Now Max Scherzer will buy all new stuff for the walls for that team.

It happens, it probably happens more than people think and with guys that you might never suspect.

And sometimes, as was the case here, with someone you fully expect.

It happens, it probably happens more than people think and with guys that you might never suspect.

A few years ago, I met up with some high school friends in Chicago, and we decided to catch a baseball game while we were in town. The options were to drive up to Milwaukee and watch Cubs/Brewers, or stay in town and go to the White Sox game. I pushed for the Sox because Sale was scheduled to pitch, but got outvoted. Turned out, that was the day Sale cut up his throwback jersey and didn't pitch as a result.

So yeah, "never suspect" might be a bit strong here.

As someone who counts Paul O'Neill among his favorite players ever, I can't be a hypocrite and knock Sale's meltdown. But I wouldn't have wept if he'd broken his foot.

“That’s who he is. He’s a redass d***.”

I’ve met Sale numerous times, and he is a super nice and down to earth guy. Obviously this outburst, as well as the jersey incident, aren’t good looks. But I’ll take a guy that treats people well but occasionally gets violent with inanimate objects any day.

No. Just no. Not acceptable. "This is just me" and "this is what makes me so good" and "I did something stupid it was just a seven-year-old temper tantrum and I'm not proud of it and I have pressure and it's your fault that you saw it because I did it where I thought it wouldn't be seen." Oh, and "they got a great new TV." He turned up with some truly awesome excuses.

Super nice and down to earth? How many times have these people who by all outward appearances are super nice and down to earth turned out to be something else in private?

The way a person behaves when they don't think they are being watched is a great measure of what they really are.

Maybe a bit too much Adderall?

As someone who counts Paul O'Neill among his favorite players ever, I can't be a hypocrite and knock Sale's meltdown. But I wouldn't have wept if he'd broken his foot.

I was always entertained and enjoyed O'Neill when I was younger...but more recently guys like Ortiz, Gardner and Amir Garret just seem tiresome and like a pain to be around. My turning point was really having to deal with John Rocker in person during his short stint in the Atlantic League. Sometimes it just seems forced, sometimes I can picture the rest of the guys in the clubhouse just sighing to themselves and saying, "here we go again..."

sometimes I can picture the rest of the guys in the clubhouse just sighing to themselves and saying, "here we go again..."

I'm sure this is true.

I wonder if O'Neill's behavior would have been tolerated on another team rather than absurdly being dubbed the Warrior by an idiot owner. (It certainly can't be the reason Piniella got rid of him, unless he hated people who behaved like him.)

Carlos Zambrano was another 'roid-raging-type.

All that said, I do think players are entitled (I hate that word,) to have some areas of privacy without 24/7 camera coverage.

I’ve met Sale numerous times, and he is a super nice and down to earth guy. Obviously this outburst, as well as the jersey incident, aren’t good looks. But I’ll take a guy that treats people well but occasionally gets violent with inanimate objects any day.

Are anger control issues really that segregated that we can be sure this will only happen to inanimate objects? You think the same temper could never lead to violence against people?

C'mon guys. Didn't you see? He's a "competitor."

As someone who counts Paul O'Neill among his favorite players ever

Did anyone ever notice O'Neill and John McEnroe were never seen in the same room together? Weird.

C'mon guys. Didn't you see? He's a "competitor."

The on field stuff bothers me less. A momentary fit of pique in the heat of competition is one thing. A lot of us have probably been there, unleashing a stream of profanity, or throwing a bat or golf club to the ground. I thought the Earl Weaver/Billy Martin vs the umpire shows were great theatre.

But if 5-15 minutes later you're still so mad you have to trash a room, I think that speaks to a deeper problem.

Are anger control issues really that segregated that we can be sure this will only happen to inanimate objects? You think the same temper could never lead to violence against people?

But if 5-15 minutes later you're still so mad you have to trash a room, I think that speaks to a deeper problem.

Indeed, tossing a solitary object is fairly benign behavior, particularly if the victim is a sleeve of plastic cups and not a MacBook Pro.

The M2 chip sounds kinda disappointing though.

Are anger control issues really that segregated that we can be sure this will only happen to inanimate objects? You think the same temper could never lead to violence against people?

Agreed, 100%. Not to mention anyone who was beaten (I don't mean spanked) as a child can often be triggered when someone nearby flies into an out-of-control rage. I know lots of incredible high achievers who get extremely frustrated; none of them resort to property damage as a way to manage it.

Attacking inanimate objects is quite similar to those who resort to hurling verbal insults at strangers with whom they disagree; people who rely on such infantile tactics are lacking something fundamental IMO and there's no telling how much further someone like that will go.

I'm a Sox fan and I hope Sale's recovery goes well. But I really can't stand that kind of extreme alpha-male typical behavior, from any athlete. They're so often the same ones who get all upset when someone hammers a 450-foot homer and enjoys it for a moment or two. If you beat me, do what you want. That behavior is a reflection on your character, my response reflects mine.

the Earl Weaver/Billy Martin vs the umpire shows were great theatre.

Exactly. They knew they were playing a part and playing to the crowd. They cycled through their go-to moves despite the appearance of "totally losing it".

In addition to his fits of rage, Sale also thrust himself into the Drake LaRoche nonsense when he was in Chicago. I still can't forgive the Red Sox for extending this ####### and then dumping Mookie.

The Sale extension is an early candidate for worst pitcher extension ever. There's time for it to turn around, of course, and for that not to be the case, but... We're now 4 years removed from his last even semi-normal season.

Destructive rage fits have been normalized among pro athletes. Every time a Bloom or a manager alibis for the perp, it becomes more entrenched.

I still can't forgive the Red Sox for extending this ####### and then dumping Mookie.

The guy who extended Sale is not the same guy who dumped Mookie. The first guy wouldn't have dumped Mookie, and the second guy wouldn't have extended Sale. I suppose you could blame ownership for not drawing the line with one of them (or both), but also maybe Mookie really just wanted out.

I suppose you could blame ownership for not drawing the line with one of them (or both),

Ownership had to sign off on the Sale extension. And Mookie's contract expiration didn't come as a surprise. So yes, I'm fine with blaming ownership.

but also maybe Mookie really just wanted out.

And if he played out his final season in Boston and left via FA, I would have no problem with him or ownership. That's not what happened.

I wonder if O'Neill's behavior would have been tolerated on another team rather than absurdly being dubbed the Warrior by an idiot owner.

Somehow I think that batting championships and a string of productive seasons would be enough for most owners to put up with a redass player like O'Neill.

(It certainly can't be the reason Piniella got rid of him, unless he hated people who behaved like him.)

Not to mention that Piniella jumped the Reds for the Mariners just six days after O'Neill was traded to the Yankees. At that point Piniella would've been more likely to be reunited with O'Neill in New York than in Seattle, given Steinbrenner's fondness for hiring retreads.

the Earl Weaver/Billy Martin vs the umpire shows were great theatre.

Billy parlayed his feuds with Steinbrenner into a famous Miller Lite commercial. Too bad that Earl couldn't have gotten a similar commercial with Ron Luciano. All Luciano ever got was a solo commercial for A&W Root Beer.

And if he played out his final season in Boston and left via FA, I would have no problem with him or ownership. That's not what happened.

This. A thousand times this.

While visiting family in the Boston area last week, when the subject of Mookie being traded came up, I was very confidently told (by someone who is probably not in any position to actually know anything) not to be surprised to see him land back with the Red Sox. No I don't get it either.

but also maybe Mookie really just wanted out.

He's done two or three interviews saying that's not the case, that he expected to be there for his entire career. It will never convince the weird subset of Red Sox fans that feel like their city's and team's culture is just so toxic that it must naturally drive everyone away (which isn't exactly entirely self-hating projection).

Mookie's pretty savvy about projecting a good image on top of being a guy folks genuinely seem to like, and he's smart enough to know that no long-term good will come of either alienating the bunch of New Englanders still wearing their Betts jerseys to Fenway or giving anyone in Los Angeles the idea that he'd rather be elsewhere, so we'll probably never really know until he's long retired, but I can't see any reason not to take him at his word even if he doesn't mope about having to move to Southern California the way that weirdo Freeman does.

when the subject of Mookie being traded came up, I was very confidently told (by someone who is probably not in any position to actually know anything) not to be surprised to see him land back with the Red Sox. No I don't get it either.

I mean, sure, if he's still hitting when that contract runs out, I could see him coming back to spend a few years DHing in Boston, but until then, that's not exactly the direction big/unwieldy contracts go in this relationship.

I also wouldn't be shocked to see him doing team ambassador/media stuff with the Red Sox if he's got any interest - Fred Lynn still hangs out in the Legends Suite a few times a year (why not let the team fly you out and have folks say how much they love you for a few days?), and the fans still go absolutely nuts for Nomar. Roger Clemens has made occasional experiences in the past few years, and it's hard to imagine anyone leaving on worse terms than he did. But that's kind of the extent to which I'd expect to see Mookie back in Boston barring some truly bizarre circumstances.

The Mookie saga will probably never be fully untangled. If the Red Sox had the chance to sign him to the extension he eventually signed then they're morons for letting him go. (Well, they're morons for letting him go period but doubly so.) But that extension was signed as MLB was returning mid-covid 2020, there's a very good chance Mookie doesn't take that offer under normal circumstances. But being offered 12/$365 when there are no fans in the stands and nobody knows for sure when they're coming back or what future MLB revenues will be like, he'd have been a fool to turn it down no matter how much of it is deferred.

But where the Red Sox really messed up was in not giving him a big extension much earlier. It's obviously harder to extend a player who's already got about $60 M in earnings. 20/20 hindsight and all but Red Sox Nation would be a happier crew if they'd given Mookie Wander Franco's deal 6 years ago. Still, you could say the same about Correa and lots of other young stars that teams weren't able to get wrapped up.

I mean, sure, if he's still hitting when that contract runs out, I could see him coming back to spend a few years DHing in Boston, but until then, that's not exactly the direction big/unwieldy contracts go in this relationship.

Just in case you aren't being facetious about the when, and to clarify: the confident not-quite-prediction I was given was that he will be back in the relatively near term. Like a year or two.

If he'd meant a brief final farewell tour in Boston before retiring, I wouldn't have been internally rolling my eyes so hard.

I figured as much, but that's weirdly refreshing. Most of the lunatic Betts stuff is insane in the other direction.

(Although that's mostly the loud, talk-radio types. In the stands, I suspect you still see more Betts gear than any player currently on the Sox. Maybe Xander is close.)

Just out of curiosity - how, exactly, did they figure Betts would wind up back in Boston? Who do the Dodgers trade him for, or is it some crazy three-way deal?

Just out of curiosity - how, exactly, did they figure Betts would wind up back in Boston? Who do the Dodgers trade him for, or is it some crazy three-way deal?

They didn't even know any details to put flesh on it so I didn't bother digging. Was seemingly purely a wild rumor mill thing.

I'd of course be very happy to be entirely wrong and admit his soothsaying inside-info expertise if it somehow comes to pass, but I ain't holding my breath.

I have a feeling Mookie might had snared this Joey Gallo "triple".

Chris Sale is an irredeemable dumbfuck. It's part of why he's good at baseball.