Baseball for the Thinking Fan

Login | Register | Feedback

btf_logo
You are here > Home > Baseball Newsstand > Discussion
Baseball Primer Newsblog
— The Best News Links from the Baseball Newsstand

Monday, March 22, 2021

The Athletic: Communication failures, poor decisions and messy breakups: How it all went wrong for the Colorado Rockies [$]

Sub required, but very in-depth look at the Rockies front office.

“They are one of the weirdest front offices to deal with,” a rival executive said. “(We’re) never really close to being on the same page on any concept we talk about. My feeling is they’re very insular.”

The Rockies’ signing of Desmond was an example of the team’s erratic process. Bridich took an inclusive approach with his analytics department, asking its members to rank the available free-agent first basemen. The first base group that offseason included Mark Trumbo, Mitch Moreland, Mike Napoli, Trevor Plouffe and Chris Carter. The Rockies’ analysts ranked Desmond, who had never played first base in his previous eight professional seasons, near the bottom. But Bridich signed him for more money than the combined total all of the other players on the list received, in part because he believed Desmond’s strong character would make him a good fit for the club….

The offseason after the Desmond signing, a member of the analytics department wrote a memo saying mid-level relievers were the worst investments on the free-agent market, a commonly held sentiment in today’s game. The memo said the best bullpens were built on established elite relievers and younger pitchers. Approximately two months later, the Rockies signed two mid-level relievers, Shaw and McGee, for a combined $54 million. They then added Davis, an established elite reliever, in a move that also flopped.

Bridich oversaw the building of the Rockies’ research and development group, but during his tenure the team’s attention to analytics has been halting, frequently behind that of other clubs. Several players in recent seasons privately have expressed concern about the lack of analytics information from the front office to the clubhouse. Some of those players cited a lack of available resources to help them improve, especially in their efforts to overcome Coors Field’s disadvantages.

RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 22, 2021 at 11:42 AM | 81 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: rockies

Reader Comments and Retorts

Go to end of page

Statements posted here are those of our readers and do not represent the BaseballThinkFactory. Names are provided by the poster and are not verified. We ask that posters follow our submission policy. Please report any inappropriate comments.

   1. puck Posted: March 22, 2021 at 02:56 PM (#6009602)
The use of front-office staffers as “clubbies,” part of the organization-wide effort to maximize an operation team officials already consider lean by major-league standards, lasted for the 30 home games during the 2020 regular season. Members of the analytics and player-development staffs might work their normal jobs from 9 a.m. to 3 p.m., then assist in the clubhouse from 3 p.m. to 2 a.m.

“I’d be holding a pile of dirty jerseys and a coach would come up to me, ‘Can I get this data for this pitcher?’ (or) something like that,” one former member of the baseball operations department said. “I’d be just like, ‘I can’t do that right now.’”


Sounds like they were more valuable for doing laundry since no one used their analyses.
   2. Walt Davis Posted: March 22, 2021 at 04:18 PM (#6009615)
#1: That's hilarious. I wonder if they're charging for the sodas.

But just how "elite" does an "elite reliever" need to be? In his 4 seasons prior to signing with the Rox, Bryan Shaw had 284 IP and a 141 ERA+. His peripherals weren't quite as good but as a GB specialist he wasn't exactly a typical reliever. (Wow, an incredible 18 GDP in 77 IP in 2017 -- he turned the average hitter into Albert Pujols! :-)

McGee was even better in fewer innings.

Anyway, for 2014-17, at least 200 GR, Shaw was tied for the 31st best ERA+ and was 26th in WAR. McGee was tied for 28th in ERA+ and was tied for 20th in WAR despite just 212 IP. Looks awfully elite to me, unless by "elite" we mean top 15 and by "relievers" we mean one. That's not a lesson in "don't invest in mid-level relievers", that's a lesson in "don't invest in relievers."

By the way, Wade Davis was #1 in ERA+ and tied for #1 in WAR over those 4 years. Andrew Miller and Zach Britton were the other two guys at the very top. Established elite relievers. In the 3 "years" since:

Davis 111 IP, 76 ERA+, -1 WAR
Miller 102 IP, 103 ERA+, 0 WAR
Britton 121 IP, 191 ERA+, 3.6 WAR (with an ERA 1.4 runs better than his FIP so just 1.5 fWAR)
   3. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 22, 2021 at 04:25 PM (#6009617)
It is also funny that the Dodgers scooped McGee up, told him to throw nothing but fastballs, and he immediately posts a 2.66 ERA with 14.6 K/9
   4. SoSH U at work Posted: March 22, 2021 at 04:27 PM (#6009618)
Members of the analytics and player-development staffs might work their normal jobs from 9 a.m. to 3 p.m., then assist in the clubhouse from 3 p.m. to 2 a.m.


That's quite the workday.
   5. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 22, 2021 at 04:58 PM (#6009621)

In more than six years running the team, the Rockies GM has committed more than $300 million in salary to 19 free agents on major-league deals. Those 19 free agents have collectively accounted for -3.4 wins above replacement while with the Rockies, according to FanGraphs.


Yikes. How do you keep your job?
   6. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 22, 2021 at 05:40 PM (#6009628)
But just how "elite" does an "elite reliever" need to be?

Mariano Rivera. Paying anyone else big bucks on a multi-year deal pretty much always turns out bad.

   7. we all water; we all 57i66135 Posted: March 22, 2021 at 06:22 PM (#6009630)
Yikes. How do you keep your job?
he puts both knees down to honor jesus
   8. Walt Davis Posted: March 22, 2021 at 07:25 PM (#6009634)
It is also funny that the Dodgers scooped McGee up, told him to throw nothing but fastballs, and he immediately posts a 2.66 ERA with 14.6 K/9

But only got 2/$5 this offseason from the Giants.
   9. Walt Davis Posted: March 22, 2021 at 07:44 PM (#6009638)
Yikes. How do you keep your job?

"We" (I forget who was involved) looked at that track record about a year ago. If memory serves, they actually did OK on the small deals of 1-2 years for little money (which may or may not be included in that $300 M) -- not great but OK. They were decimated on any deal approaching real money and, in fairness, 30-40% of that was those 3 reliever deals and another 20+% was the Desmond deal. I can't remember if we included stuff like Blackmon's extension. The Marquez extension has worked out very well so far. The Arenado extension has turned into a flop even if Arenado ends up not being a flop.

By the way, that Arenado trade includes a provision I don't think I've ever seen before. Per Cots, the Cards agreed to extend the contract with $15 M in 2027 ... and the Rox pay that $15 M. This essentially is a payment from the trading team to a player to accept the deal, and not a small one. The Rox do get to defer $20 M of $35 M in 2021 (the Cards pay nothing in 2021) which saves them a bit in NPV but nowhere near enough to offset the extra $15 M they have to pay in 2027.
   10. Walt Davis Posted: March 22, 2021 at 07:50 PM (#6009641)
Yikes. How do you keep your job?

"We" (I forget who was involved) looked at that track record about a year ago. If memory serves, they actually did OK on the small deals of 1-2 years for little money (which may or may not be included in that $300 M) -- not great but OK. They were decimated on any deal approaching real money and, in fairness, 30-40% of that was those 3 reliever deals and another 20+% was the Desmond deal. I can't remember if we included stuff like Blackmon's extension. The Marquez extension has worked out very well so far. The Arenado extension has turned into a flop even if Arenado ends up not being a flop.

By the way, that Arenado trade includes a provision I don't think I've ever seen before. Per Cots, the Cards agreed to extend the contract with $15 M in 2027 ... and the Rox pay that $15 M. So the Cards agree to give him an extra year at $15 M ... as long as the Rox pay for it. This essentially is a payment from the trading team to a player to accept the deal, and not a small one. The Rox do get to defer $20 M of $35 M in 2021 (the Cards pay nothing in 2021) which saves them a bit in NPV but nowhere near enough to offset the extra $15 M they have to pay in 2027.

Note, that the receiving team might have to agree to an extra year to get a player to waive a NTC isn't unheard of (not that I know any examples off the top of my head) but this is the trading team having to pay Arendado (not the Cards) extra to go away. I suppose there might be cases where the receiving team agrees to the extra year while the trading team eats more of the original guaranteed salary such that it works out the same but isn't labeled that way.
   11. puck Posted: March 22, 2021 at 08:13 PM (#6009646)
If memory serves, they actually did OK on the small deals of 1-2 years for little money (which may or may not be included in that $300 M) -- not great but OK.


I've posted a list like what's in the article a couple times. There were a couple non-negative WAR deals like Mark Reynolds and Nick Hundley. Bridich made a good trade for German Marquez (traded Corey Dickerson). McGee came over in that trade as well and was up and down before signing an expensive extension and being bad. But it's not nearly enough to balance the ledger.

So yeah: Yikes. How do you keep your job?

He's a brain surgeon. We can just sit back and admire him.
   12. puck Posted: March 22, 2021 at 09:14 PM (#6009651)
Does it hurt Nick Groke's relationship to the team to write these types of stories? He's the Rockies beat writer for the Athletic. He's been pretty critical--how can you not be with that track record. Though I don't think I've seen this sort of thing about of the mlb.com guy. Not sure about the Denver Post as I rarely read it.
   13. rr: cosmopolitan elite Posted: March 22, 2021 at 09:24 PM (#6009653)
The excerpt in #1 sounds like something out of a baseball comedy flick.
   14. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: March 22, 2021 at 09:37 PM (#6009655)
Yikes. How do you keep your job?
Interpolation.
   15. Howie Menckel Posted: March 22, 2021 at 10:02 PM (#6009658)
Does it hurt Nick Groke's relationship to the team to write these types of stories?

12 raises a good question.

this type of story often actually HELPS your relationship with competent insiders (if they have any) and also likely some up-and-coming players who are paying attention.

it doesn't look to me like a "hatchet job" of the sort that makes things complicated. I mean, I don't give a rat's ass about the Rockies, but the GM's contract decision-making is objectively terrible.

sometimes a front office gets mixed results, and for whatever reason a beat guy focuses heavily on the negative or on the positive instead of mainly analyzing what worked and what didn't overall. I didn't RTFA, but it sounds like some small 'victories' are included - which is only fair.

writers who:
a) worry about whether their stories will hurt their relationship to the team and/or;
b) are unable to write critically about people and yet still maintain a professional relationship with them

well, those are core elements of the gig. it probably sounds difficult, but almost any job worth doing entails a skillset that many don't have.

I got my oil changed the other day, and had the windshield wipers replaced, too. the guy sliced through the wiper packaging and then installed them in roughly dozens of seconds. I told him that if you gave me an entire hour, a full set of tools, a series of written instructions, and access to how-to videos showing the proper way to install them - honestly, I still couldn't do it in 60 minutes. It's beyond my capabilities, basically.

I have no idea who Groke is, but The Athletic's hiring prowess in general - well, it beats the hell out of what the Rockies do. I imagine he'll be just fine.
   16. puck Posted: March 22, 2021 at 11:23 PM (#6009663)
Thanks, Howie. I think Groke's doing a good job, it's not like he's a columnist doing a hatchet job. He used to be with the Denver Post, worked his way up. I remember when he was covering the Rapids (the MLS club) for the Post.
   17. Howie Menckel Posted: March 23, 2021 at 12:05 AM (#6009667)
it's not like he's a columnist doing a hatchet job.

Jeff Van Gundy was a delight in many ways as Knicks coach, and he was fascinated by media coverage.

he got to know many of the omnibus sports columnists in the region, and he once went into a monologue after one of them questioned some coaching tactic from the previous playoff game.

his premise was that he was very envious of the columnists - because one day they are offering critical analysis of a coach in one sport, another day in the next, and so on. he said that while he knows basketball, that's about it. hence the feigned envy.

that may sound douche-y, but it was hilarious. I mean, straight talk is endemic to the region, I suppose. the columnists have to "go hard with a 'take'" even before that was the language for it, even though they may not have been to a game of that team in a month and they can't possibly watch all of the games in multiple sports (literally impossible in that era).

so JVG was more bemused by the situation than anything else. he knew what their role was - and while he couldn't resist a little needling, he answered the questions at hand.
   18. Jobu is silent on the changeup Posted: March 23, 2021 at 07:13 AM (#6009677)
Bravo #14!
   19. RoyalsRetro (AG#1F) Posted: March 23, 2021 at 04:25 PM (#6009747)
   20. Russ Posted: March 24, 2021 at 09:51 AM (#6009826)

the guy sliced through the wiper packaging and then installed them in roughly dozens of seconds. I told him that if you gave me an entire hour, a full set of tools, a series of written instructions, and access to how-to videos showing the proper way to install them - honestly, I still couldn't do it in 60 minutes. It's beyond my capabilities, basically.


Thank you. I felt like such a loser when I asked them to the same thing (change the wipers with the oil), but you are right that it's crazy how much faster they do it (I've done it before and it wasn't an hour, but it was pretty close), not to mention the stress about whether they would go flying off during a storm while my wife was driving.
   21. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 24, 2021 at 09:54 AM (#6009828)
Thank you. I felt like such a loser when I asked them to the same thing (change the wipers with the oil), but you are right that it's crazy how much faster they do it (I've done it before and it wasn't an hour, but it was pretty close), not to mention the stress about whether they would go flying off during a storm while my wife was driving.

Are you guys trying to slide out the actual blades? If you buy the blades on the replacement arms, they pop in and out in 30 seconds. It costs a little more, but well worth it.
   22. SoSH U at work Posted: March 24, 2021 at 10:26 AM (#6009831)
the guy sliced through the wiper packaging and then installed them in roughly dozens of seconds. I told him that if you gave me an entire hour, a full set of tools, a series of written instructions, and access to how-to videos showing the proper way to install them - honestly, I still couldn't do it in 60 minutes. It's beyond my capabilities, basically.


This makes your fondness for mandatory gas pumping a little more understandable.

   23. Tom Nawrocki Posted: March 24, 2021 at 10:57 AM (#6009841)
It's easy to forget that this was a pretty good team not so long ago; they won 87 and 91 games in 2017-18 and were in the postseason both years. Bridich has his strengths, which are mostly contained within the farm system. Even during the disasters of the past couple of years, they have always had several good young homegrown starting pitchers, as well as a couple of All-Star-type position players.

He combines that with a Harvard man's exaggerated sense of his own brilliance, with several traits that have just killed the team:
1) A fetish for 30-plus mediocrities in the free agent department, with Ian Desmond as Exhibit A but also including wheel-spinning acquisitions like Daniel Murphy and Gerardo Parra
2) An obsession with spending a lot of money on middle relievers in an attempt to re-create the 2015 Royals
3) An inability to judge the talent at hand, exacerbated by the distortions of Coors Field

Given that, the Rockies' chances for success are all over with now, of course, with the disposal of their best player and two teams in their division who are very aggressive about being excellent. The quality of the rotation means they will probably be better than most people expect, but for this team, a successful season means approaching .500, rather than actually being contenders.

It's also disconcerting to see pitchers like Jake McGee stink for the Rockies but go on to be useful for other teams. Bud Black is supposed to know how to get the most from his pitchers, and if he's not capable of that any more, it's probably time for him to go too. But Bridich clearly needs to be fired for this team to ever be good again.

A few weeks ago I was driving on a highway in a snowstorm when one of my windshield wipers just popped loose. Never had that happen before. I slowly made my way to a gas station, where I worked on the wiper for about ten minutes before getting it back in place. You learn to do what you have to do.
   24. Howie Menckel Posted: March 24, 2021 at 11:24 AM (#6009845)
This makes your fondness for mandatory gas pumping a little more understandable.

ha

I have pumped my own gas successfully a number of times.
I do find it mildly inconvenient and much prefer having someone else do it, however.
:)
   25. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 24, 2021 at 11:34 AM (#6009848)
Are you guys trying to slide out the actual blades? If you buy the blades on the replacement arms, they pop in and out in 30 seconds. It costs a little more, but well worth it.


Yeah, you'd have to be seriously incompetent -- like, can't-tie-my-own-shoelaces incompetent -- to find this any sort of challenge.

Apparently, we've got at least a couple of people here who have to stick to loafers or sandals or go barefoot.

Or wear Crocs. Which is code for "Jesus, please kill me already."
   26. Harmon "Thread Killer" Microbrew Posted: March 24, 2021 at 12:20 PM (#6009861)
Yeah, you'd have to be seriously incompetent -- like, can't-tie-my-own-shoelaces incompetent -- to find this any sort of challenge.


I know how you feel but, as I get older, I have softened on this notion and, thus, try to avoid judgmental terms. There are things that I can do without thinking that blow some people's minds and, alternately, there are things that I consistently struggle with while others can do easily. Ain't none of us prefect . . .
   27. cHiEf iMpaCt oFfiCEr JE Posted: March 24, 2021 at 12:45 PM (#6009866)
The Rockies’ signing of Desmond was an example of the team’s erratic process. Bridich took an inclusive approach with his analytics department, asking its members to rank the available free-agent first basemen. The first base group that offseason included Mark Trumbo, Mitch Moreland, Mike Napoli, Trevor Plouffe and Chris Carter. The Rockies’ analysts ranked Desmond, who had never played first base in his previous eight professional seasons, near the bottom. But Bridich signed him for more money than the combined total all of the other players on the list received, in part because he believed Desmond’s strong character would make him a good fit for the club….
This passage is more damning than a dozen Plaschke columns.
   28. The Gary DiSarcina Fan Club (JAHV) Posted: March 24, 2021 at 04:13 PM (#6009909)
Or wear Crocs. Which is code for "Jesus, please kill me already."


I don't understand why there is an issue with Crocs. My Crocs are very comfortable, and they're lightweight and dry quickly, which makes them great to bring on backpacking trips to cross streams and to relax in at the end of the day. If it's the aesthetic or has anything to do with what's "cool," well, I'm a 38-year-old father of three who is interested in baseball analytics, Star Wars, and Dungeons and Dragons. That particular horse left the barn long ago. Practically speaking, Crocs are great. I'm just as baffled at the seemingly widespread disdain for cargo shorts.

All that said, I am mechanically incompetent in most ways and even I have no issues with installing wiper blades.
   29. Howie Menckel Posted: March 24, 2021 at 06:13 PM (#6009924)
you'd have to be seriously incompetent -- like, can't-tie-my-own-shoelaces incompetent -- to find this any sort of challenge.

as it happens, I was in first grade and still couldn't - wait for it - tie my own shoelaces.

then my oldest brother - who was in high school by then - thought it over and wondered a left-hander (to be more specific, THIS left-hander) needed to be taught from a different vantage point. problem (soon) solved! both parents and all of my siblings were right-handed.

I have never bought or even considered Crocs.

but if I did, I'd wear them regardless of potential scorn on the internet. can't please everybody, after all.
   30. Crispix Attacksel Rios Posted: March 24, 2021 at 09:19 PM (#6009934)
It's easy to forget that this was a pretty good team not so long ago; they won 87 and 91 games in 2017-18 and were in the postseason both years. Bridich has his strengths, which are mostly contained within the farm system. Even during the disasters of the past couple of years, they have always had several good young homegrown starting pitchers, as well as a couple of All-Star-type position players.


This is just it. They're like the A's or the Rays. Every year a new incredibly good player appears out of nowhere. Except that unlike the A's and the Rays, they aren't doing it on the cheap - they keep some of their homegrown players for big salaries. And to top it all off, they hand out $50 million every off-season to the worst veterans available. Must be maddening to imagine what would happen if they just didn't do that last part!
   31. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 24, 2021 at 09:57 PM (#6009940)
I don't understand why there is an issue with Crocs. My Crocs are very comfortable, and they're lightweight and dry quickly, which makes them great to bring on backpacking trips to cross streams and to relax in at the end of the day. If it's the aesthetic or has anything to do with what's "cool," well, I'm a 38-year-old father of three who is interested in baseball analytics, Star Wars, and Dungeons and Dragons. That particular horse left the barn long ago. Practically speaking, Crocs are great. I'm just as baffled at the seemingly widespread disdain for cargo shorts.

There fine for that use, or working in the garden. Wearing out to dinner is like wearing sweats.
   32. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:13 AM (#6009950)
I'm a 38-year-old father of three who is interested in baseball analytics, Star Wars, and Dungeons and Dragons.


So the legend is true, one of you actually found a mate and procreated. There is hope for others like you!

Snapper has nailed it. Crocs, though incredibly hideous, have their outdoor function of climbing on rocks around rockpools or hiking in the great outdoors. However, like wearing sneakers with bluejeans (a fashion faux pas which only the Americans have embraced), they should never been seen anywhere near a gathering of other people.
   33. SoSH U at work Posted: March 25, 2021 at 01:01 AM (#6009951)
However, like wearing sneakers with bluejeans (a fashion faux pas which only the Americans have embraced), they should never been seen anywhere near a gathering of other people.


This doesn't really apply to me, since I'm a disciple of the Smitty* school of fashion, but what kind of footwear is appropriate with jeans? To me, anything other than workboots seems like overly formal shoes for the choice of pants.
   34. the Hugh Jorgan returns Posted: March 25, 2021 at 01:17 AM (#6009952)
#33, nah, just pair of topsiders, or casual loafers. Anything from banana republic type of thing. There are lots of casual shoes you can wear with jeans that do NOT have to be a pair of sneakers.
   35. . Posted: March 25, 2021 at 06:27 AM (#6009953)
Analytics departments can never fail, they can only be failed.
   36. Lassus Posted: March 25, 2021 at 09:27 AM (#6009965)
Dude, making your data analysts cart dirty laundry around means that the Analytics department has pretty definitively been failed.
   37. SoSH U at work Posted: March 25, 2021 at 09:33 AM (#6009967)
#33, nah, just pair of topsiders, or casual loafers. Anything from banana republic type of thing. There are lots of casual shoes you can wear with jeans that do NOT have to be a pair of sneakers.


I still think that's pushing blue jeans above its weight class.

Besides, don't we, home of Levi Strauss & Co., get to make the call?
   38. Nasty Nate Posted: March 25, 2021 at 09:49 AM (#6009969)
It's easy to forget that this was a pretty good team not so long ago; they won 87 and 91 games in 2017-18 and were in the postseason both years. Bridich has his strengths, which are mostly contained within the farm system. Even during the disasters of the past couple of years, they have always had several good young homegrown starting pitchers, as well as a couple of All-Star-type position players.

This is just it. They're like the A's or the Rays. Every year a new incredibly good player appears out of nowhere. Except that unlike the A's and the Rays, they aren't doing it on the cheap - they keep some of their homegrown players for big salaries. And to top it all off, they hand out $50 million every off-season to the worst veterans available. Must be maddening to imagine what would happen if they just didn't do that last part!
Yeah. I saw this thread and the Padres/Dodgers one, and I couldn't help but notice that the Rockies had more wins than the Padres in 2017, 2018, and 2019. I'm not saying the franchise is in good shape, but they haven't bottomed out like the Orioles and Tigers with consecutive sub .400 seasons. yet.
   39. Nasty Nate Posted: March 25, 2021 at 09:52 AM (#6009970)
And sneakers and jeans were made for each other, figuratively.
   40. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 25, 2021 at 10:04 AM (#6009971)
Besides, don't we, home of Levi Strauss & Co., get to make the call?

Under that theory, shouldn't they be worn only for manual labor? Personally, I don't even own a pair. Never found them comfortable. Way too heavy.
   41. SoSH U at work Posted: March 25, 2021 at 10:10 AM (#6009973)
Under that theory, shouldn't they be worn only for manual labor?


Yes. Unless you're on a construction site or a ranch, wearing them should be considered cultural appropriation.

I half jest.
   42. cHiEf iMpaCt oFfiCEr JE Posted: March 25, 2021 at 10:16 AM (#6009974)
However, like wearing sneakers with bluejeans (a fashion faux pas which only the Americans have embraced),
Newsflash: Once embraced by a nation of 330 million people, it's no longer a faux pas.
   43. DL from MN Posted: March 25, 2021 at 10:40 AM (#6009978)
as it happens, I was in first grade and still couldn't - wait for it - tie my own shoelaces.


This seems to be more common. I often do projects with kids. We had a kite build that was mostly tying knots and the kids were terrible at it. Like half of the kids (4th-8th graders) needed me to tie knots for them.
   44. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 11:58 AM (#6009997)
Jeans and sneakers don't really go together. There's only 3 groups that can wear jeans and sneakers. Kids, old people, and dads who basically don't care they look like an idiot.
   45. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:03 PM (#6010001)
Velcro
   46. Nasty Nate Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:18 PM (#6010007)
Jeans and sneakers don't really go together. There's only 3 groups that can wear jeans and sneakers. Kids, old people, and dads who basically don't care they look like an idiot.
So, everyone in the country except women aged 20-60?
   47. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:26 PM (#6010010)
Basically every man who doesn't mind looking like an idiot or a child.
   48. cHiEf iMpaCt oFfiCEr JE Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:29 PM (#6010011)
Basically every man who doesn't mind looking like an idiot or a child.

Thanks, Principal Skinner.
   49. Lassus Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:31 PM (#6010012)
Jeans and sneakers don't really go together. There's only 3 groups that can wear jeans and sneakers. Kids, old people, and dads who basically don't care they look like an idiot.


Yeah, I dunno.

Seems kinda like it works.

Lots of spots on the tubes disagree with you.


Kinda taking the youth of the nation's opinion on this one.
   50. Nasty Nate Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:35 PM (#6010016)
I would guess sneakers/jeans is by far the most common bottoms/footwear combo in the US. It doesn't make it right, but it's not some niche behavior.
   51. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:37 PM (#6010019)
Re 49. The first photo is rocking 900 dollar shoes and the other has a dude with a man bun!

And yeah, kids like sneakers. They then grow up.
   52. cHiEf iMpaCt oFfiCEr JE Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:38 PM (#6010021)
It doesn't make it right, but it's not some niche behavior.
Don't ya know? Everyone's an idiot or child but him.
   53. Lassus Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:40 PM (#6010024)
And yeah, kids like sneakers. They then grow up.

I mean, you're old. We understand. But not everyone is old.
   54. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:41 PM (#6010028)
So I guess the rule is it's ok to wear sneakers and jeans just as long as you're spending several thousand dollars on your outfit.

Also, that guy looks like a douche.
   55. Lassus Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:44 PM (#6010030)
Here, look again.

   56. Lassus Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:47 PM (#6010034)
   57. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 25, 2021 at 12:47 PM (#6010035)
I'm just as baffled at the seemingly widespread disdain for cargo shorts.


A (subsequently) good friend of mine -- about 20 years younger than me, which would place him around age 19 at the time -- on the old Buzzcocks email list threw an absolute fit over the existence & wear of cargo pants. His vehemence sort of baffled me & others, though admittedly the garb in question looks pretty stupid.
   58. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 25, 2021 at 01:08 PM (#6010053)
Skinny jeans on men is an abomination against good taste.
   59. McCoy Posted: March 25, 2021 at 01:17 PM (#6010061)
A 27 year old man trying to look like he's 12. What am I supposed to take away from these looks?
   60. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 25, 2021 at 01:53 PM (#6010078)
That you need to unclench at long last.
   61. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: March 25, 2021 at 02:04 PM (#6010083)
on the old Buzzcocks email list
There’s your explanation. I’m pretty sure the hate for cargo shorts arose from their association with frat guys and Dave Matthews fans about 20 years ago.
   62. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 25, 2021 at 02:07 PM (#6010085)
Could well be. Both those categories are walking arguments for mass murder.
   63. Tom Nawrocki Posted: March 25, 2021 at 02:11 PM (#6010087)
This is just it. They're like the A's or the Rays. Every year a new incredibly good player appears out of nowhere. Except that unlike the A's and the Rays, they aren't doing it on the cheap - they keep some of their homegrown players for big salaries. And to top it all off, they hand out $50 million every off-season to the worst veterans available. Must be maddening to imagine what would happen if they just didn't do that last part!


I've seen a little bit of criticism that the Rockies are the only team not to sign any major league free agents this off-season. With this front office, that's not a bad thing.

On the other hand, there was some excitement over the fact that there was a four-way position battle for first base - even though three of the candidates are 28-year-old career minor leaguers, and the fourth is a 31-year-old who got released by a terrible Tigers team. What's likely to happen is that one of these guys wins the battle and hits .283 with 12 homers, and Bridich decides that's acceptable output at first base.
   64. Nasty Nate Posted: March 25, 2021 at 05:32 PM (#6010164)
Bridich took an inclusive approach with his analytics department, asking its members to rank the available free-agent first basemen. The first base group that offseason included Mark Trumbo, Mitch Moreland, Mike Napoli, Trevor Plouffe and Chris Carter. The Rockies’ analysts ranked Desmond, who had never played first base in his previous eight professional seasons, near the bottom. But Bridich signed him for more money than the combined total all of the other players on the list received, in part because he believed Desmond’s strong character would make him a good fit for the club….
Prior to his free agency, what was the link between Desmond and Bridich - how did he know him well enough to determine that his character was strong?
   65. Tom Nawrocki Posted: March 25, 2021 at 06:12 PM (#6010170)
I don't know, but Bridich wasn't wrong about that. A lot of Desmond's teammates have raved about his work ethic, and he kept a good attitude through all his years of suckitude. They should have signed him as a coach.
   66. jacksone (AKA It's OK...) Posted: March 26, 2021 at 09:08 AM (#6010212)
They should have signed him as a coach.


Didn't they try and do that with Jason Giambi? Signed him to a few one year deals with a hitting coach offer after he was done, until he went and signed with Cleveland?
   67. The Gary DiSarcina Fan Club (JAHV) Posted: March 26, 2021 at 02:48 PM (#6010286)
Wearing out to dinner is like wearing sweats.


Oh, I would never wear sweats to dinner. Well, not sweatpants, anyway, since I don't even own a pair. Usually I'd wear basketball shorts, or, if it's a nice place, the aforementioned cargo shorts. Cargo shorts and a polo shirt is my formal attire.

And yeah, kids like sneakers. They then grow up.


And continue to find them comfortable, practical, and affordable.
   68. A triple short of the cycle Posted: March 26, 2021 at 03:30 PM (#6010298)
I'm 51 and embrace a retro 50s rockabilly style as best I can. I wear Levi's 501 jeans (black not blue) and either Chuck Taylors (only sneakers I own) or black leather shoes. Would never wear sweats, crocs, or even shorts. To each their own!!

Oh yeah here is a related story. I befriended one of the Saag's sausage servers at the Coliseum - he was a big black dude named John. Always got in his line. Had him (and Fran the Sierra Nevada server) sign the foul ball I caught one time. But anyway, one time he says to me, "you know, you look like a jazz musician." I got a kick out of that being a nerdy white guy at a baseball game.
   69. . Posted: March 26, 2021 at 04:18 PM (#6010307)
So in OOTP 22, I took the Marlins as GM. I turn to my front office screen and they have Kim Ng's personality as "controlling." There's a new feature whereby the various front office/coach personalities get along well with some types and don't get along so well with other types. Kim Ng gets along well with controlling types and doesn't get along well with "personable" types.

Discuss among yourselves. I confess to finding it ... odd.
   70. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 26, 2021 at 04:23 PM (#6010310)
I'm 51 and embrace a retro 50s rockabilly style as best I can. I wear Levi's 501 jeans (black not blue) and either Chuck Taylors (only sneakers I own) or black leather shoes. Would never wear sweats, crocs, or even shorts. To each their own!!


Big rockabilly fan here (as well as, unfortunately for my wallet & probably my hearing as well, just about everything else post-'40s except opera, classical, jazz & heavy metal, & I guess rap after about 1990), but can't say I've ever felt compelled to dress the part.

I am, however, trying to cultivate long sideburns for the first time since around 2000. Achieving a decent pair was much easier back then, when my hair was darker.
   71. Tom Nawrocki Posted: March 26, 2021 at 06:09 PM (#6010330)
Didn't they try and do that with Jason Giambi? Signed him to a few one year deals with a hitting coach offer after he was done, until he went and signed with Cleveland?


For as long as he was there, Giambi's role on the team was very explicitly pinch hitter/hitting guru. I don't know if they had some sort of handshake agreement to keep him on as a hitting coach after his playing days were done. I do know that when the Rockies fired Jim Tracy after the 2012 season, Giambi was one of the finalists to replace him. The Rox ended up hiring Walt Weiss, who was then a high school baseball coach.

I don't think Giambi was invited to stay on as hitting coach, but at any rate he went to Cleveland to play out the string as a pinch-hitter. Weiss lasted four years and never won more than 75 games.
   72. Szym Posted: March 26, 2021 at 11:34 PM (#6010367)
The timing of when four of the team's six analytics staffers quit, in the middle of a pandemic that was resulting in huge cuts in sports employment, says a lot about how the team was run! I had heard a lot about the Rockies and their misuse of analytics, but the laundry was one story that I had not heard. The team's long been a joke around baseball. I actually found out about the Desmond signing being official from an agent texting me and laughing about it and wanting to see my reaction. One assistant GM told me off the record back in 2019 that they hated even talking trades with the Rockies because the team was eternally unrealistic about the value of their players. The Rockies really did demand the Orioles give them Kevin Gausman in 2014 for two months of Jorge de la Rosa. This was at the point at which Gausman was BA's #20 prospect in baseball and BP's #10. And not straight-up, either; I heard from multiple sources at the time that they wanted him as the *lead* of the package.

I wear a pair of Ralph Lauren sneakers sometimes with jeans, but I mostly rely heavily on a pair of suede moccasins for most of my day-to-day use. What it comes down to is I just don't care about being a snappy dresser nor am I in a job that requires it.
   73. Howie Menckel Posted: March 27, 2021 at 12:13 AM (#6010369)
One assistant GM told me off the record back in 2019

if it was off the record, then you can't be telling it 2 years later - because it was off the record.

perhaps you mean "not for attribution," which is a horse of another color.
   74. Szym Posted: March 27, 2021 at 12:21 AM (#6010372)
perhaps you mean "not for attribution," which is a horse of another color.

It was a casual conversation that we didn't get really to terms except for not giving his name. Sorry about sloppy language use here. I generally stay away from actual reporting, so I have a lot of "shooting the ####\" conversations.
   75. Howie Menckel Posted: March 27, 2021 at 12:58 AM (#6010375)
fair enough
   76. gef the talking mongoose, peppery hostile Posted: March 27, 2021 at 11:17 AM (#6010400)
What it comes down to is I just don't care about being a snappy dresser nor am I in a job that requires it.


I had to go into the office twice for a couple of hours in probably November for the first time since 3/13 to get my cubicle ready for building-wide carpet replacement. First time I'd worn long pants in the intervening 8 months. Once coldish (this is central Alabama, after all) weather kicked in, I wore sweatpants when necessary.
   77. Tom Nawrocki Posted: March 27, 2021 at 01:01 PM (#6010412)
One assistant GM told me off the record back in 2019 that they hated even talking trades with the Rockies because the team was eternally unrealistic about the value of their players. The Rockies really did demand the Orioles give them Kevin Gausman in 2014 for two months of Jorge de la Rosa. This was at the point at which Gausman was BA's #20 prospect in baseball and BP's #10. And not straight-up, either; I heard from multiple sources at the time that they wanted him as the *lead* of the package.


Of course, in any trade negotiation, you should always start out asking for more than you expect to eventually receive. This is the kind of thing that, when an organization that you think is smart does it, it's good negotiating. When an organization you think is dumb does it, it's the team being "eternally unrealistic about the value of their players."

Also, if you thought in 2014 that the Orioles organization was smarter than the Rockies, I'd suggest that it's time to revisit that decision.
   78. snapper (history's 42nd greatest monster) Posted: March 27, 2021 at 01:31 PM (#6010414)
Of course, in any trade negotiation, you should always start out asking for more than you expect to eventually receive. This is the kind of thing that, when an organization that you think is smart does it, it's good negotiating. When an organization you think is dumb does it, it's the team being "eternally unrealistic about the value of their players."

Also, if you thought in 2014 that the Orioles organization was smarter than the Rockies, I'd suggest that it's time to revisit that decision.


You ask for 150 units of value for your 100, hoping to end up at 110 or 120. If you ask for 300 units of value, the other team hangs up.
   79. Lowry Seasoning Salt Posted: April 17, 2021 at 11:03 PM (#6014092)
After 14 games for St. Louis and 15 for Colorado,

Arenado: 4 HR
Rockies: 4 Wins

This might be a season-long competition.
   80. Nasty Nate Posted: April 26, 2021 at 02:06 PM (#6015502)
Bridich has been ditched.
   81. Tom Nawrocki Posted: April 26, 2021 at 02:09 PM (#6015503)
That's good news and a step forward, although the timing is unfortunate. By all accounts, Nolan Arenado's prime beef with the organization was with Bridich, and if they were just going to get rid of him a month into the season, they should have just done it last November and hung on to Arenado.

You must be Registered and Logged In to post comments.

 

 

<< Back to main

BBTF Partner

Dynasty League Baseball

Support BBTF

donate

Thanks to
Brian
for his generous support.

You must be logged in to view your Bookmarks.

Hot Topics

NewsblogCleveland Guardians roller derby team sues baseball club over name change
(46 - 5:06pm, Oct 28)
Last: What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face?

NewsblogEvery WS since '82 has a Smoltz teammate
(1 - 5:06pm, Oct 28)
Last: The Gary DiSarcina Fan Club (JAHV)

NewsblogNBA 2021-2022 Season Thread
(397 - 5:03pm, Oct 28)
Last: Fourth True Outcome

NewsblogGold Glove Award finalists unveiled
(8 - 4:32pm, Oct 28)
Last: Darren

NewsblogDodgers Albert Pujols Hits the COVID-19 Injured List
(249 - 4:19pm, Oct 28)
Last: Crosseyed and Painless

NewsblogNative American group blasts MLB commissioner Rob Manfred over 'tomahawk chop' comments
(23 - 4:18pm, Oct 28)
Last: Rowland Office Supplies

NewsblogPrimer Dugout (and link of the day) 10-28-2021
(4 - 3:56pm, Oct 28)
Last: Walt Davis

NewsblogWith World Series in full swing, PETA asks baseball world to remove 'bullpen' from vocabulary
(16 - 3:53pm, Oct 28)
Last: Never Give an Inge (Dave)

Newsblog2021 World Series OMNICHATTER!
(140 - 3:25pm, Oct 28)
Last: Tony S

NewsblogHALL OF FAME’S EARLY BASEBALL ERA COMMITTEE AND GOLDEN DAYS ERA COMMITTEE TO MEET THIS WINTER
(6 - 3:05pm, Oct 28)
Last: Dennis Eclairskey, closer

NewsblogTV Ratings: World Series Opens Higher for Fox
(36 - 1:53pm, Oct 28)
Last: VCar

NewsblogWatch every LIDOM game on MLB.TV
(8 - 1:52pm, Oct 28)
Last: RoyalsRetro (AG#1F)

NewsblogMLB Just Tried a Bunch of Experimental Rules in the Minors. How Well Did They Work?
(96 - 11:32am, Oct 28)
Last: ERROR---Jolly Old St. Nick

Sox TherapyMeet the 2022 Red Sox
(15 - 11:28am, Oct 28)
Last: jacksone (AKA It's OK...)

NewsblogBrewers GM Matt Arnold latest to say no thanks to Steve Cohen, Mets as front-office search continues to flail
(27 - 11:27am, Oct 28)
Last: Nasty Nate

Page rendered in 0.4139 seconds
50 querie(s) executed