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Friday, July 26, 2019

The Case for the Mid-at bat Pitching Change

Can we….can we not? Please?

Changing pitchers mid–plate appearance: It’s a tactic that’s been sparingly deployed in college baseball, but is virtually unheard of in the big leagues. That could change soon—and the evidence says it could be more effective than you’d think.

Davo Posted: July 26, 2019 at 01:16 PM | 23 comment(s) Login to Bookmark
  Tags: pitching change, strategy

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   1. Davo Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:17 PM (#5865312)
Well that was supposed to be in quotes. Oops!0
   2. Welcome to Gator Hammock (CoB). Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:22 PM (#5865313)
Dammit, I submitted this article as well.

Shakes fist!
   3. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:22 PM (#5865314)
Ugh. No. No ####### way. The Effectively Wild guys have been banging this drum lately and patting themselves on the back for coming up with something clever. I like those guys and the podcast, but this idea is ####### horrible. If teams start thinking it's effective and adopting it, that #### needs to be banned immediately.
   4. Barry`s_Lazy_Boy Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:30 PM (#5865317)
Its not like they can increase the number of pitchers in a game. This idea really has zero negative impact, its just another pitching change. Other than the nattering naboobs of negativity who hate baseball.

   5. filihok Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:34 PM (#5865321)
Seems like it would be an effective strategy.

A ban seems, like with the 3 batter rule, hard to enforce. "My pitcher said that his elbow hurt, so we took him out as a precaution".

Also, with the 3 batter rule banning the mid-PA pitching change wouldn't seem to gain much. If you're bringing the guy in to face the next 3 hitters anyway, it doesn't take any more time to bring him in mid-PA than it does between PA's.

   6. What did Billy Ripken have against ElRoy Face? Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:43 PM (#5865327)
It's not even a pace of play thing, really. I just find it obnoxious aesthetically. Trying too hard to be clever, and if between-batter pitching changes kill the tension and excitement of the game at critical moments, mid-batter pitching changes would be even worse.

And yes, Barry, I hate baseball. Glad you got that chestnut in there.
   7. SoSH U at work Posted: July 26, 2019 at 04:51 PM (#5865330)
Its not like they can increase the number of pitchers in a game. This idea really has zero negative impact, its just another pitching change. Other than the nattering naboobs of negativity who hate baseball.


Except a mid-PA pitching change is always a mid-inning pitching change, the worst kind. One non-issue with the move to more reliever usage is the preference for the clean inning, so the number of mid-inning pitching changes hasn't risen as starter outings have decreased. But if teams continue to use the same number of pitchers but removed mid-PA more often, it would definitely have an effect on pace of play.

Sorry, if that offends your Love it or Leave it outlook.

   8. It's regretful that PASTE was able to get out Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:14 PM (#5865336)

A ban seems, like with the 3 batter rule, hard to enforce. "My pitcher said that his elbow hurt, so we took him out as a precaution".


Then he has to go on the 10-day IL.

And yeah, I hate baseball too. I much prefer watching baseball players stand around doing nothing in particular. They look so dreamy in those uniforms!
   9. Brian C Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:22 PM (#5865338)
A ban seems, like with the 3 batter rule, hard to enforce. "My pitcher said that his elbow hurt, so we took him out as a precaution".

Much easier to enforce, it seems. If a pitching change is made mid-AB, then the batter gets first base.

I'm with Elroy here. I'm all for strategery and innovation but mid-AB pitching changes are already a blight on the game even though they almost never happen. A line needs to be drawn in the sand, and this is a good place to do it, IMO.

   10. SoSH U at work Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:24 PM (#5865339)
Then he has to go on the 10-day IL.


It should already be a rule. If you lift a pitcher for an injury in mid-inning, he should be forced to sit at least three games. That would protect pitchers and prevent any possible system gaming.

   11. Davo Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:30 PM (#5865342)
In the ideal scenario he envisioned, he says, “you’re bringing a guy out of the bullpen who is a breaking ball guy, a real hard slider guy, or a really good curveball guy, especially if you have a 1-2 count or 0-2 count, even if you have a 2-2 count. And you say to your pitcher, ‘Hey, listen, I want you to throw your best breaking ball here two or three times in a row, and I want to get a swing-and-miss.’

This is hell.
   12. PreservedFish Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:38 PM (#5865347)
Perhaps this will lead to the rise of the KTHOG: Knuckleballer Two Half-Outs Guy
   13. filihok Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:49 PM (#5865351)
Then he has to go on the 10-day IL.

If you lift a pitcher for an injury in mid-inning, he should be forced to sit at least three games.

If a pitching change is made mid-AB, then the batter gets first base.


I believe the reasonable argument against this was that more pitchers will attempt to pitch when injured, increasing their risk of injury.

Can't wait for the first walk-off win when a guy tears his UCL in the middle of an at bat.
I also hate baseball.
   14. Man o' Schwar Posted: July 26, 2019 at 05:55 PM (#5865352)
I'm holding out for the mid-windup pitching change. Pitcher gets on the rubber, comes to a set, rocks back, and the manager pops out of the dugout. Pitcher holds like a statue until he's replaced by someone who takes that exact physical form, time back in, and he finishes the pitch.

Great for when you need to see if the other team is planning to run or bunt - they'll tip their hand, then you bring in the high fastball guy.
   15. Davo Posted: July 26, 2019 at 06:05 PM (#5865354)
I actually do hate baseball, and so, I in fact welcome this change, or any other changes which will hasten the demise of this wretched game.
   16. SoSH U at work Posted: July 26, 2019 at 06:07 PM (#5865355)
I believe the reasonable argument against this was that more pitchers will attempt to pitch when injured, increasing their risk of injury.


I think that's a legit fear if you put them on the 10-Day DL. But for 3 days, not so much.

   17. Brian C Posted: July 26, 2019 at 06:07 PM (#5865356)
I believe the reasonable argument against this was that more pitchers will attempt to pitch when injured, increasing their risk of injury.

That’s why I think the penalty should be minor enough that genuine precautionary measures should still be a viable option but real enough to discourage shenanigans. We can argue about where that line is, but throwing one’s hands up and saying “but someone might get hurt at some point” isn’t a “reasonable” argument, it’s an excuse to avoid being reasonable.
   18. Perry Posted: July 26, 2019 at 06:13 PM (#5865358)
Dammit, I submitted this article as well.


Yeah, I started to comment in the other thread, then I finished it here.
   19. Tom Nawrocki Posted: July 26, 2019 at 07:21 PM (#5865384)
I believe the reasonable argument against this was that more pitchers will attempt to pitch when injured, increasing their risk of injury.


In 1967, Roberto Clemente hit a line drive off Bob Gibson's leg, but Gibson stayed in the game to face three more hitters WITH A BROKEN LEG. Pantywaists.
   20. PreservedFish Posted: July 26, 2019 at 07:51 PM (#5865397)
I believe the reasonable argument against this was that more pitchers will attempt to pitch when injured, increasing their risk of injury.


If Nieporent and snapper get to not care about the slow-reflexed getting wacked by foul balls, I get to not care about pitchers that are being stupid.
   21. bookbook Posted: July 27, 2019 at 11:31 AM (#5865518)
Give Preserved Fish a Primey!
   22. Pat Rapper's Delight (as quoted on MLB Network) Posted: July 27, 2019 at 12:41 PM (#5865521)
If MLB is going to go full-on stupid with this, then it should be up to the discretion of the home plate umpire to allow a mid-batter pitching change. Imagine the hilarity that will ensue when Angel Hernandez or Cowboy Joe disallows a mid-batter pitching change, especially if they have previously allowed one for the other team, because I too hate baseball.
   23. pikepredator Posted: July 27, 2019 at 01:55 PM (#5865527)
I'm on board as long as they also allow mid-at-bat batter changes, so we can have Mookie take a couple of swings in Jackie Bradley's spot and then swap them in the field next inning. I'd also give managers a black-and-white flag they can throw in order to request a mid-at-bat umpire change, so as to change the effective strike zone in their favor.

Bring the Hate!

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