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Thursday, December 22, 2011

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 12-22-1911

Toledo News-Bee, December 22, 1911:

“I shall quit baseball when I feel that I have reached the zenith of my career,” says Ty Cobb. “I will not continue in the game a day after I feel myself beginning to slip back. I will not make the mistake that many players have made, of continuing until they lose the reputations they have made in their best days.
...

“It is my opinion that Cy Young is making the mistake of his career by remaining in the game…Had Cy quit in the heyday of his career his name would have been famous.”

Who knows? They may even have named an award after Young. But now we’ll never know.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 07:54 AM | 18 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, hall of fame, history

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   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 07:57 AM (#4021673)
Some big names on today's Birthday Team, though it's pretty thin after the front-line guys:
C/Manager: Connie Mack
1B: Steve Garvey
2B: Hervey McClellan
3B: Bill Boyd
SS: Johnny Bero
LF: Lonnie Smith
CF: Ken Landreaux
RF: Matty Alou

SP: Steve Carlton
SP: Tom Underwood
SP: David Nied
SP: Greg Smith
SP: Zach Britton
RP: Mike Jackson

The bane of my existence as a mid-80s Indians fan: Andy Allanson
Not that one: Gary Cooper
Definitely immoral: Trevor Enders
Bench OF/1B/RP: Jason Lane
Two cool nicknames: Pop "Dimples" Tate

Wes Obermueller is #3 in Games Started among pitchers born on December 22, but his career was so miserable that I couldn't bring myself to include him.

Looks like Bill Boyd was an excellent player, albeit in a short career in the 1870s. I know nothing about him - had never even heard of him before about ten minutes ago.
   2. Walt Davis Posted: December 22, 2011 at 09:42 AM (#4021676)
Here's a Cy Young factoid of which I was not aware ...

For his career, he surrendered 1,020 unearned runs.

That's almost exactly 1/3 of his career runs allowed. His RA is 1.25/9 higher than his ERA. I don't know how these were figured but in 1891 he gave up 110 unearned runs (in 423 IP but still ...) His ERA that year was 2.85, his RA was 5.19.

This wasn't atypical of the era -- Radbourn had a season of 112 unearned runs; in 1882 a guy named Denny Driscoll gave up 73 runs of which only 27 were earned. 1876 was a particularly good year as George Bradley gave up 151 and Jim Devlin gave up 201. But are we sure they weren't just calling everything on the ground that wasn't an out an error? :-)
   3. michaelplank has knowledgeable eyes Posted: December 22, 2011 at 11:47 AM (#4021679)
I guess Cy listened:

Final Game: October 6, 1911
   4. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 02:26 PM (#4021722)
Minor league deals:

IF Eugenio Velez and LHP RJ Swindle to the Cardinals
IF Anderson Hernandez to the Pirates
IF Hector Luna and OF Luis Montanez to the Phillies

Nats claim 3B Carlos Rivero off waivers from the Phillies
   5. JJ1986 Posted: December 22, 2011 at 02:48 PM (#4021748)
Velez went 0 for 37 last season. Is that a record for most at bats without a hit?
   6. Hack Wilson Posted: December 22, 2011 at 03:32 PM (#4021798)
The third baseman above, Bill Boyd, was better known after his baseball career as Hopalong Cassidy, and, I believe, the first baseman on the team also used the name Hopalong on occasion.
   7. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 03:49 PM (#4021824)

Velez went 0 for 37 last season. Is that a record for most at bats without a hit?


Bob Buhl went 0-70 in 1962.

Velez holds the record for a non-pitcher.
   8. Craig in MN Posted: December 22, 2011 at 04:32 PM (#4021880)
An interesting note on the Royals signing Jose Mijares. The Twins non tendered him rather than going to arbitration with him for the first time. He signed for $925,000, but I wouldn't have expected him getting that much in arbitration after such a poor year, and certainly no more than that. I presumed that the Twins non-tendered him after not finding any team willing to trade for him, even for another non-tender candidate or a bucket of balls. It's only a hundred grand or so, and apparently not worth the hassle of working out a trade or dealing with the ramifications of an in-division trade, but I think it's interesting when non-tendered players get better deal than you'd expect.
   9. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 04:47 PM (#4021902)
I think the Twins were ready to part ways with Mijares what with his weight issues and his attitude problems, and the fact he was iffy last year. LOOGYs as unproven as him just don't have much trade value especially when many teams know he's going to be non-tendered.

Any thoughts on reports the O's turned down a Braves offer of Jair Jurrjens, Martin Prado and a "pitching prospect" (I imagine not one of the big three). The O's reportedly want two of Beachy/Minor/Tehran/Delgado/Vizcaino. Jones is a nice young player, but I feel he's overrated (.319 lifetime OBA) and if you can get at least one of those pitchers and maybe some other lesser prospects, you jump on it.
   10. just plain joe Posted: December 22, 2011 at 04:49 PM (#4021906)
Bob Buhl went 0-70 in 1962.


He struck out in 36 of those at bats (I looked it up); you would think that at least one of those 34 other bleeders would have made it through the infield somehow.
   11. JJ1986 Posted: December 22, 2011 at 04:57 PM (#4021915)
Any thoughts on reports the O's turned down a Braves offer of Jair Jurrjens, Martin Prado and a "pitching prospect" (I imagine not one of the big three). The O's reportedly want two of Beachy/Minor/Tehran/Delgado/Vizcaino. Jones is a nice young player, but I feel he's overrated (.319 lifetime OBA) and if you can get at least one of those pitchers and maybe some other lesser prospects, you jump on it.


I'd certainly take the deal as Baltimore, but I'd probably try to flip both Jurrjens and Prado. They're more valuable than Jones, but I think both are overrated in their own way and Jurrjens, at least, would give you a very nice return.
   12. Craig in MN Posted: December 22, 2011 at 05:09 PM (#4021932)
I think the Twins were ready to part ways with Mijares what with his weight issues and his attitude problems, and the fact he was iffy last year. LOOGYs as unproven as him just don't have much trade value especially when many teams know he's going to be non-tendered.


I agree with all of that, but then I don't get why KC had to offer him $925K to get him to sign. Not a big deal, though.
   13. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 06:44 PM (#4022029)
Nats sign IF Mark DeRosa

Rangers release former first rounder P Kasey Kiker. I hope his middle name is not Korey.
   14. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 06:58 PM (#4022044)
Now that Kiker's kareer is kaput, I'd love to know the origin of the vague "questionable makeup" thing that's dogged him since high school.

When a high first rounder has giant honkin' red flags on his scouting report before the draft, a team invests $1.6M in him anyway, and then he fails badly, that's an interesting story. I doubt we'll ever find out, but it'd be interesting to know what exactly the Rangers knew pre-draft and if that was why he washed out.
   15. The Long Arm of Rudy Law Posted: December 22, 2011 at 07:23 PM (#4022065)
By hits, batting average, slugging average, runs, RBI, and OPS, Cobb had reached his zenith in 1911. Of course, as he obviously knew, his OPS+ would be better the next year and again in 1917.
   16. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: December 22, 2011 at 09:09 PM (#4022184)
Gio Gonzalez to the Nats for P AJ Cole, C Derek Norris, P Tom Milone and P Brad Peacock, per Keith Law.

GREAT win for the A's.
   17. Guapo Posted: December 22, 2011 at 09:22 PM (#4022199)
Ugh. Happy to get Gio, but the Nats gave up a lot. Would have been nice to keep either Cole or Peacock.
   18. esseff Posted: December 23, 2011 at 12:58 AM (#4022381)
Cards get Beltran and have to go only two years. I like. Just hope he can play some of the time in CF.

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