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Friday, November 22, 2019

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 11-22-2019

Pittsburgh Press, November 22, 1919:

St. Louis Cardinals recently approached Cincinnati men, and proposed a deal whereby the Reds would get Outfielder [Jack] Smith, a player much admired by Pat Moran, in exchange for Pitcher Jimmy Ring. The deal sounded fine to Moran, but now it has been intimated that the Cards do not want Ring for their own use, but, if they secure him, plan to trade him, McHenry and Hornsby to the New York Giants for Benny Kauff, Art Fletcher, Heine Zimmerman and four other players, for whom McGraw figures he has no further use.

It didn’t happen, but that would have been a catastrophic deal for the Cardinals. Zimmerman’s career was over at this point as a result of gambling and game-fixing allegations that hadn’t yet blown up into a big story, Kauff was a few months away from the auto theft indictment that ended his career, and Fletcher was 35 years old. If they had traded Rogers F. Hornsby, a talented young pitcher, and a talented young outfielder for those three, it could have destroyed the organization for years and years.

In fairness, the Cardinals organization was already a trainwreck at this point, but they were only a few years away from winning five pennants in nine seasons. Also, weirdly, when the Cardinals finally did trade Rajah, it was a deal with the Giants involving Jimmy Ring.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 09:55 AM | 16 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: bad ideas, dugout, history

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   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 09:57 AM (#5903119)
A perfectly cromulent Birthday Team today, but nothing phenomenal.

C: Austin Romine (0.0 WAR)
1B: Greg Luzinski (26.3 WAR)
2B: Wayne Tolleson (2.4 WAR)
3B: Mike Benjamin (6.7 WAR)
SS: Dick Bartell (40.2 WAR)
LF: Lyman Bostock (13.1 WAR)
CF: Jay Payton (15.4 WAR)
RF: Harry Rice (15.4 WAR)

SP: Lew Burdette (28.6 WAR)
SP: Joe Nathan (26.7 WAR)
SP: Drew Pomeranz (10.8 WAR)
SP: Yusmeiro Petit (6.8 WAR)
SP: Lee Guetterman (3.4 WAR)
RP: Adam Ottavino (10.8 WAR)
RP: Cy Acosta (5.6 WAR)

Manager: George Taylor
Owner: Fred Wilpon
Part owner: Billie Jean King
Don't touch him: Kevin Rhomberg
Fun names: Charlie Hamburg, Denny Riddleberger, Pi Schwert
   2. Der-K: at 10% emotional investment Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:21 AM (#5903125)
From Jim Callis:
Mariners to sign 1B Evan White (a minor league prospect of theirs) to a 6/24m deal with 3 club options.
   3. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:35 AM (#5903131)
Wow. Makes a ton of sense for both sides, but those three club options could potentially be huge for the team down the road.

Nice to see a kid from my neck of the woods make good.
   4. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:45 AM (#5903132)
Mariners to sign 1B Evan White (a minor league prospect of theirs) to a 6/24m deal with 3 club options.

That's a lot of do re mi for a 1B who's never had a dominant hitting season in milB.
   5. Itchy Row Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:46 AM (#5903133)
Donora, PA hasn't even produced one player who's eligible for today's birthday team.
   6. Tom Nawrocki Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:49 AM (#5903134)
A perfectly cromulent Birthday Team today, but nothing phenomenal.

Just wait till December 12.
   7. Der-K: at 10% emotional investment Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:56 AM (#5903135)
4 - True! It's also (as JJ Cooper of BA is tweeting about) a lot of foregone cash if White hits what's considered a median outcome for him. (As well as life changing money whether he does or not.)

More of these deals should happen, imo - teams save money with them and the certainty for players would be worth it to many.
   8. Nasty Nate Posted: November 22, 2019 at 10:56 AM (#5903136)
That's a lot of do re mi for a 1B who's never had a dominant hitting season in milB.
That's what I thought, but I think maybe his 2019 was in a low-scoring environment so his raw stat line undersells him.
   9. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:03 AM (#5903137)
That's what I thought, but I think maybe his 2019 was in a low-scoring environment so his raw stat line undersells him.

Fangraphs gives his wRC+ as 127 in A+ (2018) and 132 in AA (2019).

He was 11th in the Texas League (min 200 PA). I'd still say good, but not Wow!. A 1B needs like a 120 wRC+ to even be average.
   10. Nasty Nate Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:06 AM (#5903140)
Yeah it would be more understandable if it was some speedy OF or MI - because even if he doesn't hit he could be useful as a bench player.

I'd never heard of this guy before now so I'm not saying it's a bad deal. But I agree it's a little odd.
   11. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:25 AM (#5903143)
Yeah it would be more understandable if it was some speedy OF or MI - because even if he doesn't hit he could be useful as a bench player.


Agree. The hitting bar is just so high for a guy who's already a 1B at age 23.
   12. Rennie's Tenet Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:29 AM (#5903145)
Today's Jeopardy answer: "Get it Gary, get it!"
   13. JJ1986 Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:33 AM (#5903147)
I'm not sure how much it matters, but isn't White supposed to be excellent defensively at 1B?
   14. salvomania Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:45 AM (#5903151)
Part owner: Billie Jean King

One of my early surprises from the back of a baseball card was looking at a mid-70s card of Giants go-to reliever Randy Moffitt and reading the little sketch anecdote: "Randy's sister is tennis star Billy Jean King."
   15. Der-K: at 10% emotional investment Posted: November 22, 2019 at 11:54 AM (#5903154)
13: Yup, some think he's the best defensive first baseman in the minors. He's also got (per mlb.com) a 60 run tool and slightly above average arm, so he could move to a corner outfield spot.
MLB has him as the #58 prospect in baseball and #2 first baseman.
   16. Der-K: at 10% emotional investment Posted: November 22, 2019 at 02:49 PM (#5903233)
The Yankees don't want to pay Ellsbury (cut yesterday; he's still owed over 26M), on the grounds that he pursued outside medical treatment without approval.

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