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Thursday, May 07, 2020

Primer Dugout (and link of the day) 5-7-2020

Some grade A snark in the New York Evening World, May 7, 1920:

The reason the Braves aren’t so bad as we thought they’d be is because we thought they’d be terribly bad.

Hughie Jennings of baseball and William Jennings Bryan of politics hold the world’s record for consecutive beatings.

The Tigers would have a better chance of winning if they were playing roulette.

On the evening of May 7, 1920, the Braves were 8-5 and the Tigers were 3-15.

Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:06 AM | 21 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: dugout, history

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   1. Jefferson Manship (Dan Lee) Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:07 AM (#5948607)
A shaky Birthday Team today. Watch Tom Zachary, then grab yourself a daiquiri.

C: Brook Fordyce (1.8 WAR)
1B: James Loney (11.3 WAR)
2B/Manager: Dick Williams (3.4 WAR)
3B: Al Cihocki (-0.8 WAR)
SS: Mickey Doolin (13.7 WAR)
LF: Conor Jackson (2.2 WAR)
CF: Keon Broxton (3.6 WAR)
RF: Gus Williams (4.7 WAR)

SP: Tom Zachary (39.8 WAR)
SP: Casey Patten (11.4 WAR)
SP: Ed Heusser (10.1 WAR)
SP: Joe Neale (-0.1 WAR)
SP: Al Papai (-0.4 WAR)
RP: Sam Dyson (5.6 WAR)
RP: Claude Raymond (3.1 WAR)

Clubhouse chaplain/emergency pitcher: Allan Travers (-0.5 WAR)
Not that one: Mark Smith (-0.1 WAR)
Professor Frink's favorite player: John Flavin (-0.5 WAR)
   2. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:26 AM (#5948614)
Watch Tom Zachary, then grab yourself a daiquiri.
Then Casey Patten while you chug a Manhattan.
   3. Tom Nawrocki Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:40 AM (#5948620)
The 1960-61 Kansas City A's had Dick Williams, Hank Bauer, Whitey Herzog, and Dick Howser, all of whom went on to win the pennant as a manager. They brought up Tony LaRussa in 1963.
   4. Mefisto Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:57 AM (#5948630)
Yesterday's team had more WAR at just one position than this entire team.
   5. Pasta-diving Jeter (jmac66) Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:58 AM (#5948632)
The all won World Series as well
   6. Itchy Row Posted: May 07, 2020 at 10:58 AM (#5948633)
Those KC A's also had Haywood Sullivan, who won a couple of pennants as an executive.
   7. The Mighty Quintana Posted: May 07, 2020 at 11:42 AM (#5948650)
The pitching of Al Papai will have you mixing a MaiTai.
   8. Itchy Row Posted: May 07, 2020 at 11:46 AM (#5948653)
Zachary and Dyson and break out the rye, son.
   9. Cooper Teenoh Posted: May 07, 2020 at 11:50 AM (#5948657)
Woke up this morning, groggily checked the notifications on my phone, and felt a wave of sadness as soon as I read that in the SF Chronicle "fans share their memories of Willie Mays". Quickly pulled up Willie in Wikipedia to see that, no, he didn't die yesterday, he had his 89th birthday. Fresh wave of relief.

That's what I get for not seeing the Birthday Team yesterday.
   10. Starring RMc as Bradley Scotchman Posted: May 07, 2020 at 12:15 PM (#5948670)
Allan Travers (-0.5 WAR)

It's not easy to pitch just one game and have a WAR that poor. Somebody named "Lewis" managed a -0.5 by pitching three innings for the Buffalo Player's League team on July 12, 1890, giving up 13 hits and 7 walks, all of whom came around to score. (Chris Saenz, he ain't.)

EDIT: "A regular slugging and fumbling match..."
   11. Mefisto Posted: May 07, 2020 at 12:20 PM (#5948674)
@9: You didn't miss it, there was no post.
   12. Itchy Row Posted: May 07, 2020 at 12:59 PM (#5948690)
Tim Harikkala pitched one game in 1995 and had a -0.6 WAR. He pitched one game the next year and lost another 0.2 WAR.

Kiké Hernández had 3.3 WAR in 145 games of playing his normal positions in 2018 but gave 0.4 of that back by pitching to four hitters.
   13. SandyRiver Posted: May 07, 2020 at 04:36 PM (#5948737)
Travers' one game, a CG, he lost 24-2 though 10 runs were unearned, holding his ERA down to 15.75. Probably most here know that was the game where Cobb led a strike and the Tigers brought in a bunch of college kids, one of whom hit 2 triples in 3 AB. Other one-gamers have topped his .667 BA but I'm not sure about the 2.000 SLG.
   14. Itchy Row Posted: May 07, 2020 at 04:53 PM (#5948740)
Charlie Lindstrom hit a triple in his only at bat in his only game to finish with a 3.000 SLG. Ed Irwin is in a six-way tie for second among one-gamers, but he's the only one in that group who doesn't have a 1.000 BA.
   15. Walt Davis Posted: May 07, 2020 at 08:32 PM (#5948764)
Sensibly they walked Lindstrom in his other PA. :-)

Three other players at at 3000, all pitchers, most recently Eric Cammack in 2000 and, with one PA, might be considered the all-time leaders. Lindstrom leads for those with 2+ PA. The great Esteban Yan is the leader for 3+ PA at 2500 with a single, HR and sac bunt. Other leaders:

4+: Keith McDonald, Jeff Bettiger 1333
5-11: Keith McDonald (he was a C with 3 HR and 2 BB in 11 PA)
12-17: Rick Short 933 (a 2B)
18-26: Joe Pietz 731 (19th c)
27: John-Ford Griffin 696 (remember him? 2 HR, 2 doubles, 1 single in 23 AB)
28-10,626: Babe Ruth 690 (Lane Thomas, a rookie last year, is at 684 in 44 PA ... he plays for the Cards of course)

Bonds (607) had 12,606 PA; Musial 559 had 12,721; Hank 555 had 13,941 (might well have been head of Musial at the same PA); Yaz 462 at 13,992 and Rose 409 at 15,890. Lord only knows when/if we'll see a player get 14,000 much less 15,000 PA again. Pujols wasn't going to make even with a full season this year and next.
   16. Adam Starblind Posted: May 07, 2020 at 09:17 PM (#5948769)
So how long before this website ceases to exist?

If it's this slow during a pandemic, there's basically nothing left. It's sad. Used to be a pretty vibrant place.
   17. Walt Davis Posted: May 08, 2020 at 12:21 AM (#5948793)
With no baseball news, there's little to react to. But the "pop culture moment" thread got 87 posts. A dugout the other day got a trivia-driven 50+. The broad pop culture thread is pushing 150. Other threads have been in the 20-40 range which is reasonably typical.

The big threads tend to be offseason anyway -- awards, HoF, trades, FA, projections.

Maybe there's a flotilla of baseball articles out there not getting linked in which case that's an issue. Maybe they could start some general discussion threads ... but these devolve into politics most of the time.

I think the site is fine. Obviously there's the risk too many will get out of the habit of checking it so it doesn't rebound even after baseball returns. But give us a credible plan to return to play and I think you'll see us discussing it. Give us the start of "spring" training and we'll get into shape too. Give us some projections, give us concrete reasons to discuss who's helped by a shortened season, give us a woeful Cubs start and you'll see chatter.

Meanwhile, in b-r virtual land, the Yanks are running away in the NLE at 26-11 and a 9-game lead over the Rays. Cleveland (26-14) have finally pulled away a bit from the White Sox (2.5 back). The A's 23-16 hold a slim lead over the Astros 21-17 and the surprising Ms 22-18. The O's are also surprising at 16-21 leaving the Rangers 11-26 as worst in the AL. In the NL, Braves 26-13 with a 4.5 lead on the Nats; Cards 25-13 with a 4.5 lead on the Reds; Dodgers 24-12 with a 5 lead on the Rox. The Cubs are a woeful 15-23 but not as woeful as the Giants 13-24 and the Pads 10-27.
"
   18. Itchy Row Posted: May 08, 2020 at 11:27 AM (#5948853)
18-26: Joe Pietz 731 (19th c)
27: John-Ford Griffin 696 (remember him? 2 HR, 2 doubles, 1 single in 23 AB)
Joe Peitz actually had 32 PA and 26 AB, so poor John-Ford Griffin (27 PA and 23 AB) is only the modern leader.

In addition to being the player with the most AB and PA with a higher SLG than Babe Ruth, he has the most AB and PA with a higher OBP than Ted Williams. And, not too surprisingly, the most AB/PA with a higher OPS than Ruth's record.

Peitz's OPS+ is lower than Ruth's. The player with the most PA and a higher OPS+ than Ruth is Slade Heathcott, who got 30 PA and 25 AB for the 2015 Yankees and had a 208 OPS+. Heathcott was released by Oakland two years ago and then hit .194 for the Sugar Land Skeeters in independent ball. He didn't play last year, so he might not get a chance to ruin his place in baseball history. 19th Century Dan O'Connor had one more AB than Heathcott (but only 27 PA) and a higher OPS+ (212), so he has the AB record.

The hitter with the most AB/PA and a higher average than Ty Cobb is, of course, Terry Forster.

Besides Peitz and one other 19th Century player (John Bass) the top 18 on the Joe Peitz SLG leaderboard is nine HOF-type hitters (Ruth, Ted Williams, Gehrig, Foxx, Bonds, Greenberg, McGwire, Manny Ramirez, and Trout) and seven guys who debuted last year.
   19. Adam Starblind Posted: May 08, 2020 at 02:11 PM (#5948919)
[17] But it's a site for baseball nerds who would be thinking about baseball no matter what's going on. There are also very few commenters. Posts stick in the "Hot Topics" sidebar unchanged for days. I'd be interested to see traffic stats. I think there's a way to do that, but I don't know what it is.

I would make a few changes, but the one I've been thinking of lately is to rebrand it around the Hall of Merit. That way it would not just be an obscure discussion board that does this thing called the Hall of Merit--it would be a site with a truly unique focus where very smart commenters produce truly superb analysis, that also links to the stories of the day.

The Hall of Merit is what sets this place apart, IMHO, so I'd make it the brand.
   20. Ziggy: social distancing since 1980 Posted: May 08, 2020 at 03:50 PM (#5948950)
Charlie Lindstrom hit a triple in his only at bat in his only game to finish with a 3.000 SLG


Now we know how Freddie got into the hall of fame. Voters thought they were voting for his son!
   21. puck Posted: May 08, 2020 at 09:18 PM (#5949006)
Dodgers 24-12 with a 5 lead on the Rox.


Rockies were flying high, playing over their heads at 18-11. But regression's a ##### and they've won 1 of 8 since.

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