
You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.
<< Back to main