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Friday, May 26, 2023

Red Sox were very close to signing Jose Abreu last Nov., but dodged a bullet

Late last November, according to an industry source, chief baseball officer Chaim Bloom went to sleep believing the Red Sox had an agreement in principle with Abreu, with only some minor contractual matters to be completed. But when Bloom awoke, he was greeted with the news that Abreu had spurned the Sox and signed a three-year, $58.5 million deal with the Astros. Bloom was informed that the Red Sox would not have the option of revising his offer and the deal was done.

At the time, it seemed like a poor start to the offseason. Now, it seems like the Red Sox got lucky. Abreu has been horrendous with the Astros, with a slash line of .222/.280/259. Incredibly, he did not have a single homer in his first 45 games.

Eventually, the Sox pivoted and signed Justin Turner as their DH - at far less money and a shorter commitment. Turner is slashing .263/.361/.400 with five homers and 18 RBI.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: May 26, 2023 at 04:09 PM | 38 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
Tags: jose abreu, red sox

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1. Darren

Posted: May 26, 2023 at 05:41 PM (#6130270)

The article indicates that they were pursuing him to DH but my guess (only a guess) is that they were hoping to or had something lined up to trade Triston Casas for pitching. I recall (I think?) that there were some rumors of him going to the Marlins, presumably for Lopez.

2. Walt Davis Posted: May 27, 2023 at 03:55 PM (#6130395)

At the right price (not the one he got but then it's not my money), I'd have been happy to see him in a Cubs uniform. There are probably at least 15 teams that dodged a bullet on this one and, given the contract he got, presumably a lot of teams were intreested and drove up the price. He seemed like a great 2-year, not huge money get.

3. Astroenteritis Posted: May 29, 2023 at 02:12 PM (#6130569)

I was very pleased with this signing, and thought surely Abreu would provide an offensive upgrade over Yuli, but man, has that proven to be not the case. Great example of "you never know". Though there were certainly some troubling indicators with Abreu last year, it would have been hard to forecast such a horrible drop off. The Astros would be getting more production if they just played J.J. Matijevic at first base.

4. Astroenteritis Posted: May 29, 2023 at 02:13 PM (#6130570)

In fact, could this be a contender for one of the worst free agent signings in history?

5. Tony S Posted: May 29, 2023 at 02:30 PM (#6130578)

It's been a bad signing, but the two-year term contains the damage. I'd say Albert Pujols with the Angels was worse, given the length of the contract. Bruce Sutter with the Braves in 1985. Wayne Garland with the Indians in the early days of free agency -- 10 years for a pitcher!

For the Astros, I'd nominate Greg Swindell in 1992. Omar Moreno in 1982 is a candidate too, but the team was able to unload him quickly for Jerry Mumphrey, who was at least adequate.

6. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 29, 2023 at 02:58 PM (#6130581)

Teixeira was a bad signing. The Yankees have had lots of bad signings.

Sale was a bad signing, and then it wasn't.

7. Misirlou cut his hair and moved to Rome Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:02 PM (#6130583)

Sale was a bad signing, and then it wasn't.

I think you have that backwards.

8. Tony S Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:06 PM (#6130584)

There's also a distinction to be made between "boneheaded signings" and "reasonable signings that worked out badly".

9. Misirlou cut his hair and moved to Rome Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:08 PM (#6130585)

I'd say Albert Pujols with the Angels was worse, given the length of the contract.

Was Pujols or Josh Hamilton worse for the Angels? Hamilton $107.5 mil, 2.7 WAR. Pujols $240 mil, 12.8 WAR.

10. cardsfanboy

Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:20 PM (#6130587)

Was Pujols or Josh Hamilton worse for the Angels? Hamilton $107.5 mil, 2.7 WAR. Pujols $240 mil, 12.8 WAR.

Gary Matthews Jr always gets my vote, It was a decade before Hamilton, but 5 years 50 mil

11. Tony S Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:24 PM (#6130588)

Have the Angels had any GOOD free agent acquisitions? I'm sure they must have had a couple.

Reggie gave them one good year. Rudi was OK when healthy. Mark Langston.

Bobby Grich worked out well.

12. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:43 PM (#6130589)

I think you have that backwards.

He's turned around the past month. He's back to his old self. His injuries last year were freakish things that had nothing to do with his elbow or shoulder, so I expected he had a chance to regain his form, and he has. His last 5 starts have been really good: 32.1 IP, 35K/4BB.

13. Misirlou cut his hair and moved to Rome Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:49 PM (#6130590)

You're right. I was just looking at his Red Sox tenure, and his first 2 years were excellent. But he didn't come over as a FA but through trade. So those don't count for free agent contract determination.

14. Astroenteritis Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:49 PM (#6130591)

There's also a distinction to be made between "boneheaded signings" and "reasonable signings that worked out badly".

I was definitely putting it in the latter category. In terms of production, it may turn out to be one of the worst, but nothing like some of the hideous long-term signings mentioned above.

15. Dillon Gee Escape Plan Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:50 PM (#6130592)

Have the Angels had any GOOD free agent acquisitions? I'm sure they must have had a couple.

Reggie gave them one good year. Rudi was OK when healthy. Mark Langston.

Bobby Grich worked out well.

Torii Hunter? .286/.352/.462 (122 OPS+) and 20.7 WAR in five years ($90M)

16. McCoy Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:58 PM (#6130593)

Rod Carew

17. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 29, 2023 at 03:58 PM (#6130594)

But he didn't come over as a FA but through trade. So those don't count for free agent contract determination.

True, but they extended him for 5 years, which could have been money spent on an FA or 2.

18. Misirlou cut his hair and moved to Rome Posted: May 29, 2023 at 04:05 PM (#6130597)

No, what I mean is, I thought those first 2 years were his first 2 years after signing a FA contract. Thus, it was a good signing, then it wasn't. I think extensions do count, and if they do, Miguel Cabrera has to be among the worst, both in results and boneheadedness.

19. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 29, 2023 at 04:07 PM (#6130598)

Oh. Well, I think the period after his extension was just bad luck, more than a bad signing. It's not like his talent disappeared, like Teixeira's.

edit...and the trade for him turned out to be great for the Red Sox. Moncada was the guy I didn't like them giving up, but he's been mediocre, and Kopeck hasn't done anything spectacular yet, so, they made a good deal.

20. Walt Davis Posted: May 29, 2023 at 04:39 PM (#6130604)

Man, how quickly they forget Prince Fielder and Ryan Howard (extension).

Teixeira wasn't even close to a bad contract. 19 WAR, 5 very good seasons out of 8. He came in averaging 5 wAR a year and started out with 5.3, 4.1, 3.4 and 3.8. Then he missed a season due to injury, struggled when he came back then put up a 3 WAR season. At age 36, he was a very bad player, about as surprising as rain in the spring.

21. Walt Davis Posted: May 29, 2023 at 04:57 PM (#6130605)

FWIW ... agree that there's a distinction between a "bad" signing (which is about total money and production) and a "dumb" signing (what were they thinking?). La creme de la creme (or rather, the reverse so the scummiest of whatever scum is left at the bottom of a vat of cream) are those that are both. So when the Cubs signed Aaron Miles for 2/$5 (or whatever it was) that was dumb as rocks but it didn't matter. When you sign, say, Prince Fielder for 9/$214, that is at best unwise then it worked out even worse (mostly for the Rangers).

22. ReggieThomasLives Posted: May 29, 2023 at 05:13 PM (#6130609)

This is shocking, I thought that Houston would have the best stealth PED program.

23. My name is Votto, and I love to get Moppo Posted: May 29, 2023 at 10:38 PM (#6130680)

Glad Guerrero was a FA signing that worked out for the Angels, he won MVP in year one and got votes in every season except his last.

24. Froot Loops Posted: May 29, 2023 at 10:53 PM (#6130692)

The Angels got Rod Carew in a trade.

25. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: May 29, 2023 at 11:08 PM (#6130695)

The Angels paid Anthony Rendon $90 million for 3.1 WAR coming into this year. And they’re on the hook for this year and three more at $38.5 million per.

26. Shredder Posted: May 30, 2023 at 12:31 AM (#6130702)

Have the Angels had any GOOD free agent acquisitions? I'm sure they must have had a couple.

Vlad and Hunter have already been mentioned. Bartolo Colon won a Cy Young. Everybody remembers him as a bust, but believe it or not, Mo Vaughn actually gave them two OK seasons (69 homers in his first two seasons), and brought back Kevin Appier, who helped them win the WS. Kelvim Escobar was pretty good in his time in Anaheim. Orlando Cabrera had a nice little run. Don Baylor was pretty good, and their only MVP until Vlad. They haven't all been misses, but the misses have been BIG.

27. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: May 30, 2023 at 12:52 AM (#6130703)

Dec 12th 2000, Mike Hampton, Rockies. This always has to be in the top 5 worst FA signings ever.

28. McCoy Posted: May 30, 2023 at 07:44 AM (#6130714)

Nah, Denny Neagle.

They could at least trade Hampton away

29. SoSH U at work Posted: May 30, 2023 at 08:07 AM (#6130716)

Vlad and Hunter have already been mentioned. Bartolo Colon won a Cy Young. Everybody remembers him as a bust, but believe it or not, Mo Vaughn actually gave them two OK seasons (69 homers in his first two seasons), and brought back Kevin Appier, who helped them win the WS. Kelvim Escobar was pretty good in his time in Anaheim. Orlando Cabrera had a nice little run. Don Baylor was pretty good, and their only MVP until Vlad. They haven't all been misses, but the misses have been BIG.

And their absolute best is still their first foray into the FA pool (Grich).

30. Tony S Posted: May 30, 2023 at 09:00 AM (#6130721)

Vince Coleman with the Mets. A dumb idea that exploded in their faces.

31. villageidiom Posted: May 30, 2023 at 09:45 AM (#6130724)

In fact, could this be a contender for one of the worst free agent signings in history?

I feel like, in the last 20 years, Boston has made at least three worse free agent signings. They signed two 3B free agents in the same offseason, and neither worked out well.

32. Darren

Posted: May 30, 2023 at 10:28 AM (#6130728)

Was Pujols or Josh Hamilton worse for the Angels? Hamilton $107.5 mil, 2.7 WAR. Pujols $240 mil, 12.8 WAR.

I think this one is interesting because you can look at it a few different ways.

--$/WAR: Hamilton $40M/WAR, Pujols $19M/WAR
--Total wasted money. A little more complicated. Assuming ~$7M/WAR at the time (?): Hamilton -$89M, Pujols -$150M.

33. Darren

Posted: May 30, 2023 at 10:29 AM (#6130729)

Sale was a bad signing, and then it wasn't.

Still pretty bad overall though.

34. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 30, 2023 at 11:21 AM (#6130738)

How do you think Craig Kimbrel felt when they brought Sale in to close out the WS is 2018, with a 5-1 lead?

(I know Kimbrel pitched all previous 4 games, but still, it shows what the team thought of Sale, and of Kimbrel.)

35. Steve Balboni's Personal Trainer Posted: May 30, 2023 at 12:44 PM (#6130756)

One of the all-time worst FA signings, where I was genuinely like, "Why is my team doing something so obviously stupid?", was the Pablo Sandoval 5/$90m deal. He had gotten worse each year between age 24 and 27 with the Giants, was stunningly out of shape, was a barely above-average hitter when they gave him the money, and then was a total disaster from the word go in Boston.

I'm not saying everybody has to be in the condition of an Olympian, but from the first week he took the field with Boston, the fan base was like, "Pablo, can you at least try?" Then there was the moment he took a big swing, missed, and his belt broke. Awesome.

36. SoSH U at work Posted: May 30, 2023 at 01:16 PM (#6130768)

How do you think Craig Kimbrel felt when they brought Sale in to close out the WS is 2018, with a 5-1 lead?

If he was like any Red Sox fan at the time, thoroughly relieved.

That was the absolute most nerve-wracking 7 for 7 in postseason save chances any pitcher ever managed.

37. Froot Loops Posted: May 30, 2023 at 02:00 PM (#6130780)

Andruw Jones with the Dodgers was horrible. After he put up a 35 OPS+ (!) in year one, the Dodgers released him halfway through a 2-year, $36.2 million deal.

38. Captain Joe Bivens, Pointless and Wonderful Posted: May 30, 2023 at 04:02 PM (#6130799)

That was the absolute most nerve-wracking 7 for 7 in postseason save chances any pitcher ever managed.

A 5-1 lead! And they brought in Sale? Why not Brasier? Or any other reliever? Because Sale was money, and he still is. His body type is closer to Randy Johnson's than of Pedro's, so there's reason to believe he won't wear down that quickly. He's got a lot of quality innings left in that arm.

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Red Sox were very close to signing Jose Abreu last Nov., but dodged a bullet

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